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Hairdressing course

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    #32
    ILoveYourVibes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,176 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    Also She is getting her Hair dressing course.
    She is also getting a Barbering course add on. She is getting a Beauty course. She is getting nutrition course as well. She got her Kit.

    What have we learned?

    Do your research long before enter the course. Meet and greet and what did the past students did and said.
    Cash is KING, If you have the cash price in your hand you can negotiate a BIG /Discount.
    Learn how to talk to course directors and how to negotiate. Be unsure when talking and look for an incentive and GET IT IN WRITING (written text email, negotiations may be protracted).
    If you have something of value engrave it, it wont stop it being robbed but it will deter others.
    Book the course late. IF there are a few days to go they will be desperate to fill a course.
    Expect your Kit to cost money as a budgeted extra!!!

    MIND YOUR TOOLS. There are tea leaves everywhere.

    That makes no sense.

    Hairdressers are better at doing blokes hair than barbers. Any hairdressing course should include everything in a barber course and more. If she IS REALLY doing a proper hairdressing course ..she would be well able to do men's hair way better than any barber ...so that means you have paid for something you do not need.

    There should be NO need for a hairdresser to do a barbering course after their training but the opposite is true. Barbers recieve far less training than hairdressers.

    You have said its a seven month course ....and she is doing beauty and nutrition as well ?

    Well then there is no way she will have time to become a fully qualified hairdresser in 7 months WITH all that on top.

    This course sounds awful.

    I don't think you understand how the industry works.

    She HAS to be able to do hair well if not perfectly ...every time ..no **** ups.

    Does she get any kind of placement? Internship etc for a few months?

    What hairdressing skills are they actually going to teach her?

    BTW City and Guilds IS the international qualification. But it depends on what level you have it to.

    I have city guilds NVQ level 3. (combined hair types). Its the bog standard qualification in the industry. But i also have my apprenticeship from the place i did it etc.


    Its not as simple as you do a course.

    You have to have a certain no of guided hrs (500) and working hours to build up your credits.

    Guided hrs are ..like under supervision or taught.

    Im kind of sceptical you could learn everything you need to in 7 months ..but everything you need AND beauty AND nutrition ...not convinced.

    Nobody cares what qualification she will have. They just care she can do everything from bayalage to cutting and get it right everytime on all hair types. She also has to be able to work quickly and neatly.

    Dont be surprised if after the course they still want her to do the apprenticeship in most salons unless its more flexible now then when i was doing it!


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    #33
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    ILoveYourVibes wrote: »
    That makes no sense.

    Hairdressers are better at doing blokes hair than barbers. Any hairdressing course should include everything in a barber course and more. If she IS REALLY doing a proper hairdressing course ..she would be well able to do men's hair way better than any barber ...so that means you have paid for something you do not need.

    There should be NO need for a hairdresser to do a barbering course after their training but the opposite is true. Barbers recieve far less training than hairdressers.

    You have said its a seven month course ....and she is doing beauty and nutrition as well ?

    Well then there is no way she will have time to become a fully qualified hairdresser in 7 months WITH all that on top.

    This course sounds awful.

    I don't think you understand how the industry works.

    She HAS to be able to do hair well if not perfectly ...every time ..no **** ups.

    Does she get any kind of placement? Internship etc for a few months?

    What hairdressing skills are they actually going to teach her?

    BTW City and Guilds IS the international qualification. But it depends on what level you have it to.

    I have city guilds NVQ level 3. (combined hair types). Its the bog standard qualification in the industry.


    Its not as simple as you do a course.

    You have to have a certain no of guided hrs (500) and working hours to build up your credits.

    Guided hrs are ..like under supervision or taught.

    You are right I have no idea about anything about hairdressing. I am learning it second hand from the wife after 3 days.

    Any hairdresser I have had do my hair left mine in a shambles. I never had a good cut until I was 25!!! Just thought that a barbers and hairdressers was the same thing. LOL how naive I was.

