What is your impression of Aspergers syndrome?

Zorya · 05-11-2018 3:25pm

wexie wrote: »

While I personally think you may well be right in that assessment as it's largely how I feel about things, I'd also have to point out to you 'they' aren't the ones experiencing the problems are they?

Regardless of whether or not our societies and lives are structured in a completely bizarre way the fact remains that it is how they are structured.

It's not going to change so your options are essentially to either adjust and somehow learn to cope, or don't.

I do think there will come a time when more and more people will look up and ask what the hell is going on here? Why are we living like this? Maybe our kids cannot cope?

Even in the past couple of years in Ireland the roads are like lunatic asylums, and people are working every hour of the day to afford identikit doll houses in commuter belt estates, hardly seeing their children from one end of the week to the other. The fact that things are structured that way now does not mean that at some point we cannot change that, or that at least we should be regularly reminding ourselves of the insanity.

There are choices even within the status quo. Less money. Less hours working. Less THINGS. Less screens. Less rushing around like a blue arsed fly. More time with people you love, your children. More time with yourself.

Move if needs be, go live in the sticks. It all goes by very fast.

professore · 05-11-2018 3:27pm

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

I didn't know and until you said that it did not occur to me.
Spend my life making social gaffs without meaning to and I know I meant no harm so I ain't going to apologise or feel guilty.

Spent enough of my life replaying social mistakes and gaffs in my head and feeling awful.
In fact, it has caused suicidal thoughts many times.

I know I meant no harm so I am not got to worry torture myself or give a fcuk anymore.

As a small bit of advice it just works better for us NTs to apologise and explain and then stop talking. My wife was recently diagnosed and she does the same thing, keeps talking after she apologises and ends up saying she has nothing to apologise for. While technically correct, it doesn't make her easier to like.

It took both out daughters saying what I'd been saying for years for her to finally look into it.

And even the most NT people make social gaffes in unfamiliar situations. There are lots of flexible rules of conduct in social situations, I know, I've tried to make up some for my wife and failed miserably.

One of her issues is either coming across rude or overly friendly in social interactions. Also playing the same 3 songs on a loop all day long. Drives me nuts.

She's lovely though, extremely intelligent and a very honest person. Wouldn't change her for the world.

Calhoun · 05-11-2018 3:53pm

skepticalme wrote: »

Autism diagnosis cannot be bought, really annoys me when people suggest it can or that parents want a diagnosis. In reality services are minimal to non existent and parents end up paying for as much private therapy as they can afford.
The common trait I think running through people with asd is anxiety which can affect them horrendously and if not helped can lead to depression, self harm etc.
I think people with no experience of dealing with asd don't realise that even 'mild' asd involves huge challenges for those affected.

Hold on i was the one that implied that there was a psychiatrist making it difficult for people to get proper diagnosis and i stand over it. Our own private diagnosis was rejected because of the cowboy practices of certain folk looking to make a quick buck.

That may not be palatable to you but its the reality of the situation and its why parts of the HSE will only recognize if you go through their recommended service.

Calhoun · 05-11-2018 4:00pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

While I do understand where you’re coming from, I think a loaded statement like that is quite frankly ludicrous, on a number of levels.

It’s not about neglecting children, it’s about rejecting the pathologisation of what the parents consider normal behaviours. If parents are considered to be neglecting their children because they don’t want their children being labelled with various conditions, then that does make way for the State to intervene and supplant the authority of the parents if they are successful in arguing that it is in the children’s best interests to do so (and they are indeed usually successful).

If for example, my mother had followed the advice she was given by experts at the time when I was diagnosed as a child with severe dyslexia, I imagine my life would have taken a very different path had my mother actually taken their advice and enrolled me in a ‘special’ school, instead of keeping me in a mainstream school. If the State had intervened and successfully argued that I should be taken into care and enrolled in a special school, that’s exactly where you’re heading when you would have determined that my parents were guilty of child neglect from your perspective.

They certainly weren’t, not from my perspective, and that’s why it was fairly annoying when I had my own child and plenty of clueless but well-meaning types pathologising his every behaviour, analysing his behaviours to the nth degree and suggesting all sorts of conditions, top of the list of course came aspergers and transgenderism. Still think neglecting your children because you don’t want them labelled should be regarded on the same level as people who refuse to vaccinate their children? I’ve no doubt Katherine Zappine for one will be only too happy to hear it.

Well i think your wrong but you don't have to agree with me. In my view if my child badly breaks their leg i am not qualified to make sure they get the right care.

Parents are the ones with the hangup's regarding labels and medical care, they should be trying to take get the best care for their children so the long term outcome is great and the child does not end up in an institution.

