Is it just me or have SF vanished?

James Brown · 03-07-2020 3:00pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Schoolchildren wearing identical white shirts as part of uniform - no problem
Gardai wearing identical shirts as part of uniform - no problem
Sinn Fein thugs lining up in formation in identical shirts like a uniform - big, big problem

Thugs? Members of a political party you don't like. I suppose you know every individual?

blanch152 · 03-07-2020 3:19pm

McMurphy wrote: »

FG councillor tweeting his admiration for fascists in blue shirts, and comparing them with modern day Fine Gael....... No problem

You're parody.

Astonishing lack of understanding shown in your post.

Comparing a misrepresented tweet from so no-bit councillor to the display of strength by the Sinn Fein mafia and disregard for the law. Credibility is something that post lacks.

James Brown · 03-07-2020 3:32pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Astonishing lack of understanding shown in your post.

Comparing a misrepresented tweet from so no-bit councillor to the display of strength by the Sinn Fein mafia and disregard for the law. Credibility is something that post lacks.

You are fighting from various angles on this. You said it should be dismissed because we've Covid to worry about. Your labeling of him as a 'no-bit' councillor means what exactly? How was it misrepresented? Care to explain?

Mortelaro · 03-07-2020 3:47pm

Meanwhile in other news
Ireland big time over estimated the excess death rate in the Republic from covid 19 by 59% :eek:

This surely shoots us all from ok ish to one of the best in the world for the handling of the pandemic

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2020/0703/1151127-virus-report/

James Brown · 03-07-2020 3:49pm

Mortelaro wrote: »

Meanwhile in other news
Ireland big time over estimated the excess death rate in the Republic from covid 19 by 59% :eek:

This surely shoots us all from ok ish to one of the best in the world for the handling of the pandemic

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2020/0703/1151127-virus-report/

Should really be in another thread. But a distraction is a distraction.
Yes, they may have miscalculated. Another Boo Boo? Hardly something to applaude, but the outcome is good.
This was the top story this morning. Since replaced by MON's apology :rolleyes:

Yeah_Right · 03-07-2020 3:50pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The problem is that in Ireland this is no longer the case - those prices are going up, but incomes are not keeping pace.

Off the top of my head, the government has to disincentivise the use of existing property (both residential and commercial) as an investment vehicle, build large scale subsidised social housing like we did in the 20th century, engage in serious root-and-branch reform of personal injury laws so that businesses are no longer held liable for their patrons' own stupidity, reform the insurance sector, reduce VAT and excise duty for the hospitality sector, improve inter-city and inter-county public transport infrastructure, tackle commercial and private landlords to reduce the cost of housing and of doing business alike, and slash spending on vanity projects which nobody actually wants and public entities which refuse to get their own houses in order (take RTE for instance).

The first on that list is the big one and that's what I and many others talk about when we talk about smashing the paradigm of housing as an investment vehicle instead of as a place to live. The trading and subsequent of residential property by people and entities so they can be used to milk money from people in the form of rent is something we should never have normalised as a society - if you don't live in it and you didn't build it, you shouldn't be the one who owns it.

I imagine that you and I would disagree on a lot politically as I am generally right of centre (which means I'm a nazi according to some

), however I do appreciate the effort and thought that goes into your posts especially over the past few pages. You have explained your reasoning for voting SF very well and I can understand it. I disagree with it but your logic is a lot better than usual "SF good, FFG bad" and "up the RA!" we frequently see on these threads. And it is appreciated.

I don't agree with your view on housing. I think there is nothing wrong with people owning investment properties. I would never do it myself here in Ireland because I think the laws favour the tenants so much that it wouldn't be worth the hassle. I believe that if more could be done to protect landlord's rights and property, there would be more houses available to renters.

The bit in your post above that I bolded, I do agree with.

