Am I wrong for being angry at my parents incapabilities?

Another day · 06-07-2019 12:42am

For someone who missed large chunks of education you are extremely articulate so bravo there. Have you looked at springboard? Lots of courses for employed and unemployed for fee. Not good with hyperlink https://www.education.ie/en/Learners/Information/Upskilling-and-Training-options/springboard%202019.html
You are amazing and so strong, stay focused on the future not the past (I'm a fine one to talk!)

ILoveYourVibes · 06-07-2019 1:15am

No i think it would be abnormal not to be angry.

06-07-2019 1:18am

OP as someone who also had an unstable childhood with a mentally ill mother (though not quite as severe as yours), I can say that it is 100% normal to feel angry, in fact it's a good thing to a certain extent. It's only when we become adults that we can look back and understand just how badly we were treated. The memories and realisations come in waves.

It's important to get therapy in order to process what happened to you. It's ok to feel angry but you don't want to become consumed by it and eventually you need to move on from it.

I would really recommend a book called Homecoming by John Bradshaw, and the website 'out of the fog.' You can get through this and build a good life for yourself.

ipsyoopsy · 06-07-2019 2:36am

Flying Fox wrote: »

OP as someone who also had an unstable childhood with a mentally ill mother (though not quite as severe as yours), I can say that it is 100% normal to feel angry, in fact it's a good thing to a certain extent. It's only when we become adults that we can look back and understand just how badly we were treated. The memories and realisations come in waves.

It's important to get therapy in order to process what happened to you. It's ok to feel angry but you don't want to become consumed by it and eventually you need to move on from it.

I would really recommend a book called Homecoming by John Bradshaw, and the website 'out of the fog.' You can get through this and build a good life for yourself.

Yeah thats exactly it, the realisations come in waves and its honestly scary to think of such a young person in the midst of such madness and neglect. Thank you so much for the book and website recommendations, Ill check those out.

ipsyoopsy · 06-07-2019 2:38am

Another day wrote: »

For someone who missed large chunks of education you are extremely articulate so bravo there. Have you looked at springboard? Lots of courses for employed and unemployed for fee. Not good with hyperlink https://www.education.ie/en/Learners/Information/Upskilling-and-Training-options/springboard%202019.html
You are amazing and so strong, stay focused on the future not the past (I'm a fine one to talk!)

Thank you so much for saying that thats very kind. Ill look into Springboard and all the other sites people have suggested. Thanks again.

ipsyoopsy · 06-07-2019 2:50am

zoe 3619 wrote: »

So sorry to hear what you've gone through.
Go and see an adult education guidance person.(ETB?)
Doing it myself,and I'm much older than you are.The range of courses are amazing and at all different levels.
Think you probably need to move on from that household though.All people are fallible-your mother was obviously sick and your father maybe thought he tried but obviously failed you,but best not to immerse yourself back in it.
Better to be looking forward than backward.
Fetchcourses.ie,or Qualifax might be worth a look.

Its good to hear that youve had a positive experience on your course. Im sure he does think he tried, and the more I think about it, the more upset I feel on behalf of my mother. Theres nothing scarier than losing all control over yourself as an adult and it having fall-out for the people closest to you. Youre absolutley right and I'll move out of this environment as soon as its humanly possible to do so. Thank you.

ipsyoopsy · 06-07-2019 3:58am

Paddy Cow wrote: »

When I came back from doing the year in Australia, I decided I'd had enough of hospitality and wanted to get an office job. I was barely computer literate so I did a five month FAS (called Solas now) course. The course was brilliant because it assumed no previous computer experience. It went at a slow pace and I even learned to touch type. They do CV and interview skills. There was a ten week placement at the end and I got kept on in that job for three years. We had older women on the course who could barely turn on a computer and at the end were well able to use word, save files, look through a computer directory etc.

I cannot recommend enough contacting your local social welfare department and asking for a meeting with an advisor. They might even refer you to Seetec/JobPath. They get a bad rep but if you are actually looking to upskill and eventually find work, they are really good. I was referred to them as I was working part time and they paid for me to do an online ECDL course. Even though I'm now well able to use a computer, it looks good to have an official cert on the ould cv. The online course might be less daunting for you as you can do it at home and the etutors are very good at getting back if you have any difficulties.

Solas also do evening courses if a full time course is too much for you. For someone who barely had any second level education, you come across articulate and intelligent in your posts. I think you would do very well on any of these entry courses, which would boost your self-esteem and confidence. You can easily build on these with a view to entering University. You are 23 and that qualifies you as a mature student so you don't need leaving cert points. Most colleges run an access program for mature students. I think Springboard might be an option. The access courses are great because there's a lot of support and most people doing them have been out of education for years, or like yourself they never finished it and now they are determined to give it a go.

