Cross Pens

DroidJoi · 09-01-2021 11:22pm

Made an order of nearly €200 on the 1st. No further correspondence yet. Only used the main code.

KinsellaJ · 09-01-2021 11:26pm

Has anybody with an engraved pen got a shipping notification yet? Ordered an engraved pen on the 1st and refills on the 2nd but no shipping email yet? Pen works out about €40 and refills work out about €14 so expecting fee's for the pen!

DroidJoi · 09-01-2021 11:42pm

KinsellaJ wrote: »

Has anybody with an engraved pen got a shipping notification yet? Ordered an engraved pen on the 1st and refills on the 2nd but no shipping email yet? Pen works out about €40 and refills work out about €14 so expecting fee's for the pen!

I think I read that engraving takes longer. Not sure.

Mine isn't engraved and I ordered on the 1st. Orders after me are being processed and shipped before mine so I guess they don't have any systematic way of processing orders...

blindsider · 09-01-2021 11:44pm

If a company is charging in € from a .ie website, surely you'd expect that 'the price is the price'?

Similarly, if you're directed to an Irish page on a website, with € pricing...then how can VAT + Customs + Handling be added? Especially if there's no disclaimer...

Lucifer · 09-01-2021 11:57pm

blindsider wrote: »

If a company is charging in € from a .ie website, surely you'd expect that 'the price is the price'?

Similarly, if you're directed to an Irish page on a website, with € pricing...then how can VAT + Customs + Handling be added? Especially if there's no disclaimer...

Expect is the key word in your first sentence. Yes, most people would expect, but as the other poster pointed out, not all .ie websites dispatch from Ireland.

Unfortunately customs/revenue are only concerned with the origin of the package, not what the website says or doesnt say.

I would agree, websites should probably be more clear where you are buying goods from, rather than the customer having to try figure it out, especially with a .ie domain.

I think unless this happens, we are left to figure out if a .ie is infact coming from Ireland.

EDIT I would not be happy ordering something off a .ie website, and having it shipped from china and then getting hit with customs that were not expected. So a .ie should not really be doing the same from the UK without making their customers aware that custom charges may apply.

I have often seen websites state, "Custom charges may apply". .ie based stores should be including this same information.

Especially as .ie domains are protected and only allowed to companies or persons that have a connection to Ireland

Lucifer · 10-01-2021 12:07am

DroidJoi wrote: »

Made an order of nearly €200 on the 1st. No further correspondence yet. Only used the main code.

Expect charges of about €47. If you feel with this charge it is no longer good value contact cross and cancel. A few others have done so any they cancelled their orders for them. If it has dispatched, refuse delivery and they should refund you.

mik_da_man · 10-01-2021 2:16am

I ordered on the 1st, just over 100 quid.
Nada from then yet
So going on others experience I guess it will be 26 quid.
I have emailed them already about the VAT and plan to get them to refund that.

torrevieja · 10-01-2021 2:38am

blindsider wrote: »

If a company is charging in € from a .ie website, surely you'd expect that 'the price is the price'?

Similarly, if you're directed to an Irish page on a website, with € pricing...then how can VAT + Customs + Handling be added? Especially if there's no disclaimer...

Absoultely Agree , and i woulld blame the Company for this Set Up and this needs to be Addressed From the Hirearchy from now on,

endacl · 10-01-2021 2:45am

mik_da_man wrote: »

I ordered on the 1st, just over 100 quid.
Nada from then yet
So going on others experience I guess it will be 26 quid.
I have emailed them already about the VAT and plan to get them to refund that.

Not that simple. If they refund the value of the VAT, they are essentially reducing the purchase price. VAT would still be due @ 21% of (just over 100 quid, minus 26 quid). Revenue would owe you about a fiver back, which would be a pain in the arse to chase on principle.

Joys of Brexit.

DroidJoi · 10-01-2021 2:51am

Lucifer wrote: »

Expect charges of about €47. If you feel with this charge it is no longer good value contact cross and cancel. A few others have done so any they cancelled their orders for them. If it has dispatched, refuse delivery and they should refund you.

Thanks. I had emailed them about cancelling and another email asking about VAT. No reply yet, wanted something in writing around the VAT.

I would have thought that they will cancel/suspend all orders when the first few landed in Ireland and DHL started charging.

Ignorance isn't an excuse for them anymore.

DroidJoi · 10-01-2021 3:00am

mik_da_man wrote: »

I ordered on the 1st, just over 100 quid.
Nada from then yet
So going on others experience I guess it will be 26 quid.
I have emailed them already about the VAT and plan to get them to refund that.

It isn't as easy as that. They already paid UK VAT, refunding the customer will lead to double VAT, etc. and a non-taxable expense for Cross i.e. it come out of their net revenue.

