Heifer Calving at 40 months

farmer2018 · 20-05-2019 10:25am #1

Whats peoples thoughts on a heifer calving at 40 months old. Could it cause calving issues or fertility when trying to get back in calf?

Lady Haywire · 20-05-2019 10:30am

40 month? So 3 1/2 years? She wouldn't last that long on this farm anyway!
I've found in later years that any heifers we left to get a bit agey/grow up a bit before calving down appear to be less fertile than those calved down at 24/25 months. Now I'm only basing this on a few heifers but perhaps others have had the same.

Brexitcircus · 20-05-2019 10:40am

Lady Haywire wrote: »

40 month? So 3 1/2 years? She wouldn't last that long on this farm anyway!
I've found in later years that any heifers we left to get a bit agey/grow up a bit before calving down appear to be less fertile than those calved down at 24/25 months. Now I'm only basing this on a few heifers but perhaps others have had the same.

Ya 3.5 years. Very late to be calving. In too good of condition that's what I am afraid about.

Lady Haywire · 20-05-2019 10:44am

Brexitcircus wrote: »

Ya 3.5 years. Very late to be calving. In too good of condition that's what I am afraid about.

That can be managed easy enough if she's inside or on bare paddock. Just wonder why she was left so long, was she cycling or aborted a calf or what. It wouldn't exactly scream fertile cow at me.

Brexitcircus · 20-05-2019 10:56am

Lady Haywire wrote: »

That can be managed easy enough if she's inside or on bare paddock. Just wonder why she was left so long, was she cycling or aborted a calf or what. It wouldn't exactly scream fertile cow at me.

Supposedly was just missed. Ya I am hesitant about buying her.

Lady Haywire · 20-05-2019 11:01am

farmer2018 wrote: »

Whats peoples thoughts on a heifer calving at 40 months old. Could it cause calving issues or fertility when trying to get back in calf?

Brexitcircus wrote: »

Supposedly was just missed. Ya I am hesitant about buying her.

Identity crisis? :pac:

About 20yrs ago we bought a 2.5yr old heifer who'd never had a calf. Now the owner had been battling cancer and then passed away so there was a legit reason why she was missed. If I really liked an animal, i'd not hesitate to buy it but I'd also want a valid excuse for her age.
At the end of the day you'll be the one paying for her & looking at her in the field. If you think she's worth it, go for it, but bear in mind it could be an expensive mistake if she's not very fertile. If she's expensive & a pedigree you could get her handled by a vet or scanner fella to check for cysts etc on the ovaries either.

L1985 · 20-05-2019 9:14pm

Giving my issues in stopping a heifer going in calf id be very hesitant. She would have been cycling every month for three years and there was surely some male somewhere near her at that point?

Who2 · 20-05-2019 10:16pm

I know plenty of lads who don’t calve down until then. I was calving all at 24 months and I’ve gone away from it. I’ll have a few that will be over 3 calving next spring, it’s just the way they fell between when they were born and when they’ll calve. It’s better have an animal too big rather than too small, fertility or not you’ll end up with a decent frame of an animal. We can fool ourselves into thinking we’re making more money and being progressive, and might we might even get a pat on the back from Teagasc, but the reality is we’re probably better off keep what we like and not as many of them whether that means leaving them on a few extra months before calving them.

stretch film · 21-05-2019 6:52am

Interesting figures on some teargas publication lately.
Costing 1500 to get (albeit a dairy) heifer to calving at 2. It cost another 1500 by year 3 through extra costs and mostly down to loss of production individually and over all farm.

squinn2912 · 21-05-2019 9:27am

I think 24 months is too severe for a heifer unless maybe dairy and she can calve a pup. We would have jan born heifers calving March/April. Later ones if they’re good enough go into the autumn calvers and it lets them mature a bit more. Find it easier to get them in calf next time. We wouldn’t wait as long as 40 months but if you know the background of this heifers d are happy then work away

patsy_mccabe · 21-05-2019 11:24am

Calved 2 heifers I bought in this year, at 30 months. Both AI'd to average calving Lim bulls. Great comfort coming up to calving that they should calf away no bother, which they did. I'd still go with 24months, if the heifer is right and I can pick an easy calving AI bull.
Sorry but 40 months is madness. Neighbour here has a heifer calved twice before 24 months. First was a caesarain but still. The other end of the spectrum.

farmer2018 · 21-05-2019 12:24pm

I think it depends on the size of the heifer really but I think calving at 27-30 months is a good time.

Anything over 35 months is very late.