Please don't think that not finishing secondary school means you are destined for a life time of minimum wage/unskilled jobs. There are loads of options out there to help you get a better life, you just need to know where to look. 23 is still very young. With the right guidance you can get educated and away from your parents. You have every right to be angry and bitter with them but holding onto that is only going to ruin the rest of your life. It took strength to survive your upbringing but you did and unlike a lot of people who don't figure it out until their 40's, when their life is half over, educating yourself is a far better way to escape your circumstances, than drinking or taking drugs to block it out.

I wish you all the best.

Thank you so much for all of your advice and encouragement. And youre absolutley right, educating/bettering yourself is a much better option than the alternative route of the dole, drink, and drugs. Lol ****ing hell, anything else is better than the drugs/drink dole life. Thanks again.

ipsyoopsy · 06-07-2019 4:02am

Wow, those poor folks who cant read or write are probably some of the only folks in Ireland who actually have less of an education than I do, beyond my grandmothers generation haha. And yeah I dont think there was any malicious intent from either one of my parents, Its just one giant mess. Thank you.

Finchie1276 · 06-07-2019 2:14pm

Hello,
I think you are great to have survived that and to be in a place where you have at least some sense of being able to see what was wrong about what you experienced.

We are brought into this world as tiny defenceless babies, we need our parents to keep us alive, to mind us, keep us well, help us grow up and progress through life.

What happened to you was, on so many levels terribly wrong and damaging. There are so many levels where your needs were not met.

Given that you are living with your parents who put you through all that you went through tells me that in a way your self esteem is very very battered. If you had healthy self esteem you would be no contact with both.
That you have no self esteem is OK, you can learn that. That you are realising the wrongs of all you had to out up with is super encouraging.

There is a lot of pain to go back over with a psychotherapist to help you understand the failings of your parents. In my case I was stuck on the same question - how can I not feel wrong about what my parents did? Through a lot of work and good therapy I learned that parents are not perfect, they make mistakes, put themselves first, are neglectful, aware of damage and don't fix it... you get the picture. So, its easy to hate them or be angry.

There is no 'wrong' with anger.But being confused or stuck with anger stops us from being healthy with ourselves, setting boundaries and moving on to be the better version of ourselves we can be. I think what you are asking is 'is it appropriate that I be angry' and I think the answer is yes it is appropriate. When we ask that question we can start to see where our anger starts, and that starts with hurt. You were hurt by the people who should have loved you.

From that point you can start to see that to just be angry is not useful, you can feel angry and move your life to a healthier place. You may feel broken, unloved, stuck but you can move past that.

The first thing I would do is try to move out. I would read up on family dynamics, the role of the scapegoat in family dynamics and family roles. I guess you will get very angry as you learn more, thats no bad thing. If you can engage with a psychotherapist who works with family dynamics that would be ideal. Expensive but worth it. It will take time. Eventually you will move to the place where you can feel your anger, see your parents failings as not about you but about them and be in a healthier place. Everything you have written points to a survivor who has great insight and self compassion but is stuck.

Try to imaging getting better as a spiral as opposed to steps - sometimes it feels we are not getting better but we are slowly moving on up and away from the difficulties.

Your parents are very damaged and its now your chance to put that to rest and move on. I would recommend no contact as your eventual aim as I dounbt very much that either of your parents are in a position to explain or put into context what they did to you. I really wish you al the best, you are taking baby steps but on this journey you can never walk backwards.

Take care.

Emme · 06-07-2019 4:29pm

OP you have every right to be angry with your parents and the rest of your family. People say they don't know what they were doing but plenty of families with deprivation and addiction treat their children better.

Don't forgive them, there is no excuse for what they did. Use the anger to propel yourself forward. Your health issues need not be permanent. If you can get yourself to a better place in life they may well improve.

Work on getting back into education. You are articulate and intelligent and when you are in a course you will catch up fast.

I know it isn't easy these days but work towards leaving your parents' home. For good. Otherwise you will end up being an angry miserable full time carer to both of them. Despite their treatment of you they will try and blackmail you with all they done for you, how they didn't let you die and took you back in after your relationship failed. Blah blah blah. Never mind how they neglected you and abused you. Abuse takes many forms, it needn't be sexual.

Your extended family might not like you leaving your parents house when the time comes because it will push the responsibility onto them. Good enough for them, they watched you being neglected and abused and did nothing. Letting you sleep on their floors was nothing, you would do that for a dog. Often well off "respectable" families would rather treat their younger members badly if it means not losing face.

