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FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

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    #8582
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Have you ever answered poll questions - they are usually framed in a way that suits those asking the question. For instance you say that 90% on Claire Byrne want hotel quarantine for all - does this include pilots and lorry drivers coming into the country on a daily basis to deliver essential items? What about those going abroad medical reasons, or those wanting to come home for a dying loved one or the tens of other reasons why things happen. It's easy to say everyone should be quarantined when your asked a question that has yes/no type answer.

    You say that majority of the nation don't think they are doing a good job - did you just pull this out of thin air? or how do you know what the majority think?

    Finally where is labour's our SF alternative living with Covid policy?? Oh wait that's right they don't have one - wonder why that is? SF have no problem producing alternative budgets on budget day. Is it maybe because they support the majority of the policies that have been implemented, but don't want their supporters knowing this, and in turn will let FF/FG/Greens take the heat?

    If there was an election in the morning, i feel that SF would make sure to position their candidates in such a way that they wouldn't win enough to go into sole power, and hence we would be left in the current situation.

    It's very easy to blame those in power, but when there is no viable alternative option - what do you do?

    Essential travel is still allowed so that covers lorry drivers etc

    A poll out yesterday it was headline news in Irish Times has the majority think govt doing a bad job
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/covid-19-irish-times-poll-finds-government-losing-the-dressing-room-as-support-slumps-1.4494806


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    #8583
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Covid data starting to look very promising. If this keeps up the government may need to move the 5 April date forward.


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    #8584
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    Covid data starting to look very promising. If this keeps up the government may need to move the 5 April date forward.

    Wait till the schools are back and tourists get word they are free to come here without quarantine and they will go back up imo


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    #8585
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,072 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    Covid data starting to look very promising. If this keeps up the government may need to move the 5 April date forward.

    Can't help feeling we were here before and somebody ****ed it up by ignoring the expert advice. Let's hope they have learned the lesson.


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    #8586
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    Wait till the schools are back and tourists get word they are free to come here without quarantine and they will go back up imo

    Schools being open didn't impact the ability to reduce cases in lockdown 2.

    I'll stick with the positive data coming from NPHET, rather than pessimistic opinions on boards:)


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    #8587
    Ace2007
    Registered Users Posts: 19,695 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    Essential travel is still allowed so that covers lorry drivers etc

    A poll out yesterday it was headline news in Irish Times has the majority thilnk govt doing a bad job
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/covid-19-irish-times-poll-finds-government-losing-the-dressing-room-as-support-slumps-1.4494806

    51% of 1200 voters say they are doing a bad job, and the margin of error is +/- 2.8%, so in fact it might not be the majority of Irish people, at absolute most it's 646 people - do you really see this as representative of the nation?

    Furthermore in the survey it shows that, Micheál Martin is up 3 points (from October) to 42% in satisfaction from party leaders.

    That's very conflicting results in that survey - MM support as party leader is up, yet a large % think the government are doing a bad job. You see - framing questions in certain ways can give very different results.

    Support for SF hasn't fallen - but they aren't in government - why are they falling???

    All in all the poll tells us nothing as to what the majority of people in the country actual think.


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    #8588
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    blanch152 wrote: »
    There are no student nurses on placement!!!!! Placements have been suspended!!!!!!

    That is what I am saying.

    If they were able to work, the HSE would want them. They don't want them because they aren't adding anything.
    'Completely compliant': HSE defends sending student nurses to work in badly-hit care home during first wave

    So they were just doing this to them for 'experience'?

    Was there absolutely no value in training new nurses especially considering a pandemic?
    Just doesn't wash.


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    #8589
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    Bishop of hope wrote: »
    And I took his word for it, I just pointed out that didn't mean there were no international travellers allowed or let in in that time.
    I pointed to the fact that a lot of flights into the North are from the UK and a lot are used as connectors for international travel.
    It's the same here BTW.

    Yeah, but it doesn't make the assertion "international flights into the north have ceased" any less true.

    I don't think anyone was claiming international travel was impossible into the North btw, I'm sure you could even drive if you were so inclined. International flights have still stopped, the UK-North flights are still in operation, SDLP and Shinners wanted them to cease. Alliance and the unionists prevented it.


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    #8590
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Finty Lemon wrote: »
    A bad for the bashers
    Blaming Brazilian people for Covid in Monaghan
    Also claiming Monaghan is a tourist haven
    Lost on the Galway Belfast Road
    Lost on the students
    Simultaneously arguing that the restrictions are too harsh and too lenient
    Calling for the army to be deployed to keep day trippers out of Carlingford
    Having to acknowledge that Ireland's vaccine is Top 3 in EU
    Having to acknowledge that the opposition called for relaxations at Christmas and then tried to dupe the public into forgetting
    Gaining no traction with false tears on M+B
    And most importantly, case numbers starting to fall

    Enjoy your tea everyone

    Lies and spin.
    Are you conveniently forgetting 'worst in the world'?
    It's not a competition. This is people lives. Tackle criticism, please do. Makes for good discussion. Don't make up blarney.


