Twitter removing "master", "slave", and "blacklist" to be more inclusi

03-07-2020 11:49am #1

Twitter engineers replacing racially loaded tech terms like 'master,' 'slave'

No.. Not from their site's content or tweets.. From its codebase.

Since when does a programming language need to be more inclusive? Last year apparently. Some worthless cúnt who works there took issue with it and decided to save the world from racism and slavery.

But more importantly, how on Earth are "master" or "slave" racially loaded terms when there are more slaves now than ever before, and they're not all black, and the majority of slaves are owned by people of their own race? Why is America trying to force this idea on us that only black people have ever been slaves and only white people have ever been slave owners?

If they cared about black slavery, they should campaign for black people to stop selling black people to black people in Africa. But I guess it's easier to spend a few mill changing a programming language.

DrumSteve · 03-07-2020 11:50am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Twitter engineers replacing racially loaded tech terms like 'master,' 'slave'

No.. Not from their site's content or tweets.. From its codebase.

Since when does a programming language need to be more inclusive? Last year apparently. Some worthless cúnt who works there took issue with it and decided to save the world from racism and slavery.

But more importantly, how on Earth are "master" or "slave" racially loaded terms when there are more slaves now than ever before, and they're not all black, and the majority of slaves are owned by people of their own race? Why is America trying to force this idea on us that only black people have ever been slaves and only white people have ever been slave owners?

If they cared about black slavery, they should campaign for black people to stop selling black people to black people in Africa. But I guess it's easier to spend a few mill changing a programming language.

Are you triggered?

You seem triggered.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 11:52am

How can you possibly be this upset about something this small?

Twitter is making some small changes to the terminology they use in their coding, spare me the outrage.

This doesn’t effect you even a little bit.

Skylinehead · 03-07-2020 11:53am

Deleted User wrote: »

Twitter engineers replacing racially loaded tech terms like 'master,' 'slave'

No.. Not from their site's content or tweets.. From its codebase.

Since when does a programming language need to be more inclusive? Last year apparently. Some worthless cúnt who works there took issue with it and decided to save the world from racism and slavery.

But more importantly, how on Earth are "master" or "slave" racially loaded terms when there are more slaves now than ever before, and they're not all black, and the majority of slaves are owned by people of their own race? Why is America trying to force this idea on us that only black people have ever been slaves and only white people have ever been slave owners?

If they cared about black slavery, they should campaign for black people to stop selling black people to black people in Africa. But I guess it's easier to spend a few mill changing a programming language.

Jenkins did this years ago, hardly news.

Also there's no chance this costs "a few million". It's just a term used amongst people mostly, there'll be little reference in code to those terms. Hardly a full refactor of their codebase.

03-07-2020 11:53am

DrumSteve wrote: »

Are you triggered?

You seem triggered.

I just think it's completely and utterly retarded.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 11:55am

And people call liberals snowflakes...

DrumSteve · 03-07-2020 11:56am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I just think it's completely and utterly retarded.

Genuinely, will this ever affect you in any way, shape or form?

Will the changing of this language alter any part of your life?

There is obviously a massive problem with modern day Slavery (especially in Libya) which does require a wider conversation. But Twitter making this change is not an issue at all.

newirishman · 03-07-2020 11:57am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I just think it's completely and utterly retarded.

Just out of curiosity - do you work in software development?

I do, and I think "whatever".

MFPM · 03-07-2020 11:57am

Deleted User wrote: »

Twitter engineers replacing racially loaded tech terms like 'master,' 'slave'

No.. Not from their site's content or tweets.. From its codebase.

Since when does a programming language need to be more inclusive? Last year apparently. Some worthless cúnt who works there took issue with it and decided to save the world from racism and slavery.

But more importantly, how on Earth are "master" or "slave" racially loaded terms when there are more slaves now than ever before, and they're not all black, and the majority of slaves are owned by people of their own race? Why is America trying to force this idea on us that only black people have ever been slaves and only white people have ever been slave owners?

