School reopenings -current plan WAS McHugh's plan

combat14 · 02-08-2020 7:31pm

khalessi wrote: »

in regards to hiring

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40025909.html

interesting reading

if they are looking at public recruitment ban and another moratorium on promotions this will hit staff morale very badly

pay cuts, increment freezes, below inflation pay agreements and tax rises must also be in the offing shortly for public services staff too...

wirelessdude01 · 02-08-2020 7:40pm

combat14 wrote: »

if they are looking at public recruitment ban and another moratorium on promotions this will hit staff morale very badly

pay cuts, increment freezes, below inflation pay agreements and tax rises must also be in the offing shortly for public services staff too...

They'll pay the 2% in October but will take multiples of it a few weeks later in the budget. Be another rush of teachers abroad in 2021.

am_zarathustra · 02-08-2020 8:10pm

Hitting front line staff will be unpopular, it might be more politically palatable to go after civil servants. Touching nurses will be career suicide for the minister, possibly even guards now. If the schools stay open I'm not even sure touching teachers would be smart politically, and lets be clear, that's what will stop them not any sense of right or wrong. The Unions (garda reps obv) would be well to agree front line staff in the Public Service stick together. There are softer targets in the current climate.

If they do, the staffing crisis will be chronic. I'm expecting flash closure due to lack of s and s after October anyway. Nurses wont stay either

Bobtheman · 02-08-2020 9:24pm

bren2001 wrote: »

What legal protections and guidelines are you looking for? I'm genuinely curious as opposed to criticising that view. At third level, I've zero issue with online teaching but I have much more control and the average age in my class is 21+. I can see it is very different at second level but what are the actual concerns?

Manipulation of videos. You are dealing with teenagers. I could give countless examples but might lead others to guess who im talking about

Bobtheman · 02-08-2020 9:28pm

combat14 wrote: »

if they are looking at public recruitment ban and another moratorium on promotions this will hit staff morale very badly

pay cuts, increment freezes, below inflation pay agreements and tax rises must also be in the offing shortly for public services staff too...

Ah jaysus. Some people can't wait to start the public vs private war. Get those torches lite. Check your gunpowder. A recruitment ban is one thing if it happens. The last I heard the 2% in October is still going ahead .

Bobtheman · 02-08-2020 9:34pm

FF/FG ain't about to start down the road of austerity. Depends on the EU. If they do then it's SF time .
Let's not go for the panic bottoms yet;

Leftwaffe · 02-08-2020 11:09pm

O365 coupled with Teams and OneNote Class Notebook is the best for blended learning IMO. Couple that with an iPad and Apple Pencil and its all you’ll need.

Individual folders for each student. Differentiated work can be given easily. Marking up of copies, etc. All easily done.

Plus live classes can be recorded and banked for later use or if a student mosses a lesson.

Bobtheman · 03-08-2020 9:21am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

O365 coupled with Teams and OneNote Class Notebook is the best for blended learning IMO. Couple that with an iPad and Apple Pencil and its all you’ll need.

Individual folders for each student. Differentiated work can be given easily. Marking up of copies, etc. All easily done.

Plus live classes can be recorded and banked for later use or if a student mosses a lesson.

I applaud your work ethic. But who will buy me the iPad and apple pencil?? Differentiated learning often means lowering the bar. With 33 classes a week it can nearly be impossible to differentiate most material. Plus ,it would help if parents of weaker kids made them do homework. Often a clear link between the two.
I do realize there are very hard workers on here but not everyone is of that disposition or energy levels.
I always felt the department could provide more actual class plans. A seasoned teacher knows if a plan will work or not. The TES site ain't replicated here . Instead we get waffle and key terms.

boardise · 03-08-2020 9:38am

Rosita wrote: »

You are assuming that there's a specific amount of material that must be covered. And that this must be done at all costs. Not so I'm afraid. The DES may have to revise many of the old assumptions about examinations and syllabi.

We could be in a scenario where there's not a vaccine for a few years if at all. Maybe school as we know it is finished for the foreseeable future. So I would be wary of talking about "half an education" as if that's a definable amount and the only possible "education" is the one that is regarded as that at the moment.