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    #8591
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    Schools being open didn't impact the ability to reduce cases in lockdown 2.

    I'll stick with the positive data coming from NPHET, rather than pessimistic opinions on boards:)

    NPHET advised Govt to open Junior and Senior infants and 6th class. Govt have ignored them again.

    We knpw what happened when they went against the advice at xmas.

    The fact people are starting to meet up again and travel into ireland will happen imo cases will go up.

    Hope im wrong though


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    #8592
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1365003088151609347?s=19

    I wonder how that got here


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    #8593
    Cluedo Monopoly
    Registered Users Posts: 8,716 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    Lots of anger here today as BB would say. Take the lemons off the FFG fan boys...

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



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    #8594
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1365003088151609347?s=19

    I wonder how that got here

    Coupon on the back of a box of sugarpuffs.


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    #8595
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Apart from the wider promising data, such as the reducing positivity rates etc, the below good news is also great to see:

    https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/health/vaccine-starting-to-make-an-impact-as-very-severe-drop-in-covid-19-cases-linked-to-nursing-homes-reported-last-week-40132066.html


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    #8596
    Ace2007
    Registered Users Posts: 19,695 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1365003088151609347?s=19

    I wonder how that got here

    Maybe someone flew into Belfast and crossed over the border, maybe an Irish person went to the dentist in Tenerife and caught the strain over there and brought it back, who knows, but what positive comes from posting it and potential spreading fear among some posters? Does it suit your agenda to do that?


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    #8597
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Maybe someone flew into Belfast and crossed over the border, maybe an Irish person went to the dentist in Tenerife and caught the strain over there and brought it back, who knows, but what positive comes from posting it and potential spreading fear among some posters? Does it suit your agenda to do that?

    The Irish person should be in hotel quarantine. The person who came to Belfast and travelled here should have been met by a checkpoint our side of the border and if a tourist sent back where they came from.


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    #8598
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    No mandatory quarantine

    https://mobile.twitter.com/davidcullinane/status/1364978796064047105


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    #8599
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Maybe someone flew into Belfast and crossed over the border, maybe an Irish person went to the dentist in Tenerife and caught the strain over there and brought it back, who knows, but what positive comes from posting it and potential spreading fear among some posters? Does it suit your agenda to do that?

    The discussion was tackling it, some where saying there's no point. So showing we've the new variant coming in is very relevant.


  • Options
    #8600
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,248 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Deleted User wrote: »
    No mandatory quarantine

    https://mobile.twitter.com/davidcullinane/status/1364978796064047105

    Correct decision. The scale of the epidemic isn't such that it is required. It would be disproportionate.

    We are already on the borderline with regards to human rights.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0225/1199178-human-rights-covid-legislation/

    "The IHREC has pointed out that separate to this research, it warned Oireachtas members last September that emergency legislation related to Covid-19 needed to be used exceptionally, and subjected to strict human rights standards and oversight."

    It seems that those voting for mandatory quarantine are ignoring all human rights consideration, yet they would be the first to complain if there was a finding.


  • Options
    #8601
    Ace2007
    Registered Users Posts: 19,695 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    James Brown wrote: »
    The discussion was tackling it, some where saying there's no point. So showing we've the new variant coming in is very relevant.

    Maybe in a thread about the virus or the sub forum, but not in a thread about the government - it's just spreading rumours without knowing the facts behind it.


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    #8602
    Ace2007
    Registered Users Posts: 19,695 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    The Irish person should be in hotel quarantine. The person who came to Belfast and travelled here should have been met by a checkpoint our side of the border and if a tourist sent back where they came from.

    Do you know how big the border is? it's not realistic to man the border nor is it politically going to happen - not even SF would suggest to man the border.

    What is the Irish person was what you called an essential worker a few posts ago - perhaps they brought it into the country - you seem to suggest that they wouldn't need to quarantine. Have you changed your mind about this now?


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    #8603
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Correct decision. The scale of the epidemic isn't such that it is required. It would be disproportionate.

    We are already on the borderline with regards to human rights.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0225/1199178-human-rights-covid-legislation/

    "The IHREC has pointed out that separate to this research, it warned Oireachtas members last September that emergency legislation related to Covid-19 needed to be used exceptionally, and subjected to strict human rights standards and oversight."

    It seems that those voting for mandatory quarantine are ignoring all human rights consideration, yet they would be the first to complain if there was a finding.

    Sections of Australia lockdown if one case is reported. Disproportion is in the eye of the beholder it seems. I believe Canada has anyone arriving paying for their own hotel stay.

    Quite right. This is how it works, we discuss things. If we are told they would contravene civil rights, we don't. We shouldn't assume and not do things without looking into it.
    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Maybe in a thread about the virus or the sub forum, but not in a thread about the government - it's just spreading rumours without knowing the facts behind it.