If they cared about black slavery, they should campaign for black people to stop selling black people to black people in Africa. But I guess it's easier to spend a few mill changing a programming language.

What an odd reaction you have, anyway could you elaborate on the piece I've highlighted with some detail and evidence.

The Mighty Quinn · 03-07-2020 11:57am

Master and slave would also be common terminology when it comes to alarm systems and other electrical bits and pieces. Antiquated perhaps, but don't see the need to retain the term, or get rid of it. Either way. Meh.

TomTomTim · 03-07-2020 11:57am

KiKi III wrote: »

How can you possibly be this upset about something this small?

Twitter is making some small changes to the terminology they use in their coding, spare me the outrage.

This doesn’t effect you even a little bit.

You made this argument before, and you were shown how weak said argument was, yet here you are again. You people never learn, you go around in a loop of denial, over and over again.

03-07-2020 11:59am

newirishman wrote: »

Just out of curiosity - do you work in software development?

I do, and I think "whatever".

Yes, I code. I adopt children and then I kill them.

MFPM wrote: »

What an odd reaction you have, anyway could you elaborate on the piece I've highlighted with some detail and evidence.

No.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 11:59am

TomTomTim wrote: »

You made this argument before, and you were shown how weak said argument was, yet here you are again. You people never learn, you go around in a loop of denial, over and over again.

Sorry, who are you?

hellsing101 · 03-07-2020 12:00pm

This is a nice attempt to win brownie points with the woke crowd. Its really a small change to their infrastructure and not sure why it would be reported on at all bar the aforementioned brownie points.

Don't really think its anything to commend or get upset about really.

hellsing101 · 03-07-2020 12:02pm

The Mighty Quinn wrote: »

Master and slave would also be common terminology when it comes to alarm systems and other electrical bits and pieces. Antiquated perhaps, but don't see the need to retain the term, or get rid of it. Either way. Meh.

The terms are also used in database infrastructure where the master is the "live" database that is being written to and read from and the slaves are copies of that database that are generally for backup/fail-over purposes or can be used as read only to display data to the user in some instances.

03-07-2020 12:02pm

hellsing101 wrote: »

This is a nice attempt to win brownie points with the woke crowd. Its really a small change to their infrastructure and not sure why it would be reported on at all bar the aforementioned brownie points.

Don't really think its anything to commend or get upset about really.

I'm not upset. I think it's stupid.

In my opening post, I said "More importantly" and gave my actual reason for this thread which is this attempt to monopolise slavery as a white master, black slave thing.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:03pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'm not upset. I think it's stupid.

In my opening post, I said "More importantly" and gave my actual reason for this thread which is this attempt to monopolise slavery as a white master, black slave thing.

Point me to where Twitter said slavery only happened in the US, or was exclusively a white/ black issue.

03-07-2020 12:07pm

KiKi III wrote: »

Point me to where Twitter said slavery only happened in the US.

Twitter said master and slave were racially loaded terms. Black slaves in America are likely the best example of one race owning another race. It's usually not based on race, like in Africa today.

And it's not about Twitter. It's a whole thing that is happening now. Calls for statues to be brought down in Ireland because of slavery in America? When Africans raided Ireland and sold us into slavery?

hellsing101 · 03-07-2020 12:07pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm not upset. I think it's stupid.

In my opening post, I said "More importantly" and gave my actual reason for this thread which is this attempt to monopolise slavery as a white master, black slave thing.

It is stupid, it's tremendously stupid that they are changing these terms which are widely used in I.T because someone got upset. Anyone who works in I.T no matter the colour of their skin will understand these terms in this context and will know that they are not meant to be a racially loaded terms imo.

MFPM · 03-07-2020 12:09pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes, I code. I adopt children and then I kill them.

No.