Let's get real. Kids send half their time in school bored senseless learning stuff they don't need to know and struggling with basics at the end of it, while teachers pile on homework because it's expected, and the DES devises mindless classroom strategies which inappropriately conflate activity and productivity. There might be worse things than a total recalibration of how education is delivered.

Absolutely brilliant post -bang on the money.
The current scene is one of immense challenge to people's mental fortitude and creative capacity. There's a need now for people who'll roll up their sleeves ,set targets and make things happen -in defiance of the army of moaners and obstructionists we hear every day on the media.

Leftwaffe · 03-08-2020 9:56am

Bobtheman wrote: »

I applaud your work ethic. But who will buy me the iPad and apple pencil?? Differentiated learning often means lowering the bar. With 33 classes a week it can nearly be impossible to differentiate most material. Plus ,it would help if parents of weaker kids made them do homework. Often a clear link between the two.
I do realize there are very hard workers on here but not everyone is of that disposition or energy levels.
I always felt the department could provide more actual class plans. A seasoned teacher knows if a plan will work or not. The TES site ain't replicated here . Instead we get waffle and key terms.

The school I work in is an iPad school so all staff are fortunate enough to have an iPad and the vast majority of students have them too. The pencil is a personal investment to be honest, however there are cheaper alternatives on Amazon than the original.

It does require some work and extra hours and it's not for everyone but I feel its really effective platform to use, one that can be used both in class and out of class, transitioning from one to another easily.

Look, every teacher will have their own way of doing things and my way is definitely not for everyone. Just thought I'd share it. Teachers who are less comfortable with technology will struggle with it but I'm sure they have their own good methods too. Each or their own.

I agree re differentiation. You're correct there.

Bobtheman · 03-08-2020 11:07am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

The school I work in is an iPad school so all staff are fortunate enough to have an iPad and the vast majority of students have them too. The pencil is a personal investment to be honest, however there are cheaper alternatives on Amazon than the original.

It does require some work and extra hours and it's not for everyone but I feel its really effective platform to use, one that can be used both in class and out of class, transitioning from one to another easily.

Look, every teacher will have their own way of doing things and my way is definitely not for everyone. Just thought I'd share it. Teachers who are less comfortable with technology will struggle with it but I'm sure they have their own good methods too. Each or their own.

I agree re differentiation. You're correct there.

To be a teacher is to feel perpetually guilty. Unfortunately this year a lot of us will lose our rooms. Thus making the use of technology practically impossible.. I expect rubbish strewn rooms and inoperable computers. When one person mainly using a room you can maintain a computer. Not with multiple users. Plus kids unsupervised during classes like to tinker with the technology.

Bobtheman · 03-08-2020 11:14am

I think Rosita is right to Question that we don't have to cover all the material. That some of it is pointless. Wellbeing?!
Some teachers do pile on the homework as kids and parents expect it.
As to what's relevant and irrelevant in terms of curriculum you will always get about 100 valid opinions.
But the one thing in utterly convinced of is that the traditional LC is not for those going into a Trade and is a waste of my time and there's.
Also gob****es who want to wreck others education should be in special classes or FAS.
Anyway adieu for the rest of the summer.
Take my advice tune off the media. Not as relevant as you think and they will never love you. An abusive spouse is a good analogy.

Leftwaffe · 03-08-2020 11:25am

Bobtheman wrote: »

To be a teacher is to feel perpetually guilty. Unfortunately this year a lot of us will lose our rooms. Thus making the use of technology practically impossible.. I expect rubbish strewn rooms and inoperable computers. When one person mainly using a room you can maintain a computer. Not with multiple users. Plus kids unsupervised during classes like to tinker with the technology.

Practically impossible? I haven't had a room for a few years and solely rely on the iPad for teaching. Cast it through a projector and or through the computer. Every room in our school has a computer, 99% of which are operating very well. Multiple users log on through their own accounts. IT maintenance this year will increased I'd imagine but really ours were just fine last year.

I understand losing your room is a disaster for you and others but this is something we will have to adapt to. It is far, far from impossible to teach without a classroom. Many teachers don't enjoy that luxury for a long time.

cwboy · 03-08-2020 11:54am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Practically impossible? I haven't had a room for a few years and solely rely on the iPad for teaching. Cast it through a projector and or through the computer. Every room in our school has a computer, 99% of which are operating very well. Multiple users log on through their own accounts. IT maintenance this year will increased I'd imagine but really ours were just fine last year.