Do people find calving heifers later increases or decreases their breeding lifespan?

21-05-2019 1:04pm

Who2 wrote: »

I know plenty of lads who don’t calve down until then. I was calving all at 24 months and I’ve gone away from it. I’ll have a few that will be over 3 calving next spring, it’s just the way they fell between when they were born and when they’ll calve. It’s better have an animal too big rather than too small, fertility or not you’ll end up with a decent frame of an animal. We can fool ourselves into thinking we’re making more money and being progressive, and might we might even get a pat on the back from Teagasc, but the reality is we’re probably better off keep what we like and not as many of them whether that means leaving them on a few extra months before calving them.

Same for us, we tried it for a few years and wasn’t successful found they just weren’t fit for calving so young bar an odd one.

Normally calve at around the 36 months or so.

farmer2018 · 21-05-2019 1:22pm

William Ugly Stingray wrote: »

Same for us, we tried it for a few years and wasn’t successful found they just weren’t fit for calving so young bar an odd one.

Normally calve at around the 36 months or so.

Do you ever encounter any problems?

One cow I bought at a dispersal sale a number of years ago she has a big udder of milk and has no problem going incalf. She had her first calf at 46 months old going by the ICBF report :eek:

carrollsno1 · 21-05-2019 1:30pm

Re calving heifers at two years. Why dont lads just use a real easy calving strain on the heifers? The farm i was on last year had about 200 Angus heifers calving down to Angus again and they weren't much bigger if not smaller than calves i had seen on dairy farms there was very little assistance with them we drove the ute around once a day caught the calf and tagged them only a handful had to be handled and mature cows never needed handling. I reckon if you could get the strain of Angus from this part and send it back yed do well, these cattle would thrive off straw as theyve little options most years.

Welding Rod · 21-05-2019 1:42pm

I’ve calved a few heifers every year for the past six or seven years, aged between 24 and 26 months.
Can honestly say, never yet had a problem calving. Bit slower to get back in calf though.
I wouldn’t ever go back to calving at 36 months which was always my policy. It’s waste I reckon.

squinn2912 · 21-05-2019 2:36pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Calved 2 heifers I bought in this year, at 30 months. Both AI'd to average calving Lim bulls. Great comfort coming up to calving that they should calf away no bother, which they did. I'd still go with 24months, if the heifer is right and I can pick an easy calving AI bull.
Sorry but 40 months is madness. Neighbour here has a heifer calved twice before 24 months. First was a caesarain but still. The other end of the spectrum.

Jesus was that deliberate?? What age was she calving first time? Must have been just over a year. That’s unethical

squinn2912 · 21-05-2019 2:39pm

I think allowing a heifer to go to 36 months is costing you beef or dairy. Even if the first calf is just a wee Angus or whatever you’re better with it. Then the second calf round that time and you’re right. I think you need to have your mind on the second or subsequent calves when deciding to bull the first time. I like to allow a wee bit of room so I think under 30 months round 27 is sweet spot

patsy_mccabe · 21-05-2019 2:45pm

squinn2912 wrote: »

Jesus was that deliberate?? What age was she calving first time? Must have been just over a year. That’s unethical

God no. Teenage pregnancy. Farmer is in his late 80's so hard to be judgemental in a case like that.

squinn2912 · 21-05-2019 5:30pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

God no. Teenage pregnancy. Farmer is in his late 80's so hard to be judgemental in a case like that.

Oh I see apologies. That can happen anyone I thought for a sec someone tried to do it

L1985 · 21-05-2019 7:34pm

I think it really depends on the animal but I’d do very easy calving AI AA first time around but I go more by the weight and size of the heifer tbh then by calendar. Also ease with myself I try get then calving a little separate to the rest If I can so they get a closer eye kept on them. But I think 36months is too late and costs too much.

Who2 · 21-05-2019 9:32pm

I’m making nothing substantial with sucklers and even if I was to keep 10 more and calve them down at twenty four months I’d say I’d be at even less. I enjoy trying to breed good stock and to use the bulls I want to use and to have the fields of animals I like it means giving them extra time. I’ve heaps of small cows here that I have to watch what I put on them. It’s crazy pushing for more numbers of average calves from a system that’s broken. I’ve dropped from fifty cows back to forty here and now going with giving the heifers extra time and going in with stronger bulls and I honestly reckon I’m far better off. Selling weanlings for 7-800 when it costs the bones of it to get them there is a pure waste, if some lad is willing to pay 11-1200 for a bit better of a calf, then I’ll go for that. You won’t get it for a saler or limo on a consistent basis and definitely won’t get it for an angus. Calving at 24 months means using an easy calving bull the second time around too and I never made anything doing it.

