Belfast rape trial discussion thread II

SirGerryAdams · 13-06-2019 8:52pm

Gangu wrote: »

Brands don’t have to play judge and jury on a trial but they do have choice about what faces to associate with their brand. Look how the pathetic insults are slung around this thread.

What brand would want to be associated with those horrible text messages that came out in court and defence strategy, echoed in tone by those supporters of pj on this thread?

Good call by Diageo, the judgment of a multi million euro brand. We can see why by this decision. I have more respect for them. I will start drinking Diageo drinks. To not make this choice would say that the facts that were proven, the behaviour, the language the texts are acceptable.

Bravo Diageo.

They were fairly happy to have a rugby player who cheated on his wife with multiple men with the threat of spreading HIV front and centre for them weren't they?

I also have a feeling they won't be pulling any sponsorship of Irish Rugby considering Sean O'Brien can't control his bladder now..

Mrsmum · 13-06-2019 8:52pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I am fine with whatever consenting adults do in a bedroom. And I am fine with people having private conversations.

I would not be fine with a daughter of mine getting so drunk and going to the houses of strangers though. Amid all the ranting and twitter rage a valuable chance to spell out a warning was totally missed.

I hope that warning of yours isn't just to girls as the line previous to it seemed to suggest. After all it's the boys here that have their lives in tatters.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 13-06-2019 8:54pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

So you never talked about anything embarrassingly private with your friends by text? People you had a secret crush on? The night you couldn't get it up? The night you got sick on your way home from a club? The night you hooked up with something and got him or her confused with their sibling the next morning?

And you've never made any lewd and lascivious remarks about anyone at all? Celebrities? People you know or knew? Never? Never written that a friend of yours is hot, or that Pauline McLynn has a lovely bottom?

Most of us have had chats with our friends about sexual things which we would be absolutely scarrrrleh' if they saw the light of day in the general public domain. Why do you think it was such a huge story a few years ago when Facebook briefly posted messages from Facebook Chat to one's timeline by accident and quickly rectified the programming error responsible?

Ah, hatrickpatrick, this is highly disingenuous and you know it.

I can very honestly say that I’ve never said anything as crude as the crude things revealed in this trial. Is it really that hard to believe?

hatrickpatrick · 13-06-2019 8:57pm

Mrsmum wrote: »

I hope that warning of yours isn't just to girls as the line previous to it seemed to suggest. After all it's the boys here that have their lives in tatters.

As a lad I'll certainly be advising any children of mine, gender aside, to be very careful when it comes to getting mindless and hanging out with strangers. Not even from a danger point of view, but just from a regrets point of view. As someone who has done this and had serious regrets afterwards, the most honest truth I'll be able to tell them is that you just don't know how you'll feel about something the next day if you did it while you were sh!tfaced, and you might end up happy about it and with fond memories of it, but it's very much a coin toss where the other 50% option is that you might at the very tamest end of the spectrum spend a few days hiding under your bedcovers and being afraid to look at your phone because you know there are photos of you twerking with your arse bared for all the world to see which are now the subject of a long and hideously un-faceable group thread of mockery among your mates.

Hell, some of my friends confused me with a doppelganger who stripped off and jumped into the UCD lake on camera back in '11 or '12, and tagged me in the video. It wasn't me (I have an alibi, dammit!) but he did look like me and I had to put up with the ridicule regardless

FrancieBrady · 13-06-2019 8:59pm

Mrsmum wrote: »

I hope that warning of yours isn't just to girls as the line previous to it seemed to suggest. After all it's the boys here that have their lives in tatters.

We were discussing the girl.

And yes, my boys have been told how to behave properly and honestly. I have raised one of them through the 'young male' years and watched as he made his mistakes and learned from them. Am I holding those mistakes against him for the rest of his days...no I am not. The logic of what Diageo have done and the moral high grounders here is that you can never be allowed to recover from a mistake if you happen to have talent at a sport or in entertainment. Ludicrous.

weldoninhio · 13-06-2019 9:01pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You don't but many did and Guinness agreed, and apologised.
No different to what these lads did about their private whatsapp chat.

