Coming home? Are you thinking about it?

Suaimhneach · 31-05-2015 10:21pm #1

I've been reading some Generation Immigration stuff on the Irish Times (some of it amazing, some of it embarrassing) and found the Migrant Project which includes info on leaving and returning Ireland.

I know there's a huge mix of reasons why people leave, and stay away, but I'd love to talk to people who are thinking about returning and the pros and cons of both.

For me, I think I'll be ok to secure a job but will definitely take a significant salary cut. But, no money in the world could pay me enough to keep me missing out on friends and family, so that's how I have made the decision now to probably come home in a year or so. My challenge is my partner would prefer to stay, because of the higher standard of living.

Would love to hear thoughts from other people considering the same. Maybe if there's enough interest we should get our own forum, haha. Also apologies if this already exists (I searched!) or this is in the wrong forum!

Tom Dunne · 01-06-2015 4:28am

Yeah, myself and herself have decided we are "on the road home". Maybe not in the immediate term, but almost certainly within the next two years.

I'm living in the Middle East for the past six years and I think it comes to a point where I feel I have achieved as much as I can. Sure, the lifestyle is good, the money is good, the people are great, we have regular visitors and we get home 2-3 times a year, but there is always the longing to go back home for good, a sense that things are really only temporary.

Looking at job websites in Ireland, I would have a reasonably good chance of getting a decent job in Ireland at the moment (I have a fairly good set of skills on my CV that straddle a number of industries). The fact that I will endure a paycut doesn't even come into it - it's a given and not an issue for me.

iusedtoknow · 01-06-2015 2:19pm

I've been gone close to 10 years now and it couldn't be further from my mind. Part of is that Ireland has changed a lot in those 10 years, and I'm unsure if it really is "home" now. TBH, I love the changes that I see in Irish society (especially with the last referendum) but whenever I am back there is something that I can't put my finger on that feels different. Maybe if I took the plunge I wouldn't notice it.

The other thing is that my wife's "home" isn't Ireland - it's Spain. Her mother is widowed but hale and hearty and the same with my own parents. My father is only recently retired and they off to Chile and Peru in November. If we moved back to Europe, at the moment it would make the most sense to move to Spain but for me personally, it would be career suicide..not to mention financial. The wife ironically would probably earn slightly more there than she does here as a doctor.

We recently got granted our American green cards and are now on the way to becoming citizens. I think once we've seen out commitments here on the west coast, we'll be moving further east to make the frequent trips we make to Ireland easier (the 13 hour monster from Dublin to San Francisco is not a pleasant thing to put yourself through a few times a year).

Magico Gonzalez · 01-06-2015 3:13pm

Sometimes I think about it, the fact that it's 21c here in late autumn (almost winter) makes a compelling argument not too!

Depends where you live, with Argentina and I guess South America in general there are always "stability" concerns. The Irish "crisis" was fairly pale in comparison to what has happened here previously. We keep Ireland in the back of our minds as a safety net.

If we have a kid, it's possible that Ireland would become more appealing, right now they wet and grey weather fills me with dread every time I think about moving home.

jester77 · 01-06-2015 3:20pm

15 years gone and can't ever see myself returning. When you live somewhere where things just work (health care, public transport, government, etc) then it is too difficult to give that up. Lower taxes and being close to family would be nice, but the sacrifice is now too big.

keithclancy · 02-06-2015 3:54pm

Went back for 6 months to visit Ireland and didn't like it, only felt at home when I got back to NL.

Zambia · 02-06-2015 4:15pm

No, but we don't know what the future holds.

Mrs OBumble · 02-06-2015 4:25pm

Nothing says "Irish summer" quite like the hailstones we had at the weekend.

Ponster · 02-06-2015 5:05pm

17 years gone. Maybe someday but I realise that it's far from the same country that I left. I'd be looking at a 30% pay-cut so maybe closer to retirement age or if I decide to change career.

sashafierce · 02-06-2015 9:01pm

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wuffly · 03-06-2015 6:27am

We left almost 5 years ago, plan was to travel for a few months then settle in Dubai for two years. Getting work and set up in Dubai took longer than we expected, (it wasn't the best time to move here) but it has been worth it overall. We are now looking at a cut off date of 2020, most likely at least 2-3 more years. I has been an entirely different experience to what I had thought it was going to be. OH is setting up his own business which hopefully will make the move home a lot easier. At the moment I'm the main bread winner but I will need to diversify my skills in next few years to be able to get a decent job at home. I love to travel but its expensive going anywhere from here, its so much more reasonable in Europe and when I'm living at home I won't need to use my leave to visit home. There are a lot of reasons why it can never be home long term(Can't naturalise etc...) I get home pretty often at least once a year if not more so its not that I miss home so much as I am at stage where I am ready to settle make somewhere home and for us that place is Ireland.
Pros:
Buy a house with little or no mortgage
Own our own business
Close to family/friends
Education (Free-ish)
Democratic
Green

Cons
Tax
Price of everything
Job availability for me
Health insurance
Car insurance

Gone West · 03-06-2015 6:36am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

I've been reading some Generation Immigration stuff on the Irish Times (some of it amazing, some of it embarrassing) and found the Migrant Project which includes info on leaving and returning Ireland.