    Well the barbering course is separate course and takes in shaving. Its an extra piece of paper. Who are we to refuse?

    The nutrition is a separate course and the Beauty is a separate course.

    I am NOT on the course myself but she is getting her certification. Trust me if Shampoo and conditioner werent written on the bottle I wouldnt know the difference or care.

    What are they teaching her? I occasionally look over her should so she is doing the physiology of hair, chemical interactions, health safety, hair up styles hair down styles, washing hair, colouring hair.

    I understand there is loads of CPD courses to beat the band.

    I am a straight male, I have no interest in hair styling but I do look in, I dont have all the technical jargon. I am just learning too.

    No placement or internship but Mrs Skooter is more than competent to sort that out herself.

    In all fairness she isnt a 19 year old glued to the phone, switching between apps and chatting about going out the weekend to her colleague at the same time. She has proven herself at management level. The first hair she cut was mine and it was better as my mothers hairdresser normally did at home (The hair dresser with 20 year exp was dire). So It was a great first attempt.

    She is going to be amazing and she has great customer focus.


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    #34
    ILoveYourVibes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,176 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    What are they teaching her? I occasionally look over her should so she is doing the physiology of hair, chemical interactions, health safety, hair up styles hair down styles, washing hair, colouring hair.


    You are very naive. But good luck to her.
    I think you have been ripped off but anyway.

    You know what you have described is basically a 1st year trainee level? Or maybe even the first six months.


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    #35
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    ILoveYourVibes wrote: »
    You are very naive. But good luck to her.
    I think you have been ripped off but anyway.

    You know what you have described is basically a 1st year trainee level? Or maybe even the first six months.

    It takes 4 years to do a level 3 fetac course ..... now that is taking the Mick.
    That is dragged out longer than it needs to be.
    I did see her text book and there is a good bit of theory a kin to the same its about 2.5 cm thick.


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    #36
    Airyfairy12
    Registered Users Posts: 3,390 ✭✭✭Airyfairy12


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    It takes 4 years to do a level 3 fetac course ..... now that is taking the Mick.
    That is dragged out longer than it needs to be.
    I did see her text book and there is a good bit of theory a kin to the same its about 2.5 cm thick.

    It does not take 4 years to do a fetac level 3, thats equivalent to junior cert level, you would finish a level 3 in a year part time.
    A fetac level 6 takes 2 years full time, 4 years part time.
    Its not a Bachelors degree she's undertaking.


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    #37
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    Airyfairy12 wrote: »
    It does not take 4 years to do a fetac level 3, thats equivalent to junior cert level, you would finish a level 3 in a year part time.
    A fetac level 6 takes 2 years full time, 4 years part time.
    Its not a Bachelors degree she's undertaking.

    That sounds more like sense and what it is.


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    #38
    ILoveYourVibes
    Registered Users Posts: 15,176 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    It takes 4 years to do a level 3 fetac course ..... now that is taking the Mick.
    That is dragged out longer than it needs to be.
    I did see her text book and there is a good bit of theory a kin to the same its about 2.5 cm thick.
    4 years apprenticeship was dragged out so they could get income out of you as you took clients before you moved on. 'Trainees' would be do clients and have most of that income going to someone else.

    People realized this and started to make more options for people. So you could do 3 year and 2 year apprenticeships and get the same qualification.Most apprenticeships seem to be 3 years now.

    It was seen as modernizing the industry but lots of people still do the 4 year apprenticeship and its probably the most respected way to become qualified in the industry. The NCQ levels and city guilds etc were just ways of showing certification if you left the country etc.

    By the way .every apprentice GETS the city and guilds qualification at some point during their apprenticeship.

    She isn't doing a degree its a TRADE. Its like 4 years to be come an electrician.

    this is a one year course ....that offers an apprenticeship at the end ..and its like 400 euro.
    https://www.cdcfe.ie/courses/hairdressing/

    From what you are saying it doesnt sound like she will be fully qualifed when she finishes and will still have to do some sort of apprenticeship at the end.
    I hope she knows this.
    I did see her text book and there is a good bit of theory a kin to the same its about 2.5 cm thick.