The WhatsApp chat that they deleted certain messages from before the police confiscated their phones??

Mrsmum · 13-06-2019 9:02pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

So you never talked about anything embarrassingly private with your friends by text? People you had a secret crush on? The night you couldn't get it up? The night you got sick on your way home from a club? The night you hooked up with something and got him or her confused with their sibling the next morning?

And you've never made any lewd and lascivious remarks about anyone at all? Celebrities? People you know or knew? Never? Never written that a friend of yours is hot, or that Pauline McLynn has a lovely bottom?

Most of us have had chats with our friends about sexual things which we would be absolutely scarrrrleh' if they saw the light of day in the general public domain. Why do you think it was such a huge story a few years ago when Facebook briefly posted messages from Facebook Chat to one's timeline by accident and quickly rectified the programming error responsible?

Ah now, there's scarlet stuff and there's disgusting stuff. You say we've all said similar in texts and then you post some mild as could be stuff as examples. Come on now, let's be having all the hardcore stuff you said to match their chat and while you're at it, tell us when you laughed and joked about a girl that left your house crying and bleeding. Let's get to the serious stuff.

FrancieBrady · 13-06-2019 9:04pm

weldoninhio wrote: »

The WhatsApp chat that they deleted certain messages from before the police confiscated their phones??

If they were deleting messages to avoid embarrassment they would have deleted them all.

weldoninhio · 13-06-2019 9:06pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Not necessarily.

From OED:
Lie2
1An intentionally false statement.

they might all be giving their version of events which they believe to be true.
Ie. They didnt lie. Being locked etc.

(Except your man with his willy in his hand, hes a bit different)

You have to swear in an affidavit. If you can’t remember what happened and make up a story, that’s lying in an affidavit. In my opinion they all made contradictory statements to give the jury the impression that it was crazy in the bedroom and confuse them. That they all had completely contradictory stories would make me think they were coached in what to say.

hatrickpatrick · 13-06-2019 9:07pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Ah, hatrickpatrick, this is highly disingenuous and you know it.

I can very honestly say that I’ve never said anything as crude as the crude things revealed in this trial. Is it really that hard to believe?

You said you'd be happy for everyone to read all your texts, they don't have to be as embarrassing as the texts from the trial to still embarrass you enough that you'd want to keep them private. Of course it's not hard to believe, some people simply have different senses of humour and different levels of "filter" than other people. I can guarantee you that a very large proportion of millennials, male or female, would be utterly mortified if the contents of their group chat were suddenly made public. I don't think I've ever been in a group chat where extremely lewd comments weren't made (by men and women) which, if taken out of context, would have made us all look like complete eejits at worse, and perverted assholes at best.

That's just me. But it is what it is.

I'll give you a silly example: there's a famous character from YouTube who makes prank calls using extremely lewd language to describe his weiner and what he'd like the listener to do with it. Myself and one of my (male, also straight) mates are huge fans of this channel and we regularly send eachother quotes from this guy as a joke when we're getting ready for a night out. Now, if anyone were to read our text thread, depending on the day, they might easily find a bunch of back and forth texts saying "Eight inches. Can you handle that?" "Worship my c0ck" "Balls rubbing against your chin..." and other such lewdity. Anyone reading them would assume that the two of us are in the closet and regularly in eachothers' pants. Anyone who's part of our group of mates would know that those texts are in reference to this youtube channel, anyone outside that clique... Not so much. So we'd certainly be morto if those texts were made public with our names attached. Especially since we've both jokingly used those quotes to refer to others outside the thread who might be joining the sesh, or whatever.

As I say, I think most millennials tend to be intentionally "edgy" and say things which are totally socially unacceptable in private chats, for no reason other than the thrill of taboo and because we can. It doesn't mean we're actually complete assholes, and one's group chat persona in my experience is almost never aligned to one's real life persona.

