Does Ireland have a drug problem or not?

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 10:06am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

I'm not convinced this will truly occur, do we have absolute proof of this occuring anywhere in the world, humans would kill over water?

Portugal has seen a decrease in drug use https://www.google.ie/amp/s/m.mic.com/articles/amp/110344/14-years-after-portugal-decriminalized-all-drugs-here-s-what-s-happening

Lower crime after legalizing weed in US https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/medical-marijuana-legalisation-cannabis-us-states-violent-crime-drop-numbers-study-california-new-a8160311.html%3famp

It doesn’t eliminate organized crime because they make more money from opiates and cocaine. So that is the thinking of legalizing everything https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.theglobeandmail.com/amp/opinion/article-even-with-legalized-marijuana-organized-crime-isnt-going-away/

Wanderer78 · 02-02-2019 10:11am

joeguevara wrote:

Portugal has seen a decrease in drug use

We need to be careful when quoting such 'success' stories, again, addictions are complex, it's difficult to find absolute proof in such matters, even though I think Portugals move is brave and probably a better approach, I'd imagine it has created it's own complexities and it's own failures, which may not seem evident within the data and statistics

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 10:12am

Of course it has. Any strategy is a risk. But anything has to be better than allowing crime gangs control it.

Wanderer78 · 02-02-2019 10:15am

joeguevara wrote:

Of course it has. Any strategy is a risk. But anything has to be better than allowing crime gangs control it.

I do agree with this statement, but it would mean state interaction with criminal gangs, that would be difficult for some to swollow, and would these gangs just move onto other products?

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 10:55am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

I do agree with this statement, but it would mean state interaction with criminal gangs, that would be difficult for some to swollow, and would these gangs just move onto other products?

We have precedent in the past of bringing illegal gangs to round table discussions and it was very successful. i. E paramilitaries. It may mean an amnesty or completely cut them out which is probably best.

Then where does supply come from. Marijuana is easy. Harder is difficult. I have no knowledge but it is unlikely that we have capacity or climate to grow coca plants or opioid poppies. So maybe it could be like tigers. Illegal to bring them in but not illegal to own. MDMA is simply a synthetic process (motbthe natural oil ones from some trees in Vietnam.

Do it in stages. It is probably ridiculous but anything is better than now.

What is really required is worldwide recognition that war on drugs doesn’t work and build a new sustainable industry.

Or go the Philippines route where the president said he will personally shoot every drug dealer and user.

El_Bee · 02-02-2019 11:50am

the bulk of drug dealers money comes from marijuana, legalizing it would be a massive blow to them, and widespread use would be less destructive than alcohol and coke.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 12:03pm

El_Bee wrote: »

the bulk of drug dealers money comes from marijuana, legalizing it would be a massive blow to them, and widespread use would be less destructive than alcohol and coke.

Revenue from marijuana is just under 50 million per annum while cocaine is hundreds and heroin high hundreds.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/organised-crime-in-republic-worth-at-least-1-7bn-annually-1.2848801%3fmode=amp

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 12:12pm

Grant Wexford wrote: »

On what basis are you saying that crime is rising, what statistics are you looking at?

I am talking about the deaths related to gang feuds involved in drug trade,

thunderdog · 02-02-2019 1:19pm

I’m in my 30s, I have two younger sisters, one in her early 20s and a younger one doing her JC this year. There is definitely more openness now to drug taking in those age groups than there was when I was that age.

Chatting to the sister in her 20s, her stance on it is that it’s cheaper to have 1e on a night out (which would last the night) rather than a rake of drinks.

With coke you see it with a few lads that they need it to have a decent night. Even over a few quiet beers they’d disappear off and come back buzzed. More of a social crutch than anything else.

Ger Roe · 02-02-2019 1:47pm

To cut through all the stories and anecdotal evidence that get posted whenever this subject arises, the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction, produces annual reports on drug activity for every European country. It is generally accepted as the benchmark for statistical data presentation in the field.

Ireland's 2018 report is available here -

http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/countries/drug-reports/2018/ireland_en

For anyone is interested in reviewing some statistical facts, it's an interesting read.

dartboardio · 02-02-2019 1:59pm

NIMAN wrote: »

You can make the decision not to, of course. Your call.

If others like your cousins want to wreck their lives, that's their decision. No-one elses.

I have yet to hear of anything positive to come out of someone taking drugs.

Of course it’s my decision, that’s not my point, my point is it’s so ‘normal’ amongst young people. And that imo shouldn’t be the case.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 2:06pm

NIMAN wrote: »

You can make the decision not to, of course. Your call.

