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What's the plan for 2010 ?

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124

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    #92
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    iamhunted wrote: »
    im kinda psychic *after* the fact
    .


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    #93
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    kfoltman wrote: »
    Well, about 50% of the people in each profession are below-average,.

    It HAS to be more than that ?? ;)


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    #94
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    I'll never trust a surgeon again


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    #95
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    Even if you are **** hot and have all the right contacts, that's no guarantee of success. It's a very good starting point though.

    A lad I knew years ago was in a band called the Subterraeneans, they were the Hotpress band of the year 1986, they were signed to the Mother label and Bono (when people liked him) was asked on TV who his favourite band was, he said "Subterraeneans".

    You couldn't pay for that kind of publicity and they were an excellent band.

    They released a couple of singles, one produced by Stephen Street, and had some radio play.

    Needless to say they didn't make the big time. Not because they weren't technically good enough or because they didn't have good contacts. They just didn't appeal to the record buying public.

    People have to like what you do enough to want to pay for it by buying your records or going to your gigs. That's assuming you want commercial success.:D


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    #96
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    Rockshamrover wrote: »
    Even if you are **** hot and have all the right contacts, that's no guarantee of success. It's a very good starting point though.

    A lad I knew years ago was in a band called the Subterraeneans, they were the Hotpress band of the year 1986, they were signed to the Mother label and Bono (when people liked him) was asked on TV who his favourite band was, he said "Subterraeneans".

    You couldn't pay for that kind of publicity and they were an excellent band.

    They released a couple of singles, one produced by Stephen Street, and had some radio play.

    Needless to say they didn't make the big time. Not because they weren't technically good enough or because they didn't have good contacts. They just didn't appeal to the record buying public.

    People have to like what you do enough to want to pay for it by buying your records or going to your gigs. That's assuming you want commercial success.:D

    I remember them!
    Saw them a couple of times in the Baggot Inn as I recall.

    Never quite cut the mustard to my ears with a bit too much of The Clash going on.


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    #97
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    I remember them!
    Saw them a couple of times in the Baggot Inn as I recall.

    Never quite cut the mustard to my ears with a bit too much of The Clash going on.

    They were quirky. Talking heads quirky.

    You either liked them or hated them.


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    #98
    Aridstarling
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭Aridstarling


    Rockshamrover wrote: »
    People have to like what you do enough to want to pay for it by buying your records or going to your gigs. That's assuming you want commercial success.:D

    This a very important sticking point for me. I think the level of success I'd be happy with, the success I'm always trying to work towards, has very little to do with money earned really... I'd hope to make money doing it, its far from the primary aim though.


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    #99
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    It's grand having contacts and having the right people saying the right things, but a band has to be out there regardless writing music and trying to let people hear it.

    The focus on commercial success is what has ruined music in my eyes. A band doesnt need contacts if they can work out how to make them for themselves. There's plenty of musicians worldwide Im sure who are happy enough getting by and releasing music rather than striving for success deemed by making money.

    The next few years i reckon are going to be both a hard time for everyone involved in music, but also maybe a time to re-evaluate what the music industry currently is, and what it really should be. We all might end up in a better place, one never knows.


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    #100
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    Guys, the commercial success I am referring to is not that you become rich but just that you actually cover your costs and can still have enough left to live on.

    As Paul mentioned a few weeks ago, you could go out and spend 10 grand making an album that nobody wants to hear and be lucky to sell a few hundred copies. Pointless unless you just want to say, I made an album.

    This band did everything that some posters mentioned earlier.

    They were excellent musicians.
    They played hundreds of gigs.
    They had radio and TV appearances.
    They released singles.
    They toured extensively, both here and in the UK.

    My point is the public have to like you and what you do. You have to have an audience. You get an audience by being good.


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    #101
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    Rockshamrover wrote: »
    They were excellent musicians.
    They played hundreds of gigs.
    They had radio and TV appearances.
    They released singles.
    They toured extensively, both here and in the UK.

    My point is the public have to like you and what you do. You have to have an audience. You get an audience by being good.

    Aye - that's the case with some bands here all that has happened ( a lot of the 'if only' boxes have been ticked) but still no result ...

    Logical Conclusion = Yer Shyt ....

    Harsh but Fair.


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    #102
    Savman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,323 ✭✭✭Savman


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    Logical Conclusion = Yer Shyt ....

    Harsh but Fair.
    Not really fair IMHO. A lot of bands are just not 'economically viable' for a number of reasons, and some just place too much emphasis on getting lucky.

    May as well be doing your Lotto quickpicks in the meantime.


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    #103
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    Rockshamrover wrote: »
    Guys, the commercial success I am referring to is not that you become rich but just that you actually cover your costs and can still have enough left to live on.

    You dont need to spend a fortune to do some music. Plus whats more important? Writing the music or living off it? If its writing the music, then get a day job, if its living off the money then a band is in the wrong business.


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    #104
    Aridstarling
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭Aridstarling


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    Logical Conclusion = Yer Shyt ....

    Harsh but Fair.

    Not always true I don't think. Many bands, good bands, just haven't fit with whatever the prevailing trend or anti-trend was at a given time. Many gave up, more didn't. There are many great records out there that only a handful of people actually own.


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    #105
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    iamhunted wrote: »
    You dont need to spend a fortune to do some music. Plus whats more important? Writing the music or living off it? If its writing the music, then get a day job, if its living off the money then a band is in the wrong business.

    That's the key to the whole thing, having realistic goals and expectations.