I know there's a huge mix of reasons why people leave, and stay away, but I'd love to talk to people who are thinking about returning and the pros and cons of both.

For me, I think I'll be ok to secure a job but will definitely take a significant salary cut. But, no money in the world could pay me enough to keep me missing out on friends and family, so that's how I have made the decision now to probably come home in a year or so. My challenge is my partner would prefer to stay, because of the higher standard of living.

Would love to hear thoughts from other people considering the same. Maybe if there's enough interest we should get our own forum, haha. Also apologies if this already exists (I searched!) or this is in the wrong forum!

Fair play to you. At some point in the next 2 years I will settle back in Ireland for good.
I've been everywhere, and even though Ireland has it's problems, it's home and I wouldn't settle anywhere else.

Suaimhneach · 03-06-2015 6:55am

Thanks everyone for the replies

Yeah I have to do the San Francisco <-> Dublin 11 hour flight to go home, and that has made it absolutely killer. The time suck + cost is a burden. I've considered trying to find something on the east cost but the weather seems like an insane thing to take on, but then it is literally half the cost and half the time to get home.

I could consider London as a compromise I guess, but I have never really loved it there and it would just feel like more delaying the inevitable I think?

For people who said they're staying away, which is a perfectly legit choice, how do you handle visits home? Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle? I am curious because I find the mix of my "time off" being family&friends visit us/we visit home/there is some small % of time left over for us to travel to be a big burden.

For people planning to go home - what are you practically planning for? I feel like I need to start a list. Find a job, find a place, figure out taxes, move furniture (maybe? or sell it all?), best time of year to move, good enough reasons to delay a move (promotion, or some other reason).

wuffly · 03-06-2015 7:09am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

For people planning to go home - what are you practically planning for? I feel like I need to start a list. Find a job, find a place, figure out taxes, move furniture (maybe? or sell it all?), best time of year to move, good enough reasons to delay a move (promotion, or some other reason).

At the moment we are hoping that the business will be in a position to support us through the move so there won't be an income gap. I have spoken to a few industry people about myself and they are positive but turning it into work I think will be harder. Would start talking to people in the 1yr/6months before the move putting myself out there as available. Practically we are on the lookout for a house not hardcore yet but most likely next year or so. Also looking a buying a small car at home to cut down the massive insurance loading and to have it when we visit home, renting a car with decent insurance is outrageously costly. We would move around this of the year before summer hits Dubai and when the evenings are long at home (I miss long evenings) so we aren't moving in the depths of winter. We have furniture most of which will bring back as we have slowly bought nice stuff and I like to restore/upcycle stuff in my spare time. It would be better value for us to ship than to sell it.

wuffly · 03-06-2015 7:15am

I should have said the reason we are hoping to do it this way is to try and spread the cost of the financial hit over a few years as opposed to an almighty outlay when we get home. For us its a question of when not if so we can go slowly as such..

Undertow · 03-06-2015 8:51am

I'm in the same boat. I've spent 5 years split between Oz and NZ and I'm set to call it a day in this part of the world. One way flight booked home for Christmas. Going to spend the first couple of months of next year travelling (more like escaping the Irish winter!!) and try to get set up in Dublin or the UK in March/April of next year! I think its pretty important for anyone wishing to set up back home after a few years away, to at least head back and set up when the weather is half decent! Otherwise, it would be very tough to deal with I think. The UK is probably a more realistic destination, but that might as well be home when you've lived on the other side of the world for that long! Cant wait.

I think there comes a point in every emigrants life when they just say enough is enough. Personally speaking, I feel as if I've done it all on this side of the world and while it was a great experience, I feel as though the time has come to move on. As one of poster pointed it, it can get pretty lonely not having good friends and family about too. I don't even think the Irish economy is doing all that great, but there seems to be so many people making the move home from Oz and NZ within the last year!

jester77 · 03-06-2015 9:48am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

For people who said they're staying away, which is a perfectly legit choice, how do you handle visits home? Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle? I am curious because I find the mix of my "time off" being family&friends visit us/we visit home/there is some small % of time left over for us to travel to be a big burden.