If others like your cousins want to wreck their lives, that's their decision. No-one elses.

I have yet to hear of anything positive to come out of someone taking drugs.

What do you mean by positive to come out? Have you heard of anything positive to someone having a drink or a smoke? Is having a good night positive or is there something else? Honest question.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 2:08pm

dartboardio wrote: »

Of course it’s my decision, that’s not my point, my point is it’s so ‘normal’ amongst young people. And that imo shouldn’t be the case.

Why shouldn’t it be the case? Is it based on the fact it’s a crime? Or is it because you believe they are so dangerous or inherently evil? Society determines what is normal and things change. Alcohol is illegal in some countries but considered normal to drink bootleg. Should that be the case?

scamalert · 02-02-2019 2:26pm

ive pretty much finished reading when someone mentioned half bag of weed for 40e, nice imagination i supposed it size of tescos bag :pac:

coke would be actually on top of 30+ age groups and above, not sure if anyone does maths but 1g costs in excess of 100e thats some habit to maintain.

As seems everyone anti drug mashes all drugs into same category, shrooms were ok in Ireland until one dumpling decided to take to many and voila its dangerous like crack and heroin, yet somehow is sad news when someone out of their head on booze dies or kills someone daily, ignorance is a bliss for those lining up pockets, sure let em drink but oh no we dont need extra work figuring how to make weed legal as some fart in government prob would have a stroke having to actually work for money.

TerrorFirmer · 02-02-2019 2:36pm

Ger Roe wrote: »

To cut through all the stories and anecdotal evidence that get posted whenever this subject arises, the European Monitoring Centre for Drugs and Drug Addiction, produces annual reports on drug activity for every European country. It is generally accepted as the benchmark for statistical data presentation in the field.

Ireland's 2018 report is available here -

http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/countries/drug-reports/2018/ireland_en

For anyone is interested in reviewing some statistical facts, it's an interesting read.

Cannabis leading the way with 14% prevalence, MDMA at 4.5%, Cocaine at 3%.

On the first page or two of this thread we've people claiming that 70% of the patrons in any given pub are on cocaine and that schoolkids are doing it on weekends as if it's the universally done thing.

People have always, and will always, take drugs, and yes prevalence may have risen somewhat, but stuff like the above is just total waffle.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 2:40pm

scamalert wrote: »

ive pretty much finished reading when someone mentioned half bag of weed for 40e, nice imagination i supposed it size of tescos bag :pac:

coke would be actually on top of 30+ age groups and above, not sure if anyone does maths but 1g costs in excess of 100e thats some habit to maintain.

As seems everyone anti drug mashes all drugs into same category, shrooms were ok in Ireland until one dumpling decided to take to many and voila its dangerous like crack and heroin, yet somehow is sad news when someone out of their head on booze dies or kills someone daily, ignorance is a bliss for those lining up pockets, sure let em drink but oh no we dont need extra work figuring how to make weed legal as some fart in government prob would have a stroke having to actually work for money.

One night at a party I asked someone about cost as I had a few drinks and was genuinely curious. I was told that 100 for a g of coke would be expensive and normally 70 or 80. But if 4 bought an 1/8 that is 200 for 3.5g so just over 50 each for .85. Which is 3 vodka red bulls in town. Still expensive I thought but not outrageous. It’s a long way from when we went out in college with 10 quid and had a great night.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 2:44pm

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

Cannabis leading the way with 14% prevalence, MDMA at 4.5%, Cocaine at 3%.

On the first page or two of this thread we've people claiming that 70% of the patrons in any given pub are on cocaine and that schoolkids are doing it on weekends as if it's the universally done thing.

People have always, and will always, take drugs, and yes prevalence may have risen somewhat, but stuff like the above is just total waffle.

Fair point but the percentages are skewed somewhat as the age band is 15-34. So if you take out 15-20 that increases the percentage considerably. Also the location will always have a higher usage. So if you take a bar in south Dublin frequented by 22-27 year olds you will see that the 3% is a nonsense.

screamer · 02-02-2019 2:52pm

Yes it’s a huge problem, I think in a couple of years we’ll need far more addiction services to help people. Cocaine seems to be widely used amongst twenty to thirty year group, combined with heavy spirit drinking, there’ll be an increase in the amount of people with really bad addiction and health issues. Drugs really are a scourge that destroys lives and families, that’s the tragedy, and dealers should get a few really harsh sentences as a deterrent,

TerrorFirmer · 02-02-2019 2:54pm

That doesn't affect the overall figure though.