    You need to know the theory. But its a practical profession ...it can take years to become a good colorist or decent at cutting etc.

    Its not something you can bluff your way through. Its a skill like being a good carpenter etc. Or a good mechanic.

    Generally 1st year would be what you described you learn styling etc hair theory ...all the theory you will need regarding colour perming ..while you practise the basics of blow drying ..then the last six months of the first year you do colour ...2nd year perming ..and later part of 2nd year or 3rd year cutting. Cutting is usually the last thing you learn. From then on you are just on the floor either for the last two years or the last year ..depending on how fast you learn.

    Even then after four years a lot of places want people with 2 years MORE experience.

    4k seems like a lot.


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    #39
    Faith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,655 Mod ✭✭✭✭Faith


    Maybe, OP, if you shared details of the course (name, website, etc), people here could have a look for themselves and it might save you having to answer a lot of the questions? I'm sure a legit course will have all the details of apprenticeships, qualifications, etc on their website for all to clearly see.


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    #40
    Dizzyblonde
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,108 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dizzyblonde


    All I can say is that as a hairdresser myself, expensive courses such as this make me very angry.

    There are no shortcuts into hairdressing, and there is no way anyone would be employable as a qualified stylist at the end of it. Yes, a four year apprenticeship is unnecessary, but there is just no replacement for a minimum of two years on a salon floor learning every aspect of your craft and dealing with every possible style/colour/type of hair over and over. Learning to blow dry all sorts of hair, and to colour hair properly, and to cut all types of hair. At best, these courses will shave a small amount of time off an apprenticeship in a salon setting.

    OP, if your wife sets herself up in business as a hairstylist at the end of this course I'm afraid she's going to find herself way out of her depth.


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    #41
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    Faith wrote: »
    Maybe, OP, if you shared details of the course (name, website, etc), people here could have a look for themselves and it might save you having to answer a lot of the questions? I'm sure a legit course will have all the details of apprenticeships, qualifications, etc on their website for all to clearly see.

    Well you see if I told you the course, she was the only one who paid cash up front and got a discount. That could cause friction in the class later on.

    I hope you wont be disappointed if I dont have permission to share. That would draw negative attention to my wife. There are commercial partners for the course (Big recognisable brands even to me).


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    #42
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    Dizzyblonde wrote: »
    All I can say is that as a hairdresser myself, expensive courses such as this make me very angry.

    There are no shortcuts into hairdressing, and there is no way anyone would be employable as a qualified stylist at the end of it. Yes, a four year apprenticeship is unnecessary, but there is just no replacement for a minimum of two years on a salon floor learning every aspect of your craft and dealing with every possible style/colour/type of hair over and over. Learning to blow dry all sorts of hair, and to colour hair properly, and to cut all types of hair. At best, these courses will shave a small amount of time off an apprenticeship in a salon setting.

    OP, if your wife sets herself up in business as a hairstylist at the end of this course I'm afraid she's going to find herself way out of her depth.

    You think €4,200 is expensive for a course? Wait until I tell you about University or post graduate stuff. Its a cheap course for a job that will always in demand and done in a short time. I am starting my university course costing €9k a year for the next 4 years and then have to do a masters afterwards. Education is expensive.

    Hairdressing and Acupuncture are like painting, the more you do the better you get. Nobody is saying it is the final qualification.


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    #43
    Dizzyblonde
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,108 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dizzyblonde


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    You think €4,200 is expensive for a course? Wait until I tell you about University or post graduate stuff. Its a cheap course for a job that will always in demand and done in a short time. I am starting my university course costing €9k a year for the next 4 years and then have to do a masters afterwards. Education is expensive.

    Hairdressing and Acupuncture are like painting, the more you do the better you get. Nobody is saying it is the final qualification.

