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Free upskilling courses in Maths, Physics and Spanish

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    #32
    doc_17
    Registered Users Posts: 6,850 ✭✭✭doc_17


    I don’t have anything against Biology by the way!


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    #33
    Treppen
    Registered Users Posts: 4,568 ✭✭✭Treppen


    doc_17 wrote: »
    I totally agree with you. But if I don’t teach Physics there won’t be Physics in my school. There aren’t any Physics teachers about, hence the reason for this course. So whilst I may not be on the register as a qualified physics teacher, at least they get to do it. Otherwise it’s more students doing Biology, and then more Biology teachers! That report several years ago that highlighted the feedback issue in science teaching was a good read. I was appointed as a Maths teacher and I’m doing the school and students a favour by taking this on since the previous physics teacher retired.

    I did an OU course in 2010 and had I done the 2 week residential in the UK I’d be at a level where I would be deemed to have enough university Physics to teach to A Level. I’m happy I have enough to teach them well.

    But my advice was that if you go into it you will face a fierce amount of work. If your school wants you to go into it then you should be looking for something from them in return.

    Really I get the impression that the courses aren't aimed at permanent established teachers.

    Like your last sentence there, you'll be doing the department a huge favour by doing the course. I notice there seems to be a push on for other minor subjects like Computer Science, Ag Science, Politics and Society, Applied Maths, so I wonder would schools be all that concerned if another minor subject
    like Physics is lost, especially if the curriculum/timetable is already jam packed with choice. Don't get me wrong though, I'd love my kids to do physics if they could.


    You'll get the qualification for free but what will you get for all the work put in, if schools aren't bothered with qualification requirements. They'd just as easy give maths to an unqualified science teacher as they would to a qualified maths teacher if it suited timetabling.


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    #34
    Mmmml80
    Registered Users Posts: 10 ✭Mmmml80


    Just wondering if the Maths course is difficult in terms of the actual Maths content? I’m thinking of doing it to further my employment prospects (keen to move schools). I have another MFL so I’m not too keen on doing Spanish, but I haven’t done Maths since my Leaving Cert nearly 20 years ago! Had anyone any insights as to how tricky the Maths element would be? Thanks


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    #35
    Treppen
    Registered Users Posts: 4,568 ✭✭✭Treppen


    Mmmml80 wrote: »
    Just wondering if the Maths course is difficult in terms of the actual Maths content? I’m thinking of doing it to further my employment prospects (keen to move schools). I have another MFL so I’m not too keen on doing Spanish, but I haven’t done Maths since my Leaving Cert nearly 20 years ago! Had anyone any insights as to how tricky the Maths element would be? Thanks

    It's not too bad. But if you haven't looked at a. LC paper in 20 years you might need help asking the way. Some of the lectures I have a breeze what was going on but figured it out eventually.
    A WhatsApp group or help from your own school maths teachers will go a long long way.


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    #36
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Treppen wrote: »
    Really I get the impression that the courses aren't aimed at permanent established teachers.

    Like your last sentence there, you'll be doing the department a huge favour by doing the course. I notice there seems to be a push on for other minor subjects like Computer Science, Ag Science, Politics and Society, Applied Maths, so I wonder would schools be all that concerned if another minor subject
    like Physics is lost, especially if the curriculum/timetable is already jam packed with choice. Don't get me wrong though, I'd love my kids to do physics if they could.


    You'll get the qualification for free but what will you get for all the work put in, if schools aren't bothered with qualification requirements. They'd just as easy give maths to an unqualified science teacher as they would to a qualified maths teacher if it suited timetabling.

    A principal won't care whether it's a permanent teacher or a non permanent teacher with the qualification. Actually, if the teacher is there on a permanent basis they are likely to stay long term and if they can be move sideways into a subject that has been problematic to get a teacher for, then it might be easier to hire for that teacher's current subject area, particularly if there is a demand for the subject.

    I'd also say that Ag Science is not a minority subject. 8000 sit Ag every year, where there's only about 6500 sitting Physics. Computer Science and Politics and Society are new/recent subjects so will take many years to become established in schools.

    I moved into Physics 7 years ago in my school when the previous teacher left. I upskilled and went back to college part time for two years to complete the module requirements. As the only person qualified to teach Physics in my school, I essentially have it guaranteed to be on my timetable each year. I have relatively small classes of interested students, because students that take Physics tend to have an interest in it and an aptitude for it. That is a plus in terms of the timetable I get every year, and it leaves no room for random CSPE type stuff to appear on my timetable.


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    #37
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Mmmml80 wrote: »
    Just wondering if the Maths course is difficult in terms of the actual Maths content? I’m thinking of doing it to further my employment prospects (keen to move schools). I have another MFL so I’m not too keen on doing Spanish, but I haven’t done Maths since my Leaving Cert nearly 20 years ago! Had anyone any insights as to how tricky the Maths element would be? Thanks

    Well it would be college level maths. It has to be, to be the equivalent of what people are doing in maths degrees to be recognised to teach Maths.


