oughterard people - see OP for Mod warning 29/09/19

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 2:08pm

alastair wrote: »

I’ll treat your opinions with all the regard they deserve. Cheers.

Still nothing though

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 2:09pm

alastair wrote: »

You want proof of an absence? Well there you go - nada evidence of any deported asylum seekers.

You want the same for dinosaurs?

Dude. Are you 5?

alastair · 28-09-2019 2:24pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Still nothing though

On the supposed deportation hangers on? Nope - not a peep.

alastair · 28-09-2019 2:24pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Dude. Are you 5?

Are you a cartoon American?

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 2:46pm

alastair wrote: »

Are you a cartoon American?

Last part 1/2

Still nothing to support they're all gone...

Boggles · 28-09-2019 2:50pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

But who in this thread has said they dont want any immigrants allowed into Ireland?

TeaBagMania wrote: »

No we don't, they can f*** off back to their own country and live there, and that goes for anyone looking to immigrate to Ireland

.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 3:07pm

Boggles wrote: »

.

So we've one b0llox.

Boggles · 28-09-2019 3:18pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

So we've one b0llox.

No we don't.

Everyone is responsible for their opinions.

But he certainly wouldn't be a lonely voice.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 3:31pm

Boggles wrote: »

No we don't.

Everyone is responsible for their opinions.

But he certainly wouldn't be a lonely voice.

"We've", the contributors in this thread have one b0ll0x among us...

Is there more?
I thought a hot bed of right wing nazis would be crawling with them

Gatling · 28-09-2019 3:31pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

So we've one b0llox.

So disappointed ,

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 3:31pm

Gatling wrote: »

So disappointed ,

Surely theres more than one...

Limerick HQ · 28-09-2019 3:35pm

I'd have more respect for the people of
oughterard, if they just came out and admitted that they don't want Muslims and blacks in their town, instead of this wishy washy nonsense about having only 1 overworked GP, incidentally one never hears people from that part of the country being concerned about their one GP'S workload when the mass influx of Irish teens come in the summer going to the gaelthtacht

alastair · 28-09-2019 3:41pm

Limerick HQ wrote: »

I'd have more respect for the people of
oughterard, if they just came out and admitted that they don't want Muslims and blacks in their town, instead of this wishy washy nonsense about having only 1 overworked GP, incidentally one never hears people from that part of the country being concerned about their one GP'S workload when the mass influx of Irish teens come in the summer going to the gaelthtacht

Grealish might be a populist pandering oaf, but his straightforward bigoted line at least had the merit of honesty.

alastair · 28-09-2019 3:42pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Last part 1/2

Still nothing to support they're all gone...

Except for their absence of course. Same as the dinosaurs.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 3:51pm

alastair wrote: »

Except for their absence of course. Same as the dinosaurs.

There's no crows where I am. I cant see any. If i said there were crows, a person like you wouldnt believe me.
In fact, if i really had to, i doubt I could produce a crow.
They must be there though, they're described in our biota. But still...

The minister has said a "significant number" are gone. Significant...not all, not most.

But you must be privy to more information, as you claim (not even an opinion, a statement of fact) that they're all gone.
So you really need to produce something to obviate these continuous insinuationsstatements you're nothing but a spoofer.

alastair · 28-09-2019 4:08pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

There's no crows where I am. I cant see any. If i said there were crows, a person like you wouldnt believe me.
In fact, if i really had to, i doubt I could produce a crow.
They must be there though, they're described in our biota. But still...

The minister has said a "significant number" are gone. Significant...not all, not most.

But you must be privy to more information, as you claim (not even an opinion, a statement of fact) that they're all gone.
So you really need to produce something to obviate these continuous insinuationsstatements you're nothing but a spoofer.

Thing is - there’s ample evidence of crows nationally. Just zilch evidence of remaining deported asylum seekers (or dinosaurs).

Gatling · 28-09-2019 4:13pm

alastair wrote: »

Thing is - there’s ample evidence of crows nationally. Just zilch evidence of remaining deported asylum seekers (or dinosaurs).

But we do have evidence of dinosaur's .

Unlike your claim

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 4:15pm

alastair wrote: »

Thing is - there’s ample evidence of crows nationally. Just zilch evidence of remaining deported asylum seekers.

But i dont see any crows.

Theres no evidence of the number "non enforced" deportees who have left.
The minister says its "a significant number" gone, yet you say all. Repeatedly.

So one of you is wrong. Im going with the guy who has an entire Dept., and several state bodies to tell him " a significant" number are gone, leaving you adrift on the goodship
SS Spoofer, crew of two.

Seathrun66 · 28-09-2019 4:16pm

section4 wrote: »

The Irish times article written by a vested interest
You are some fool you ,
Can you tell me your experience of the world
Where have you lived abroad and for how long ,
Were you brought up in an immigrant community
What job fo you do in Ireland
Are you a member if a political party ,
Because reading your posts for the Last half hour
You are either a sixteen year old child watching musuc videos
Which informs your opinion
Or Or working for an NGO

Oh dear.

alastair · 28-09-2019 4:18pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

But i dont see any crows.

