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What's the plan for 2010 ?

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    #62
    alan kelly
    Registered Users Posts: 444 ✭✭alan kelly


    Good post sean.. hit the nail on the head.. although oasis even played all over england for 2 years before getting spotted. A lot of people glammed it up at the time. Am hoping to release an album for download during the summer and thinking bout giving it away for free. If i get any success great but would much prefer a lot of people getting access to my music. And when i mean success i dont mean appearing on celeb big brother i just mean getting a better standard of gig.. ie supporting some good irish acts


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    #63
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    alan kelly wrote: »
    If i get any success great but would much prefer a lot of people getting access to my music. And when i mean success i dont mean appearing on celeb big brother i just mean getting a better standard of gig.. ie supporting some good irish acts

    I know exactly what you mean Alan, I too would like my music to reach a wider audience and am looking to support some good Irish acts. We had a little bit of success and supported one or two relatively well known Irish acts (and even would ridiculously well known international act) but as far as I can see the support scene (and in particular anything to do with a certain Irish promoter we shant mention) seems to be a particularly hard nut to crack. I think once again it is perseverance that makes the difference here.:p


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    #64
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    I feel that along the way musicianship and the desire to be an artist gave way to being famous. Performers began to see being famous/chart success as the goal rather than the by-product of success as an artist.

    exactly, and thats what has to change - or what will be changing over the next while. Less focus on money, more focus on music.
    I think the money now is in live work as essentially the music industry has come full circle - we are back to the days of the travelling showman/guitar slinger.

    I think thats one part - using the internet as a medium to advertise, promote, give away music, sell music and play live gigs via webcams is another part that musicians will have to start considering. We've had more people tuning into a web gig that we'd normally get at a live gig.


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    #65
    telecaster
    Registered Users Posts: 528 ✭✭✭telecaster


    alan kelly wrote: »
    Am hoping to release an album for download during the summer and thinking bout giving it away for free.

    This most certainly isn't an attack on you or your music (which I haven't heard as far as I know) alan, but, even if you gave it away for free - who would download it unless you have an existing and vibrant fan base?

    Almost every artist with a computer is recording and producing their own music, adding a thousand other bands in the same boat to their myspace page and calling them fans, doing the same on facebook, and pimping their homemade videos on youtube.

    Now that the tyrannical gatekeepers of the record industry have given way to democracy - or perhaps anarchy as an earlier post alluded to - there is an enormous amount of musical schit clogging up the funnell for our attention. Most of the stuff that gets out is fast-tracked by some route most of us either aren't taking or don't have access to.

    It is near impossible to get attention for your music until it hits the mainstream as far as I can see. And little gets to the mainstream by accident. Did Lady Gaga play to half-empty clubs for years or did she just magically appear everywhere being billed as ''the sensation of the year''?

    People saying gigs are the way to make money is fine in theory, but who is going to go to these gigs? Fine we can all get 50 people to one gig one night if we milk the friends and family thing, but who comes to the third and fourth gigs?

    Do the same things, get the same results...

    Buying publicity via PR companies is something I am considering for my own music this year. Has anyone been down that road?

    Ultimately, I'm making the music either way, whether ten people ever get to hear it or ten million, it's just what I do. But it would be satisfying to get a shot at feeding the massed sheep a little bit of my flavour!


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    #66
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    So now those cobwebs have been blown away it's down to brass tacks.

    One of the most common faults I see with bands is relying on other people/institutions/luck for something to happen.

    "If only we -
    got that support slot
    got that producer
    got that promoter
    got that gear
    - we'd be successful"

    etc.

    It's patently clear and demonstrably so, that if you make music that people are interested in, you'll get an audience.

    THERE ARE NO OTHER FACTORS INVOLVED.

    For any bands who have been at it a long time with no success, that's the reason why.


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    #67
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    telecaster wrote: »
    Buying publicity via PR companies is something I am considering for my own music this year. Has anyone been down that road?

    No one gives a toss if you're shyt....

    A complete and utter waste of money unless it's part of a much bigger picture.


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    #68
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    I know exactly what you mean Alan, I too would like my music to reach a wider audience and am looking to support some good Irish acts. We had a little bit of success and supported one or two relatively well known Irish acts (and even would ridiculously well known international act) but as far as I can see the support scene (and in particular anything to do with a certain Irish promoter we shant mention) seems to be a particularly hard nut to crack. I think once again it is perseverance that makes the difference here.:p


    No one gives a shyte about supports !
    Do YOU go to a gig to see the support?
    No they're the annoying noise going on whilst you're trying to have a chat/drink with your mates.