Also i don't think i need to point out the parallels between ones personal beliefs in both cases and medical evidence but i will.

fyfe79 · 05-11-2018 4:18pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

It’s obviously a modern diagnosis which pathologises what would previously have been considered normal human behaviour. That’s not to suggest people who are diagnosed with the condition are faking it, but making the point that the criteria for the diagnosis of the condition are so broad that practically anyone could be diagnosed with aspergers syndrome.

One of the things I constantly hear promoted about the disorder is the observation that people diagnosed with aspergers syndrome are unusually highly intelligent in one way or another, and it’s not from clinicians I hear this but ordinary people who are self-diagnosing themselves as having aspergers, or parents who identify their children as having aspergers or displaying characteristics of behaviour they typically associate with autism. It reminds me of the myth which I thought had been debunked a long time ago when people who were autistic were portrayed as savants, the reality of course being that savants are as rare in people who are autistic as they are in the general population.

The idea that medicine and science are getting better at diagnoses of neurological and developmental disorders like autism and aspergers and that’s why we’re seeing such a dramatic rise in people diagnosed with these conditions, is eventually going to get to the point where what were once considered atypical characteristics are actually normal behaviours that should probably never have been pathologised and categorised as atypical behaviour when they’re as common among a population as they are.

I’ve often thought about this – what is the tipping point? There seems to be more and more people diagnosed. At what point will be percentage of the western world diagnosed with AS or Autism lead to a discussion of “well actually, AS and Autism seems to be quite normal human behaviour since so many people display the traits”? It could be just another facet of human existence and not a ‘disorder’ at all.

skepticalme · 05-11-2018 4:29pm

Calhoun wrote: »

Hold on i was the one that implied that there was a psychiatrist making it difficult for people to get proper diagnosis and i stand over it. Our own private diagnosis was rejected because of the cowboy practices of certain folk looking to make a quick buck.

That may not be palatable to you but its the reality of the situation and its why parts of the HSE will only recognize if you go through their recommended service.

Have you heard of any of this psychiatrists diagnosis being retracted by the hse assessment when they eventually get around to it, because I don't think that is happening.
The hse are rejecting private diagnosis in some areas, not because the diagnosis is wrong but because their waiting lists are so long. Children under 5 might see early intervention after hse assessment a few times only before they are moved to the school age team, where they wait years for an appointment which is only an assessment of their difficulties. There is hardly any hse help. Parents are paying privately for whatever therapy they can afford.

CinemaGuy45 · 05-11-2018 5:01pm

Carla Victorious Cane wrote: »

Two people I've watched programmes about recently - The Unabomber and Vincent Van Gogh - apparently said this also: a feeling of being "outside" the standard social world, and trying to get in but encountering an impenetrable barrier.

Don't want to claim the fukcer as one of our own however will take Van Gogh.:D

Calhoun · 05-11-2018 5:09pm

skepticalme wrote: »

Have you heard of any of this psychiatrists diagnosis being retracted by the hse assessment when they eventually get around to it, because I don't think that is happening.
The hse are rejecting private diagnosis in some areas, not because the diagnosis is wrong but because their waiting lists are so long. Children under 5 might see early intervention after hse assessment a few times only before they are moved to the school age team, where they wait years for an appointment which is only an assessment of their difficulties. There is hardly any hse help. Parents are paying privately for whatever therapy they can afford.

I have not heard of them retracting a diagnosis but i have heard of them not recognizing diagnosis from psychiatrists who aren't following a multi-disciplinary diagnosis.

Tell me something i don't know, i have a daughter who is exactly 5 going through the system right now and i can tell you its not been made any easier by certain diagnosis muddying the water.

CinemaGuy45 · 05-11-2018 5:16pm

I got a private diagnosis about 7 years ago not that I have ever needed to use it for anything at my age it has just made sense of my life somewhat.

As regards the HSE I applied about 8 years ago still waiting to hear back.:rolleyes:

wexie · 05-11-2018 5:19pm

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

As regards the HSE I applied about 8 years ago still waiting to hear back.:rolleyes:

If my experiences with HSE adult mental health care are anything to go by you could end up with a diagnosis of being French

James Brown · 05-11-2018 5:22pm

Zaph wrote: »

I have a friend who has two children on the spectrum and have worked with several people over the years who I'd be very surprised weren't on it as well. Not entirely sure how that's relevant though, I'm not the one slagging them off.

We're all on the spectrum to varying degrees.

One eyed Jack · 05-11-2018 5:22pm

Calhoun wrote: »

Well i think your wrong but you don't have to agree with me. In my view if my child badly breaks their leg i am not qualified to make sure they get the right care.

Parents are the ones with the hangup's regarding labels and medical care, they should be trying to take get the best care for their children so the long term outcome is great and the child does not end up in an institution.

Also i don't think i need to point out the parallels between ones personal beliefs in both cases and medical evidence but i will.