    You don't have to explain the cost of education to me, I've raised a family and know precisely what university costs at all levels. Hairdressing is not education and can't be approached in the same way. It is a trade, and is practical training and experience for the most part. You can't buy experience. I hate to tell you, but if you've paid €4,200 or anything close to it you've been royally ripped off.

    I've seen your approach to hairdressing before, always in people who aren't hairdressers, and tbh it's quite naive. It will be interesting to see how many people drop out of the course before it's finished. Many apprentices drop out because not everyone has the ability or the patience for hairdressing.


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    #44
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    Dizzyblonde wrote: »
    I've seen your approach to hairdressing before, always in people who aren't hairdressers, and tbh it's quite naive. It will be interesting to see how many people drop out of the course before it's finished. Many apprentices drop out because not everyone has the ability or the patience for hairdressing.

    Yeah I have seen kids getting apprenticeships before and not understanding them. They see the softer money working in the factory and other things and leave. Yes it is a problem but that is with kids these are all mature students. It was addressed on the course that younger people have shorter attention spans and haven't developed professional skills. I do realise it takes time to build a practice or business.


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    #45
    Airyfairy12
    Registered Users Posts: 3,390 ✭✭✭Airyfairy12


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    Yeah I have seen kids getting apprenticeships before and not understanding them. They see the softer money working in the factory and other things and leave. Yes it is a problem but that is with kids these are all mature students. It was addressed on the course that younger people have shorter attention spans and haven't developed professional skills. I do realise it takes time to build a practice or business.

    Comparing the price of a hairdressing course to a BA in a University is ridiculous OP, I don't know how or why youre drawing any comparison between the two.

    If you can afford to spend 9K a year for 4 years surely your wife can invest her time and money in a full time 2 year hairdressing course that will give her the knowledge and skills that she needs.

    Keep in mind, when she finishes her 7 month part time course she will be competing for jobs against people who have the full qualification + at least a year of experience.

    If you dont mind me saying, youre sounding completely out of touch. If you think your wife will be setting up a lucrative business in 7 months to a years time you are very much mistaken. You are setting yourselves up for some serious debt in the coming years if you dont go about this the right way which is unfortunately the long way.


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    #46
    Dizzyblonde
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,108 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dizzyblonde


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    Yeah I have seen kids getting apprenticeships before and not understanding them. They see the softer money working in the factory and other things and leave. Yes it is a problem but that is with kids these are all mature students. It was addressed on the course that younger people have shorter attention spans and haven't developed professional skills. I do realise it takes time to build a practice or business.

    I would say on balance that older apprentices are far more likely to drop out, and mainly because of the workload and menial tasks required of them during training. The lower wage won't get in the way of a young apprentice who really wants to be a hairdresser.
    No course will get you out of cleaning mirrors, sweeping up hair and being sent to the shop for a qualified stylist's lunch when you move on to a salon to finish your training.


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    #47
    Dizzyblonde
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,108 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dizzyblonde


    Airyfairy12 wrote: »
    Comparing the price of a hairdressing course to a BA in a University is ridiculous OP, I don't know how or why youre drawing any comparison between the two.

    If you can afford to spend 9K a year for 4 years surely your wife can invest her time and money in a full time 2 year hairdressing course that will give her the knowledge and skills that she needs.

    Keep in mind, when she finishes her 7 month part time course she will be competing for jobs against people who have the full qualification + at least a year of experience.

    If you dont mind me saying, youre sounding completely out of touch. If you think your wife will be setting up a lucrative business in 7 months to a years time you are very much mistaken. You are setting yourselves up for some serious debt in the coming years if you dont go about this the right way which is unfortunately the long way.

    Wait - it's only part time? I would class that course an introduction to hairdressing. She'll still have to go into any reputable salon at the bottom.


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    #48
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    Mrs SkooterBlue would like to thank you all for your time and experience.

    Mod- would you kindly close the post. Thank you to all involved.


This discussion has been closed.
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