202 Hyundai Kona brake failure

furiousox · 28-08-2020 4:15pm #1

Just a word of warning if you own, or know anybody that owns a Hyundai Kona.
I have a 1.6.d model, brand new about 3 weeks old.

On Wednesday as I approached a roundabout and braked, the brake pedal juddered, gave way, and went all the way to the floor.
The brakes had failed completely and the kona failed to slow down or stop.
Luckily there was no traffic on or approaching the roundabout as I entered.
I exited the roundabout and put on my hazard lights.
I continued to press the brake pedal to try and work out what had happened but the brakes had completely failed and were not working at all.

Fortunately I was very close to the garage I got the vehicle from when this happened so I drove there slowly with hazard lights on and informed the staff there as to what had just occurred.

One of the mechanics had a look at the van and immediately noticed that the driver's side wheel and tyre were stained with quite a lot of brake fluid.
There was also a small pool of brake fluid under the van.

After inspecting inside the wheel arch, the mechanic noticed that a rubber brake pipe that was supposed to be bolted to the van body had come loose.
The brake pipe had then landed on top of the driveshaft which caused it to become frayed and damaged.
He said that when I braked at the roundabout. the damaged brake pipe burst causing all the brake fluid to be expelled from the system and the brakes to fail.

The garage has since replaced the damaged brake pipe and checked all the relevant bolts are tightened to the correct torque.

They think the bolt was not tightened correctly in the factory during production.
Such a simple error could have had far more serious consequences.
They said they had never heard of this happening before and would be compiling a report for Hyundai.
Hopefully a one off occurence but just putting it out there as a precaution to any other kona drivers.

EDIT: Photo added

McCrack · 28-08-2020 4:48pm

The PCP brigade wont like this story - one of their justifications for stretching to get a brand new vehicle is safety

Tij da feen · 28-08-2020 4:52pm

I hope you made sure they did a complete overview of the car. Not catching that is a serious failure of QA from the Hyundai side.

v240gltse · 28-08-2020 5:07pm

thank god you are ok and a dreadful/frightening situation to find yourself in. Interesting to see what Hyundai have to say and i would certainly be looking for some compensation in whatever form , but a "its all sorted now" wouldn't wash with me.

so much for a through PDI ??????

zg3409 · 28-08-2020 5:15pm

Typically on most cars, there is 2 mostly separate systems. One does 2 wheels, other does other 2 wheels. As in front left and back right, and front right and back left. If fluid leaks from one system, you still have 2 wheels to stop car.

However in this situation the pedal will still go very soft and you may need to pump the brake pedal multiple times. After multiple pumps on brake pedal did you get some braking? Could you stop car on electronic handbrake/ emergency brake?

https://www.carcontacts.com/Reading/car-repair/brakes/How-Do-Car-Brakes-Work.aspx

Hoses fraying on old cars does happen, but you should not lose all ability to stop. Imagine at motorway speeds...

bazz26 · 28-08-2020 5:23pm

McCrack wrote: »

The PCP brigade wont like this story - one of their justifications for stretching to get a brand new vehicle is safety

Irish begrudgery, the best in the world.

RandomViewer · 28-08-2020 5:26pm

No handbrake?

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 5:30pm

Hopefully it's a one off as there are a load of these coming into service with the Gardai.

furiousox · 28-08-2020 5:34pm

Multiple pumping on the brake pedal during and after the incident had no effect at all.
Brakes were completely gone (possibly dry of brake fluid?)
Not sure about hand-brake tbh, I didn't have time to react when it happened but I think it may have worked when I parked up at the garage.

furiousox · 28-08-2020 5:36pm

Looks like something similar has happened before.
Very poor practice if they haven't addressed it.

http://australiancar.reviews/reviews.php#!content=recalls&make=Hyundai&model=Kona&gen=1609

Miscreant · 28-08-2020 5:37pm

If this was a regular occurrence it would have been all over the news/social media by now.

Thankfully the OP is OK and it happened close to a Hyundai garage but as said above, I would be expecting a little more from them than what they have said already. Something was missed during PDI that needs to be rectified and procedures in the garage should be reviewed/changed as a result.

McCrack · 28-08-2020 5:59pm

bazz26 wrote: »

Irish begrudgery, the best in the world.

A 1.6 kona? I think you need to broaden your horizons if you think my post was in some way begrudgery

Beltby · 28-08-2020 6:03pm

Miscreant wrote: »

If this was a regular occurrence it would have been all over the news/social media by now.

Thankfully the OP is OK and it happened close to a Hyundai garage but as said above, I would be expecting a little more from them than what they have said already. Something was missed during PDI that needs to be rectified and procedures in the garage should be reviewed/changed as a result.