While we’re drawing parallels, your idea was tried in the past, and it caused massive social damage to society where children who became wards of the State were institutionalised and subjected to all sorts of inhumane treatment, only to be institutionalised later in life as adults (if they lived that long), secluded and excluded from society.

All because of the personal beliefs of a minority of people who had the power to use agents of the State to enforce their personal beliefs on other people. If your policy had been in force 30 years ago, I would have been institutionalised in a rehabilitation centre and would likely still be unable to read or write, only making potato patterns on paper or working on an assembly line for 3 quid a week because I wouldn’t have been regarded as being capable of much more according to what some people believed at the time.

I was fortunate enough to have parents who were in a position to be able to tell other people what they could do with their personal beliefs and their ideas for how other people should raise their children.

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 05-11-2018 5:25pm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

We're all on the spectrum to varying degrees.

I've heard that before

"Sure there's something wrong with all of us"

One eyed Jack · 05-11-2018 5:25pm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

We're all on the spectrum to varying degrees.

Speak for yourself there Matt :pac:

professore · 05-11-2018 5:27pm

mvl wrote: »

Saw few "coming out" posts in here, this is good.
- might have guessed some, without getting into details... but maybe I have an online radar now, after my personal experiences .

Now ... I would be curious hearing some thoughts from NT partners/children: how is it to be married/in a partnership with someone with Asperger's; how are they as parents ?

Thanks,

My wife has Aspergers - and I agree with others that there SHOULD be a line between Aspergers and autism, ASD doesn't cut it. She is easier to live with since we now know she has it. She needs some time to herself every day and if we are going anywhere social we need to plan it well in advance, and she needs to know she can leave at a certain time.

Also I often go to events alone or with my older daughters as she and I are quite social and enjoy the whole thing. Ironically I come across as "shy" compared to her, as she tends to talk and talk in social situations as a coping mechanism, whereas I need to feel out the room first.

The most difficult thing is that she is extremely stubborn and will never ever admit she is wrong about something. Some might cynically say all women are like that but this is another level entirely. Often the "being wrong" was her misunderstanding something that was said. For example I might have said looking at 2 t-shirts 10 years ago, one blue and one green "I don't like the green one" and she would interpret that as I hate anything green regardless of context, and when I would say "that's not true" she would accuse me of saying it 10 years previous. Upon digging it nearly always turns out to be something like the t shirt example.

Also she doesn't seem to understand analogies. If I say I don't like it when she tells me "I don't like beards so you should always shave" and I say "How would you feel if I said "I don't like makeup so you should never wear any" she says these two examples are completely different and totally irrelevant to each other. This makes it much harder to explain social things to her.

This kind of thing has caused a lot of conflict in our relationship. Now I understand it better, I explain these things a lot more.

She gets obsessed with particular songs and music and plays them ALL THE TIME. Also certain games on her phone she could play for hours on end.

Most people who know her would say she is confident, articulate and outgoing. We get to see how draining she really finds it all and how little she actually enjoys it. I suspect there are nearly as many Aspie girls out there as boys, but the girls can hide it better.

CinemaGuy45 · 05-11-2018 5:29pm

wexie wrote: »

If my experiences with HSE adult mental health care are anything to go by you could end up with a diagnosis of being French

I went into a shrink once in my life for one visit in total before I knew about the ASD.

I was feeling down after somebody close had died and work was proving a disaster at the time.

The shrink said to me you don't think the dead person is going to come back or anything?
I replied that is why I am depressed and sad I know what death is.

He asked a few more questions like this and said my reactions were normal and I was not crazy.:rolleyes:

I went because I was feeling like sh*t I knew I was sane:rolleyes:.

It's like going to a doctor with a broken arm and saying your in pain and the doctor telling you that you do indeed have a broken arm the pain is quite normal now move along.:D

AndrewJRenko · 05-11-2018 5:30pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I think you will find that they were wrong or simply made it up.

You'd have to have been through a diagnosis to understand that it's laughable to suggest that an over the phone is possible. It takes hours of face to face to be diagnosed.

For the record, the people involved were fully in agreement with your position that diagnosis by phone is laughable at best and dangerous at worst. They weren't suggesting that this was a good approach - quite the opposite.

Calhoun · 05-11-2018 5:37pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

While we’re drawing parallels, your idea was tried in the past, and it caused massive social damage to society where children who became wards of the State were institutionalised and subjected to all sorts of inhumane treatment, only to be institutionalised later in life as adults (if they lived that long), secluded and excluded from society.

All because of the personal beliefs of a minority of people who had the power to use agents of the State to enforce their personal beliefs on other people. If your policy had been in force 30 years ago, I would have been institutionalised in a rehabilitation centre and would likely still be unable to read or write, only making potato patterns on paper or working on an assembly line for 3 quid a week because I wouldn’t have been regarded as being capable of much more according to what some people believed at the time.