I live 10 mins from the airport here. It takes me longer to get out of Dublin after arriving than it takes me to get from my house here to Dublin airport. 30 days holiday is standard here, plus the various public holidays. So this makes coming home easy, can come home a few times a year. Plus being so close I could be at home for dinner with my parents this evening if decided I want to leave now and the flight is not full. And my family comes out as well, it's easy for them to get here.

keithclancy · 03-06-2015 1:32pm

Suaimhneach wrote: »

For people who said they're staying away, which is a perfectly legit choice, how do you handle visits home? Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle? I am curious because I find the mix of my "time off" being family&friends visit us/we visit home/there is some small % of time left over for us to travel to be a big burden.

To be honest I think I see some friends/family more often living outside of Ireland than I did when I was living in Ireland.

You find yourself making an effort to visit people and the time is a bit more special.

I work in Germany so I get 30 days vacation days, Public Holidays and also any flextime I build up, also its quite common to take a sabbatical and I can work remotely as well.

Flights wise I have the choice of going from Work 20 minutes on a train directly to the airport in Dusseldorf and then a flight to Dublin, their also opening up a flight to Cork in the near future I hear.

We live in Eindhoven so we can also fly from Eindhoven - Dublin or Amsterdam - Dublin, Amsterdam - Cork as well.

It's pretty well connected, if I really need to get to Ireland the same day I can do that, we keep money aside for family emergencies, as a bonus we have options on our doorstep to hop into the car with the dog and drive anywhere on the continent we like and have one of the best connected Airports in the world which is around 1hr 35 mins on a train that runs every 30 minutes (I find myself taking this for granted now and when we went back for 6 months Irish Public transport was about as useful as a chocolate fireguard)

Also since we live in the Netherlands people come to visit us too, I can't remember anyone I know living in Ireland that wanted to come and visit me in Cork unless they lived abroad anyway :pac:

We don't really have that many Expat friends here , I found that was a trap many Irish/UK/US people fell into, your expat friends are on max 2 year contracts or they get homesick and go back to their home country which in turn causes the same problem for you.

Better to immerse yourself in the local life/people than try to hang on to things from your home country.

Travelling/Holidays, I think I do more Holidays here than when I lived in Ireland simply because there are so many options available to us without the need to get a Ferry or a Flight, we can even pop up to Amsterdam for a weekend and its a little holiday

Magico Gonzalez · 03-06-2015 1:48pm

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Thanks everyone for the replies

For people who said they're staying away, which is a perfectly legit choice, how do you handle visits home? Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle? I am curious because I find the mix of my "time off" being family&friends visit us/we visit home/there is some small % of time left over for us to travel to be a big burden.

14km, 13 hr flight to Europe then a connect to Dublin. I aim to do it every 2 years, with luck someone comes out in the interim. It's expensive given that our currency is useless outside of the country. Luckily we have some assets that would facilitate a return should it ever become a necessity. If you're living somewhere "precarious" a bit of long term planning and contingency planning is essential. Maybe that sounds stressful, but we're adventurous enough people, something in it keeps us stimulated.

I can't complain, my wife spent 10 years doing the same thing from Dublin to B.A. It's a compromise I'm happy to make and my family understand our reasons, try and get a skype in at the weekend although I find it a bit artificial. "Hello...here we are now, talk. Tell me your news!" Can be overwhelming at times.

iusedtoknow · 03-06-2015 2:36pm

Suaimhneach wrote: »

For people who said they're staying away, which is a perfectly legit choice, how do you handle visits home? Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle? I am curious because I find the mix of my "time off" being family&friends visit us/we visit home/there is some small % of time left over for us to travel to be a big burden.

My work is really flexible. I travel back to Europe 7 or 8 times a year and always latch on 4 or 5 days at the end of a trip where I work remotely from my parents place which allows me to visit. Every second trip I take vacation time so that I'm not working but to be honest, even when I am working - i am still out and about. I end up seeing my folks a lot which makes them happy.
I get 5 weeks vacation a year, my wife around the same. We do a full two weeks in Ireland/Spain every year and her mother will usually come over for two weeks - same with my folks.

Because of the nature of my wife's work (she's a doctor) she needs vacations without family as well to decompress. We always go away before a new batch of interns start (we're off to Hawaii next week). Also, if her schedule allows it, she will travel with me to europe for a few days and laze around - I usually go to Paris and Stockholm for work, so she enjoy's it.

