Man who knocked down burglar in court

The_Thing · 15-02-2012 8:43pm

It's a pity the scumbag wasn't paralysed from the neck down - it'd be kinda hard to enjoy whatever compensation he'd get if all he could ever do was move his head from side to side as if at a tennis match.

hondasam · 15-02-2012 8:47pm

tayto lover wrote: »

1. Not guilty on direction of judge.
2 Not guilty on majority verdict.

Out of curiosity has the burglar changed his ways or is he still involved in crime?

tayto lover · 15-02-2012 8:50pm

hondasam wrote: »

Out of curiosity has the burglar changed his ways or is he still involved in crime?

Has not been caught for anything since but he now has money. Won't last too long though with his "lifestyle".

nlgbbbblth · 15-02-2012 8:56pm

While I accept that the homeowner used excessive force I cannot fathom the suspended sentence for the burglary. Is it a case of "the burglar has been punished enough by having his legs broken"?

People (especially the Gardai) are very fond of saying "you can't take the law into your own hands". If they truly believe that then they should disregard the contribution of the homeowner's actions towards the burglar's "punishment". Instead they should impose a meaningful jail sentence upon the baddie.

Plug · 15-02-2012 8:57pm

Lovely that cheered my day up. The scumbag bastard!

tayto lover · 15-02-2012 8:59pm

It was the judge in the court who gave him the suspended sentence not the gardai. The D.P.P. decided to prosecute the home owner after reading the papers sent by the gardai. I believe that's how it works. I think from looking at the scenes after the verdict the gardai were pleased with it.

Tigger · 15-02-2012 9:04pm

jacquesbernis wrote: »

Bad day of verdicts for the scum.
Still it will not make it any easier tomorrow morning when the alarm goes off and it's time to go to work to pay this reprobate his reward of 175,000 +++..awarded by my better on my behalf.

Was it you?

casandra · 15-02-2012 9:08pm

Not Guilty verdict, Thank God for a sensible jury, BURGLARS BEWARE !! Maybe the civil action can be revisited now - Precedent set ? -a victory for all decent law abiding people.

EASYNEWS · 15-02-2012 9:27pm

Justice.

Mance Rayder · 15-02-2012 9:32pm

gigino wrote: »

this is a S*** country.

Scumbags like that burgular contribute nothing to society.

Unfortunatly as has been pointed out here before, scumbags do in fact contribute alot to the wages of those in the legal profession. It is in their interests (Solicitor/barristers and judges alike) to see that scumbags are released to re-offend. They could easily lock up anyone with over 3 serious convictions for a long long time, but then they would have no clients claiming free legal aid because the scumbags are on the dole. The 'free' legal aid is not free, its paid by the taxpayers, just as the dole is paid to these scumbags who will never work a day in their lives.

It's the money merry-go-round and everybody wins except the public.

benway · 15-02-2012 9:32pm

Corruptable wrote: »

I really think it's time that homeowners organised themselves into a recognisable national lobby to have the Law tilted back in favour of the victim of crime, currently homeowners still run the risk of running foul of legislation such as Occupiers Liability, Non-Fatal Offences, etc.

*ahem* :rolleyes:

Surprised at the verdict, would've thought a conviction and probation or suspended sentence was most likely ... no accounting for a jury of peers. He was hardly ever likely to see the inside of a prison anyway, but sure that's all fine wines, tiddleywinks and brushing up on your French between slopping out, he probably would've enjoyed the break.

Curious as to why the reckless endangerment charge wasn't sent to the jury, will be interesting to see whether the state appeals.

tayto lover wrote: »

Has not been caught for anything since but he now has money. Won't last too long though with his "lifestyle".

You're just pulling this out of your a$$, aren't you?

Vizzy · 15-02-2012 9:38pm

benway wrote: »

You're just pulling this out of your a$$, aren't you?

What ??

Why would he need to do this?

I don't know tayto lover, but if you bothered to read the thread it is fairly apparent that he knows both the victim(i.e the householder) and the scumbag in this case.Do you ?

tayto lover · 15-02-2012 9:38pm

benway wrote: »

*ahem* :rolleyes:

Surprised at the verdict, would've thought a conviction and probation or suspended sentence was most likely ... no accounting for a jury of peers. He was hardly ever likely to see the inside of a prison anyway, but sure that's all fine wines, tiddleywinks and brushing up on your French between slopping out, he probably would've enjoyed the break.

Curious as to why the reckless endangerment charge wasn't sent to the jury, will be interesting to see whether the state appeals.

You're just pulling this out of your a$$, aren't you?