I was fortunate enough to have parents who were in a position to be able to tell other people what they could do with their personal beliefs and their ideas for how other people should raise their children.

What idea was tried in the past? I have never said to force anyone to do anything. I said parents who do not engage in helping their children at all because they are afraid of a label are as damaging as anti-vaxxers.

Your falling into the anecdotal evidence trap and turning this into something that is solely about you. You had one experience, and are basically saying that lets ignore all the fact based evidence that the right care can have a positive impact. Sure why engage in modern medicine at all we should just burn the science witches at the stake.

So lets get back to what i am saying, 1. Parents need to fight on behalf of their children and not blindly accept any single person or professionals word on it and believe me when i say this you have to fight all the time to just get basic services, but 2. there are a group of parents out their who are so fearful of the stigma of a label they won't get any help and support which could make the lives of their children a hell of allot easier.

yourdeadwright · 05-11-2018 5:38pm

Its strange because in certain moment in a certain set of circumstances we all show signs of Asperger's depending on our life experience and likes and dislikes .
I think we may come to a point where we over prescribe people as having Asperger's ,

All humans have certain character flaws and at the moment we seem to be a race who want to find a reason or "problem" in certain parts of someone character that we do like or find "normal "

Sometimes children's acts as children are seen as odd and something that need's to be fixed when in fact its just a child being a child,
Then if said child is constantly told growing up he is different and has a "problem" he will grow up believing this and trying to be something he is not, As people when then notice something is not quite right and further beat on the drum that the person has a medical issue such has Asperger's

Its a dangerous road

DEFTLEFTHAND · 05-11-2018 5:39pm

It's amazing how it's missed so often in early development, I've heard of people in their late 30s being diagnosed with it for the first time.

Most people with it seem to get on well and are usually above average intelligence.

I wouldn't consider anybody with it to be a 'weirdo' or creepy.

professore · 05-11-2018 5:56pm

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

It's amazing how it's missed so often in early development, I've heard of people in their late 30s being diagnosed with it for the first time.

Most people with it seem to get on well and are usually above average intelligence.

I wouldn't consider anybody with it to be a 'weirdo' or creepy.

I work in IT and let's just say I encounter more people on the spectrum than in the average workplace. I find many with it are great to work with but less so when you go out to the pub as they just continue the same conversations that they were having at work. I remember one night in particular where this particular guy showed up and no one else did and it was the most painful hour I ever put in in my life. The guy had no ability to hold a conversation. Everything was "Yes" and "No" answers. I eventually made my excuses and left.

Sleeper12 · 05-11-2018 5:57pm

wexie wrote:

If my experiences with HSE adult mental health care are anything to go by you could end up with a diagnosis of being French

Had an adult nephew in the mental health ward in the Mater hospital for two weeks a few years ago. Because he checked himself in & he was an adult they wanted very little to do with the family. We were pushing for him to be assessed for autism. After two weeks the only answer we got was that he had too many visitors for him to be autistic.. A year or two later he was arrested during a water meter protest. In court his mother stated that autism runs in our family and we all believed /knew that he was autistic. Judge had him assessed and he is autistic with bells on.

HSE mental health sucks

One eyed Jack · 05-11-2018 5:59pm

Calhoun wrote: »

What idea was tried in the past? I have never said to force anyone to do anything. I said parents who do not engage in helping their children at all because they are afraid of a label are as damaging as anti-vaxxers.

What do you suggest is done then with children and what Katherine Zappone would call “unsupportive parents”? The anti-vaxxers comparison isn’t helpful because that too is as mired in political ideologies as diagnoses of what are considered developmental disorders and other conditions regarding child development and children’s welfare.

Your falling into the anecdotal evidence trap and turning this into something that is solely about you. You had one experience, and are basically saying that lets ignore all the fact based evidence that the right care can have a positive impact. Sure why engage in modern medicine at all we should just burn the science witches at the stake.

I’m not falling into any anecdotal evidence trap. There’s mountains of evidence to support the fact that removing children from their parents causes children more harm than any good it’s perceived to have done. That’s exactly why it’s not regarded as best practice any more to do so. Of course the right care can have a positive impact, which is why I disagree with your idea that forcing parents into conforming to your ideological beliefs would not have a positive impact on their children’s welfare. When modern medicine and science are infested with ideologues who are more interested in promoting their ideology than they are in children’s welfare, then society suffers for their personal and political beliefs.

So lets get back to what i am saying, 1. Parents need to fight on behalf of their children and not blindly accept any single person or professionals word on it and believe me when i say this you have to fight all the time to just get basic services, but 2. there are a group of parents out their who are so fearful of the stigma of a label they won't get any help and support which could make the lives of their children a hell of allot easier.