Again, this is just me. Maybe we're all complete w@nkers and we don't realise it. I can certainly say that despite all the text bants, I've never actually done anything sexual with another gentleman, and I don't really see it happening going forward, but who knows? If my group chat persona is indeed fundamentally tied to my actual persona, then clearly it's only a matter of time. And when that time comes, all the "eight inches" stuff will be revealed as a fraud and a lie.

If anyone's curious about the prank call character, here's a brief run through:

https://www.soundboard.wiki/wiki/Springfield_Pervert

Mrsmum · 13-06-2019 9:08pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

As a lad I'll certainly be advising any children of mine, gender aside, to be very careful when it comes to getting mindless and hanging out with strangers. Not even from a danger point of view, but just from a regrets point of view. As someone who has done this and had serious regrets afterwards, the most honest truth I'll be able to tell them is that you just don't know how you'll feel about something the next day if you did it while you were sh!tfaced, and you might end up happy about it and with fond memories of it, but it's very much a coin toss where the other 50% option is that you might at the very tamest end of the spectrum spend a few days hiding under your bedcovers and being afraid to look at your phone because you know there are photos of you twerking with your arse bared for all the world to see which are now the subject of a long and hideously un-faceable group thread of mockery among your mates.

Hell, some of my friends confused me with a doppelganger who stripped off and jumped into the UCD lake on camera back in '11 or '12, and tagged me in the video. It wasn't me (I have an alibi, dammit!) but he did look like me and I had to put up with the ridicule regardless

I'll be borrowing that line with my teenagers.

hatrickpatrick · 13-06-2019 9:10pm

Mrsmum wrote: »

Ah now, there's scarlet stuff and there's disgusting stuff. You say we've all said similar in texts and then you post some mild as could be stuff as examples. Come on now, let's be having all the hardcore stuff you said to match their chat and while you're at it, tell us when you laughed and joked about a girl that left your house crying and bleeding. Let's get to the serious stuff.

I've never done that myself, and I think that in particular is just being a straight up asshole. Doesn't change my stance that when it comes to private conversations between friends, anything goes, and just because those conversations now tend to be put in writing as opposed to spoken over a pint and lost to time, doesn't change the fact that they shouldn't be used to professionally punish a person.

hatrickpatrick · 13-06-2019 9:11pm

Mrsmum wrote: »

I'll be borrowing that line with my teenagers.

I wish I could claim that this example was a hypothetical, but...............

It certainly makes a good cautionary tale for educating one's future offspring about the dangers of drink and drugs, so every cloud has a silver lining I guess

weldoninhio · 13-06-2019 9:11pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If they were deleting messages to avoid embarrassment they would have deleted them all.

What if they wanted to avoid the jail?? Maybe they only had time to delete the incriminating ones.

FrancieBrady · 13-06-2019 9:17pm

weldoninhio wrote: »

What if they wanted to avoid the jail?? Maybe they only had time to delete the incriminating ones.

Why not just delete it all?
The conversations look fairly continuous to me. Maybe somebody texted an embarrassing picture...who knows. Don't let it stop you jumping to conclusions.

jeffleppard · 13-06-2019 9:27pm

weldoninhio wrote: »

You have to swear in an affidavit. If you can’t remember what happened and make up a story, that’s lying in an affidavit. In my opinion they all made contradictory statements to give the jury the impression that it was crazy in the bedroom and confuse them. That they all had completely contradictory stories would make me think they were coached in what to say.

That bit in bold surely cannot be serious?

Also, Jackson applied to have McIlroy severed from the indictment because his story and Jackson's story couldn't both be true, and Jackson's barrister said in court that Jackson did not accept McIlroy's version of events - why would he do that if that was the plan?

pinkyeye · 13-06-2019 9:34pm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

You seem obsessed with Gareth Thomas riding other men bareback. Obsessed.

Totally obsessed. Fantasy if you ask me.