I thought as much! So there's no substance to your statement just a bit of hysteria - good to know.

Quantum Erasure · 03-07-2020 12:10pm

KiKi III wrote: »

And people call liberals snowflakes...

Remind me again why these terms are changing?

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:11pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Twitter said master and slave were racially loaded terms. Black slaves in America are likely the best example of one race owning another race. It's usually not based on race, like in Africa today.

And it's not about Twitter. It's a whole thing that is happening now. Calls for statues to be brought down in Ireland because of slavery in America? When Africans raided Ireland and sold us into slavery?

Master and slave are racially loaded terms in the US, where Twitter is headquartered.

Nobody said that’s the only kind of slavery that’s ever existed or exists today.

It’s weird that an attempt to be more inclusive would bother you so much.

As for statues, we’ve got plenty of threads discussing that already.

It seems like you’re just opposed to any attempt to make POC feel more welcome/ included.

MFPM · 03-07-2020 12:12pm

hellsing101 wrote: »

It is stupid, it's tremendously stupid that they are changing these terms which are widely used in I.T because someone got upset. Anyone who works in I.T no matter the colour of their skin will understand these terms in this context and will know that they are not meant to be a racially loaded terms imo.

Why is it 'stupid', you've used the term twice but haven't explained why?

Quantum Erasure · 03-07-2020 12:12pm

hellsing101 wrote: »

The terms are also used in database infrastructure where the master is the "live" database that is being written to and read from and the slaves are copies of that database that are generally for backup/fail-over purposes or can be used as read only to display data to the user in some instances.

I wonder does Boards use the same terminology....?

MFPM · 03-07-2020 12:14pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Twitter said master and slave were racially loaded terms. Black slaves in America are likely the best example of one race owning another race. It's usually not based on race, like in Africa today.

And it's not about Twitter. It's a whole thing that is happening now. Calls for statues to be brought down in Ireland because of slavery in America? When Africans raided Ireland and sold us into slavery?

Black slaves in America are likely the best example of one race owning another race.

This is becoming absurd...you're flinging statements around with no evidence?

When Africans raided Ireland and sold us into slavery?

When was this now?

03-07-2020 12:15pm

MFPM wrote: »

I thought as much! So there's no substance to your statement just a bit of hysteria - good to know.

What part are you asking for evidence for?

There are more slaves now that ever before, and they are mostly owned by their own race.

Asians growing weed in farms in the UK are owned by Asian gangs. Eastern European prostitutes in the US are owned by Eastern European gangs. African slaves in the Congo are owned by Africans. Asians catching shrimp off Thailand are owned by Asians.

If you think this is hysteria, I can tell you it's not. The last few years have just been token efforts picking at low-hanging fruit just to look good, be it companies, or individuals on social media. There is almost no actual effort made to combat slavery even though it's the hot topic of the year. Most people seem to think it disappeared when the US ended it. I think it's terrible that people are being convinced of this.

Assetbacked · 03-07-2020 12:16pm

BDSM Lives Matter.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:17pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What part are you asking for evidence for?

There are more slaves now that ever before, and they are mostly owned by their own race.

Asians growing weed in farms in the UK are owned by Asian gangs. Eastern European prostitutes in the US are owned by Eastern European gangs. African slaves in the Congo are owned by Africans. Asians catching shrimp off Thailand are owned by Asians.

All of these sound like good reasons for Twitter to stop using terms like master and slave?

Skylinehead · 03-07-2020 12:17pm

Deleted User wrote: »

What part are you asking for evidence for?

I'd like evidence that this is going to cost a few million. As opposed to an email asking people not to use the terms, which is what actually happens.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 03-07-2020 12:18pm

I'm very niggardly. I only spend money when necessary.

03-07-2020 12:18pm

MFPM wrote: »

This is becoming absurd...you're flinging statements around with no evidence?

Can you point to a better example of slavery based on race? I think what happened in the US is synonymous with it and you say I'm flinging out statements without evidence?