There are a group of parents out there who aren’t so much fearful of any stigma, but rather they are fighting on behalf of their children for what they believe is in their children’s best interests against people who want to use those children against their parents to further their own ideological beliefs.

ELM327 · 05-11-2018 6:02pm

professore wrote: »

I work in IT and let's just say I encounter more people on the spectrum than in the average workplace. I find many with it are great to work with but less so when you go out to the pub as they just continue the same conversations that they were having at work. I remember one night in particular where this particular guy showed up and no one else did and it was the most painful hour I ever put in in my life. The guy had no ability to hold a conversation. Everything was "Yes" and "No" answers. I eventually made my excuses and left.

If your job involves anything to do with IT, Fintech, Coding or development or such like, you are likely to find a higher number of ASD people than normal.

I sound just like the guy you describe tbh, but I'm a little more self aware now.

CinemaGuy45 · 05-11-2018 6:04pm

ELM327 wrote: »

If your job involves anything to do with IT, Fintech, Coding or development or such like, you are likely to find a higher number of ASD people than normal.

I sound just like the guy you describe tbh, but I'm a little more self aware now.

ELM327 · 05-11-2018 6:05pm

Feck off!
Nah the difference is I wouldnt have gone to the work event in the first place to be honest

Sleeper12 · 05-11-2018 6:07pm

professore wrote:

Also I often go to events alone or with my older daughters as she and I are quite social and enjoy the whole thing. Ironically I come across as "shy" compared to her, as she tends to talk and talk in social situations as a coping mechanism, whereas I need to feel out the room first.

I'm going to U2 tonight in the Three Arena. I want to go as I like U2 and love music. Between now and 7pm I could back out. The slightest hint from my wife that she's tired ill jump on it so I won't have to go. The crowd I can cope with but 15,000 people all talking at the same time for 30 minutes before the show starts freaks me out no end. 15,000 people clapping is torture for me. I will go & it will be extremely stressful for me at times yet while the band play & no one is clapping its pure heaven

Mr.Wemmick · 05-11-2018 6:12pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I'm going to U2 tonight in the Three Arena. I want to go as I like U2 and love music. Between now and 7pm I could back out. The slightest hint from my wife that she's tired ill jump on it so I won't have to go. The crowd I can cope with but 15,000 people all talking at the same time for 30 minutes before the show starts freaks me out no end. 15,000 people clapping is torture for me. I will go & it will be extremely stressful for me at times yet while the band play & no one is clapping its pure heaven

Can you wear ear defenders that just look like a normal headphone set? You wouldn't look out of the ordinary wearing them at the start.. bands always take an age to come on stage.

Calhoun · 05-11-2018 6:13pm

One eyed Jack wrote: »

What do you suggest is done then with children and what Katherine Zappone would call “unsupportive parents”? The anti-vaxxers comparison isn’t helpful because that too is as mired in political ideologies as diagnoses of what are considered developmental disorders and other conditions regarding child development and children’s welfare.

I’m not falling into any anecdotal evidence trap. There’s mountains of evidence to support the fact that removing children from their parents causes children more harm than any good it’s perceived to have done. That’s exactly why it’s not regarded as best practice any more to do so. Of course the right care can have a positive impact, which is why I disagree with your idea that forcing parents into conforming to your ideological beliefs would not have a positive impact on their children’s welfare. When modern medicine and science are infested with ideologues who are more interested in promoting their ideology than they are in children’s welfare, then society suffers for their personal and political beliefs.

There are a group of parents out there who aren’t so much fearful of any stigma, but rather they are fighting on behalf of their children for what they believe is in their children’s best interests against people who want to use those children against their parents to further their own ideological beliefs.

Who said that we should institutionalize kids? this is something you are projecting using your own bias.

What i said is kids will end up having to be institutionalized long term because their parents cannot cope. Maybe its not a big deal to folk with Asperger but kids on the autism spectrum who aren't help communicate can turn very violent. I know of a case recently where a woman was looking for the government to take her son off her hands as she could not cope.

As for the comments on Zappone, i am not a big fan of hers and agree with you on the direction of the trans parents but what i would be an advocate for is a policy inclusive of parents that includes them in the process rather than excludes. I know in Ireland given the recent evidence that we may not be there yet but its something we can hope for that there is care that is inclusive of the family ect.

Sleeper12 · 05-11-2018 6:18pm

Mr.Wemmick wrote:

Can you wear ear defenders that just look like a normal headphone set? You wouldn't look out of the ordinary wearing them at the start.. bands always take an age to come on stage.

I have orange rubber ear plugs. I don't look out of place as most of the roadies & Arena staff ware them.

I'm the only person wearing plugs before & after the gig but not during it. As others plug in I plug out

eviltwin · 05-11-2018 7:07pm

Both of my children have Aspergers and it's not that big a deal for us. I've always said our children will not be treated any different because of it so it doesn't make much of an impact to our lives, or rather, we don't let it.

