Olympic lifts

Wailin · 27-08-2019 4:07pm #1

Mid 40's guys and I currently do the standard lifts (squats, deadlifts, OH press etc). Lately I've been watching videos on the more complex lifts like the snatch, clean and jerk and I am wondering are they worth learning and will they add a new angle to my training? I know mobility is more of an issue with these lifts so it's not something I'd take lightly. I also wouldn't try them without proper coaching. So what's your advice on learning these? Give it a go or just stick to the regular lifts?

Zillah · 27-08-2019 4:18pm

I am no expert, but I was always under the impression that Olympic lifts like the clean and jerk are more about displaying strength and technique rather than building strength.

Wailin · 27-08-2019 4:36pm

I'd imagine the use of speed and explosiveness in those lifts would work the cardio a good bit more than the regular lifts. I guess it would be good to mix it up a bit too.

Mellor · 28-08-2019 1:29pm

Zillah wrote: »

I am no expert, but I was always under the impression that Olympic lifts like the clean and jerk are more about displaying strength and technique rather than building strength.

Not really.
The clean is the most powerful lift of any lift. They are only really trained in explosive range and as such help build that power. Oly lifters predominately train with olt lifts for a reason.

Wailin wrote: »

I'd imagine the use of speed and explosiveness in those lifts would work the cardio a good bit more than the regular lifts. I guess it would be good to mix it up a bit too.

Explosiveness is literally the opposite of cardio

Zillah · 28-08-2019 10:51pm

Mellor wrote: »

Oly lifters predominately train with olt lifts for a reason.

Is that true? I am sure they are obsessively performing olympic lifts to master the technique, but I would be very surprised if they weren't doing other movements, like deadlifts, to improve total strength. Obviously they could deadlift a much heavier weight than they can snatch.

Mellor · 28-08-2019 11:27pm

Zillah wrote: »

Is that true? I am sure they are obsessively performing olympic lifts to master the technique, but I would be very surprised if they weren't doing other movements, like deadlifts, to improve total strength. Obviously they could deadlift a much heavier weight than they can snatch.

Predominantly with oly lifts but not exclusively. In terms of rep numbers.
The main strength move would be squats after that. Deadlift would probably be a clean pull variant. You could say squats build base strength, and oly lifts turn that into power/explosive movements.

There’s obviously a huge technical element. But a certain point the technique is good but carrying is out at increasingly heavier weights simply requires more power and the strength to hold it.

Brian? · 29-08-2019 9:48pm

Mellor wrote: »

Predominantly with oly lifts but not exclusively. In terms of rep numbers.
The main strength move would be squats after that. Deadlift would probably be a clean pull variant. You could say squats build base strength, and oly lifts turn that into power/explosive movements.

There’s obviously a huge technical element. But a certain point the technique is good but carrying is out at increasingly heavier weights simply requires more power and the strength to hold it.

My understand is that it's really front squats that Oly lifters do for a strength base and very little deadlifting.

Mellor · 29-08-2019 10:34pm

Brian? wrote: »

My understand is that it's really front squats that Oly lifters do for a strength base and very little deadlifting.

Front squats and high bar back squats.
Very little standard deadlifts but they would do weightlifting varients like clean pulls and snatch pulls.

Wailin · 30-08-2019 1:02am

Maybe I'm reading into the responses incorrectly, but do I detect a little disdain about olympic lifts and lifters?

My heaviest deadlift was 170kg at 82kg. Watching a 100kg olympic lifter snatch 180kg above his head, has to be one of the most impressive displays of strength, technique and control surely?

Mr. CooL ICE · 30-08-2019 10:32am

Wailin wrote: »

Maybe I'm reading into the responses incorrectly, but do I detect a little disdain about olympic lifts and lifters?

My heaviest deadlift was 170kg at 82kg. Watching a 100kg olympic lifter snatch 180kg above his head, has to be one of the most impressive displays of strength, technique and control surely?

I don't see disdain. Just lots of confusion over how oly lifters train.

I say go for it if you can get coaching. The very fact that you're thinking about it (and asking about it) means that if you didn't give it a go, you'd regret it.

I don't see your age being an issue. I've no experience oly lifting but from what I know, beginners are trained the lifts in some form of progression, so you'd be doing light power snatches, light power cleans and overhead stability work before catching heavy barbells in deep positions. Your mobility probably wouldn't be there at the start, but with good coaching, it will come.

freemenfitness · 30-08-2019 10:46am

I can offer a bit of insight am by no means a good Oly lifter but spent a lot of time learning them and in a few clubs learning from a few coaches.

If you can find a good coach go and do it. Yes it can be pretty tough and the mobility is an issue for many but you will be working on it every session.