At this stage I personally see just one option for orders already dispatched which is to pay the charges and at least get a product. The other option of refusing delivery is another uncertainty, won't be straightforward getting your money back!

For orders not yet dispatched, we probably have one last chance to cancel.

Luckycharms_74 · 10-01-2021 9:34am

GalwayGaillimh wrote: »

Rang Cross talked to a gentleman named Steve he said same thing warehouse had a covid outbreak hence the delay , orders being processed and they use DHL for delivery and as regards vat dutys etc he said price you see is price you pay :-)

I emailed a few days about order update but no reply yet. I think I’ll call them tomorrow as one pen is engraved for a birthday gift for end of January

beardybrewer · 10-01-2021 10:40am

I got my ship notification yesterday.

richardw001 · 10-01-2021 10:46am

endacl wrote: »

Not that simple. If they refund the value of the VAT, they are essentially reducing the purchase price. VAT would still be due @ 21% of (just over 100 quid, minus 26 quid). Revenue would owe you about a fiver back, which would be a pain in the arse to chase on principle.

Joys of Brexit.

This is an interesting read guys

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/consumer/online-shopping-from-the-uk-delivers-financial-shocks-1.4451638

The thing that bugs me - is that I dont think we should be getting hit with admin fees from an post and courier companies.

Paying the VAT is one thing - and I didn't mind paying these extra sort of charges before for stuff from China or the US - however, the way the Irish and UK governments have left this is - the UK or Irish customer is paying VAT in both countries and admin fees to various companies.

And every time you order online you have to check whether something is being shipped from the UK or the EU - really not ideal

vicwatson · 10-01-2021 12:03pm

richardw001 wrote: »

This is an interesting read guys

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/consumer/online-shopping-from-the-uk-delivers-financial-shocks-1.4451638

The thing that bugs me - is that I dont think we should be getting hit with admin fees from an post and courier companies.

Paying the VAT is one thing - and I didn't mind paying these extra sort of charges before for stuff from China or the US - however, the way the Irish and UK governments have left this is - the UK or Irish customer is paying VAT in both countries and admin fees to various companies.

And every time you order online you have to check whether something is being shipped from the UK or the EU - really not ideal

Paywall

10-01-2021 12:29pm

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

In crosses case they likely never had an obligation to register in Ireland as I assume they never sold enough to breach the registration threshold. They like plenty of other uk exporters didn’t do their Brexit homework, customer experience own goal for them. The company I work for did their due diligence and have the adequate plans in place.

As for those “threatening” to send a dear John email to cross saying hello I availed a loophole in your ordering system were I stacked discount codes now I demand another 21% refund to cover Irish vat. Dream on if you thing cross are effectively going to give you another 21% discount which it will be for them.

Some posters need a reality check, much of the bargains on here are risky, you win some and lose some so grow up and put this in the missed out pile.

I’d suggest those who want to continue to chance their arm with purchases from outside the European Union should do some research so they know the risks and can decide it worth it

dakar · 10-01-2021 12:30pm

My DHL tracking has ‘Customs Status Updated’ at Shannon (I assume the DHL depot there) as the second step before the package was even collected. Item still in the UK, due for delivery on Tuesday. I’m guessing I’ll get a customs payment request after it lands in Ireland.

Still, €37.78 (+ whatever charges) for €130 rrp of pens is still ok by me.

Blanchy90 · 10-01-2021 12:51pm

Mayo_fan wrote: »

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

Bit off topic but Screwfix do have shops in Ireland so they should be sorting out the vat on any online orders. I'd be pretty annoyed if I ordered from them and had to pay vat on top.

whiterebel · 10-01-2021 1:12pm

I ordered on 3rd. 2 pens total €36.25. Shipped on Friday, departed E Midlands early hours. No notification of more charges, although it says they may be due.

whiterebel · 10-01-2021 1:13pm

Blanchy90 wrote: »

Bit off topic but Screwfix do have shops in Ireland so they should be sorting out the vat on any online orders. I'd be pretty annoyed if I ordered from them and had to pay vat on top.

"Orders made from our Screwfix Ireland website will not have any export tax attached to them.
I hope this helps,
If you have any further inquiries please do not hesitate to get back in contact with us."

Jonesy101 · 10-01-2021 2:15pm

Mayo_fan wrote: »

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

In crosses case they likely never had an obligation to register in Ireland as I assume they never sold enough to breach the registration threshold. They like plenty of other uk exporters didn’t do their Brexit homework, customer experience own goal for them. The company I work for did their due diligence and have the adequate plans in place.

As for those “threatening” to send a dear John email to cross saying hello I availed a loophole in your ordering system were I stacked discount codes now I demand another 21% refund to cover Irish vat. Dream on if you thing cross are effectively going to give you another 21% discount which it will be for them.

Some posters need a reality check, much of the bargains on here are risky, you win some and lose some so grow up and put this in the missed out pile.