As for new lives, we slipped into live in the US pretty easily. Personally, it was nice to be in a country where everyone spoke English. I don't drink so it initially made life a bit harder, but I now have a wide circle of friends where we go off hiking/cycling etc. My wife has made great friends through her work, and we hang out with them as well, with respective partner's.

sashafierce · 03-06-2015 3:20pm

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Magico Gonzalez · 03-06-2015 4:32pm

sashafierce wrote: »

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Conversely the Irish weather was one of the initial triggers for me to start thinking about leaving Ireland.

I bought a dog, a good walk and a chat with the hound soon sorts me out.

iusedtoknow · 03-06-2015 4:36pm

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

I can't complain, my wife spent 10 years doing the same thing from Dublin to B.A. It's a compromise I'm happy to make and my family understand our reasons, try and get a skype in at the weekend although I find it a bit artificial. "Hello...here we are now, talk. Tell me your news!" Can be overwhelming at times.

Hola Porteño! Mi cuñada vive alli!

I know what you mean about Skype - it is so awkward. I get around it by having iMessage chats in the day, so that we do FaceTime etc, it is usually about something specific or a quick catch up with nieces/nephews than anything else. Keeps the awkwardness of the whole thing down.

jiminho · 03-06-2015 10:22pm

sashafierce wrote: »

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Bit of an exaggeration unless you're living very far north

iusedtoknow · 03-06-2015 10:33pm

jiminho wrote: »

Bit of an exaggeration unless you're living very far north

It is awful if you aren't used to it. My sister is Quebec and it took her 2 winters to get used to the relentlessness of it. She's been there 6 years now and hated the weather here in San Francisco when she came for Christmas - it was a balmy 17c for the whole week she was here.

sashafierce · 04-06-2015 4:18am

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clever user name · 04-06-2015 4:50am

Was gone 7 years...UK, Dubai, Singapore and then China. Came back for a year and I just didn't like it. I really don't know why. It felt great to be back and to see everyone, but after 2 months I just wanted to leave again. So now I've been in Thailand for 3 months. Will I ever go back? To be honest I don't think so. I'll visit of course, but that's about it.

Suaimhneach · 04-06-2015 4:55am

iusedtoknow wrote: »

We always go away before a new batch of interns start (we're off to Hawaii next week).

What are the chances, us too! San Jose to Maui - cant wait.

Thanks for all the replies. To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

Interesting skype has become my lifeline to my mam and a few friends, but my husband definitely has that reaction with his family.

I think we'll do the same, go home in a year or so and try make it work in Ireland. If not, look at our options. I cant see myself being happy anywhere else even though I'd really like to.

iusedtoknow · 04-06-2015 5:32am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

What are the chances, us too! San Jose to Maui - cant wait.

Thanks for all the replies. To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

Interesting skype has become my lifeline to my mam and a few friends, but my husband definitely has that reaction with his family.

I think we'll do the same, go home in a year or so and try make it work in Ireland. If not, look at our options. I cant see myself being happy anywhere else even though I'd really like to.

Ha! We're off to the Big Island. Can't wait for a bit of pool time and sightseeing.

On your other point..having lived in a non-english country before - i've seen people survive in ex-pat bubbles, especially in Barcelona.
You can survive without the language by living with foreigners, pointing at things and knowing enough to be polite. But the reality is - people that do that only survive away for so long before they realize there is more to life. It starts feeling really transitory and after a couple of years - they leave, or you stay and watch your friends leave. I saw a few people that I worked with fall into the trap of staying in that bubble - saw a few too many of them descend into alcoholism and drugs etc as there was no reason not to.

I was kinda lucky, i fell into life pretty easily and my group of friends, even ones through work were more on the local side than "expat" side. This was mostly because I fell into my wife's group of friends, but also my own ones, either through work or hobbies were more local. Nothing gets you to learn the language than being yelled at on a football pitch by a bunch of catalans.

ush · 04-06-2015 5:48am

This is home now.

ush · 04-06-2015 5:50am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

Learn the lingo. You are only just existing otherwise. You'll end up dependent on other bitter "expat" p*ssheads. Hate that word "expat". You're an immigrant, deal with it.

Tom Dunne · 04-06-2015 9:50am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

Here in the Middle East, it's a tricky one.

In my job contract (I work in a third-level college) it actually stipulates that in addition to our core subject area, we are also expected to teach the students English (in reality, that means speaking to them in English, enforcing English as the language in the classroom and giving them assignments only in English).