A PDI doesn't cover every single but and bolt on the car.

mk7r · 28-08-2020 6:05pm

I would be looking for a new wheel and tyre also, brake fluid is highly corrosive and even a few minutes exposure will have done damage to the paint/rubber

bazz26 · 28-08-2020 6:47pm

McCrack wrote: »

A 1.6 kona? I think you need to broaden your horizons if you think my post was in some way begrudgery

Maybe your the one who needs to broaden your horizons by making an appointment with a surgeon to have that big PCP begrudging chip on your shoulder removed.

furiousox · 28-08-2020 7:01pm

Vehicle was bought outright, not on PCP.

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 7:24pm

Who cares how it's bought or if it's a rental or a Garda car.... I'd be more worried is this a fault across this model....

Seriously any car to have such brake failure is crazy and more so something brand new....

TigerTim · 28-08-2020 7:55pm

RandomViewer wrote: »

No handbrake?

Not sure what handbrake is in the Kona but in my Avensis its electric/electronic. Only works when the wheels are not rotating. Absolutely no use in an emergency.

T.

kirving · 28-08-2020 8:19pm

Not that it should happen at all, but just to note in this scenario you need to let the pedal come up fully to let fluid back into the system from the reservoir, and then press it again.

No use in an emergency, but will provide braking power over a longer period.

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 8:24pm

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Not that it should happen at all, but just to note in this scenario you need to let the pedal come up fully to let fluid back into the system from the reservoir, and then press it again.

No use in an emergency, but will provide braking power over a longer period.

All the fluid burst out.... Pull electronic handbrake and keep it pulled

coolbeans · 28-08-2020 8:32pm

McCrack wrote: »

The PCP brigade wont like this story - one of their justifications for stretching to get a brand new vehicle is safety

You really seem to have a bee in your bonnet regarding pcp. What's it to you? You jelly?

Water John · 28-08-2020 8:35pm

Car manufacturers get away with less these days because of social media. Renault had a fault years ago in one of their models where the drivers air bag would go off without reason. If it happened to you, they'd tell you, 'never heard of that happening before'. Took some years to own up.

Rusky rusky · 28-08-2020 8:39pm

I had a master break cylinder failing on a 3-week old golf a few years ago. This wasn’t fun as it failed during an emergency break avoiding a pedestrian running across the road. A flatbed and 2 weeks waiting for a part in the garage.

khaldrogo · 28-08-2020 9:08pm

Rusky rusky wrote: »

I had a master break cylinder failing on a 3-week old golf a few years ago. This wasn’t fun as it failed during an emergency break avoiding a pedestrian running across the road. A flatbed and 2 weeks waiting for a part in the garage.

Brake

kravmaga · 28-08-2020 9:27pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

Hopefully it's a one off as there are a load of these coming into service with the Gardai.

They are already in service with AGS.

Rusky rusky · 28-08-2020 9:36pm

khaldrogo wrote: »

Brake

Autocorrect:)

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 9:40pm

kravmaga wrote: »

They are already in service with AGS.

Yes indeed they are I've seen quite a few.

It's the tucson and Kona that are now coming with alloys like back in 2014 on the i30 and some i40 but then went back to steelies....

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 9:40pm

Rusky rusky wrote: »

Autocorrect:)

Have a kit kat ;-)

RandomViewer · 28-08-2020 9:45pm

kravmaga wrote: »

They are already in service with AGS.

Ford must have dirtier the bib badly with the Guards

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 9:47pm

RandomViewer wrote: »

Ford must have dirtier the bib badly with the Guards

No it was oh Hyundai are cheap let's buy buy and buy some more.

PsychoPete · 28-08-2020 9:48pm

Miscreant wrote: »

If this was a regular occurrence it would have been all over the news/social media by now.

Thankfully the OP is OK and it happened close to a Hyundai garage but as said above, I would be expecting a little more from them than what they have said already. Something was missed during PDI that needs to be rectified and procedures in the garage should be reviewed/changed as a result.

Not every single part, nut, bolt, clip, etc is checked during a pdi. You cant spend that much time doing a pdi on a car just because one part failed on one car

Miscreant · 28-08-2020 10:01pm

PsychoPete wrote: »

Not every single part, nut, bolt, clip, etc is checked during a pdi. You cant spend that much time doing a pdi on a car just because one part failed on one car

But you can certainly change your PDI procedures as a result of this occurrence. That was the salient part of my point. The OP is entitled to know that the garage will now double down on their inspections to make sure this never happens again to anyone else.

barney shamrock · 28-08-2020 10:04pm

Would the car have been checked over again by the local dealer after being checked by hyundai when it rolled off the production line?

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 10:06pm

barney shamrock wrote: »

Would the car have been checked over again by the local dealer after being checked by hyundai when it rolled off the production line?

Nope....

Out the door and bye

kirving · 28-08-2020 10:25pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

All the fluid burst out.... Pull electronic handbrake and keep it pulled

They really should be separate circuits? Terrible design if not.

Agreed on the electronic handbrake.

barney shamrock · 28-08-2020 10:29pm

Manual handbrake on the 1.6d.

punisher5112 · 28-08-2020 10:32pm

barney shamrock wrote: »

Manual handbrake on the 1.6d.