Edgware · 03-07-2020 3:52pm

This is great fun. All the Shinners getting upset. The fishwife missing out on power and on the backfoot. All the **** up of their own making letting Martin off the hook and no one paying any attention to her one for everyone in the audience front bench

James Brown · 03-07-2020 3:58pm

Edgware wrote: »

This is great fun. All the Shinners getting upset. The fishwife missing out on power and on the backfoot. All the **** up of their own making letting Martin off the hook and no one paying any attention to her one for everyone in the audience front bench

I think you have it in reverse chief. The likes of myself are posting on the hypocrisy of the one sided get the shinners mob.
It's shameful this non story took the public attention off politicians refusing positions and crony senate spots, one drawn from a hat. Likely the point.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 4:04pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Christ almighty. We have already had someone compare the Sinn Fein thugs in white shirts to schoolchildren. Now we are equating Sinn Fein thugs to the Gardai. Pathetic.

I was pointing out the utter and abject stretching you are doing blanch, with a bit of humour that seems to have gone over people's heads.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 4:09pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

I know all about NICRA. Unlike you whose historical knowledge is based on brief visits to Wikipedia.

McMillan was on NICRA executive. Do you think himself and Adams were besties

(Adams was never on NICRA executive. He was on IRA Army Council and attended conventions up to the very last one.)

A chap gets a bit tired of the likes of you trying to tell them stuff by the way. Especially when you haven't a breeze about the history of the republican movement.)

I didn't say Adams was. When using even recent history, like posts made this morning on this forum, try not to lie about things that can be backed up.

YOU said the IRA had nothing to do with NICRA, McMillen was key to it's formation and the writing of it's constitution.

How many times is that now the facts have had to be pointed out to you?

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 4:17pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

YOU said the IRA had nothing to do with NICRA,

Where did I say this?

I said that Adams lied about being at executive meetings; a fact that has been supported by people who were at such meetings.

He also lies about his being in the IRA.

blanch152 · 03-07-2020 4:20pm

Bowie wrote: »

I think you have it in reverse chief. The likes of myself are posting on the hypocrisy of the one sided get the shinners mob.
It's shameful this non story took the public attention off politicians refusing positions and crony senate spots, one drawn from a hat. Likely the point.

I think the lack of respect shown by Sinn Fein politicians to all those who lost loved ones during this crisis and couldn't pay their respects in the normal way is the big story. One rule for the Shinners, another rule for the rest of us, that is what people are seeing. Unlike other issues, ordinary people can relate to this, because they have had to watch funerals online, comfort friends from afar and mourn in solitude, while SF TDs can waltz up from Cork to Belfast without a care in the world to bury a common thug.

Of course, the busy defence being put up by yourself and others is not surprising, and entirely not unexpected, and I hope that you will be thanked for the good work and wish you well in that regard, because it looks mostly like a thankless task.

blanch152 · 03-07-2020 4:21pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Where did I say this?

I said that Adams lied about being at executive meetings; a fact that has been supported by people who were at such meetings.

He also lies about his being in the IRA.

Adams is a proven liar.

He told one story to Spotlight about his knowledge of the child abuse carried out by his brother. He told another story to a court.

He got away with not being charged with perjury, because nobody could know which one was the truth, but it proved his status as a liar.

Edgware · 03-07-2020 4:23pm

Bowie wrote: »

I think you have it in reverse chief. The likes of myself are posting on the hypocrisy of the one sided get the shinners mob.
It's shameful this non story took the public attention off politicians refusing positions and crony senate spots, one drawn from a hat. Likely the point.

It's not a bit shameful. It just shows up the Shinner hypocrisy. Every other funeral goes from church to crematorium. Storey is carried around West Belfast like a team bringing home the Sam Maguire.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 4:23pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Where did I say this?

I said that Adams lied about being at executive meetings; a fact that has been supported by people who were at such meetings.

He also lies about his being in the IRA.

What did you mean by the 'IRA was adjunct to NICRA'?