Also in any service industry, the primary language is English. And of course, the locals all have generally good standards of the language, so in the time that I have been here (5+ years), I've learned about three words.

jester77 · 04-06-2015 10:58am

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies. To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

Language is not really an issue. When you are surrounded the whole day by the language you quickly pick it up. It's everywhere, from work, socialising, media,
going shopping, so it's not like you can avoid it. It's a basic requirement for getting by.

Oh and Hawaii is awesome. Make sure and do the road to Hana and a sunset tour on Mauna Kea.

murphaph · 04-06-2015 12:09pm

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Thanks for all the replies. To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

You can't really properly exist in a country where you don't speak the local language. We're building a house this year near Berlin. Tradesmen generally don't speak English. I couldn't imagine building this house without a decent command of German.

keithclancy · 04-06-2015 2:12pm

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

Conversely the Irish weather was one of the initial triggers for me to start thinking about leaving Ireland.

I bought a dog, a good walk and a chat with the hound soon sorts me out.

That was one of my real dislikes with Ireland

I couldn't bring my dog on any public transport.

I couldn't bring my dog into a cafe/pub/restaurant without real research beforehand.

If we went on a trip we had to find a hotel that would allow a dog, there's very very few in Ireland, here in NL it's completely normal to bring your dog with you to a hotel

People just left their dogs run around on the street chasing cars and left their dog sh1t all over the place without picking up after them.

In Cork anyway there are hardly any bins on the beach or around the estates so people just don't bother.

They even had a Doggy Swim Day at the National Swim Center in Eindhoven

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Ftongelreep.nl%2Fnieuws%2Fhondenplons-in-nationaal-zwemcentrum-de-tongelreep.html&edit-text=

Bringing our Dutch dog back to Ireland for 6 months really opened my eyes,

Magico Gonzalez · 04-06-2015 4:37pm

Suaimhneach wrote: »

What are the chances, us too! San Jose to Maui - cant wait.

Thanks for all the replies. To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

Absolutely 100% had to learn the language, family don't speak much English and there is plenty of them. To be honest there is a good number of expats who come down for a year or 2 and don't get to grips with it. I guess they hang out with other expats and locals with English. I am more comfortable with immersion, I spend 90% of my day speaking Spanish now, to the extent that my English has suffered a little. I cherish the Irish connections we have here, but in my experience most of the Irish we've met here (over 30 anyway) are long term immigrants who speak Spanish very well.

The language really opens up so much culturally, there's a good local theatre scene which would be a shame to miss out on. Reading the local media gives you the ability to learn more about your host country. I've been able to take carpentry (a disaster!) classes, cookery classes and even a business start up course in Spanish all of which I would have missed out on with getting to at least an advanced level of Spanish. I would estimate that takes 2 years if you are quick and dedicated, ....more like nearly 3 in my case

Magico Gonzalez · 04-06-2015 4:41pm

keithclancy wrote: »

That was one of my real dislikes with Ireland

I couldn't bring my dog on any public transport.

I couldn't bring my dog into a cafe/pub/restaurant without real research beforehand.

If we went on a trip we had to find a hotel that would allow a dog, there's very very few in Ireland, here in NL it's completely normal to bring your dog with you to a hotel

People just left their dogs run around on the street chasing cars and left their dog sh1t all over the place without picking up after them.

ps. It's usually warm enough here to eat outside, at least for the hardy Irish. 19c today. Locals wrapped up like it's baltic out, I'll be in my short sleeve shirt.

In Cork anyway there are hardly any bins on the beach or around the estates so people just don't bother.

They even had a Doggy Swim Day at the National Swim Center in Eindhoven

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Ftongelreep.nl%2Fnieuws%2Fhondenplons-in-nationaal-zwemcentrum-de-tongelreep.html&edit-text=

Bringing our Dutch dog back to Ireland for 6 months really opened my eyes,

In Argentina they are very dog friendly. Need a bit of improvement in the picking up of the shyte, but they are getting there. We wouldn't bring our dog to a hotel, I wouldn't be mad about a hotel crammed full of dogs, but we do frequently hire apartments that accept hounds and go to cabins or ranches in he countryside which cater for them.

Our slightly demented president recently ruled that "small dogs" are allowed to fly on the national carrier on your lap. Going to test that out this year.

jiminho · 04-06-2015 7:32pm

sashafierce wrote: »

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Ok fair enough. I just want to put it out to people to not let the weather be the factor not to stay in Canada. I live in Alberta and I have friends living in most major cities in the country as well. Even know a few people from Yellowknife. The majority of seasons I've been here have been like this:
Winter: November to March - Cold especially January and February where it can be bitterly cold. Although look at irish weather during winter. Raining and windy. You wrap up warm in Canada and you're grand regardless of the temp.
Spring/Autumn: October/ April / May - You do get four distinct seasons here. Autumn is particularly nice in the Rockies. Although April can still be quite cold same with October they can also be quite warm as well. It was high teens on the last day of October last year.
Summer: June to September - June is a bit hit or miss but I wouldn't says it's cold. Looking at 31 degrees here on Monday and it's been quiet warm the last while. July and August can be very hot but the great thing I found is the days in those two months are consistently great weather. You can plan something for the weekend without fear of rain. And it does rain here, but the thunderstorms tend to happen in the evenings.