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    #69
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    telecaster wrote: »

    Buying publicity via PR companies is something I am considering for my own music this year. Has anyone been down that road?

    This is something we were/are looking at. But it isn't as easy as paying someone to get you on the inside track. There really is only three PR companies in Ireland that deal with musicians/bands and all have quite a few acts on their books. You really need to wow the PR company or else all they will do is send a few newsletter-like press releases to a few people (along with similar press releases for the other 150 acts they represent) and charge you quite a bit for this.

    As Paul has said, really in order to get where you are going you first need to start out with a good product to sell i.e. you have to be good.


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    #70
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    No one gives a shyte about supports !
    Do YOU go to a gig to see the support?
    No they're the annoying noise going on whilst you're trying to have a chat/drink with your mates.

    Ha ha you may have a point!! Although I do have a habit of watching supports (I am a self confessed weirdo tho). I got into one of my favourite bands ever (You Am I) after seeing them play support to the Lemonheads in the olympia.

    From our point of view it is a way to gig more with out having to worry about the bulk of the running cost of a gig (venue hire, publicity etc.).


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    #71
    telecaster
    Registered Users Posts: 528 ✭✭✭telecaster


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    No one gives a toss if you're shyt....

    And most don't give a toss even if you're not shyt.

    Until you are being pushed by the mass radio and print media you are going nowhere. In fact you would be better off being shyt but enjoying media support than the other way round if you wanted exposure for your music.


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    #72
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    telecaster wrote: »
    And most don't give a toss even if you're not shyt.

    Until you are being pushed by the mass radio and print media you are going nowhere. In fact you would be better off enjoying being shyt but enjoying media support than the other way round if you wanted exposure for your music.

    I disagree - there's always a huge hunger for new music.

    Most of it, unfortunately, doesn't deserve listening. That Penny must drop.

    There are a zillion bands who started the train by just being good - all the other paraphernalia clicks into place real quick.

    Think of it from a Promoter/Radio guy/Journalist's/Photographer's/PR man/Label Guy's etc etc perspective.

    'Holy Shyt, they're good- I want to get involved and get my name in with that'

    That's why bands like Artic Monkeys, or this weeks favourite, Delphic happen so quick - everyone can see they're good and within the business want to be associated with it.

    Bang ! Yer on the telly....


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    #73
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    I disagree - there's always a huge hunger for new music.

    Most of it, unfortunately, doesn't deserve listening.

    There are a zillion bands who started the train by just being good - all the other paraphernalia clicks into place real quick.

    Think of it from a Promoter/Radio guy/Journalist's/Photographer's/PR man/Label Guy's etc etc perspective.

    'Holy Shyt, they're good- I want to get involved and get my name in with that'

    That's why bands like Artic Monkeys, or this weeks favourite, Delphic happen so quick - everyone can see they're good and within the business want to be associated with it.

    Bang ! Yer on the telly....

    Any advice on how to get the music to the Promoter/Radio guy/Journalist's/Photographer's/PR man/Label Guy in the first place?


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    #74
    alan kelly
    Registered Users Posts: 444 ✭✭alan kelly


    Did someone in one of those posts say im never gonna make it.. ah shucks i might as wll give up now.. Most nights i venture into my home studio/spare bedroom not cause i wanna be a millionaire or a rockstar but really because i love it.. hell if i get a few e mails from people saying the like what i do then i have beaten the system... Am i setting my standards too low.. Maybe:rolleyes:


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    #75
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    Any advice on how to get the music to the Promoter/Radio guy/Journalist's/Photographer's/PR man/Label Guy in the first place?

    BE PHUCKIN GOOD ! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YA!
    They'll come to you ....


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    #76
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    alan kelly wrote: »
    Did someone in one of those posts say im never gonna make it.. ah shucks i might as wll give up now.. Most nights i venture into my home studio/spare bedroom not cause i wanna be a millionaire or a rockstar but really because i love it.. hell if i get a few e mails from people saying the like what i do then i have beaten the system... Am i setting my standards too low.. Maybe:rolleyes:

    Once it remains fun that's cool.

    That's a much more wholesome goal than 'Gettin' in da Simons.'


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    #77
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    that's it - Im recording a song called 'Gettin' in da Simons' and Im going to ..err ..... get it in the Simons. Thats a fecken whole new catchphraze there mr brewer


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    #78
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    BE PHUCKIN GOOD ! HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YA!
    They'll come to you ....

    I agree with you to a point, however, you can be amazing in your rehearsal room - the best band the world has ever seen - but no one is going to come and seek you out.

    This is another reason in my view to look for support slots - established bands tend to attract a lot of heads from the industry - so if you are good this is a shop window so to speak.