I understand losing your room is a disaster for you and others but this is something we will have to adapt to. It is far, far from impossible to teach without a classroom. Many teachers don't enjoy that luxury for a long time.

Can I ask what you use to cast the ipad screen?

Bobtheman · 03-08-2020 12:07pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Practically impossible? I haven't had a room for a few years and solely rely on the iPad for teaching. Cast it through a projector and or through the computer. Every room in our school has a computer, 99% of which are operating very well. Multiple users log on through their own accounts. IT maintenance this year will increased I'd imagine but really ours were just fine last year.

I understand losing your room is a disaster for you and others but this is something we will have to adapt to. It is far, far from impossible to teach without a classroom. Many teachers don't enjoy that luxury for a long time.

Maintenance in our school is ****. We also don't have iPads . Of course it's not impossible but a retrograde step. As soon as kids leave the room social distancing will be a joke .Even colm o Rourke agrees with that and he is no friend of the Asti having carried a grudge for decades. I think there was a personal element to his attacks. Asti didn't back him on an issue.
I think you should keep in mind not all schools are equal when it comes to IT.
I'm looking forward to the smashed oranges and stolen leads next year.

Leftwaffe · 03-08-2020 1:57pm

cwboy wrote: »

Can I ask what you use to cast the ipad screen?

You can use a few different apps. Reflektor is good, Airserver is another good one. There are more. Generally it's a one time license payment of around 10 euro and then you install. They can be found elsewhere though, if you know what I mean.

Extremely handy tool and easy switch between desktop and iPad if needed.

purplecow1977 · 04-08-2020 2:20pm

Reading this thread has made me realise I'm virtually clueless when it comes to technology - despite having done several CPD technology related courses - am I thick?!

Mardy Bum · 04-08-2020 3:16pm

purplecow1977 wrote: »

Reading this thread has made me realise I'm virtually clueless when it comes to technology - despite having done several CPD technology related courses - am I thick?!

95% of CPD is useless for technology. It changes very quickly and there are lots of faddish waves. Knowing the principles of good teaching and learning is a lot more useful.

Leftwaffe · 04-08-2020 3:29pm

purplecow1977 wrote: »

Reading this thread has made me realise I'm virtually clueless when it comes to technology - despite having done several CPD technology related courses - am I thick?!

Absolutely not. From my experience a large percentage of our staff don't rely on technology at all and of course there are great teachers amongst them. Being profient in educational technology certainly helps in these times but it still won't make much of a difference if a teacher isn't able to teach.

Personally, I'm just fascinated by the benefits of it and it has made my work a lot easier. I'm not an expert by any means but would gladly help anyone on here that needs it.

mtoutlemonde · 04-08-2020 5:50pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Absolutely not. From my experience a large percentage of our staff don't rely on technology at all and of course there are great teachers amongst them. Being profient in educational technology certainly helps in these times but it still won't make much of a difference if a teacher isn't able to teach.

Personally, I'm just fascinated by the benefits of it and it has made my work a lot easier. I'm not an expert by any means but would gladly help anyone on here that needs it.

Yes definitely. I have pulled back on technology - I have found students getting fed up/bored but will pay more attention if they are following my explanation on the board and taking that down. I often think the students say to themselves that Sir knows what he's talking about. Taking notes from PowerPoint is pointless I think. I do however use the books for correcting and a language teacher the audio saves me time messing with a CD player.

If we are not provided with laptops/computers in the classrooms, students will be completing listening activities at home and definitely chalk and talk.

As you have said, I will also be willing to answer IT related questions. I've been asked plenty over the years.