To each their own; four distinct seasons or fair weather year round.

CelticRambler · 04-06-2015 8:09pm

Upped and left in 1991 with the intention of getting a few years experience in England before coming home. Finally gave it some serious thought twelve years (one wife and four children) later, but we spent three months in Dublin, did the sums and nothing added up. Also the Ireland of 2003 was way out of line with our family ideals, so we came to France instead.

Another decade later, children are all-growed-up (kind of!) and I've been back, done some interviews and once again done the sums. The figures add up better now, but when all is said and done, I can have the same quality of life here in France (by my standards) if I can get five months work in the year, instead of working full-time with five weeks holiday in Ireland. So I'm staying put for the foreseeable future.

Suaimhneach wrote: »

For people who said they're staying away, which is a perfectly legit choice, how do you handle visits home? Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle?

I'm effectively self-employed (short-term contracts), so can have as much time off as I want. Being geographically closer doesn't make the trip much easier - 4hr drive/train to the airport + check-in + 1.5hr flight: I'm already at half the length of your journey, so I tend to make it a long stay - two weeks minimum, four weeks max. I buy a one-way ticket and decide when to come back based on what's going on with family & friends. (Free parking in France is great!

)

Family&Friends come here too, and we're all on each other's e-mail/text/whatsapp lists, so when the messages are flying back and forth, it doesn't make much difference whether we're all in the same town or in different countries (currently in four different EU countries).

Suaimhneach wrote: »

To the folks who live in non-english speaking languages, do you learn the language or survive without it?

You can survive with out it, but life is so much better when you learn the language. For a start, you vastly improve your chances of getting work! But more importantly, you get to meet people who share your interests, not just your native language, which goes a long way to making it "home".

keithclancy · 04-06-2015 8:24pm

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

In Argentina they are very dog friendly. Need a bit of improvement in the picking up of the shyte, but they are getting there. We wouldn't bring our dog to a hotel, I wouldn't be mad about a hotel crammed full of dogs, but we do frequently hire apartments that accept hounds and go to cabins or ranches in he countryside which cater for them.

Our slightly demented president recently ruled that "small dogs" are allowed to fly on the national carrier on your lap. Going to test that out this year.

https://www.klm.com/travel/gb_en/prepare_for_travel/travel_planning/pets/index.htm

Pets in the cabin
A small cat or dog can be taken into the Economy Class cabin of most KLM flights, and in Business Class on most KLM flights within Europe:

In a suitable pet travel bag with max. dimensions 46 (length) x 28 (width) x 24 (height) cm, or in a hard kennel with max. dimensions 46 (length) x 28 (width) x 20 (height) cm. Your pet must be able to stand up and lay down comfortably.
Total weight of pet + travel bag or kennel may be max. 8 kg (18 lbs).
The kennel must be put under the seat in front of you. It is not allowed to take your pet out of the travel bag or kennel.

Always make a reservation by telephone or through My Trip at least 48 hours in advance. Please note that we have room for a limited number of kennels in the cabin. It is not possible to reserve a seat in the Economy Comfort zone when travelling with your pet in the cabin. Unfortunately it is also not possible to bring a pet in the cabin in Business Class on intercontinental KLM flights, because there is no space for your pet under the seat in front of you.

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

biddywiddy · 04-06-2015 10:25pm

Moved to the US Midwest 2 years ago. We like it here - small college town, near a well-connected airport, proper summers. The winters are harsh here too. Really low temps from Dec - March.

We have no plans to move back to Ireland yet. My OH can apply for citizenship in 2017, so we will probably need to figure out our plans at that stage. Each time we go to Ireland, it feels less and less like home. We miss family and friends, especially if we're not there for big events, but we don't miss the place or the weather. I speak to my family on Skype every weekend (agree that the calls can be tedious, but it makes them happy).

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Do you use your vacation/holiday days? Do you just go home a lot less? Did you make entire new lives and settle? I am curious because I find the mix of my "time off" being family&friends visit us/we visit home/there is some small % of time left over for us to travel to be a big burden.