I’d suggest those who want to continue to chance their arm with purchases from outside the European Union should do some research so they know the risks and can decide it worth it

Well said! So many whingers on here about scamming a price mistake likely getting someone in trouble or fired or whinging about a few cents saved when buying a product they dont even want.

lawred2 · 10-01-2021 2:52pm

Mayo_fan wrote: »

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

In crosses case they likely never had an obligation to register in Ireland as I assume they never sold enough to breach the registration threshold. They like plenty of other uk exporters didn’t do their Brexit homework, customer experience own goal for them. The company I work for did their due diligence and have the adequate plans in place.

As for those “threatening” to send a dear John email to cross saying hello I availed a loophole in your ordering system were I stacked discount codes now I demand another 21% refund to cover Irish vat. Dream on if you thing cross are effectively going to give you another 21% discount which it will be for them.

Some posters need a reality check, much of the bargains on here are risky, you win some and lose some so grow up and put this in the missed out pile.

I’d suggest those who want to continue to chance their arm with purchases from outside the European Union should do some research so they know the risks and can decide it worth it

Surely the refund request would be for the UK VAT.

Do you really think that their sales into Ireland didn't exceed 35k? If so Ireland is a mickey mouse market for them. Can't see them bothering to serve Ireland with a dedicated operation. They'll have to append us to another EU operation.

I'd agree that seeking a VAT refund from them after using a stack of discount codes would be rather brass faced.

swingking · 10-01-2021 3:18pm

Did anyone who ordered on the 1st NOT get a shipping notification.

I ordered a pen on the 1st and a pen on the 3rd but haven't got a shipping notification for either.

Nigel Fairservice · 10-01-2021 3:29pm

swingking wrote: »

Did anyone who ordered on the 1st NOT get a shipping notification.

I ordered a pen on the 1st and a pen on the 3rd but haven't got a shipping notification for either.

I ordered on the first but haven’t got a shipping notification. I got mine engraved so that might be the source of the delay.

Unknownability · 10-01-2021 3:38pm

I ordered on the 1st and have heard nothing.

10-01-2021 4:13pm

the pen is mightier than the boards

mik_da_man · 10-01-2021 4:14pm

DroidJoi wrote: »

It isn't as easy as that. They already paid UK VAT, refunding the customer will lead to double VAT, etc. and a non-taxable expense for Cross i.e. it come out of their net revenue.

At this stage I personally see just one option for orders already dispatched which is to pay the charges and at least get a product. The other option of refusing delivery is another uncertainty, won't be straightforward getting your money back!

For orders not yet dispatched, we probably have one last chance to cancel.

Well that's not correct, they have not paid any VAT yet.
They have only charged the customer.

They obviously don't have their IT systems setup correctly as the transaction should have not attracted VAT in the first place, (place if supply) they are not liable to pay the sakes VAT on a transaction to Ireland. So honestly I don't see the issue claiming it back.
In fact if they had their systems setup correctly or revised invoices to Irish customers a refund is due.

The code stacking is a different issue, some codes stacked and some did not. We don't know for sure but they could have intentionally let them stack.

august12 · 10-01-2021 4:15pm

Unknownability wrote: »

I ordered on the 1st and have heard nothing.

Same here, no shipping notification, ordered on the 1st and no engraving.

mik_da_man · 10-01-2021 4:41pm

august12 wrote: »

Same here, no shipping notification, ordered on the 1st and no engraving.

Same here

DroidJoi · 10-01-2021 5:52pm

mik_da_man wrote: »

Well that's not correct, they have not paid any VAT yet.
They have only charged the customer.

They obviously don't have their IT systems setup correctly as the transaction should have not attracted VAT in the first place, (place if supply) they are not liable to pay the sakes VAT on a transaction to Ireland. So honestly I don't see the issue claiming it back.
In fact if they had their systems setup correctly or revised invoices to Irish customers a refund is due.

The code stacking is a different issue, some codes stacked and some did not. We don't know for sure but they could have intentionally let them stack.

UK VAT already prepaid. That was always the arrangement.

Wolftown · 10-01-2021 6:11pm

Ordered on the 1st, no engraving and received a shipping notification yesterday

mik_da_man · 10-01-2021 8:30pm

DroidJoi wrote: »

UK VAT already prepaid. That was always the arrangement.

But it shouldn't.. it's a zero rated export.
Either that or they charge Irish VAT

Anyway I'll wait and see what happens, I've no issues paying VAT but not twice.

DroidJoi · 10-01-2021 8:47pm

mik_da_man wrote: »

But it shouldn't.. it's a zero rated export.
Either that or they charge Irish VAT

Anyway I'll wait and see what happens, I've no issues paying VAT but not twice.