Theres no evidence of the number "non enforced" deportees who have left.
The minister says its "a significant number" gone, yet you say all. Repeatedly.

So one of you is wrong. Im going with the guy who has an entire Dept., and several state bodies to tell him " a significant" number are gone, leaving you adrift on the goodship
SS Spoofer, crew of two.

Your inability to spot some crows doesn’t negate the fact that many others do across the country. You can’t same the same for your mystery deported asylum seekers, or dinosaurs. Because they’ve gone, while the crows remain.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 4:18pm

So are the subject(s) of these two parliamentary questions deported or still in the country??

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-09-26/104/

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-09-17/263/

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 4:21pm

alastair wrote: »

Your inability to spot some crows doesn’t negate the fact that many others do across the country. You can’t same the same for your mystery deported asylum seekers, or dinosaurs. Because they’ve gone, while the crows remain.

Heres the Irish Times calling you a spoofer:

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/less-than-a-fifth-of-deportation-orders-carried-out-1.3680876%3fmode=amp

Still havent seen a crow

alastair · 28-09-2019 4:24pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

So are the subject(s) of these two parliamentary questions deported or still in the country??

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-09-26/104/

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-09-17/263/

Depends on whether Charlie Flanagan opted to revoke the deportation or not. If he didn’t they’re gone.

Seathrun66 · 28-09-2019 4:25pm

alastair wrote: »

Except for their absence of course. Same as the dinosaurs.

.... and the snakes we mythically had.

Gatling · 28-09-2019 4:26pm

Seen dinosaur fossils and eggs , footprints in museum's

Haven't seen any evidence 7197 failed asylum have left our country.

But wait if crows exist in other parts of the country surely failed asylum seekers exist too

Seathrun66 · 28-09-2019 4:27pm

Gatling wrote: »

But we do have evidence of dinosaur's .

Unlike your claim

Working in Tallaght kebab shops?

alastair · 28-09-2019 4:27pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Heres the Irish Times calling you a spoofer:

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/less-than-a-fifth-of-deportation-orders-carried-out-1.3680876%3fmode=amp

Still havent seen a crow

The IT piece does no such thing, it’s, once again, comparing enforcement numbers with deportation orders.

Gatling · 28-09-2019 4:28pm

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Working in Tallaght kebab shops?

Tallaght kabab shops ,

What's that got to do with your claim

Seathrun66 · 28-09-2019 4:31pm

Gatling wrote: »

Tallaght kabab shops ,

What's that got to do with your claim

Where you located your dinosaurs while on the hunt for your mythical underground asylum seekers.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 4:46pm

alastair wrote: »

The IT piece does no such thing, it’s, once again, comparing enforcement numbers with deportation orders.

"Less than one-fifth of people who have received deportation orders so far this year have been removed from the State"...

So 4/5 are not removed by the state.
Youre saying they all left themselves.
You're saying everyone is gone.
You're saying there is no one in the state with a deportation order against them.

Yet the courts and papers list several appellants to deportation orders, so they'restill in the state. So not all are in fact gone, as you claim.
The minister says a significant number are gone, and unless you dont understand the word significant (it doesnt mean all) , it stands to reason:
All - significant = some

The only people claiming theyre all gone is the crew of the HMS Delusional.
Toot toot

Gatling · 28-09-2019 4:51pm

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Where you located your .

Wrong again

Not located in tallaght

So what have tallaght and kebabs got to do with your false claims /lies .

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 4:54pm

alastair wrote: »

Depends on whether Charlie Flanagan opted to revoke the deportation or not. If he didn’t they’re gone.

One of those is two days ago.
It was a parliamentary question on behalf of a constituent. Even if Charlie said no (to their appeal which is ongoing) , you're saying they're gone. They've removed themselves in the day and a half....since

Catch yourself on.
Toot toot.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 4:56pm

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Where you located your dinosaurs while on the hunt for your mythical underground asylum seekers.

As a rebuff - poor.
As humour- awful
As a point- dull

In essence, nonsense.

alastair · 28-09-2019 4:58pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

One of those is two days ago.
It was a parliamentary question on behalf of a constituent. Even if Charlie said no (to their appeal which is ongoing) , you're saying they're gone. They've removed themselves in the day and a half....since

Catch yourself on.
Toot toot.

Now you’re just being silly.

alastair · 28-09-2019 5:00pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

As a rebuff - poor.
As humour- awful
As a point- dull

In essence, nonsense.

I liked it.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 5:02pm

alastair wrote: »

Now you’re just being silly.

How so?

SchrodingersCat · 28-09-2019 5:06pm

There is a lot of fake and misintreperation of deportation statistics going on here, so I will post up the official government figures from the Irish Times:

"9,197 deportation orders have been made since 2011 while only one in five of those who received these orders – 1,857 people – have been deported from Ireland. Some 5,504 people facing deportation have been granted permission to remain following a re-examination of their case since 2011. Another 2,245 returned home voluntarily."