MFPM wrote: »

When was this now?

The Barbary slave trade.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:19pm

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I'm very niggardly. I only spend money when necessary.

Edgy.

frozenfrozen · 03-07-2020 12:20pm

I think don't overthink it. If they want to do that then that's fine but the fact we're hearing about it means its just for show.

Yeah twitter is a massive platform for bigots but they use inclusive terms behind the scenes!

MFPM · 03-07-2020 12:21pm

Deleted User wrote: »

What part are you asking for evidence for?

There are more slaves now that ever before, and they are mostly owned by their own race.

Asians growing weed in farms in the UK are owned by Asian gangs. Eastern European prostitutes in the US are owned by Eastern European gangs. African slaves in the Congo are owned by Africans. Asians catching shrimp off Thailand are owned by Asians.

If you think this is hysteria, I can tell you it's not. The last few years have just been token efforts picking at low-hanging fruit just to look good, be it companies, or individuals on social media. There is almost no actual effort made to combat slavery even though it's the hot topic of the year. Most people seem to think it disappeared when the US ended it. I think it's terrible that people are being convinced of this.

There are more slaves now that ever before, and they are mostly owned by their own race.

Have you evidence for this?

Asians growing weed in farms in the UK are owned by Asian gangs. Eastern European prostitutes in the US are owned by Eastern European gangs. African slaves in the Congo are owned by Africans. Asians catching shrimp off Thailand are owned by Asians.

This is nonsense, this is criminal activity, slavery and the subjugation of primarily Black people was legally and systematically organised and overseen by legal institutions.

03-07-2020 12:22pm

Skylinehead wrote: »

I'd like evidence that this is going to cost a few million. As opposed to an email asking people not to use the terms, which is what actually happens.

https://www.fr24news.com/a/2020/07/george-floyd-twitter-abandons-master-slave-and-blacklist.html

Replacing the terms could cost millions and take months, experts say.

Loads of sites say it will cost millions.

03-07-2020 12:22pm

Hopefully my external preamps will still work..

But I'm sure no one would have an issue if it was just this..

It's more the encroaching totalitarianism that people find objectionable..

Skylinehead · 03-07-2020 12:23pm

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.fr24news.com/a/2020/07/george-floyd-twitter-abandons-master-slave-and-blacklist.html

Replacing the terms could cost millions and take months, experts say.

Loads of sites say it will cost millions.

Cheers, was just curious, as in my experience, there's almost zero references in code to these terms, and it's just an architectural terminology change. It's a people problem rather than a code problem.

I still doubt that it will cost them much at all.

hellsing101 · 03-07-2020 12:24pm

MFPM wrote: »

Why is it 'stupid', you've used the term twice but haven't explained why?

It's stupid to change these terms as they are commonly used in I.T and most engineers will be accustomed to them, if they are forbidden (I dont know that they are forbidden from use in Twitter but just randomly guessing here) then that will be a big change for those engineers who have used them throughout all their careers and will cause them to be less productive as a result as they will need to come up with new terminology to describe whatever master/slave described in Twitter's infrastructure and what happens if someone is building code and forgets that the terms are banned, they will have to rebuild their code without the terms.

An analogy would be in a professional kitchen where a team of chefs is working, one of them was a stabbing victim and the term "knife" upsets them so the chefs can no longer say "knife", can you imagine the confusion this would cause. The term itself has been used forever in the kitchen and in this context the word "knife" isn't related to stabbing or violence apart from the tangential link.

Thats my take anyway, I should have said "In my opinion its stupid", maybe others feel differently.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:24pm

Language evolves constantly as does culture.

Dravokivich · 03-07-2020 12:24pm

KiKi III wrote: »

Master and slave are racially loaded terms in the US, where Twitter is headquartered.

Nobody said that’s the only kind of slavery that’s ever existed or exists today.