That's the whole point. No one expected to be paying VAT in two countries. Cross were clueless about paying Irish VAT thinking paying UK VAT covers them. Now customer are being charged Irish VAT. When you say you will ask for VAT back they need to apply for a UK refund the success of which is anyone's guess...

This isn't a unique Cross problem, they were just too ignorant... and still are!

M&S, Tesco, etc. having even greater problems regarding re-exporting...

The fault lies in Mr. Johnson selling a narrative that nothing changes, when in fact every process changes... maybe not the end result which is "tariff free" after jumping through multiple hoops.

Prefect_1998 · 10-01-2021 8:52pm

Orderd 2 seperste pens and confirmation mail received for both.

First order i have a DHL tracking, this was not an engraved pen.

Second order was engraved, just received a refund of the payment to revolut. Very strange experience so far

Gerard93 · 10-01-2021 8:56pm

Anyone compare prices against Easons? I checked one Roller Ball pen and it's the same price and free delivery over €10, the only discount that seems available now with Cross is the introductory discount when you sign up, but anything over €22 is liable for Customs etc as mentioned/

Lucifer · 10-01-2021 9:05pm

They do not need to seek a refund. They won't have paid the VAT to HMRC yet. They will have accounted for it on their books. They could do a refund for the full amount. Then invoice at 0 rate for export.

Example.

They charged 100. They owe 20 to HMRC.

They credit 100, 20 of which is VAT, cancelling the previous that they owe.

They then charge 80 at 0% as an export.

They still have their 80 that they originally would have been keeping. HMRC shouldn't have got the 20 on the export in the first place, so they are not suffering.

You receive the goods, and pay Irish VAT here.

I personally am not going to do this as on my order its not a huge amount of money for the time involved for myself and cross staff. By the time I get through, explain above and then hope the person on the other end of the phone will understand, be willing, and have the ability to do a 0% rate on their system, this is just not worth the €5 involved.

Nunu · 10-01-2021 9:31pm

Nunu wrote: »

Just noticed on their ‘shipping & delivery’ page there is the line, ‘We are currently unable to process any engraved orders’. So these orders might not be processed?

Although all other info on the page has not been updated since Christmas period because it still has Christmas dates etc.

... just reposting this info in case it was missed. Because reading through last few pages a lot of questions re engraved orders.

I have feeling no engraved orders will be fulfilled?

Prefect_1998 · 10-01-2021 11:25pm

Nunu wrote: »

... just reposting this info in case it was missed. Because reading through last few pages a lot of questions re engraved orders.

I have feeling no engraved orders will be fulfilled?

Mine was just refunded

eclipsechaser · 10-01-2021 11:27pm

glasso wrote: »

the pen is mightier than the boards

Too soon.

kollegeknight · 11-01-2021 3:23am

danielle_door wrote: »

Mine was just refunded

Just refunded also.

lawred2 · 11-01-2021 8:41am

kollegeknight wrote: »

Just refunded also.

Did you try and add engraving?

whiterebel · 11-01-2021 9:03am

Payment notice received, €6.29 VAT and €5 clearance.

swingking · 11-01-2021 9:08am

danielle_door wrote: »

Mine was just refunded

Did you get an email confirming this?

kollegeknight · 11-01-2021 9:23am

lawred2 wrote: »

Did you try and add engraving?

No engraving. One Gel pen- the Ferrari ones. €19 including postage

kollegeknight · 11-01-2021 9:24am

swingking wrote: »

Did you get an email confirming this?

Nothing bar spam emails on 35% discounts.

sydthebeat · 11-01-2021 9:29am

My €26 order payment is still pending from my aib account

lawred2 · 11-01-2021 9:42am

kollegeknight wrote: »

No engraving. One Gel pen- the Ferrari ones. €19 including postage

Was it a refund or a release of previously held funds?

Funds can get automatically released after a length of time if a transaction doesn't complete. Doesn't necessarily mean that the order was cancelled.

Luckycharms_74 · 11-01-2021 10:06am

Just got through to CS. The guy said the engraved pen I ordered is out of stock. He said the best thing to do is cancel the complete order and put through a new one :rolleyes:.

The problem is now if I order today for a birthday gift I don't think it will arrive in time

Just tried to look at putting through similar pen order

Subtotal €53.50
15% discount - New Customer -€8.03
Shipping (Pens & Accessories - Standard (5 - 7 Working Days)) €4.99

Est. Total €50.46

Plus the Irish VAT & Import charges I'm guessing around €70 total for the pen

11-01-2021 10:42am

Two orders, one on 5th one on 6th. Neither engraved. Order from 5th shipped this morning. Payment still pending for both (AIB).

hhmmm? · 11-01-2021 10:43am

Just got another email and SMS advising of delivery and still no mention of customs or VAT. Is this unusual or will they just tell the missus when she answers the door?

Cross Pens

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