The IRA was part of the formation of NICRA represented by McMillen. It was adjunct or supplementary or whatever you meant.

Like Adams says about the IRA there are those who say he and those who say he wasn't.
I have no idea of the truth of that or what he says about NICRA or what others say about him.

Neither do you, unless you were there, you are just choosing who to believe.

blanch152 · 03-07-2020 4:23pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I was pointing out the utter and abject stretching you are doing blanch, with a bit of humour that seems to have gone over people's heads.

Humour? About that funeral? And the hurt being felt by many people around the country which has forced the ladies of Sinn Fein to apologise?

Would that not be in bad taste?

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 4:25pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Adams is a proven liar.

He told one story to Spotlight about his knowledge of the child abuse carried out by his brother. He told another story to a court.

He got away with not being charged with perjury, because nobody could know which one was the truth, but it proved his status as a liar.

The story to Spotlight which has curiously disappeared?

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 4:30pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Humour? About that funeral? And the hurt being felt by many people around the country which has forced the ladies of Sinn Fein to apologise?

Would that not be in bad taste?

Yes blanch, about a funeral...nobody ever used humour about a funeral ever. You and your friends here are depicting people mourning at another funeral as all sorts. I have been likened to 'scum' in the last few posts.

dundalkfc10 · 03-07-2020 4:37pm

Sinn Féin living rent free in Blanchs head

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 4:51pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What did you mean by the 'IRA was adjunct to NICRA'?

The IRA was part of the formation of NICRA represented by McMillen. It was adjunct or supplementary or whatever you meant.

Like Adams says about the IRA there are those who say he and those who say he wasn't.
I have no idea of the truth of that or what he says about NICRA or what others say about him.

Neither do you, unless you were there, you are just choosing who to believe.

Adams and others are trying to pretend that the Provos became a sort of armed civil rights movement, seeking the same thing as NICRA.

That is nonsense. NICRA did not support a united Ireland and the Provos dismissed NICRA demands as reformist and partitionist.

Which is what led to the split, with Adams and McMillan's different wings of the IRA trying to kill one another for ten years.

As for Adams being in the IRA, only an imbecile would believe that he wasn't. The historical record of those who were in the IRA and who knew him as a leadership figure, including Chief of Staff, proves that he was.

The fact that the Village of the Damned kids who have largely taken over the movement since the surrender believe that he was not says a ,ot about how effective the Big Lie is.

Adams doesn't give a fart that those who were in the movement when it mattered laugh at his lies.

That is not the point. His target is the electorate because if they can obliterate history then they can convince them to vote for them.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 4:55pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Adams and others are trying to pretend that the Provos became a sort of armed civil rights movement, seeking the same thing as NICRA.

That is nonsense. NICRA did not support a united Ireland and the Provos dismissed NICRA demands as reformist and partitionist.

Which is what led to the split, with Adams and McMillan's different wings of the IRA trying to kill one another for ten years.

As for Adams being in the IRA, only an imbecile would believe that he wasn't. The historical record of those who were in the IRA and who knew him as a leadership figure, including Chief of Staff, proves that he was.

The fact that the Village of the Damned kids who have largely taken over the movement since the surrender believe that he was not says a ,ot about how effective the Big Lie is.

Adams doesn't give a fart that those who were in the movement when it mattered laugh at his lies.

That is not the point. His target is the electorate because if they can obliterate history then they can convince them to vote for them.

So say you were not in the RA but get your second in command and many more to openly admit they were ....in the hope you can fool the electorate as a political party?

Ha ha ha...two seconds to show up your nonsense. Any more gems of historical analysis there Bonnie?

JohnnyFlash · 03-07-2020 5:04pm

Very strong piece in the Irish Times today from Stephen Collins about the continued influence of the IRA Army Council on the machinations of the SF party: https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/storey-funeral-a-reminder-that-ira-army-council-runs-sinn-f%C3%A9in-1.4294619

It spells out in very clear and stark terms that we are not dealing with a normal political party here. This is a party that has its eyes on being in Government in the 'Free State', and takes its orders from violent men in the ilk of Storey.