It can be tough at times, my son struggles in school and my daughter has an obsession with cleanliness that regularly leads to arguments but everyone has something don't they?

One eyed Jack · 05-11-2018 7:20pm

Calhoun wrote: »

Who said that we should institutionalize kids? this is something you are projecting using your own bias.

What i said is kids will end up having to be institutionalized long term because their parents cannot cope. Maybe its not a big deal to folk with Asperger but kids on the autism spectrum who aren't help communicate can turn very violent. I know of a case recently where a woman was looking for the government to take her son off her hands as she could not cope.

As for the comments on Zappone, i am not a big fan of hers and agree with you on the direction of the trans parents but what i would be an advocate for is a police inclusive of parents that includes them in the process rather than excludes. I know in Ireland given the recent evidence that we may not be there yet but its something we can hope for that there is care that is inclusive of the family ect.

The institutionalising of children is where I thought you were going because that’s what generally happens with children with disabilities and developmental disorders when the State steps in in the interests of the children’s welfare when the parents are deemed to be incapable of providing for the child’s needs. They’re institutionalised until they either age out of the system, or are transferred to an adult rehabilitative facility. They don’t go on to have any opportunities in life and the whole process has a detrimental effect on their mental health.

When I say I know where you’re coming from, I really do, as I worked with children and adults with autism and other developmental disorders and intellectual disabilities for a number of years. That’s why the whole ‘aspies’ stuff really ticks me off, because it’s like trying to put a cutsie positive spin on what is a developmental disorder, and also why the whole ‘spectrum’ stuff is, from my point of view at least, a load of bollocks. There’s no risk for example of an adult diagnosed with aspergers putting your head through the window of a transit van because you naively insist on offering him an apple he doesn’t want :pac:

It was definitely a learning experience, from the non-verbal guy who liked to click his fingers in time with the vibrations of the van as we were driving, to the guy who never stopped talking and had a thing for men in uniform

I met plenty of parents (many of them elderly themselves) who couldn’t cope with their adult children’s disabilities, but then I also met plenty of parents who could and didn’t want their children labelled. It wasn’t because of any stigma, but simply because they didn’t regard their children in terms of what other people would see as a disability.

I just don’t agree with the current trend to pathologise children with an A to Z of clinical diagnoses which the criteria are being broadened all the time to include more children in this ‘spectrum’ of disorders from mental health disorders to developmental disorders, and there is a growing tendency among some parents to want to have their children diagnosed with something for which the parents can say ‘everything makes sense now’, and while it’s not so prevalent here in this country, in larger populations like the US and the UK it’s rife among certain demographics who have a propensity to want the medical and psychiatric professionals to agree with their diagnosis of their children’s behaviours because being ‘aspie’ or having ‘aspie’ children is trendy among that particular social demographic nowadays, quite the opposite of any perceived stigma about developmental disorders, it’s like it’s regarded as a badge of honour.

Hammer89 · 05-11-2018 7:40pm

I met a man with Aspergers in the United Kingdom earlier this year. We were staying at the same hostel. He'd hug me whenever I left the room, even if it was just for a cigarette. I thought it was weird at first, but eventually thought it was pretty sweet.

He was completely obsessed with heavy-duty machinery, like ferries and the trains and stuff like that. I made the mistake of mentioning that I went on the HSS when I was little, and half-an-hour later he's still talking about how it was such an amazing ship. It's really quite remarkable how much he knows about the HSS - the speed, the capacity - and his memory was second to none. He's about 40, but he and his family travelled to Ireland on the HSS when he was a kid, and he still remembered how to pronounce Dun Laoghaire, and he knew how to navigate around the town, from being there once 30 years ago. Phenomenal.

He was a lovely, lovely guy really. I accidentally gave him a panic attack, because he wished me Happy Birthday about a month before the actual event, because he wouldn't be around to say it in person, but then remarked that it was bad luck in Germany to do that. "Great, so if my plane crashes I know who to blame," I say, just messing, but he started getting super nervous at the thought of him accidentally causing my death.

He'd sit in the common room of the hostel, listening to heavy metal music on his phone and carefully unwrapping bits of RAM that he'd bought in CEX, as if he was unwrapping C4 or something. For such an intelligent and knowledgeable lad, he'd very often forget what he was talking about though, which I found interesting. I imagine his brain is constantly functioning at a higher level than mine at all times, so trains of thought can occasionally get a bit scrambled. I don't know if that's the science but it made sense to me.

Anyway, to my knowledge Colin is the first Aspergers sufferer I've ever met. I don't know if he is the atypical person with the condition, but if he is then I certainly wouldn't hold any negative prejudice toward them.