That's like saying our crime statistics are wrong because certain places account for a significant portion of it. It doesn't mean that some areas aren't pushing much higher statistics when broken down, but it doesn't change the percentage or overall prevalence.

Anecdotal 'evidence' is not actual evidence.

Sure, it may be under reported for a variety of reasons, but you could double, triple, even quadruple the figure and it's still nowhere near the picture being painted by some in this thread of an entire society - from schoolkids to adults - gripped by cocaine hysteria.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 2:59pm

screamer wrote: »

Yes it’s a huge problem, I think in a couple of years we’ll need far more addiction services to help people. Cocaine seems to be widely used amongst twenty to thirty year group, combined with heavy spirit drinking, there’ll be an increase in the amount of people with really bad addiction and health issues. Drugs really are a scourge that destroys lives and families, that’s the tragedy, and dealers should get a few really harsh sentences as a deterrent,

Drugs offenses are amongst the harshest sentences and are enforced. The issue is when one goes in there is someone to take their place. Doesn’t stop anything and is a failed regime.

Again alcohol is a bigger scourge and causes much more violence both domestically and in society.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 3:03pm

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

That doesn't affect the overall figure though.

That's like saying our crime statistics are wrong because certain places account for a significant portion of it. It doesn't mean that some areas aren't pushing much higher statistics when broken down, but it doesn't change the percentage or overall prevalence.

Anecdotal 'evidence' is not actual evidence.

Sure, it may be under reported for a variety of reasons, but you could double, triple, even quadruple the figure and it's still nowhere near the picture being painted by some in this thread of an entire society - from schoolkids to adults - gripped by cocaine hysteria.

But if you take an average of an age band that is too wide then you are going to get a skewed figure. If use is concentrated amongst a much narrower band then a more realistic statistic is produced. That is like saying the death rate amongst 15-79 year old is 7% but if you actually looked at 65-79 then it would be 60% (I am using this as an example). That is what I mean that the 3% is spread over an age range where it doesn’t apply to a considerable % of that group.

Balanadan · 02-02-2019 3:34pm

Cocaine users are boring as ****. They'd melt your head the way they go on. It shows a serious lack of confidence using it too. Not to mention the environmental and social impact that their drug use has.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 3:39pm

Balanadan wrote: »

Cocaine users are boring as ****. They'd melt your head the way they go on. It shows a serious lack of confidence using it too. Not to mention the environmental and social impact that their drug use has.

Agree with the boring part. Jaysus it gets boring quickly when you listen to somebody who thinks they are solving the worlds problems talking 100 miles an hour. It’s funnier looking at people hanging off every word and the only reason is they want some.

Denis Leary takes them off perfectly pretending to be a wired Hitler and a Jew in the jacks with him going ‘I know you didn’t do it now give me a bump of that’.
https://youtu.be/1KvZxoQqAhs

dartboardio · 02-02-2019 6:30pm

joeguevara wrote: »

Why shouldn’t it be the case? Is it based on the fact it’s a crime? Or is it because you believe they are so dangerous or inherently evil? Society determines what is normal and things change. Alcohol is illegal in some countries but considered normal to drink bootleg. Should that be the case?

What are you even on about? Have you even read my previous post? I didn’t call anyone or anything evil I simply said I wish taking drugs wasn’t so normal amongst friends including myself.

And are you really asking me why taking drugs shouldn’t be normal? Seriously? The last thing a group of 20 something year olds should want or feel they need to do, is drugs on a night out. Speaking from experience here too.

freshpopcorn · 02-02-2019 7:02pm

Irish_peppa wrote: »

I dont get,,, if the above is true about all them on cocaine etc and not actually drinking much whats the attraction over drink? Few beers and knakker drinking was good fun. relaxing chilled. Is cocaine not like running around like a looper chewing the jaw of yourself? not exactly my idea of a great weekend after a long stressful working week lol

I know people and they won't have a few pints of beer/cider because it might make them put on weight but they've no issue with spirits/drugs.

freshpopcorn · 02-02-2019 7:10pm

Does Ireland have a drug problem?
I don't really know. Take for instance when I was at college I went to various house parties/nights out and it was easy to access it. You'd see loads taking it from Mechanics to Tourism Students to Nurses to Gardai to Doctors and they are still taking it when they a qualified.
If I hung around with a girl in my class who went to the cafe and shopping/cinema for a night out I'd say there wasnt much drug use.
It really depends on the social circle your in but once your not a hermit and you go out drugs are easy enough to get.
I take it tough lots of the developed countirs in the world have a similar attitude.

joeguevara · 02-02-2019 10:37pm

dartboardio wrote: »

What are you even on about? Have you even read my previous post? I didn’t call anyone or anything evil I simply said I wish taking drugs wasn’t so normal amongst friends including myself.