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    #38
    Alex86Eire
    Registered Users Posts: 330 ✭✭Alex86Eire


    Mmmml80 wrote: »
    Just wondering if the Maths course is difficult in terms of the actual Maths content? I’m thinking of doing it to further my employment prospects (keen to move schools). I have another MFL so I’m not too keen on doing Spanish, but I haven’t done Maths since my Leaving Cert nearly 20 years ago! Had anyone any insights as to how tricky the Maths element would be? Thanks

    It is college level maths. I would have done some maths in college and my background is in science but found parts of the course very tricky. It's very labour intensive and fairly full on when you're working full time. The drop out rate is very high. A lot of my class had underestimated the amount of work involved to be honest. If you've a good cohort in your class that will help you a lot.

    Many of the modules were fairly irrelevant to teaching LC maths when I did the course. Hopefully this will change this time around.


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    #39
    RealJohn
    Registered Users Posts: 2,099 ✭✭✭RealJohn


    Mmmml80 wrote: »
    Just wondering if the Maths course is difficult in terms of the actual Maths content? I’m thinking of doing it to further my employment prospects (keen to move schools). I have another MFL so I’m not too keen on doing Spanish, but I haven’t done Maths since my Leaving Cert nearly 20 years ago! Had anyone any insights as to how tricky the Maths element would be? Thanks
    If you were reasonably good at leaving cert maths (did and at least passed higher level) then you’ll probably be fine, as long as you work at it. If you weren’t able for higher level leaving cert maths, and haven’t done maths since, I would think it will be hard work to pass this course.
    If you chose to do ordinary level leaving cert maths to concentrate on other subjects, but might/probably would have been able for higher level, you might struggle with the course but manage it with hard work.
    In my opinion.


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    #40
    Treppen
    Registered Users Posts: 4,568 ✭✭✭Treppen


    Alex86Eire wrote: »
    It is college level maths. I would have done some maths in college and my background is in science but found parts of the course very tricky. It's very labour intensive and fairly full on when you're working full time. The drop out rate is very high. A lot of my class had underestimated the amount of work involved to be honest. If you've a good cohort in your class that will help you a lot.

    Many of the modules were fairly irrelevant to teaching LC maths when I did the course. Hopefully this will change this time around.

    Nice to see they kept Matrices and Vectors!
    They make for good TY modules.


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    #41
    djemba djemba
    Registered Users Posts: 2,580 ✭✭✭djemba djemba


    Any feedback from anyone participating on these courses?
    Whats the work load like?


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    #42
    27061986a
    Registered Users Posts: 60 ✭✭27061986a


    If you undertake the physics course, does this qualify you to teach junior cert science as well?


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    #43
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    27061986a wrote: »
    If you undertake the physics course, does this qualify you to teach junior cert science as well?

    You have to have credits in biology and chemistry to teach junior science


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    #44
    Polka_Dot
    Registered Users Posts: 551 ✭✭✭Polka_Dot


    I think that requirement is being removed from 2023 as there's no mention of it in the new TC document and was only brought in a few years back. Not entirely sure though as it's very ambiguous.


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    #45
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Polka_Dot wrote: »
    I think that requirement is being removed from 2023 as there's no mention of it in the new TC document and was only brought in a few years back. Not entirely sure though as it's very ambiguous.

    The document only deals with Leaving Cert subjects. The requirement has been around for a long time. My degree 25 years ago included enough credits in physics, chemistry and biology in first year so that everyone would be qualified for JC Science along with whatever LC subjects they picked for degree level.


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    #46
    Polka_Dot
    Registered Users Posts: 551 ✭✭✭Polka_Dot


    rainbowtrout wrote: »
    The document only deals with Leaving Cert subjects. The requirement has been around for a long time. My degree 25 years ago included enough credits in physics, chemistry and biology in first year so that everyone would be qualified for JC Science along with whatever LC subjects they picked for degree level.

    Ah fair enough, I find the requirements a bit confusing. I just remember that when I was considering teaching before going to college, the document at the time did not explicitly state having credits in all 3 (I think I remember it saying that if you were qualified in one LC science you could teach JC science but I'm not 100% sure as it was 10 years ago), and then the requirements being updated in the last few years where it was explicitly stated. And since the 2023 document doesn't mention it, I wasn't sure if it was changing.


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    #47
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    Polka_Dot wrote: »
    Ah fair enough, I find the requirements a bit confusing. I just remember that when I was considering teaching before going to college, the document at the time did not explicitly state having credits in all 3 (I think I remember it saying that if you were qualified in one LC science you could teach JC science but I'm not 100% sure as it was 10 years ago), and then the requirements being updated in the last few years where it was explicitly stated. And since the 2023 document doesn't mention it, I wasn't sure if it was changing.

    10 credits are required in each of Physics, Chemistry and Biology to be eligible to teach JC Science.

    I suspect however that in reality a person hired to teach Physics in a school would be given a JC Science class whether they had Chemistry/Biology credits or not.


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