    Listen I might be being very niave here and I am only at this a wet weekend but surely you have to be in some sort of shop window in order to gain the powers that be's attention? I really see gigging/support slots as a way to (a) hone the skills and (b) sell your product. I also really enjoy gigging:P


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    #79
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    I also really enjoy gigging:P

    That's a great reason by itself!

    In about 1998 I had a 3 piece covers band and we did 150 gigs in the year - it was my main source of income that year and was brilliant craic !


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    #80
    telecaster
    Registered Users Posts: 528 ✭✭✭telecaster


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    but surely you have to be in some sort of shop window in order to gain the powers that be's attention?

    That's true. No one beats down your door no matter how good you are unless the music is being heard.

    The ''they'll come to you if you're good enough'' theory is one of the greatest pieces of bull ever posted on the internet.


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    #81
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    telecaster wrote: »
    That's true. No one beats down your door no matter how good you are unless the music is being heard.

    The ''they'll come to you if you're good enough'' theory is one of the greatest pieces of bull ever posted on the internet.

    Thank you for that Tele.

    It's no theory I'm afraid.

    Look at the evidence .... look at the evidence for the opposite point of view.

    I'm not saying that you don't have to work.

    Think of it from a Music Business person's perspective.

    'Right I need a support band - the lads in the office are going on about DC Tempest - they'll do'

    then ...

    ' Holy Phuck, them DC Tempest boys are great, I wonder will they do another this weekend for me ?'

    then ...

    ' Hey Paddy Journalist guy, come down to the gig Friday and see this new band- they're brilliant'

    and so it goes ...

    Everyone wants to work with great bands... Be one - simple, really.


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    #82
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    Thank you for that Tele.

    It's no theory I'm afraid.

    Look at the evidence .... look at the evidence for the opposite point of view.

    I'm not saying that you don't have to work.

    Think of it from a Music Business person's perspective.

    'Right I need a support band - the lads in the office are going on about DC Tempest - they'll do'

    then ...

    ' Holy Phuck, them DC Tempest boys are great, I wonder will they do another this weekend for me ?'

    then ...

    ' Hey Paddy Journalist guy, come down to the gig Friday and see this new band- they're brilliant'

    and so it goes ...

    Everyone wants to work with great bands... Be one - simple, really.


    That DC Tempest are fantastic as it happens :D


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    #83
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    That DC Tempest are fantastic as it happens :D

    So I believe .... it's all going to kick off in 2010 for them !


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    #84
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    The chain usually breaks between

    'Right I need a support band - the lads in the office are going on about Whoever - they'll do'

    and

    ' Holy Phuck, them Whoever boys are great, I wonder will they do another this weekend for me ?'

    though doesn't it ?;)


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    #85
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    i think the point is that it's up to the bands to make things happen for themselves - not up to anyone else. You don't need anything more than good tunes.

    probably one of the quickest ways to build a fan base it research local and national music DJs, find the ones that suit your taste, email them, say hullo and send them off some cds. if they like the music, they'll play it. You can roll the ball from there.


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    #86
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    Indeed that is why we are spending the first three months in rehearsals. At least rehearsing what you do takes the variable of sloppy playing out of the equation. It is down to the actual music at that point.

    Of course there is a lot of that deludedness we see on X-Factor where people believe thay are amazing when quite clearly they are not.

    You have to walk the walk as well as talk the talk methinks.


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    #87
    kfoltman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 252 ✭✭kfoltman


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    The chain usually breaks between

    'Right I need a support band - the lads in the office are going on about Whoever - they'll do'

    and

    ' Holy Phuck, them Whoever boys are great, I wonder will they do another this weekend for me ?'

    though doesn't it ?;)
    Well, about 50% of the people in each profession are below-average, so what can you expect? (well, below-median, to be nitpicky)

    And the distribution is seriously skewed, too.


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    #88
    kfoltman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 252 ✭✭kfoltman


    SeanHurley wrote: »
    At least rehearsing what you do takes the variable of sloppy playing out of the equation.
    Optimist!


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    #89
    PaulBrewer
    Registered Users Posts: 7,790 ✭✭✭PaulBrewer


    iamhunted wrote: »
    i think the point is that it's up to the bands to make things happen for themselves - not up to anyone else. You don't need anything more than good tunes.

    .

    Like I feckin said !


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    #90
    SeanHurley
    Registered Users Posts: 347 ✭✭SeanHurley


    kfoltman wrote: »
    Optimist!

    ha ha indeed


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    #91
    iamhunted
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,569 ✭✭✭iamhunted


    PaulBrewer wrote: »
    Like I feckin said !

    im kinda psychic *after* the fact


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