squinn2912 · 22-05-2019 12:01am

Who2 wrote: »

I’m making nothing substantial with sucklers and even if I was to keep 10 more and calve them down at twenty four months I’d say I’d be at even less. I enjoy trying to breed good stock and to use the bulls I want to use and to have the fields of animals I like it means giving them extra time. I’ve heaps of small cows here that I have to watch what I put on them. It’s crazy pushing for more numbers of average calves from a system that’s broken. I’ve dropped from fifty cows back to forty here and now going with giving the heifers extra time and going in with stronger bulls and I honestly reckon I’m far better off. Selling weanlings for 7-800 when it costs the bones of it to get them there is a pure waste, if some lad is willing to pay 11-1200 for a bit better of a calf, then I’ll go for that. You won’t get it for a saler or limo on a consistent basis and definitely won’t get it for an angus. Calving at 24 months means using an easy calving bull the second time around too and I never made anything doing it.

I totally agree with you. Ordinary cattle will get a bad touch any time the market falls. There’s people and they’ll tell you they’re doing better with that small calf at 24 months. My father talks about my grandfather saying a heifer needs to be 27 months and it’s as true today imo

squinn2912 · 23-05-2019 9:26pm

Just when we’re on it lads what bull do you serve to maiden heifers? I had earmarked a bb Cogent Bull hitman but I got a second opinion on him and am a bit put off now. I want to divert away from lim as I’d use the stock bull in that case

High bike · 23-05-2019 10:12pm

I’m calving heifers at 24 to 25 mts to Aubrac or Sailer and no issues

Hard Knocks · 23-05-2019 10:48pm

High bike wrote: »

I’m calving heifers at 24 to 25 mts to Aubrac or Sailer and no issues

Are you having any problems selling the progeny?

Have a 13 month heifer Bulling today tempted with Saler in 3 weeks time

tanko · 23-05-2019 11:07pm

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Are you having any problems selling the progeny?

Have a 13 month heifer Bulling today tempted with Saler in 3 weeks time

Ive been putting Saler bulls on the heifers here for a few years now, mainly for thier ease of calving.
Have kept a few of the heifer calves for breeding.
You will take a hit when selling the bulls/bullocks compared to Lims but thats just the way it is.

squinn2912 · 23-05-2019 11:09pm

tanko wrote: »

Ive been putting Saler bulls on the heifers here for a few years now, mainly for thier ease of calving.
Have kept a few of the heifer calves for breeding.
You will take a hit when selling the bulls/bullocks compared to Lims but thats just the way it is.

I think it’s hard to get an ai bull for heifers that’s high quality and easy enough calved

tanko · 23-05-2019 11:22pm

squinn2912 wrote: »

I think it’s hard to get an ai bull for heifers that’s high quality and easy enough calved

Yeah, its a compromise.
No point destroying a nice heifer with a hard calving bull and risk losing the calf.
It all depends what level of calving difficulty you're comfortable with and how good you are at managing body condition leading up to calving. I'd be more cautious than most, dont want any hassle calving heifers. Cant be bothered with that crap.
LM2014 might be the bull you're looking for.

squinn2912 · 24-05-2019 7:46am

tanko wrote: »

Yeah, its a compromise.
No point destroying a nice heifer with a hard calving bull and risk losing the calf.
It all depends what level of calving difficulty you're comfortable with and how good you are at managing body condition leading up to calving. I'd be more cautious than most, dont want any hassle calving heifers. Cant be bothered with that crap.
LM2014 might be the bull you're looking for.

Thanks. That’s what I think. Putting heifers through hard calving doesn’t work out long term. Awful strain on yourself too and even if you get a live calf he can take ages to get going. Even on cows I prefer something inbetween

patsy_mccabe · 24-05-2019 9:21am

tanko wrote: »

Ive been putting Saler bulls on the heifers here for a few years now, mainly for thier ease of calving.
Have kept a few of the heifer calves for breeding.
You will take a hit when selling the bulls/bullocks compared to Lims but thats just the way it is.

Are you taking a hit though? Compared to what, having the heifer around the place for a year producing no calf and costing the same to keep.
Or compared to putting a harder calving bull on her and destroying her.
Great comfort in having heifers getting ready to calf knowing they are in calf to a very easy calving bull.

Heifer Calving at 40 months

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