Of course this doesn't matter to the blind defenders of a sinister political party, but this week opened a lot of eyes to what SF is really about.

"The Bobby Storey funeral is another reminder not simply that the IRA has not gone away but that its army council is the ruling body of Sinn Féin. Clearly some voters have no problem with that but the episode should alert the wider electorate to what a vote for Sinn Féin actually means".

blanch152 · 03-07-2020 5:07pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Sinn Féin living rent free in Blanchs head

I don't think you have answered a single point I have made other than to throw a personal insult.

James Brown · 03-07-2020 5:13pm

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Very strong piece in the Irish Times today from Stephen Collins about the continued influence of the IRA Army Council on the machinations of the SF party: https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/storey-funeral-a-reminder-that-ira-army-council-runs-sinn-f%C3%A9in-1.4294619

It spells out in very clear and stark terms that we are not dealing with a normal political party here. This is a party that has its eyes on being in Government in the 'Free State', and takes its orders from violent men in the ilk of Storey.

Of course this doesn't matter to the blind defenders of a sinister political party, but this week opened a lot of eyes to what SF is really about.

"The Bobby Storey funeral is another reminder not simply that the IRA has not gone away but that its army council is the ruling body of Sinn Féin. Clearly some voters have no problem with that but the episode should alert the wider electorate to what a vote for Sinn Féin actually means".

Zero credibility on the shock and awe JF.

Deputy First Minister Michelle O'Neill has said she will never apologise for attending the funeral of the IRA veteran.
https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2020/0703/1151100-northern-ireland-politics/

These shinner/RA exposes are jaded. They own the relationship.

I see Fosters real issue is MON/SF attended the funeral at all.
That, added to the complete hypocrisy from yourself and others on the Garda funeral and social distancing has shone a light on the fact that the shinners are still a worry and losing power is more of a concern than the actual running of the state, which just got a new government by the way. Was news up until recently...
Story is a farce.

Mortelaro · 03-07-2020 5:19pm

Bowie wrote: »

Zero credibility on the shock and awe JF.

I see Fosters real issue is MON/SF attended the funeral at all.
That, added to the complete hypocrisy from yourself and others on the Garda funeral and social distancing has shone a light on the fact that the shinners are still a worry and losing power is more of a concern than the actual running of the state, which just got a new government by the way. Was news up until recently...
Story is a farce.

The issue I have with Fosters criticism is that if Mrs Windsor died in the morning, Darlene would be on the first plane over to London and you can be guaranteed that there'd be a darn side more than 30 at the funeral

McMurphy · 03-07-2020 5:21pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Humour? About that funeral? And the hurt being felt by many people around the country which has forced the ladies of Sinn Fein to apologise?

Would that not be in bad taste?

I thought you were all on for a bit of humour and light heartedness? Didn't you tell us that there was absolutely nothing wrong with leo injecting a bit of humour into his speeches regarding covid and the thousands of people that died or had lost jobs due to ?

And by the way, I think by humour Francie was referring to ripping the piss out of your OTT postings, not the funerals. Doh.

blanch152 · 03-07-2020 5:21pm

Mortelaro wrote: »

The issue I have with Fosters criticism is that if Mrs Windsor died in the morning, Darlene would be on the first plane over to London and you can be guaranteed that there'd be a darn side more than 30 at the funeral

For all of us watching the North from the outside, the conclusion that they are better left to each other gets stronger and stronger.

MerlinSouthDub · 03-07-2020 5:22pm

Mortelaro wrote: »

The issue I have with Fosters criticism is that if Mrs Windsor died in the morning, Darlene would be on the first plane over to London and you can be guaranteed that there'd be a darn side more than 30 at the funeral

So, your issue with Arlene Foster is the way you believe she will behave in an entirely hypothetical situation?