My OH and I both have 22 vacation days. We've gone home twice a year since moving, which does suck up your holidays and doesn't leave much time for our own (US) trips. Plus a trip home isn't really a holiday. We can't get a direct flight to Ireland from here, and then we try to fit in as many family and friend visits and meet-ups as possible, leaving us exhausted (and in need of a detox!) by the time we get back.

We're moving to the East Coast in the autumn. The huge bonus is a direct flight to Ireland. We hate the one-stop trips we have to take to get home, so we're excited for the drop in price and flight time. The downside is that I will only have 10 vacation days in my new job (though I'm hoping to negotiate paying for a few extra). Two trips to Ireland per year is pretty much off the table now, or will be very difficult to manage, but hopefully family and friends will visit us more.

Suaimhneach · 05-06-2015 4:53am

All these replies are great, so interesting to read. I wonder what's a common skill/attitude/something inherent that the people who are happy to stay away (and do so happily and successfully) are?

Also curious about people who went home and if they regretted it?

I'm really trying to decide what I want to do. I must be mad to leave California (weather! career! lifestyle!) but I cant figure out fitting in here or making friends at all and I'm a really social person who has never struggled with this. Not sure if it's just where we are based (1 hour + from the big city) or if I just truly wanna go home. I have been seriously stuck in a rut about it for months!

Minderbinder · 05-06-2015 6:24am

OP, I lived in Korea for a while and then decided to go back to Ireland. After three weeks at home I regretted my decision. I felt trapped in the same old routine, the same conversations and I was bored out of my mind. Unless you can guarantee a job you shouldn't move back. Even if i was guaranteed a job i wouldn't go back to be honest. the lifestyle is too slow and social life revolves too much around pubs and alcohol.

I'm in china now and i'm addicted to the fast pace of life and the ease at which i can make friends and find opportunities. This summer i'm moving to the UK to start a business. i'll really miss china but i imagine i'll come back at some stage.

i have learned a small bit of chinese but i should have done more.

my main point here is that the first few weeks back in Ireland might be nice but that'll soon wear off and you'll be bored and you'll be pining for freedom and travel and foreign lands.

Crann na Beatha · 05-06-2015 6:28am

This post has been deleted.

CelticRambler · 05-06-2015 7:57am

biddywiddy wrote: »

we try to fit in as many family and friend visits and meet-ups as possible, leaving us exhausted (and in need of a detox!) by the time we get back.

:pac: One of my sons did a solo trip to see the family Ireland last year; his little sister is doing it next month. His advice: don't eat before you go! :eek:

(And don't plan to do anything else in the day after you hook up with the cousins!)

Suaimhneach wrote: »

All these replies are great, so interesting to read. I wonder what's a common skill/attitude/something inherent that the people who are happy to stay away (and do so happily and successfully) are?

Don't know if it's the common link, but for me it was hearing an interview with Ronnie Drew waaaaayyyyyyy back in the 80s. "You can never go home" is what he said (or at least how I remember him saying it) - you change while you're away and the country changes while you're gone.

Suaimhneach wrote: »

I'm a really social person who has never struggled with this. Not sure if it's just where we are based (1 hour + from the big city) or if I just truly wanna go home.

Could be just where you are at the moment. It was similar for me when I was in England - distracted by work and getting married, having children etc, but once the novelty of that had worn off, there was nothing else. It wasn't until we moved to France that I realised that there had even been something missing - but I've been able to replace that bit of Irish life with something at least as good here, and better in many ways.

baker59 · 05-06-2015 10:51am

CelticRambler wrote: »

You can never go home you change while you're away and the country changes while you're gone.

Very much agree with that line.

but I cant figure out fitting in here or making friends at all and I'm a really social person who has never struggled with this.

I don't know if it is used in the States but meetup is a good site for this kind of thing. IMO, not the social groups, I went to one event organised by a group that was entitled "Expats nights out" or something along those lines, it was awful but since I've joined a sports team and it's a great way to meet people.
My advise is to find a group on that site or somewhere else that is based around an activity/sport.