People won't like this but you are fully justified in using people and doing what you have to do (without putting yourself in harms way or engaging in dangerous work) to get out of there and cover the ground you lost. It's your turn now and let your parents fend for themselves when the opportunity comes for you to move out. No contact ever again with any of them.

Again, use your anger to singlemindedly propel yourself forward. Channeled correctly your anger will help you.

Good luck.

JustAThought · 11-07-2019 8:31am

No you are not wrong to be angry and outraged at how you were treated by your family and at how appalingly your extended family treated your welfare and ignored all but your most basic needs. Perhaps they were all also brought up in extremely chaotic ways (hoarding, mental illness seen as a non doctor normal thing etc) and were totally out of their depth in even beginning to know how to help - daily sandwiches, allowed sleep on floor, etc - they gave but in a chaotic way where a different approach would have been transformational to your life.

You will make yourself ill trying to unravel or change the past - your dad couldn't cope, neither he nor her relations had the copung skills to manage, and you suffered terribly as a result.

You DO sound like a really smart articulate person. 23 is still young and far too young to ignore all the chances of full time education. After your surgery and recovery try snd see if you can get signed into some kind of degree course - many doors are opened with degrees and you can apply to get a grant for rent/living costs as well as fees. A lot of the springboard courses are interesting and fine BUT you dont want to use up your mature student status and one chance at getting a degree paid for by using it up by doing a springboard course. You could do something lifechanging like business with accountancy where you would always be employed and have a great salary and future in business - or get sponsored after for exemptions to do the professiinal qualification while being paid by s company & mentored along. With a long term illness like Chrons or UC I assume a solid stable respected qualification that will hold you up for life would be a good path.

You sound understandably angry but bear in mind anger and dwelling on the mess of a past your family created and managed will eat away at your health and happiness. You mom was mentally ill, you dad could notcope or manage her or your needs and is now also still angry and unwell over it all. Your family had not the skills to do it differently or know how to approach your care and needs. Dont let your past ruin your future. You do not have to understand, or forgive, to move on. Draw a line under it and if you can place it one side and make the posotive choices that will improve yiur quality of life and mental headspace instead of thinking and dwelling on people and a past you cannot change or understand .

Your future is bright -dont let other peoples inadequacies and failures to cope ruin your future. Look forward, not back. Your hope and dreams lies ahead of you - follow them, not other peoples failures.

Neyite · 12-07-2019 11:11am

You had a chaotic, neglectful and abused childhood.

Any anger is entirely normal and natural. But you've got determination and drive to succeed and I've no doubt you'll come out on top.

You are only 23. This is the perfect age to go back to college and get that education you want. You are still young enough to enjoy college life but old enough not to piss away the chance like some that are straight out of LC might.

I'm 44 and my friend and I have decided to enrol in Sept for a qualification that we both want to do. (and I was never academic to begin with). Another woman I know is resitting her Leaving Cert maths. Same age as me.

I think that you could really do with counselling to sort it all out in your head. And finding some sort of physical distance from the ongoing dysfunction - maybe after your operation you might be able to find a flatshare or something.

This thread on mumsnet is where I think you can find people who really get it. Some have been through worse, some through far more benign types of parental dysfunction but all get treated with respect and kindness and you get a lot of insight from experienced and wise people.
All the best.

StinkyMunkey · 12-07-2019 10:26pm

After reading that, I feel somewhat privileged about my upbringing. Thinking I had it tough because my parents separated when I was 7.

I think if they made your life into a movie I'd feel physically ill and emotionally disturbed after watching it, how you survived is beyond me. Your obviously stronger than you give yourself credit for.

Your mother and father really had no business being parents, and your extended family failed you on an epic scale. I'm surprised your able to string a sentence together let alone be so articulate. It's obvious with more education you will broaden your horizons.

Your story makes things that seem like a big deal at the time seem totally trivial.

I genuinely hope life cuts you break, god knows you fcuking deserve it.

ipsyoopsy · 21-07-2019 3:06pm

Good luck to you and your friend with going back to education in September! I hope it all works out. Thanks for your advice.

ipsyoopsy · 21-07-2019 3:07pm

Thank you so much I appreciate it.

ipsyoopsy · 21-07-2019 3:09pm

Thank you for your other suggestions! And youre absolutely right a stable, respectable qualification is what im aiming for.

21-07-2019 3:47pm

ipsyoopsy wrote: »

Thank you for your other suggestions! And youre absolutely right a stable, respectable qualification is what im aiming for.

That's totally doable.. decide what direction you want to go and go about working towards it..
Good luck with everything anyway..

Am I wrong for being angry at my parents incapabilities?

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