And are you really asking me why taking drugs shouldn’t be normal? Seriously? The last thing a group of 20 something year olds should want or feel they need to do, is drugs on a night out. Speaking from experience here too.

I get what you are saying but what is the underlying reason. I am not saying it should be normal but I am interested in knowing the reason why you are so averse to drugs being normal. It is a mind altering substance. So alcohol. One is legal one is not. If you could make it safer by being properly regulated and tested would that be better. If there was no crime element would that be better. I am not saying it should be I would just like to know the reason you categoricallybsay it shouldn’t be. I think the biggest problem with drugs is who controls it rather than the substances themselves. If it was taken away from criminal gangs and legalized which would reduce the price significantly then why should society abstain from something that produces a favourable effect.

Jesseray · 04-02-2019 2:32am

Just saw this.

I'd say so, more leaning into a Yes, because? I've met a lot of people taking drugs in my life living here (not by choice) but yeah, heroin, cocaine, mdma and **** like that. Even foreigners selling them. I'd rather stay away from people like that. My mum used to say "If you hang out with stupid people, you will become stupid. If you sorrounded yourself with wise people you will become wise" I was too afraid to become like them, wandering the streets like zombies or when me and my mates go on adventures exploring abandoned places, caves or forests, there would be so much needles around, even the corner of the streets. It's up to the person but seeing people on drugs on the street of cork is just pitiful. I'd say Ireland does has a drug problem in my honest opinion. I don't know by how much but I'd say it does.

JupiterKid · 04-02-2019 2:51am

Sinead O'Connor (or whatever she calls herself now) as much as she is derided in a widespread way, has made some pretty astute observations of social malaise and religious indoctrination and she summed it up aptly back in a song she had in 1994...

"look at all our old men in pubs, look at all our young people on drugs."

Dakotabigone · 04-02-2019 2:53am

Their sticking the marajama up their rectums now

Rubberchikken · 04-02-2019 3:14am

ive never seen or been offered illegal drugs. completely fail to see the attraction.
i do have an incredibly low opinion of anyone who indulges.

freshpopcorn · 04-02-2019 3:27am

Rubberchikken wrote: »

ive never seen or been offered illegal drugs. completely fail to see the attraction.
i do have an incredibly low opinion of anyone who indulges.

I think it really depends on the social circle you mix in.
However once you start going to house parties at college I think it's hard to avoid being around them.

Sam Quentin · 04-02-2019 3:28am

Rubberchikken wrote: »

ive never seen or been offered illegal drugs. completely fail to see the attraction.
i do have an incredibly low opinion of anyone who indulges.

This is basically the truth,. it's so easy to dramatise drug taking and violence and thievery when most people are getting information about these activities from social media,..
I'm not saying Ireland hasn't got a drug problem (because it has)and I'm not saying Ireland does not have a drink problem. Being in the THICK of it most weekends,. I do think people should be more worried about the alcohol problem... Gardaī seem to be on top of this drug issue,tho obviously their hands are tied when it comes to 'young' people and alcohol..

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 04-02-2019 3:49am

Rubberchikken wrote: »

ive never seen or been offered illegal drugs. completely fail to see the attraction.
i do have an incredibly low opinion of anyone who indulges.

Is that based on the effects of the drug on the person or the aforementioned illegality?

Sam Quentin · 04-02-2019 4:09am

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Is that based on the effects of the drug on the person or the aforementioned illegality?

I'd say it's based in the unatural behaviour of drug users and the unatural uselessness of said drug users in everyday life... Basically the non functioning behaviour in family life and what it means to the rest of the family (picking up the pieces after them etc etc).. never mind the criminality it sometimes involves, that's asside from the illegality of the actual drug...

Trump Is Right · 04-02-2019 5:59am

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I think it really depends on the social circle you mix in.
However once you start going to house parties at college I think it's hard to avoid being around them.

And if you're surrounded by a house full of millenials, you might find you need some drugs just to survive that particular experience... this might help explain our growing drug culture!

Always Tired · 04-02-2019 6:31am

dodderangler wrote: »

I’d say about 70% of people in a pub at any time is on coke.

dude bring me out with you some weekend, please. sounds like you're a great man for hunting down a proper sesh!

pubs i be at 70% are alcoholic mid to pension age alcoholics. and that drug, legal and completely ingrained in our culture, is the most dangerous by a million miles.

freshpopcorn · 04-02-2019 6:36am

Always Tired wrote: »

dude bring me out with you some weekend, please. sounds like you're a great man for hunting down a proper sesh!

pubs i be at 70% are alcoholic mid to pension age alcoholics. and that drug, legal and completely ingrained in our culture, is the most dangerous by a million miles.