Elmer Blooker · 03-07-2020 5:31pm

I heard a gem on the RTE news at one (after bashing SF all morning) The RTE US correspondent said the big rise in covid cases had nothing to do with the BLM protests as 'there is little chance of catching covid outdoors'
The Storey funeral was outdoors if I am correct.

Truthvader · 03-07-2020 5:46pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The problem is that in Ireland this is no longer the case - those prices are going up, but incomes are not keeping pace.

Off the top of my head, the government has to disincentivise the use of existing property (both residential and commercial) as an investment vehicle, build large scale subsidised social housing like we did in the 20th century, engage in serious root-and-branch reform of personal injury laws so that businesses are no longer held liable for their patrons' own stupidity, reform the insurance sector, reduce VAT and excise duty for the hospitality sector, improve inter-city and inter-county public transport infrastructure, tackle commercial and private landlords to reduce the cost of housing and of doing business alike, and slash spending on vanity projects which nobody actually wants and public entities which refuse to get their own houses in order (take RTE for instance).

The first on that list is the big one and that's what I and many others talk about when we talk about smashing the paradigm of housing as an investment vehicle instead of as a place to live. The trading and subsequent of residential property by people and entities so they can be used to milk money from people in the form of rent is something we should never have normalised as a society - if you don't live in it and you didn't build it, you shouldn't be the one who owns it.

OK at least this is a coherent collection of suggestions though I suspect there is an unreality to it in that it contains the double wish of lower taxes and more services. Unfortunately one moves co-relative to the other. To put it crudely you can have a Trump model of low taxes but you pay for your own **** and public services are minimal or a Nordic high tax and high social/ state services model

To comment specifically

1. Not sure what disincentivising private property and/or tackling Landlords actually means. You can certainly make it illegal (though would need a referendum) to own real property of either residential or commercial unless you actually occupied it but it would mean nothing to rent in either sector which seems impractical. Already payment of rent on residential property is essentially voluntary which is why so many Landlords have got out. The result is less to rent, more demand ,less supply; rents go up

2. Big social housing means big taxes. And just so you know a "tax the rich" solution does not work because there are not enough rich. Plus the more you do it the more people don't bother becoming rich and/or take their money and go where they can keep it. Already plenty of Irish in Monaco. So he price is middle income earners get hosed.

3. Personal injuries. All I will say is ask anyone who got a lot of money on a personal injury whether it was worth the injury. Dont know one - save a very few who suffered a minor soft tissue spoofy injury. What we could do is take the lawyer out of it so if you are injured you are compensated without having to prove negligence. They do it in Australia though I think that is motor claims only. Agree that Courts are too generous - particularly to idiots falling over in pubs but not sure what the solution is .Outlaw idiocy?

4. Public Transport? Again Big taxes

As you can see there are no "Lets form a band and save the school" solutions. I expect the centre parties FF/FG Labour are trying to balance all the pressures. The far left PBF etc just want all the stuff but have no concept that we will have to pay for it, while Sinn Fein will tell you anything you like to get power and again have no notion of how anything will be paid for - mainly because of the low standard of person they attract but also because their experience to date is in Northern Ireland where the Brits have created a free money tunnel to keep the two sides from killing each other

OPEN FOR IDEAS

Mortelaro · 03-07-2020 6:05pm

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

So, your issue with Arlene Foster is the way you believe she will behave in an entirely hypothetical situation?

Oh I know she'd be over for that funeral being first Minister unless it was on a Sunday

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 6:42pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So say you were not in the RA but get your second in command and many more to openly admit they were ....in the hope you can fool the electorate as a political party?

Ha ha ha...two seconds to show up your nonsense. Any more gems of historical analysis there Bonnie?