05-11-2018 7:47pm

professore wrote: »

I remember one night in particular where this particular guy showed up and no one else did and it was the most painful hour I ever put in in my life. The guy had no ability to hold a conversation. Everything was "Yes" and "No" answers. I eventually made my excuses and left.

I must say, this is one of the best AH threads I've seen in a long time- great examples and discussions going on- very informative.

@professore- a very similar experience to you. I used to meet up with a group of wider friends and acquaintances at events like weddings where there was this one person, who i invariably found myself sitting beside for a considerable time.

He worked in IT but to say he was monosyllabic would be generous- not just to me, just to people in general.

He just seemed very happy to sit there and say and do very little. What got me is I always felt bad thinking he didn't like me or was being ignorant- but I've heard since that just his way.

After reading this thread today, I thought of him and I really do feel, that he's on the spectrum in some way.

While the cause of Aspergers and Autism in general doesn't seem to be well defined, (although there is some genetic links i think in some cases) I understand that the older you are having a baby, the more the chances are that they will have it? Anyone have stats on that?

I know 4 couples out of my circle of friends - all had babies in their late 30's who have been now diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum- I thought this was quite unusual.

Early diagnosis is key in terms of starting appropriate treatments/therapies but also for the sanity of the parents. I spotted the signs in one of my friends kids at 18 months- I didn't mention it to the parents at the time as I felt it wasn't my place. They only started considering autism as a possibility in the last 6 months with the child well past 4 years of age.

gormdubhgorm · 05-11-2018 8:09pm

I thought about this thread where the OP asked if people with Aspergers were perceived as annoying weirdos.
The the OP belatedly revealed that he has Aspergers and it was an 'experiment' on his part.
The OP then totted up the number of thanks his original post got (prejudiced to aspergers) v another post (non-prejudiced to Aspergers).

Ironically this information is a truer reflection of an 'experiment' as you now have to ask yourself do you find the OP's behaviour annoying as you did not know you were part of an experiment?

paleoperson · 05-11-2018 8:22pm

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I thought about this thread where the OP asked if people with Aspergers were perceived as annoying weirdos.
The the OP belatedly revealed that he has Aspergers and it was an 'experiment' on his part.
The OP then totted up the number of thanks his original post got (prejudiced to aspergers) v another post (non-prejudiced to Aspergers).

Ironically this information is a truer reflection of an 'experiment' as you now have to ask yourself do you find the OP's behaviour annoying as you did not know you were part of an experiment?

I lose all respect for and interest in someone immediately when they try to trick or deceive me like that.

I am very much against any kind of "experiments" where some people are being deceived. I think they're wrong and at best pointless.

Wanderer78 · 05-11-2018 8:24pm

paleoperson wrote: »

I lose all respect for and interest in someone immediately when they try to trick or deceive me like that.

I am very much against any kind of "experiments" where some people are being deceived. I think they're wrong and at best pointless.

you must get very upset with the marketing and advertisement industry

paleoperson · 05-11-2018 8:26pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

you must get very upset with the marketing and advertisement industry

Why, do they do something like that?

Wanderer78 · 05-11-2018 8:28pm

paleoperson wrote: »

Why, do they do something like that?

experimentation of deception! oh yea, big time!

Riesen_Meal · 05-11-2018 8:36pm

My cousin has Asperger's, he was only diagnosed with it at the age of 28 I think, before that we were all convinced (and the doctors) he was dyslexic, he sat a dyslexic junior and leaving cert as thats what the diagnosis was, his writing and grammar was terrible, he always struggled with certain things like that..

He goes through phases in his life, one minute he is the biggest Trekkie you would ever meet and was borderline obsessed with Star Trek growing up, the next week he is a goth and wearing 3/4 length leather jackets and makeup... (at 37!)

He has a fairly normal life as it stands, he's a tradesman, works all his life, has a chick, who was a bit young for him when they first got together but she seems to get him, all in all he is fairly happy in his bubble...

I get the part about empathy, I think sometimes he does not know what he does be at and can get confused with himself...

If you met him you would just think he was odd, a strange kettle of fish, he is very mannerly and really nice and chatty etc...

I don't think of him as handicapped or anything of the sort, I just think you take him as he is...

maxwell smart · 05-11-2018 8:38pm

Fieldog wrote: »

My cousin has Asperger's, he was only diagnosed with it at the age of 28 I think, before that we were all convinced (and the doctors) he was dyslexic, he sat a dyslexic junior and leaving cert as thats what the diagnosis was, his writing and grammar was terrible, he always struggled with certain things like that..

He goes through phases in his life, one minute he is the biggest Trekkie you would ever meet and was borderline obsessed with Star Trek growing up, the next week he is a goth and wearing 3/4 length leather jackets and makeup... (at 37!)