:D

Muahahaha · 13-06-2019 9:44pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Stop talking nonsense. There is literally nothing he can do to change his image...others are deciding what it is.

ah Francie, you're losing the plot now. His image is peoples perceptions of his actions. He alone controls his actions, the public merely form an opinion based on them and the results aren't good.

FrancieBrady · 13-06-2019 9:49pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

ah Francie, you're losing the plot now. His image is peoples perceptions of his actions. He alone controls his actions, the public merely form an opinion based on them and the results aren't good.

What's your perception of him in the last two years? Any room in your life for change?

I mean, you expect him to change immediately after coming out of a traumatic court case and say you would have accepted that. But refuse to take into account his behaviour over two years.

You are way out of whack with how most people deal with stuff.

mfceiling · 13-06-2019 9:52pm

weldoninhio wrote: »

In my opinion they all made contradictory statements to give the jury the impression that it was crazy in the bedroom and confuse them.

And there's the problem right there....

"In my opinion"

Not the opinion of the judge, jury, jackson, olding, the girl or either legal party but "your opinion".

No offence but your opinion means fcuk all. It's just guess work on your behalf. There's a reason why we have a legal system and we don't prosecute on "heresay" or "opinion". Something the twitter mob can't seem to get their heads around.

Muahahaha · 13-06-2019 9:53pm

Meanwhile, over on Twitter

https://twitter.com/rolabirb/status/1139231258293211143

https://twitter.com/lauraekelly97/status/1139222129659076609

Paddy Irish whiskey also sponsor London Irish, looks like that sponsorship could be in jeopardy too

https://twitter.com/LindaOkaythen/status/1138512586360655872

Ruraldweller56 · 13-06-2019 9:55pm

Strange how outraged all these libs are over those WhatsApp messages.

Jackson and Olding are children of the porn/degeneracy culture that they've spent the last 30 years advocating.

FrancieBrady · 13-06-2019 10:00pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

Meanwhile, over on Twitter

https://twitter.com/rolabirb/status/1139231258293211143

https://twitter.com/lauraekelly97/status/1139222129659076609

Paddy Irish whiskey also sponsor London Irish, looks like that sponsorship could be in jeopardy too

https://twitter.com/LindaOkaythen/status/1138512586360655872

Linda's tweet is certainly going viral...:)

Yeah_Right · 13-06-2019 10:03pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Ah, hatrickpatrick, this is highly disingenuous and you know it.

I can very honestly say that I’ve never said anything as crude as the crude things revealed in this trial. Is it really that hard to believe?

What did Paddy Jackson say in the Whatsapp group?

KaneToad · 13-06-2019 10:07pm

Yeah_Right wrote: »

What did Paddy Jackson say in the Whatsapp group?

"There was a lot of spit roast last night"

FrancieBrady · 13-06-2019 10:07pm

Yeah_Right wrote: »

What did Paddy Jackson say in the Whatsapp group?

'Yeh, there was a lot of spit roast' or words to that effect.

The world wobbled on it's axis apparently.

is_that_so · 13-06-2019 10:09pm

Ruraldweller56 wrote: »

Strange how outraged all these libs are over those WhatsApp messages.

Jackson and Olding are children of the porn/degeneracy culture that they've spent the last 30 years advocating.

Meanwhile, poster finds everyone else is to blame!

Jackman25 · 13-06-2019 10:14pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Linda's tweet is certainly going viral...:)

Not one of the messages she highlights in her tweet is actually from PJ.

What the f**k is an intersectional feminist anyway. She sounds like an absolute dose.

Kenny B · 13-06-2019 10:16pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

Again, I’d happily display all my text, social media and email exchanges from that period of my life. There’d be nothing like how those guys spoke. We didn’t “all” speak like them at one point or another. People should only speak for themselves.

Modern 18-25 years behave this way,

Mobile phones probably didn't exist when you were in that age bracket, yet you happily pass judgement on people,

jm08 · 13-06-2019 10:16pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If they were deleting messages to avoid embarrassment they would have deleted them all.

I think they did delete them. The police were able to retrieve some of them.

Belfast rape trial discussion thread II

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