I have no explanation for the multitude of lies he has told over the years; from denying what anyone with half a brain (that's your opt out Francie

knows about his being in the IRA, lies about his rapist brother and how he was protected, to people who were buried on beaches on his say so, and so on.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 6:54pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

I have no explanation for the multitude of lies he has told over the years; from denying what anyone with half a brain (that's your opt out Francie knows about his being in the IRA, lies about his rapist brother and how he was protected, to people who were buried on beaches on his say so, and so on.

With the exception of his brother, who he has admitted and apolgised for handling all wrong, I'll tell you what you and me don't have is 'proof' that he is lying or others are.
With regard to the IRA I don't care anymore whether he was or not. Did he build the peace as he promised...yes IMO, he risked his own life to do that.

Edgware · 03-07-2020 7:07pm

I accept that people are upset that Storey's funeral showed scant regard for social distancing etc. I would be more offended that they gave this sectarian thug the title of being a republican. (Non capital letters intentional)

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 7:12pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

With the exception of his brother, who he has admitted and apolgised for handling all wrong, I'll tell you what you and me don't have is 'proof' that he is lying or others are.
With regard to the IRA I don't care anymore whether he was or not. Did he build the peace as he promised...yes IMO, he risked his own life to do that.

There was peace before 1969. That was not what it was about for the IRA.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 7:33pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

There was peace before 1969. That was not what it was about for the IRA.

Tell that to my dad who was born there in the late 20's.

If you call 'peace' a society that partitionists can ignore...then yeh, there was bountiful peace and provident harvests.

Jesus, the poster priding himself on his grasp of history comes out with that mouthful.

By the way, as far as I know, SF's opinion is (and I share it) there will be no peace on this island until partition is gotten rid.

Truthvader · 03-07-2020 7:36pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

With the exception of his brother, who he has admitted and apolgised for handling all wrong, I'll tell you what you and me don't have is 'proof' that he is lying or others are.
With regard to the IRA I don't care anymore whether he was or not. Did he build the peace as he promised...yes IMO, he risked his own life to do that.

1. The IRA are a criminal gang. They dont have a register of members held by the little old lady in No 2. I have no doubt that in Gerry's rat like mind he thinks he was not "in" the IRA becsuse as one of the founders he never actually went through whatever gang initiation ceremony they had.

2. Gerry is all about Gerry. The sad truth is that although it did bring a peace of sorts the "peace process" was a sellout and " give in" To Paisley and Adams. The bad guys won. My own belief is that Gerry is far more sinister, self serving and evil than even his own side know. I don't believe that stakeknife ran his sordid death campaign alone. The one thing Gerry has is a rat cunning intelligence and I dont believe for a second he did not know and control what was going on. It will all emerge at some stage no doubt.

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 7:39pm

Peace is the absence of war and armed conflict.

Of course northern Catholics were treated like sh1t. That is one of reasons the IRA opposed partition. Until it surrendered obviously with partition still in place.

I supported the ceasefire by the way. It is the political surrender and abandonment of any serious republican project for unity that I find objectionable. That is why the 30 years of armed conflict were a needless waste.

Edgware · 03-07-2020 7:41pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

There was peace before 1969. That was not what it was about for the IRA.

I know its Friday but lay off the Dutch Gold. If the Northern state had treated the Nationalists with respect and equality there would never have been Troubles. The minority would have looked South and have said "**** that for a game of cowboys"

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 7:44pm

So the objective of the IRA was a reformed Northern Ireland was it? Or peace?

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 7:55pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Peace is the absence of war and armed conflict.

Of course northern Catholics were treated like sh1t. That is one of reasons the IRA opposed partition. Until it surrendered obviously with partition still in place.

I supported the ceasefire by the way. It is the political surrender and abandonment of any serious republican project for unity that I find objectionable. That is why the 30 years of armed conflict were a needless waste.

No more than those luxuriating in the higher moral ground of the south, did you ever pause to wonder what the independence of Ireland 'cost'?