ForEffsSake · 06-06-2015 9:53am

Just thought I'd give you my experience of moving home as there seems to be a lot of people who've had negative ones. Ours (so far!) has been very positive. We lived in London for 11 years so it's a bit different in that culturally, it's not vastly different and there are no language barriers. It's also a quick plane ride away. We settled well there, made lovely friends but after a few years I started to feel really homesick. I'd never considered moving back before that but I think the combination of my older child starting school and having my second child meant that I was really starting to put down roots and was getting more and more permanent.
I realised that if we were ever going to move we'd have to do it before the children got too old. However, it was 2008 and the sh*t hit the fan in Ireland.
Come 2012, we made up our minds to go for it. We knew we would have to accept pay cuts and we would really miss our London friends but it was basically now or never.
I intentionally moved to a town that neither of us were from but was halfway between our families with good links to Dublin, where we both worked. I had schools, childcare (luckily on the school site) and a rental property lined up before we came back.
One thing we found difficult was our dog. It's a very unfriendly place for dogs as regards renting/holidaying. It was a huge barrier to us finding somewhere to rent. Ican't say i blame landlors though. The old 'working dogs' mentality is still there and people don't often take time to socialise and properly train their dogs to live at home. So often the place can be destroyed by them.

Nearly two years on and we've settled really well. My children are loving the school and the freedom I would never have given them in London. It was hard for my eldest at first but he's fine now. Through GAA and school we've made lovely friends and we're currently buying a house. We don't miss the drop in salary at all, London is very expensive so it still feels relatively cheaper here! I love my job but would like to work part-time as I did in London so will try for that.

I feel it was the right decision for us. But we are both Irish which helps massively. We moved to a town where we knew no-one so we made a huge effort to make friends and get involved rather than trying to slot in around existing friends and realising they'd moved on. We can hop in the car and be with family in half an hour. Get to attend all family events - even minor ones that don't warrant a trip home! And it's been lovely catching up with old friends and seeing them for the odd weekend afternoon or Sunday lunch. We love the local town (Maynooth)and as it's a small university town it's got a lovely youthful vibe to it. Some complain about the students but I think they improve a place!

Sorry for the long post but just wanted to put out a positive example. I never want to move again and hope I never have to. Do a bit of research, accept you may have to drop in salary but in our case, we have a better standard of living and our holidays are now our own ðŸ˜€. Also I would strongly advise renting before buying. It got a bit mental here last year again but it seems to have calmed. We paid more than we thought we would have to but I'm glad we rented and had the time to make sure it was the right decision.

Suaimhneach · 07-06-2015 9:47pm

Wow, thanks again everyone for the really considered replies

I dont think there is one true answer for everyone. Some folks love travel and fast pace, some dont. Some love city life and big bucks and some dont. I think it's about finding what's right for you, which is not an easy question to answer.

I think I have a plan. At the end of this year start seriously looking for a job that will 1) be awesome and 2) relocate us, with optional 3) see if my SO can get moved home with his job. We will try living at home for a year, and if we hate it we can look at moving back to the US, or to try London or something. From what everyone here says you tend to know within a few months if home will work for you, or not.

I honestly think it will work out though. My best friend who's been in NY and Toronto for 2+ years is going home in July, and my other friends I've kept in touch with are so excited to have us back. There is a life waiting for us there, just gotta wait a few months for it (for CV reasons, wanna have one year in my most recent promotion on my CV and wanna enjoy a last summer here). Though moving back in December might be a bad move too! Ah, it'll be grand. Will figure it out

Thanks again all.

Was gonna ask if there was any interest in an "immigrants return to Ireland" forum, but I think the majority of the posts were for staying away?

Undertow · 07-06-2015 9:53pm

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Was gonna ask if there was any interest in an "immigrants return to Ireland" forum, but I think the majority of the posts were for staying away?

Yeah thats a great idea! Or have a sticky for it? There seems to be heaps of people considering the move at the moment, especially from the land down under. It would also be good to find out more about how the economy is doing in general, which sectors are on the rise, what opportunites are available etc etc!

Suaimhneach · 07-06-2015 10:28pm

Yeah and very practical things like "can I get an irish driving licence with my american permit?" (no), and "how do I re-register for taxes?" (no idea) and "am I entitled to the dole while I settle in and look for a job?" (probably not cuz you havent paid taxes?) and "I am having regret about leaving, what do I do?" (general reassurance/life experience per this thread?)... if there is more interest I'll request it

Wompa1 · 14-06-2015 8:16pm

Moved to the US 3.5 years ago by myself, to a place where I don't know anybody.

I'm hopefully going to move back in 4 or 5 years. I'm currently working 3 jobs. I plan to save as much money as possible and then return to a rural part of the country and buy a home...hopefully without the need for a mortgage or at least with only getting a small mortgage. Ideally, I would like to keep a job with an American company and work remotely but if I can't, that's fine. I'd like to be in a position in which it doesn't matter if I work in McDonalds..it should still be enough to live comfortably without rent or a mortgage.

I was making a 5th of what I'm making here when I lived back in Galway. I'm under no illusions that I will be make good money when I move back but Ireland has a lot going for it.

Coming home? Are you thinking about it?

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