No. Watch this space. I know him well enough. He will re-appear in time. Leopards and spots like.

zenno · 15-02-2012 9:40pm

That's good news. now it's time to see whether this man want's to counter-sue the scumbag.

benway · 15-02-2012 9:43pm

tayto lover wrote: »

No. Watch this space. I know him well enough. He will re-appear in time. Leopards and spots like.

Fair enough, just wondering.

hollypink · 15-02-2012 9:47pm

benway wrote: »

*ahem* :rolleyes:

Surprised at the verdict, would've thought a conviction and probation or suspended sentence was most likely ... no accounting for a jury of peers.

I was a bit surprised too but from the rte article, it sounds like the defense barrister did a good job of casting doubt on the reliability of the witnesses, one of whom said the defendant was drunk but couldnt explain why he didnt say that to the gardai at the time. The cctv also showed the burglar was in the house longer than he had said.

Mance Rayder · 15-02-2012 9:54pm

benway wrote: »

Of course, three strikes worked so well in the States that their crime rates are still exponentially higher than ours? Murder rate is a couple of thousand times higher?

2 points

*There are over 313022060 people in the USA,
There are only 4581269 in the Republic of Ireland.

* They sell guns in corner shops in the US, They don't in Ireland.

Maybe these facts have something to do with the much higher murder rates in USA?

Just a thought.....

zeds dead · 15-02-2012 10:08pm

My name is URL wrote: »

He was an idiot to go after the burglar. Why? Because he's now on trial for it and stands to be punished more severely than the burglar himself. It doesn't matter if people agree with it or not, that's the law. You're allowed to protect yourself and your home, but chasing and driving over somebody twice is plain fcuking stupid when you know you're going to be done for it.

Well...maybe then if the idiot as you call him said he too was also drunk, and that was why he hit him twice, then he surly would get away with it....oh no wait..the idiot was a honest decent chap who had scum bag invade his property and reacted on anger as most normal people would do.....but you see this man as an idiot and fcuking stupid....pot calling the kettle black here!!

ash23 · 15-02-2012 10:10pm

Jaysoose wrote: »

Do you have any proof of this or are you making up more "facts".

I never stated anything as fact but thanks for more passive agressive drivel.

As I said in my previous posts the Irish Times reported that when the gardai arrived the guys shin bone was broken through the skin ergo scars :rolleyes:

AudreyHepburn · 15-02-2012 10:14pm

man.about.town wrote: »

typical, you believe the scum, whats wrong with you??? what about the other witness who said he was making tea and saw the whole thing, said it was an accident, he was trying to block him, after he knocked him down he looked distraught and non threatening?

Nothing wrong with me at all thanks!

Read the article I linked to and you'll see.

I repeat, ramming some-one twice with a vehicle and threatening to kill the person if they move goes beyond self defense or defense of your home and loved ones.

benway · 15-02-2012 10:16pm

Robbery, extortion and hijacking offences in Ireland: 55.35 per 100,000
Larceny-theft in the United States: 2,060.9 per 100,000

Both figures are for 2009. Data has slightly different titles, but measures pretty much the same thing.

Incarceration rate in Ireland: 95 per 100,000 (2011)
Incarceration rate in the United States: 743 per 100,000 (2009)

Long prison sentences are really helping, obviously.

Spudmonkey · 15-02-2012 10:17pm

Maybe that scumbag will pay back his free legal fees with his windfall.

Callan57 · 15-02-2012 10:21pm

Thankfully there was a jury with a bit of cop on in Dundalk

Ace2007 · 15-02-2012 10:24pm

Spudmonkey wrote: »

Maybe that scumbag will pay back his free legal fees with his windfall.

I wonder if the same people here will agree with the justice system when the bankers walk free. or will it be different then?

If you followed the case, you would see the judge internvened in the charges twice, first he directed the jury on one charge to find him not guilty, and then when they couldn't agree on the second charge, he told them he would accept the majority. Had he not internvened there probably wouldn't have been a verdict yet.

AudreyHepburn · 15-02-2012 10:27pm

casandra wrote: »

Not Guilty verdict, Thank God for a sensible jury, BURGLARS BEWARE !! Maybe the civil action can be revisited now - Precedent set ? -a victory for all decent law abiding people.

I sincerely hope not. This is exactly the kind of attitude we don't need.

Do we really want to live in a country where you can seriously injure or kill some-one and get away with it?

benway · 15-02-2012 10:31pm

PickledLime wrote: »

Sign of the times.

I'm getting sick and tired of seeing this scum walking around like they own the place while the rest of us struggle to get by. They have everything they want for no effort, they'll happily tread on other people's toes to get their own way, but cry foul as soon as someone looks at them the wrong way.

There's no disincentive to committing crime. Slap on the hand, couple months behind bars in a medium security, maximum comfort prison. I know if i was one of these career criminals i'd be put off breaking into a house knowing that the owner was allowed to stick a knife in me than go to holiday camp prison for a few months.