    This is a general thread regarding government. Stuff comes up.


  • Options
    #8604
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Do you know how big the border is? it's not realistic to man the border nor is it politically going to happen - not even SF would suggest to man the border.

    What is the Irish person was what you called an essential worker a few posts ago - perhaps they brought it into the country - you seem to suggest that they wouldn't need to quarantine. Have you changed your mind about this now?

    Its about limiting the chances of the virus and new strains getting here. If a flight has 50 on it split 50/50 essential workers. Is it better to allow 25 go do what they want or send them to quarantine.

    We are not allowed travel 5km and people are talking about civil rights of tourists coming into country during a pandemic.


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    #8605
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,248 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Do you know how big the border is? it's not realistic to man the border nor is it politically going to happen - not even SF would suggest to man the border.

    What is the Irish person was what you called an essential worker a few posts ago - perhaps they brought it into the country - you seem to suggest that they wouldn't need to quarantine. Have you changed your mind about this now?

    Look, some of the people suggesting things don't have a clue, they are just repeating what the opposition are saying without any filter.

    I asked about hotel room numbers earlier, didn't get a credible response.

    Mandatory quarantine is only useful as part of a zero Covid strategy, which the same posters deny they want.


  • Options
    #8606
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,248 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    Its about limiting the chances of the virus and new strains getting here. If a flight has 50 on it split 50/50 essential workers. Is it better to allow 25 go do what they want or send them to quarantine.

    We are not allowed travel 5km and people are talking about civil rights of tourists coming into country during a pandemic.

    The virus getting here is not the problem, the virus already here is.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0225/1199357-hse-coronavirus-ireland/


    "HSE Chief Executive Paul Reid has said while there is "room for optimism" due to the vaccination roll-out, the HSE "remains concerned" at the high level of movement across the community."

    ""There are out higher levels of movement across society, people going to work, in transit and moving between households."

    "Mr Reid also said there has been an increase in the positivity rate among close contacts over the past seven days, and that the average number of close contacts for the last seven days is 3.3 - with one person recording 38 close contacts."

    Those who are wasting their breath about manadatory quarantine are ignoring the public health experts and their advice and should be concentrating on the real issues of people movement.


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    #8607
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Look, some of the people suggesting things don't have a clue, they are just repeating what the opposition are saying without any filter.

    I asked about hotel room numbers earlier, didn't get a credible response.

    Mandatory quarantine is only useful as part of a zero Covid strategy, which the same posters deny they want.

    Yes you did. It was pointed out that theres thousands of hotel rooms all over Ireland, not just Dublin


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    #8608
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    blanch152 wrote: »
    The virus getting here is not the problem, the virus already here is.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0225/1199357-hse-coronavirus-ireland/


    "HSE Chief Executive Paul Reid has said while there is "room for optimism" due to the vaccination roll-out, the HSE "remains concerned" at the high level of movement across the community."

    ""There are out higher levels of movement across society, people going to work, in transit and moving between households."

    "Mr Reid also said there has been an increase in the positivity rate among close contacts over the past seven days, and that the average number of close contacts for the last seven days is 3.3 - with one person recording 38 close contacts."

    Those who are wasting their breath about manadatory quarantine are ignoring the public health experts and their advice and should be concentrating on the real issues of people movement.

    Just under 4000 people arrived last week non essential, they are moving about the country.
    Our schools are returning Monday that will be more movement. I have to take 8 and 9 year old to the school gates just so my 5 yr old can go back. I know plenty in same boat

    My sons school has pupils from both sides of the border


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    #8609
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,248 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    Yes you did. It was pointed out that theres thousands of hotel rooms all over Ireland, not just Dublin

    I said I didn't get a credible response. The only one I did get didn't understand the extra risks associated with the idea.
    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    Just under 4000 people arrived last week non essential, they are moving about the country.
    Our schools are returning Monday that will be more movement. I have to take 8 and 9 year old to the school gates just so my 5 yr old can go back. I know plenty in same boat

    My sons school has pupils from both sides of the border

    I assume that they are being sent straight to quarantine for two weeks?


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    #8610
    Whatisthisnow
    Site Banned Posts: 301 ✭✭Whatisthisnow


    blanch152 wrote: »
    I said I didn't get a credible response. The only one I did get didn't understand the extra risks associated with the idea.



    I assume that they are being sent straight to quarantine for two weeks?

    Why would they, our Govt voted against it. The same day a new strain has been identified


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    #8611
    Ace2007
    Registered Users Posts: 19,695 ✭✭✭✭Ace2007


    Whatisthisnow wrote: »
    Just under 4000 people arrived last week non essential, they are moving about the country.
    Our schools are returning Monday that will be more movement. I have to take 8 and 9 year old to the school gates just so my 5 yr old can go back. I know plenty in same boat

    My sons school has pupils from both sides of the border

    How do you know there were 4,000 and that they were non-essential travel? How do you know they are moving around the country?


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