TheValeyard · 04-08-2020 6:13pm

I'm the opposite. If you have seen my handwriting, you'd know why I use PowerPoint for important note taking.

am_zarathustra · 04-08-2020 7:12pm

I have been to a lot of the ICT workshops too. I worked as a programmer and used fairly advanced methods in a previous life. I have a very good grasp of technology and would be very comfortable learning new technologies quickly. Being able to programme a bit and having the basics of i/o helps. What I'll say is I've never been to an in-service with anyone leading it who knew more than me. I am self taught but I do my research because that's my background. There is a lot of people coming out and talking who have a powerpoint they didn't design and they haven't a breeze. It's like everything, you can't teach a topic unless you know the topic well and a good bit of the information behind it. I had to explain to one of them that my personal laptop ran off Linux (for obvious reasons if you knew anything about computers), literally could have been talking double dutch.

scrubs33 · 04-08-2020 7:26pm

am_zarathustra wrote: »

I have been to a lot of the ICT workshops too. I worked as a programmer and used fairly advanced methods in a previous life. I have a very good grasp of technology and would be very comfortable learning new technologies quickly. Being able to programme a bit and having the basics of i/o helps. What I'll say is I've never been to an in-service with anyone leading it who knew more than me. I am self taught but I do my research because that's my background. There is a lot of people coming out and talking who have a powerpoint they didn't design and they haven't a breeze. It's like everything, you can't teach a topic unless you know the topic well and a good bit of the information behind it. I had to explain to one of them that my personal laptop ran off Linux (for obvious reasons if you knew anything about computers), literally could have been talking double dutch.

Do you mean the ICT in services or inservice days in general? If it’s the latter that’s a pretty broad statement to make in fairness. Even if it is in relation to the ICT ones it’s still a big claim based on explaining to one individual how Linux works.

am_zarathustra · 04-08-2020 7:39pm

ICT in service.

That was an example but I have plenty. I teach coding in school, in fairness the JCT in-service for that was actually good, more methodologies but very well planned and extremely professional.

The general ICT ones we've had, some department some private to be fair, have been woeful. One issue is generality, it's always pitched in the middle. ICT skills in a school vary wildly. A huge number of issues in schools are actually hardware based, our server is held together with tape, it requires a lot of coaxing but we don't have the money to replace it. Computers are wiped every summer with a clean reinstall, they are so old it is the only way they will run new OS's smoothly.

And I was speaking from my own experience, I have not been at an inservice with someone who was I felt very knowledgeable. As I said I have been at in services in other areas that were excellent. Part of the issue is the market cost of someone with experience in this areas, they are not working in the PDST

I suspect you would get a more nuanced answer on here than in any inservice you attended. I might be wrong but that's my experience

alroley · 04-08-2020 8:07pm

I still don't get the keeping students in classrooms.

In my school 1st - TY are being base classrooms but 5th and 6th are not. I teach two option subjects, so all my classes are a mixture of base classes and I am losing my classroom. They will all be moving anyway.

rainbowtrout · 04-08-2020 8:36pm

alroley wrote: »

I still don't get the keeping students in classrooms.

In my school 1st - TY are being base classrooms but 5th and 6th are not. I teach two option subjects, so all my classes are a mixture of base classes and I am losing my classroom. They will all be moving anyway.

We are not using base classrooms for students. They mix for more classes than they don’t so it’s a waste of time

alroley · 04-08-2020 8:41pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

We are not using base classrooms for students. They mix for more classes than they don’t so it’s a waste of time

I don't understand our plan - 1st - 3rd are only together for history, geography, RE, CSPE, SPHE. They are mixed for everything else. Every teacher other than the likes of Home Ec. etc. are losing their classrooms.

TheValeyard · 04-08-2020 8:42pm

alroley wrote: »

I still don't get the keeping students in classrooms.

In my school 1st - TY are being base classrooms but 5th and 6th are not. I teach two option subjects, so all my classes are a mixture of base classes and I am losing my classroom. They will all be moving anyway.

Think it's to minimise the movement. But yeah it's not exactly going to work as it's been reported.

rainbowtrout · 04-08-2020 10:05pm

alroley wrote: »

I don't understand our plan - 1st - 3rd are only together for history, geography, RE, CSPE, SPHE. They are mixed for everything else. Every teacher other than the likes of Home Ec. etc. are losing their classrooms.

Ya it's not going to work and they will mix at breaks anyway, so there's no point trying to keep them in one room for a small set of classes.

In our school, they are with their core class for English, Irish, Maths for first year, but are streamed from second years so they would really only be in core classes for Religion, PE, SPHE, CSPE and Science. We are implementing a one way system in the school and the layout of the building allows for that.

am_zarathustra · 04-08-2020 10:28pm

They've suggested holding off on streaming for as long as possible. So unstreamed for 1st into 2nd year etc.

School reopenings -current plan WAS McHugh's plan

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