Most of these morons only understand violence anyway.

You
rang?

Spudmonkey · 15-02-2012 10:44pm

Ace2007 wrote: »

I wonder if the same people here will agree with the justice system when the bankers walk free. or will it be different then?

If you followed the case, you would see the judge internvened in the charges twice, first he directed the jury on one charge to find him not guilty, and then when they couldn't agree on the second charge, he told them he would accept the majority. Had he not internvened there probably wouldn't have been a verdict yet.

What have bankers got to do with anything? Who awarded him the decision in the first place?

benway · 15-02-2012 10:51pm

Spudmonkey wrote: »

What have bankers got to do with anything?

For me, I find the level of vitriol and plain hatred towards petty criminals and "scumbags" goes way, way beyond anything I've seen towards the people who actually, y'know, ruined this country.

Like, a "scumbag" will rob stuff out of your house, a banker robs your entire house. For all the harm done by petty crime, our national debt now stands at around €400,000 per person.

Although part of me does think it's kinda funny that a property developer can run a guy down with his Merc and be applauded for it, after everything that's happened.

Stark · 15-02-2012 10:54pm

For all "bankers" (I think the counter staff in TSB are lovely personally) have done, I know I never have to worry about waking up in the middle of the night and finding Sean Fitzpatrick holding a knife to my throat so he can borrow my car keys to take my car for a drive. For the victims, the toll scumbags inflict goes way beyond paying a few percent extra on one's tax bill.

Spudmonkey · 15-02-2012 10:57pm

benway wrote: »

For me, I find the level of vitriol and plain hatred towards petty criminals and "scumbags" goes way, way beyond anything I've seen towards the people who actually, y'know, ruined this country.

Like, a "scumbag" will rob stuff out of your house, a banker robs your entire house. For all the harm done by petty crime, our national debt now stands at around €400,000 per person.

Although part of me does think it's kinda funny that a property developer can run a guy down with his Merc and be applauded for it, after everything that's happened.

The two are not mutually exclusive. One doesn't excuse the other so I fail to see how vilifying one does exactly that.

jluv · 15-02-2012 10:59pm

benway wrote: »

For me, I find the level of vitriol and plain hatred towards petty criminals and "scumbags" goes way, way beyond anything I've seen towards the people who actually, y'know, ruined this country.

Like, a "scumbag" will rob stuff out of your house, a banker robs your entire house. For all the harm done by petty crime, our national debt now stands at around €400,000 per person.

Although part of me does think it's kinda funny that a property developer can run a guy down with his Merc and be applauded for it, after everything that's happened.

The banker is not in my bedroom with my kids asleep next door.He is someone I get to deal with in the cold light of day when I am wide awake..

benway · 15-02-2012 11:00pm

Stark wrote: »

For all "bankers" (I think the counter staff in TSB are lovely personally) have done, I know I never have to worry about waking up in the middle of the night and finding Sean Fitzpatrick holding a knife to my throat so he can borrow my car keys to take my car for a drive. For the victims, the toll scumbags inflict goes way beyond paying a few percent extra on one's tax bill.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I will never resent the petty thieves and so-called "scumbags" as much as I resent the children of privilege who've bent us all over a barrel and are crudely a$$f*cking every single one of us. And having the cheek to make us buy our own KY. Funny that I apparently owe €400k personally after Celtic Tiger excesses ... don't ever recall it having been lodged to my account. In fact, it seems like plain larceny to me.

For the victims, whose best friends and children are forced to emigrate, who are forced into indignity, unemployment and punery, I'd say the toll is every bit as bad as anything your "scumbags" can manage, probably worse.

jluv · 15-02-2012 11:09pm

benway wrote: »

We'll have to agree to disagree. I will never resent the petty thieves and so-called "scumbags" as much as I resent the children of privilege who've bent us all over a barrel and are crudely a$$f*cking every single one of us. And having the cheek to make us buy our own KY. Funny that I apparently owe €400k personally after Celtic Tiger excesses ... don't ever recall it having been lodged to my account. In fact, it seems like plain larceny to me.

For the victims, whose best friends and children are forced to emigrate, who are forced into indignity, unemployment and punery, I'd say the toll is every bit as bad as anything your "scumbags" can manage, probably worse.

Don't even know where you are going with this!.The amount stolen,the amount made by the VICTIM in whatever employment does not justify anyone breaking into his home while his family slept. His reaction would have nothing to do with whether the person invading his home was a "scumbag" or one of your best friends and children who are hard done by. Totally off the topic and back to the Woe is me that is so prevelent at the moment...