Although true, It is unfair to make the statement that "only one in five who receive deportation orders get deported" without giving the number who stayed after appeals or who returned home voluntarily: An uninformed reader will assume that the remainder just stayed illegally in Ireland regardless. By definition, these who won their appeal shouldnt have received the deportation order in the first place.

alastair · 28-09-2019 5:12pm

SchrodingersCat wrote: »

There is a lot of fake and misintreperation of deportation statistics going on here, so I will post up the official government figures from the Irish Times:

"9,197 deportation orders have been made since 2011 while only one in five of those who received these orders – 1,857 people – have been deported from Ireland. Some 5,504 people facing deportation have been granted permission to remain following a re-examination of their case since 2011. Another 2,245 returned home voluntarily."

Although true, It is unfair to make the statement that "only one in five who receive deportation orders get deported" without giving the number who stayed after appeals or who returned home voluntarily: An uninformed reader will assume that the remainder just stayed in Ireland regardless. By definition, these who won their appeal shouldnt have received the deportation order in the first place.

There’s a few uninformed readers about the place alright.

handlemaster · 28-09-2019 5:14pm

Looking at this thread the irish are very inward looking. There's a very big world out there a new comers might help the IQ level

Happyilylost · 28-09-2019 5:16pm

SchrodingersCat wrote:

"9,197 deportation orders have been made since 2011 while only one in five of those who received these orders â€“ 1,857 people â€“ have been deported from Ireland. Some 5,504 people facing deportation have been granted permission to remain following a re-examination of their case since 2011. Another 2,245 returned home voluntarily."

Any idea why these figures don't match up?

jackboy · 28-09-2019 5:18pm

handlemaster wrote: »

Looking at this thread the irish are very inward looking. There's a very big world out there a new comers might help the IQ level

Are you Irish?

alastair · 28-09-2019 5:20pm

Happyilylost wrote: »

Any idea why these figures don't match up?

Might be to do with the rolling start to the figures. Some deportations taking place past the 2011 starting point, but on orders served before the starting date?

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 5:21pm

SchrodingersCat wrote: »

There is a lot of fake and misintreperation of deportation statistics going on here, so I will post up the official government figures from the Irish Times:

"9,197 deportation orders have been made since 2011 while only one in five of those who received these orders – 1,857 people – have been deported from Ireland. Some 5,504 people facing deportation have been granted permission to remain following a re-examination of their case since 2011. Another 2,245 returned home voluntarily."

Although true, It is unfair to make the statement that "only one in five who receive deportation orders get deported" without giving the number who stayed after appeals or who returned home voluntarily: An uninformed reader will assume that the remainder just stayed in Ireland regardless. By definition, these who won their appeal shouldnt have received the deportation order in the first place.

The reasonable person understands:

A- A number have left "voluntarily" after being unsuccessful in their application for assylum.
B- A number have left "voluntarily" before their deportation order was enforced.
C- A number of orders have had to be "enforced"
D- A number remain at various stage of appeal against their deportation order.
E- And a small number remain keeping a low profile.

A reasonable person understands A B C D to be true. Even if you believe E to be false, the fact is a number remain in Ireland with deportation orders against them. Its very simple.

We're not concerning ourselves with A. We know C. But we have no idea of either, or the sum of B and/or D (until their appeal is listed), and E could be any natural number. But we're left with the inescapable fact, a number remain.

Happyilylost · 28-09-2019 5:21pm

alastair wrote:

Might be to do with the rolling start to the figures. Some deportations taking place past the 2011 starting point, but on orders served before the starting date?

Fair enough. Seems weird to have such accurate numbers but then they don't add up.

alastair · 28-09-2019 5:22pm

Happyilylost wrote: »

Fair enough. Seems weird to have such accurate numbers but then they don't add up.

Just a suggestion. It may not be that at all.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 5:23pm

Happyilylost wrote: »

Any idea why these figures don't match up?

The 5k includes people who were applying for assylum but case not deternined, or at appeal and a deportation order not made, and those who actually had an order against them.

Anyone able to stick in a Venn?

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 5:25pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

How so?

Still waiting...

Or has the penny dropped and you now realise there actualy are people with an order against them still in the state...

alastair · 28-09-2019 5:25pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

But we're left with the inescapable fact, a number remain.

Eminently escapable, primarily because it’s not a fact. There’s absolutely no evidence to support the notion.

Roger Hassenforder · 28-09-2019 5:27pm

alastair wrote: »

Eminently escapable, primarily because it’s not a fact. There’s absolutely no evidence to support the notion.

Which part is false?

Is D false?

alastair · 28-09-2019 5:35pm

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

The 5k includes people who were applying for assylum but case not deternined, or at appeal and a deportation order not made, and those who actually had an order against them.

The article makes clear that the numbers are all those who had deportation orders made against them. What muddies the issue up is that the appeal process was streamlined in 2015, removing the possibility of a deportation order being followed by a subsequent appeal for subsidiary protection, which doesn’t happen any more. Deportation orders are now only issued at the end of a parallel decision-making process. The only route left post deportation order is a ministerial appeal.

oughterard people - see OP for Mod warning 29/09/19

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