    Do the music for the sake of the music to the very best of your ability. Enjoy it for as long as you can. If you connect with the public, fantastic.


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    #106
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    precisely. not that it would be a crime to make some money, but it just doesnt happen that often.


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    #107
    all the stars
    Registered Users Posts: 1,058 ✭✭✭all the stars


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    No one gives a shyte about supports !
    Do YOU go to a gig to see the support?
    No they're the annoying noise going on whilst you're trying to have a chat/drink with your mates.

    :eek:
    yikes!
    Im actually wondering who is supporting Alicia keys... coz i hope to be up there as support act soon. Why? bloody good experience is a factor.
    I know of some SENSATIONAL acts who are supporting others at the moment internationally and its been great for them. Have amassed huge interest which you can see splashed all over any of their internet pages.
    And when i was at horselips- to say the support act was noise would be blasphemy! They were excellent.
    I genuionely like to hear the support acts - as usually there are an up & coming artist and i like to know :)


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    #108
    all the stars
    Registered Users Posts: 1,058 ✭✭✭all the stars


    SeanHurley wrote: »

    Of course there is a lot of that deludedness we see on X-Factor where people believe thay are amazing when quite clearly they are not.
    Indeed... but they see 3 goes of judges prior to cowell & co, and the producers AND a&r guy from Record company views them and says YES .. hence the "im amazing" thing.


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    #109
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    all the stars wrote: »
    Indeed... but they see 3 goes of judges prior to cowell & co, and the producers AND a&r guy from Record company views them and says YES .. hence the "im amazing" thing.

    Dont forget, mammy and daddy and granny too.


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    #110
    ZV Yoda
    Registered Users Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭ZV Yoda


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    Aye - that's the case with some bands here all that has happened ( a lot of the 'if only' boxes have been ticked) but still no result ...

    Logical Conclusion = Yer Shyt ....

    Harsh but Fair.

    Couldn't disagree more... even if we could get consensus on a definition of "Shyt" music (which we won’t), the bottom line is there are lots of factors involved which contribute to an artist’s success (or not). Talent alone simply won’t get you there. Like it or not, there’s lots of other factors…

    Determination
    Image
    Management
    Financial backing
    Marketing/distribution strategy
    Musical talent
    Luck

    In reality, some success is achievable if an artist scores big 1 or 2 of these areas, but for real longevity, they need to be scoring big in most of these areas.... and musical talent is absolutely essential for a long-term career.


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    #111
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    all the stars wrote: »
    Indeed... but they see 3 goes of judges prior to cowell & co, and the producers AND a&r guy from Record company views them and says YES .. hence the "im amazing" thing.

    I take your point, but I think by now most people realise that some are put through for their entertainment factor i.e. they are so bad it could be seen as humerous.

    I still find it amazing that the families of some people going into these talent competitions don't stop them. I mean how many times have we seen would be pop stars butchering Mariah Carey or Whitney Huston and getting indignant when they are told that they aren't good enough.


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    #112
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    I think the only things a musician needs are:

    Determination
    Marketing/distribution strategy
    Musical talent
    Luck

    Image if you're going after the tweeny boppers, but you dont need money nor management essentially.


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    #113
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    There are a lot of opinions being expressed here (many of which I agree with!) but what evidence are they based on ?

    My own experience from the low ( good old Country + Irish ) to the reasonably high ( Madness, Crowded House, Iggy Pop etc) is that the reality is totally different to what one expects - even if you've already some experience in Da Biz .... it certainly was for me.

    So rather than 'Well I think ...' I'd love to see more ' I think ... and here's why'


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    #114
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    There are a lot of opinions being expressed here (many of which I agree with!) but what evidence are they based on ?

    My own experience from the low ( good old Country + Irish ) to the reasonably high ( Madness, Crowded House, Iggy Pop etc) is that the reality is totally different to what one expects - even if you've already some experience in Da Biz .... it certainly was for me.

    So rather than 'Well I think ...' I'd love to see more ' I think ... and here's why'


    Paul, give us a breakdown of the factors needed for possible success.

    My two are luck and talent.


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    #115
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    There are a lot of opinions being expressed here (many of which I agree with!) but what evidence are they based on ?

    My own experience from the low ( good old Country + Irish ) to the reasonably high ( Madness, Crowded House, Iggy Pop etc) is that the reality is totally different to what one expects - even if you've already some experience in Da Biz .... it certainly was for me.

    So rather than 'Well I think ...' I'd love to see more ' I think ... and here's why'

    the only 'here's why' I have is a musician doesnt need anyone (essentially) but themselves, some luck, some talent and the willingness to work hard.


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    #116
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    Rockshamrover wrote: »
    Paul, give us a breakdown of the factors needed for possible success.

    My two are luck and talent.

    Neck ?;)


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    #117
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    LOL but actually very true. Persistence and self belief can go a long way.


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    #118
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    Rockshamrover wrote: »
    Persistence and self belief can go a long way.

    These can also be the hallmarks of the untalented.


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    #119
    dav nagle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,182 ✭✭✭dav nagle


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    These can also be the hallmarks of the untalented.

    Yes I have seen the over persistent wearing tattoos saying things like 'listen to me'. Someone give this guy a reality check!! :pac:


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    #120
    Rockshamrover
    Registered Users Posts: 1,472 ✭✭✭Rockshamrover


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    These can also be the hallmarks of the untalented.


    True.

    God, is there no hope for any of us:D


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    #121
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    Mumford and Sons ...

    Heard them on BBC Radio 6 and though 'Yup, they'll crack it ok'


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