Age is not an issue a few of the clubs I was in had people 50+ training regularly the lifts tend to be done at lower weight to get the technique down so its a lot less intense than the conventional powerlifts.

For example one of the most humbling sessions I ever did was when I was paired with a 10 year old girl doing snatches for two hours. I had 5kg practice plates and had to add weights for her each set and take them off for mine. Could barely lift my arms after the session.

As for supplementary work I have only seen a handful of stuff done such as snatch grip deadlifts, front squats and ATG paused back squats. But many just do various version of the Oly lifts eg off blocks etc.

Transform · 30-08-2019 11:05am

watch this video i made that covers some of the concepts

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L98D-lAc-lw

overall = IMO do power cleans if you want to do oly lifts and then add in a wide range of far far safer movements that help develop power

Im impressed by what oly lifters do but i also understand theres a sh1t ton of drugs involved and all of them are genetically built and adapted for that sport

Wailin · 30-08-2019 11:32am

Thanks lads, it was the advice and help I was looking for.

LuckyLloyd · 30-08-2019 10:51pm

https://powerathletehq.com/power-pulls-performance/

This article is a few years old but the basic concept applies to your question here. The full olympic lifts are not worth it for most people / athletes in terms of time investment / risk of injury vs reward. The movements in Dominic's video above are within the remit of most people and will build a lot of power. As will power cleans / power snatches in comparison to trying to learn full cleans / snatches.

I personally do a lot of power cleans, swings, box jumps and my personal opinion is that those around me my age or older get negative returns from the full lifts. It's an olympic sport requiring a huge amount of specialisation and repetition to perform the full variants competently at even a light or moderate load.

Wailin · 31-08-2019 12:04am

Thanks! For front squats, what are the best stretches to help with keeping elbows high throughout the lift? I find that once I'm up at 80/90kg I'm barely in contact with the bar with only two fingers. Not a fan of the variation where you cross your arms and grip the bar from the front.

Alf Veedersane · 31-08-2019 9:22am

Wailin wrote: »

Thanks! For front squats, what are the best stretches to help with keeping elbows high throughout the lift? I find that once I'm up at 80/90kg I'm barely in contact with the bar with only two fingers. Not a fan of the variation where you cross your arms and grip the bar from the front.

Work on your lats and triceps and thoracic extension. And you really just have to focus on driving your elbows up as you head into and out of the bottom of the squat

Brian? · 31-08-2019 9:54pm

Wailin wrote: »

Maybe I'm reading into the responses incorrectly, but do I detect a little disdain about olympic lifts and lifters?

My heaviest deadlift was 170kg at 82kg. Watching a 100kg olympic lifter snatch 180kg above his head, has to be one of the most impressive displays of strength, technique and control surely?

Absolutely not. I wish I could Oly lift properly. It’s a phenomenal feat of strength and agility

Celticfire · 01-09-2019 10:38am

Wailin wrote: »

Mid 40's guys and I currently do the standard lifts (squats, deadlifts, OH press etc). Lately I've been watching videos on the more complex lifts like the snatch, clean and jerk and I am wondering are they worth learning and will they add a new angle to my training? I know mobility is more of an issue with these lifts so it's not something I'd take lightly. I also wouldn't try them without proper coaching. So what's your advice on learning these? Give it a go or just stick to the regular lifts?

If you have someone that can coach you then go for it. Never too late to try something new. Mobility is a huge issue but worst case scenario if you can't to the full lifts you could still do the power versions.

If your mobility is really bad ( you can't do an overhead squat) your road to a snatch will be bumpy.

Wailin · 01-09-2019 3:24pm

I think the snatch is probably beyond me now at this stage

But power cleans would be a good alternative to standard high bar squats.

Transform · 02-09-2019 3:37pm

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Work on your lats and triceps and thoracic extension. And you really just have to focus on driving your elbows up as you head into and out of the bottom of the squat

this ^^^
most of the fast elbows stuff is just really poor t spine mobility

Alf Veedersane · 02-09-2019 3:54pm

Transform wrote: »

this ^^^
most of the fast elbows stuff is just really poor t spine mobility

Circle of life.

Many moons ago, I asked here how to make my wrists stop hurting on front squats and the advice above was from yourself and Hanley. Put it into practice and Presto!

Transform · 06-09-2019 9:56am

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Circle of life.

Many moons ago, I asked here how to make my wrists stop hurting on front squats and the advice above was from yourself and Hanley. Put it into practice and Presto!

nice, the feet elevated back bridge is a core movement i would like all our clients to achieve.

I put together a full playlist of what i feel helps most here - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJ5zcpP8dG8&list=PL7HyOap7lRnwktWj-nIPhyqjI_INgl3t_

Olympic lifts

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