I would seriously wonder about your dissident like careful choice of words there...'I supported the ceasefire'.

Did you support the GFA?

James Brown · 03-07-2020 8:27pm

blanch152 wrote: »

For all of us watching the North from the outside, the conclusion that they are better left to each other gets stronger and stronger.

Some of us would never leave our fellow countrymen and women in the lurch. Sad that a sensational news story would have some turn their back.
Irish people like Arlene will always have my welcome despite her confused outlook

James Brown · 03-07-2020 8:28pm

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I heard a gem on the RTE news at one (after bashing SF all morning) The RTE US correspondent said the big rise in covid cases had nothing to do with the BLM protests as 'there is little chance of catching covid outdoors'
The Storey funeral was outdoors if I am correct.

Foster's big issue now it seems is MON attended the funeral at all.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 8:31pm

Bowie wrote: »

Foster's big issue now it seems is MON attended the funeral at all.

Manna from heaven for the Unionists, they'll try and keep this going until the 12th, ably assisted by our outraged partitionists in the south no doubt.

She'll be wanting O'Neill to disown Storey altogether next.

James Brown · 03-07-2020 8:33pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

There was peace before 1969. That was not what it was about for the IRA.

What was it about?
The fact that many entered politics should be welcomed IMO. The fact that some politicians and parties will pat themselves on the back for ushering in peace and talk out the side of their mouths about the 'RA if asked awkward questions is disappointing.

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 8:36pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No more than those luxuriating in the higher moral ground of the south, did you ever pause to wonder what the independence of Ireland 'cost'?

I would seriously wonder about your dissident like careful choice of words there...'I supported the ceasefire'.

Did you support the GFA?

I had family members who luxuriated in Ballykinlar, Mountjoy, the Curragh and Portlaoise when people in west Belfast were being told who to vote for by priests.

I didn't support the GFA because it accepts partition and Stormont. Two things that Adams and co said they would never accept in 1994 and indeed right up until the final negotiations in April 1998.

James Brown · 03-07-2020 8:37pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

Peace is the absence of war and armed conflict.

Of course northern Catholics were treated like sh1t. That is one of reasons the IRA opposed partition. Until it surrendered obviously with partition still in place.

I supported the ceasefire by the way. It is the political surrender and abandonment of any serious republican project for unity that I find objectionable. That is why the 30 years of armed conflict were a needless waste.

The people felt their was a need for the IRA. To suggest they were created in a vacuum by some self interested parties with no public support just isn't the case. You can disagree with their methods, but people wanted them and felt they needed them.

FrancieBrady · 03-07-2020 8:44pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

I had family members who luxuriated in Ballykinlar, Mountjoy, the Curragh and Portlaoise when people in west Belfast were being told who to vote for by priests.

I didn't support the GFA because it accepts partition and Stormont. Two things that Adams and co said they would never accept in 1994 and indeed right up until the final negotiations in April 1998.

Fair enough. I could not take a dissident position to an agreement that legitimised getting rid of partition and delivered so much for Irish people.

I think it took fundamentally brave men and women to accept that armed conflict had reached stalemate and nobody was going to win.
I think Adams and McGuinness's achievement in holding the peace was incredible. Took me a long time to believe their bona fides. A peaceful transition to a UI will be a testament to both.

Truthvader · 03-07-2020 9:55pm

Bonniedog wrote: »

I had family members who luxuriated in Ballykinlar, Mountjoy, the Curragh and Portlaoise when people in west Belfast were being told who to vote for by priests.

I didn't support the GFA because it accepts partition and Stormont. Two things that Adams and co said they would never accept in 1994 and indeed right up until the final negotiations in April 1998.

And what did your family members do to earn their place in Ballykinlar Mountjoy the Curragh and Portlaoise?

Bonniedog · 03-07-2020 10:26pm

They were fighting for a Catholic Deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland :-)

Is it just me or have SF vanished?

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