You've to crash college house parties or just go to clubs and stay in the toilets all night.

freshpopcorn · 04-02-2019 8:03am

When you find things likes this thrown over a gate on a rural country road. You suspect there might be.
51124156_2293952340637980_8936430722122514432_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent.fdub1-2.fna&oh=7f1eb5e45dd266fca9034df70e9c4714&oe=5CF3B26B

51124156_2293952340637980_8936430722122514432_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent.fdub1-2.fna&oh=7f1eb5e45dd266fca9034df70e9c4714&oe=5CF3B26B

Graces7 · 04-02-2019 8:38am

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I think it really depends on the social circle you mix in.
However once you start going to house parties at college I think it's hard to avoid being around them.

we used to call it peer pressure .

El_Bee · 04-02-2019 11:30am

freshpopcorn wrote: »

When you find things likes this thrown over a gate on a rural country road. You suspect there might be.

What is that?

Sam Quentin · 04-02-2019 12:09pm

El_Bee wrote: »

What is that?

Wee scales for weighing wee spuds!?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 04-02-2019 12:36pm

Sam Quentin wrote: »

I'd say it's based in the unatural behaviour of drug users and the unatural uselessness of said drug users in everyday life... Basically the non functioning behaviour in family life and what it means to the rest of the family (picking up the pieces after them etc etc).. never mind the criminality it sometimes involves, that's asside from the illegality of the actual drug...

Sounds like you're confusing drug use with drug abuse to be honest.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 04-02-2019 12:38pm

El_Bee wrote: »

What is that?

Microscale. Used for weighing small quantities of things, bloody either drugs are jewels/precious metals. I'm guessing not the former.

Tacitus Kilgore · 04-02-2019 12:58pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

ive never seen or been offered illegal drugs. completely fail to see the attraction.
i do have an incredibly low opinion of anyone who indulges.

Really :eek: , never even been offered them?

Honest question - have you ever walked around the capital city of any country?

I enjoy some recreational drugs, not gonna lie - mostly cannabis - (regular) but on the rare (now, very very rare <once annually) occasion I will indulge on a little bit of coke or some MD/pills, but I'm too old for that crap now.

Hasn't done me any harm tbh, but I see plenty around me being harmed - particularly young lads taking far too much ketamine & other miscellaneous powders, same can be said for most other vices too - gambling/gaming/drinking.

I wouldn't say we have any more or less of a drug problem now than we did 20 years ago, it's just the drug(s) of choice are constantly evolving - The lads taking too much Ket are just the lads that were drinking themselves into oblivion 20 years ago.

The problem is our love affair with excess, or is it an addition to excess?

Collie D · 04-02-2019 8:36pm

I’ve actually just witnessed something that I had heard about but sounded like an urban myth.

A woman who must have been about 70 selling what was presumably her prescription to an addict. Nothing discreet about it. Him handing over a few €2 coins while she gave him a couple of pills. She hadn’t even left the busy chemist’s shop.

freshpopcorn · 04-02-2019 8:43pm

Graces7 wrote: »

we used to call it peer pressure .

I've being in plenty of apartment with drugs/alcohol and I was never really pressured into taking either. It was just the places I was at the time.
If I hung out with another group the strongest thing me that would have coffee on a night out.
I wouldn't really care if peer pressure just people being into different things.

Sam Hain · 04-02-2019 8:48pm

ArchXStanton wrote: »

The drug problem in my home town is unbelievable, you'd get a bag of coke here easier than the city centre, every pub toilet cistern is coated in vaseline to try deter would be users.

If the toilet cistern is coated in vaseline, I'd say drugs is the least of your problems in that pub.

Tommy Kelly · 04-02-2019 8:49pm

I'm nearly 40 work for big company, van, phone. expenses the lot and I'd take 1 to 2 grams of coke a day. Note I don;t drink.

The place is absolutely flooded with coke and the quality is getting stronger and stronger. No bother get a shot of Peruvian Flake now.

Tommy Kelly · 04-02-2019 9:01pm

The lads gone to Templemore for Garda training, i'd say every 2nd one of them are on it. I know a lad that used to work with me and used to be a half once off another lad every friday evening without fail. He got accepted for the Guards there 3 weeks ago. He'll be some boyo when he gets his stripes.

Does Ireland have a drug problem or not?

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