It’s weird that an attempt to be more inclusive would bother you so much.

As for statues, we’ve got plenty of threads discussing that already.

It seems like you’re just opposed to any attempt to make POC feel more welcome/ included.

Master tapes. Remastered releases. People should stop loading a phrase and start looking at the context in which it is used. Doublegood.

is_that_so · 03-07-2020 12:25pm

In a parallel universe back in about 2006 Twitter reflected on terms like master, slave and blacklist and deemed them inappropriate to today's world and were widely praised for being ahead of the curve. In ours they did so in 2020 so as not to garner bad PR. Cynicism is the only word I have here. I guess the MBR is next! Indifferent to the terms personally, except for their commonly understood meaning and I hope there is an appropriately descriptive replacement. I really do wonder whether we're heading for a Newspeak world.

Stark · 03-07-2020 12:26pm

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.fr24news.com/a/2020/07/george-floyd-twitter-abandons-master-slave-and-blacklist.html

Replacing the terms could cost millions and take months, experts say.

Loads of sites say it will cost millions.

Doesn't say much for their software engineering practices if such a simple change costs millions to implement.

hellsing101 · 03-07-2020 12:26pm

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

I wonder does Boards use the same terminology....?

I would say so, most sites which run database replication would have a master-slave infrastructure to ensure the integrity of data.

03-07-2020 12:26pm

MFPM wrote: »

Have you evidence for this?

This is nonsense, this is criminal activity, slavery and the subjugation of primarily Black people was legally and systematically organised and overseen by legal institutions.

https://theconversation.com/fact-check-how-many-people-are-enslaved-in-the-world-today-107078

Estimates of over 40 million slaves today. If you think forced prostitution isn't real slavery because it's outside the law, I don't care much for your opinion on the topic.

Stark · 03-07-2020 12:27pm

FWIW, AWS replaced the terms master and slave with terms like "primary" and "replica" quite some time ago.

No-one got upset from what I recall.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:28pm

Stark wrote: »

FWIW, AWS replaced the terms master and slave with terms like "primary" and "replica" quite some time ago.

No-one got upset from what I recall.

And the world didn’t crumble?

03-07-2020 12:30pm

Stark wrote: »

FWIW, AWS replaced the terms master and slave with terms like "primary" and "replica" quite some time ago.

No-one got upset from what I recall.

Do you think I'm upset?

Not a fan of this whole "Oh are you upset?" "Are you triggered?" trend these days if someone looks at a story like this and thinks it's stupid. I'm allowed to have opinions on what is going on in the world and it does not mean I'm upset.

Padre_Pio · 03-07-2020 12:30pm

Master and slave are pretty sh*t terms really.

It's hard to Google troubleshooting stuff.

Server and Client work better.

hellsing101 · 03-07-2020 12:32pm

Stark wrote: »

FWIW, AWS replaced the terms master and slave with terms like "primary" and "replica" quite some time ago.

No-one got upset from what I recall.

Did AWS not start with those terms rather than replace them? If you are starting your infrastructure from scratch with a new team then you can call anything anything really as people will adapt to those terms and you wont have a problem.

KiKi III · 03-07-2020 12:32pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Do you think I'm upset?

Not a fan of this whole "Oh are you upset?" "Are you triggered?" trend these days if someone looks at a story like this and thinks it's stupid. I'm allowed to have opinions on what is going on in the world and it does not mean I'm upset.

Well, the way you phrased your OP including calling the guy who spearheaded the idea a “worthless cùnt” made it seem like you were indeed quite upset and more so than the situation really warranted.

is_that_so · 03-07-2020 12:34pm

Padre_Pio wrote: »

Master and slave are pretty sh*t terms really.

It's hard to Google troubleshooting stuff.

Server and Client work better.

Not everything has that relationship. Primary and secondary or variations on them are better terms.

Twitter removing "master", "slave", and "blacklist" to be more inclusi

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