He has a fairly normal life as it stands, he's a tradesman, works all his life, has a chick, who was a bit young for him when they first got together but she seems to get him, all in all he is fairly happy in his bubble...

I get the part about empathy, I think sometimes he does not know what he does be at and can get confused with himself...

If you met him you would just think he was odd, a strange kettle of fish, he is very mannerly and really nice and chatty etc...

I don't think of him as handicapped or anything of the sort, I just think you take him as he is...

Sounds like he has a great life and someone who cares about him. What more could someone want

wexie · 05-11-2018 8:39pm

Fieldog wrote: »

I don't think of him as handicapped or anything of the sort, I just think you take him as he is...

CinemaGuy45 · 05-11-2018 8:47pm

paleoperson wrote: »

I lose all respect for and interest in someone immediately when they try to trick or deceive me like that.

I am very much against any kind of "experiments" where some people are being deceived. I think they're wrong and at best pointless.

Social gaffes and mistakes are my life if one mistake is enough to turn you off somebody you really have zero understanding and tolerance for people on the spectrum.

wexie · 05-11-2018 8:49pm

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

Social gaffes and mistakes are my life if one mistake is enough to turn you off somebody you really have zero understanding and tolerance for people on the spectrum.

Or people in general one might argue....

MikeyTaylor · 05-11-2018 10:11pm

I have it.

CinemaGuy45 · 05-11-2018 10:14pm

MikeyTaylor wrote: »

I have it.

Your threads were part of my inspiration for this thread.
Read through quite a few of us here have it.

ToddyDoody · 05-11-2018 10:23pm

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

As regards the HSE I applied about 8 years ago still waiting to hear back.:rolleyes:

That's it. 50% of hse budget to Bulgarian hospitals that will schedule procedures and diagnoses for the Irish population. You know this makes more sense.

mvl · 05-11-2018 10:26pm

professore wrote: »

She needs some time to herself every day
...
she tends to talk and talk in social situations as a coping mechanism
...
The most difficult thing is that she is extremely stubborn and will never ever admit she is wrong about something.
Often the "being wrong" was her misunderstanding something that was said.
...
She gets obsessed with ... <insert_something_here>

... I read it was harder, but you got it working for your family unit, and communication got easier from when it was all in the open ...Thank you for sharing !

Also, I hope you won't mind quoting your message, but I can relate very well with all points above, while I think I am not exactly an average NT, as all my life I had my quirks. But I am also an IT professional and sometimes do wonder how much my job profile, the (cultural) environment, working close to some of my co-workers re-wired my brain to become who I am today.
- As someone said earlier that we're all on the spectrum in a way, think this has some truth in it

Since I was looking into the aspie female traits found this blog thought I'd post here: https://taniaannmarshall.wordpress.com/2013/03/26/moving-towards-a-female-profile-the-unique-characteristics-abilities-and-talents-of-asperwomen-adult-women-with-asperger-syndrome/

PS: @all, plse don't get into an aspie gender debate now

Wibbs · 05-11-2018 10:39pm

I find the stuff about the problems with overstimulation interesting. That as Calhoun said earlier folks with this condition find it hard to handle more than one "program" at a time coming down the line. I was only thinking on it in the car earlier. Apparently when you're born, you have more connections in your brain than an adult and very early on a process prunes these connections down so that you end up "normal".

I wonder is it this that's affected with Aspergers? That you folks that have this have too many of these connections that would otherwise have been pruned, so what is just background noise for me, unimportant until my brain decides it's important, comes in with equal importance and force for you guys?

A dodgy analogy might be: your brain is the CEO of a big company, it can't deal with all the minutia that's going on so it has a secretary that filters that stuff out and only passes on the important stuff. You guys are missing that assistant so the phones are constantly hopping off the hook?

EG. the Cocktail party effect, where you're at a gathering with the background drone of conversation that you dismiss on an instinctive level, but if someone calls or mentions your name you immediately pick that out. Would you folks with Aspergers be able to do that or would it be just too much stimulation going on?

That overstimulation must be a bloody nightmare for ye. Especially in modern society. Maybe one reason people were under diagnosed in the past partly because there was far less "noise" going on? EG an Aspie lad living in 1850's Italy working as an olive farmer would have far less "noise" in his life and environment. He might be seen as a bit odd, because he didn't like crowds at religious festivals or whatever, but otherwise would likely seem not odd at all.

05-11-2018 10:46pm

professore wrote: »

Most people who know her would say she is confident, articulate and outgoing. We get to see how draining she really finds it all and how little she actually enjoys it. I suspect there are nearly as many Aspie girls out there as boys, but the girls can hide it better.

I don't know about it but for autism there is a different set of criteria is my understanding as it presents differently in girls than boys
Or it's under reported in girls or camouflaged better as you say

What is your impression of Aspergers syndrome?

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