Wasn't sure but if electronic keep it pulled or pressed depending on switch set up.

Hotblack Desiato · 29-08-2020 1:36am

zg3409 wrote: »

Typically on most cars, there is 2 mostly separate systems. One does 2 wheels, other does other 2 wheels.

There are two ways to do dual circuit brakes -

The "three wheel" where each circuit does both front brakes and one rear wheel

The "4+2" where one circuit does all four wheels, one does both front wheels.

Either way you have braking on both front wheels with one circuit out, you should not have to pump (pumping will not help a brake circuit which still has pressure), but push the pedal into the floor.

Also the handbrake is legally required as a totally independent braking system, it's not great but it's there and electronic or not it needs to be able to stop the car from at least low speed.

Toyotafanboi · 29-08-2020 9:40am

punisher5112 wrote: »

Nope....

Out the door and bye

Of course it would have been re-checked, thats the intention of a PDI.

It's not really practical or sensible though to check every nut and bolt on every single car, nor is it asked or required.

Terrivle thing to have happened to OP and it could have been an awful lot worse. I dont personally think it's cause to change PDI procedures.

The right thing for the dealer to do is to feed it back to Hyundai, let them find out how this could have happened then take steps based on what they say next. Was it a freak occurance, did it happen to a batch of cars etc.

Silent Running · 29-08-2020 9:50am

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

There are two ways to do dual circuit brakes -

The "three wheel" where each circuit does both front brakes and one rear wheel

The "4+2" where one circuit does all four wheels, one does both front wheels.

Either way you have braking on both front wheels with one circuit out, you should not have to pump (pumping will not help a brake circuit which still has pressure), but push the pedal into the floor.

Also the handbrake is legally required as a totally independent braking system, it's not great but it's there and electronic or not it needs to be able to stop the car from at least low speed.

This!

Surely all modern cars have dual circuit brake systems at this stage? It doesn't matter if a hose bursts, only half of the brake fluid will escape, leaving the second circuit still working.

I find it hard to believe there would be total brake failure, unless both circuits have been damaged.

mickdw · 29-08-2020 11:08am

Silent Running wrote: »

This!

Surely all modern cars have dual circuit brake systems at this stage? It doesn't matter if a hose bursts, only half of the brake fluid will escape, leaving the second circuit still working.

I find it hard to believe there would be total brake failure, unless both circuits have been damaged.

Ive had brake failure twice in my time driving, both times from burst flexi hose at wheel. Once because the car simply wasnt maintained in my younger day and the second time due to an incorrectly installed brake pipe.
Both times, in cars with dual circuits and the pedal went to the floor offering no useable brake on that first press of the pedal.

mk7r · 29-08-2020 12:00pm

mickdw wrote: »

Ive had brake failure twice in my time driving, both times from burst flexi hose at wheel. Once because the car simply wasnt maintained in my younger day and the second time due to an incorrectly installed brake pipe.
Both times, in cars with dual circuits and the pedal went to the floor offering no useable brake on that first press of the pedal.

This is how it works generally, there will be no brakes once a hose bursts, dual circuit or not.

road_high · 29-08-2020 12:03pm

Didn’t the same thing happen on a Suzuki Celario on test with Autocar about 5 years ago? Remember a big thing about it at the time

extra-ordinary_ · 29-08-2020 2:35pm

Is electronic handbrake not mechanical as opposed to hydraulic?

wonski · 29-08-2020 3:05pm

extra-ordinary_ wrote: »

Is electronic handbrake not mechanical as opposed to hydraulic?

In VW it is just connected to electrical motor connected to the caliber.

Not connected to service brakes at all.
Never tried to engage it at speed, though. Not sure it is gonna work that way.

mk7r · 29-08-2020 3:08pm

wonski wrote: »

In VW it is just connected to electrical motor connected to the caliber.

Not connected to service brakes at all.
Never tried to engage it at speed, though. Not sure it is gonna work that way.

It works if you hold it

02-09-2020 1:10pm

McCrack wrote: »

The PCP brigade wont like this story - one of their justifications for stretching to get a brand new vehicle is safety

Don't knock PCP until you try it.

Henry Ford III · 02-09-2020 2:50pm

Dual circuit brakes go way back - 1970's at least. So losing 1 circuit of the hydraulics shouldn't give you a total brake failure.

02-09-2020 3:01pm

extra-ordinary_ wrote: »

Is electronic handbrake not mechanical as opposed to hydraulic?

Indeed, it's a cable essentially.

Stallingrad · 03-09-2020 9:50am

Total brake failure on a new car? I hope Hyundai are taking this very seriously and not treating it as a one off, if the OP had crashed and this was the US it could have meant a huge settlement and potential recall.

Modern manufacturing means Hyundai will be able track who tightened that bolt at the factory and see what went wrong.

03-09-2020 9:56am

There's very little consumer protection in Ireland when it comes to cars, once you buy a car you're stuck with it where as in the USA if it's defective you can give it back, lemon law or something they call it.

202 Hyundai Kona brake failure

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