Sunnyisland · 15-02-2012 11:18pm

Delighted for the victim as in the householder.

benway · 15-02-2012 11:27pm

jluv wrote: »

Don't even know where you are going with this!

Seems like.

I just find the level of bile against lower-class "scumbags" to be wildly disproportionate to the damage they do, by comparison with upper-class "scumbags". Seems to me that we're hating the wrong people.

Would people be a quarter as outraged by a story of yet another family losing their home through no real fault of their own? But you're right, off topic, neither time nor place - just the very idea of the developer being applauded for running a guy down in his Merc got me to thinking.

Hasten to add that I'm not suggesting for a second that McCaughey was ever involved in dirt or anything dodgy ...

jluv · 15-02-2012 11:35pm

benway wrote: »

Seems like.

I just find the level of bile against lower-class "scumbags" to be wildly disproportionate to the damage they do, by comparison with upper-class "scumbags". Seems to me that we're hating the wrong people.

Would people be a quarter as outraged by a story of yet another family losing their home through no real fault of their own? But you're right, off topic, neither time nor place - just the very idea of the developer being applauded for running a guy down in his Merc got me to thinking.

Hasten to add that I'm not suggesting for a second that McCaughey was ever involved in dirt or anything dodgy ...

But we were only discussing the "scumbag" in relation to the case being debated. Another thread for the bankers yeah?....

Tigger · 15-02-2012 11:42pm

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I sincerely hope not. This is exactly the kind of attitude we don't need.

Do we really want to live in a country where you can seriously injure or kill some-one and get away with it?

not "someone" only people that break into your house

Yakult · 16-02-2012 1:47am

At least they had some common sense not to charge this man. I say a BIG fair play to him and if you are a criminal reading this, watch out cos I will run you the **** down if you come into my house. Might not be so lucky to survive tho. Lowlifes.

Jo King · 16-02-2012 2:23am

Ace2007 wrote: »

I wonder if the same people here will agree with the justice system when the bankers walk free. or will it be different then?

If you followed the case, you would see the judge internvened in the charges twice, first he directed the jury on one charge to find him not guilty, and then when they couldn't agree on the second charge, he told them he would accept the majority. Had he not internvened there probably wouldn't have been a verdict yet.

A majority verdict only applies to a finding of guilty. It made no difference to finding him not guilty. A majority verdict simply means that 10 members are enough to convict rather than all members. Since there never was more than 10
going to convict allowing a majority verdict made no difference.

nice_very · 16-02-2012 2:36am

could he (the householder) now sue the scumbag for stress etc, given that he has had to pay the scum 175,000 in the other case??

I would hope so, and I would hope it would be a unanimous verdict for the householder

steve9859 · 16-02-2012 8:57am

Just seem the morning papers. Great news!

greendom · 16-02-2012 9:11am

So the state sanctions the committal of violence on its citizens - sad sad day.

Dunny · 16-02-2012 9:19am

greendom wrote: »

So the state sanctions the committal of violence on its citizens - sad sad day.

Pfft, it sanctions the commital of a scumbag going into a persons house and BEDROOM WHILE THEY SLEEP and give him 175grand in damages! It was also mentioned he is a repeat offender ffs, how anyone can stand up for this guy is beyond me.

Aye he's a victim of the state alright.

greendom · 16-02-2012 9:21am

Dunny! wrote: »

Pfft, it sanctions the commital of a scumbag going into a persons house and BEDROOM WHILE THEY SLEEP and give him 175grand in damages!

Aye he's a victim of the state alright.

Yes he's a low life and tbh I don't give a toss about him. It's the precedent that has been set that worries me.

Sunnyisland · 16-02-2012 9:33am

greendom wrote: »

Yes he's a low life and tbh I don't give a toss about him. It's the precedent that has been set that worries me.

IMO no precedent has been set, on the contrary it shows that you cant take the law into your own hands or you will/can be charged,The jury saw that this was a heat in the moment reaction and could understand and maybe relate to that.

On a different note that money the burglar got should not have been paid,To me its saying crime pays,what about the stress & fear to the householders wife & children in having the likes of that creeping around your bedrooms, will they be compensated ? :mad:

Wibbs · 16-02-2012 9:38am

Should the householder have pursued this muppet and run him down after said muppet had left the scene? No. IMHO he went wayyy over the line. Should said muppet get compensation? No, not beyond free medical care. Should this muppet have been on the streets after repeat offences like so many of these scumbags? No +1000. If we had something approaching a decent justice and rehab system in this country said scumbag would have been a lot less likely to have been in this guys house in the first place and wouldn't be walking with a limp today.

Freddie59 · 16-02-2012 9:38am

realies wrote: »

IMO no precedent has been set, on the contrary it shows that you cant take the law into your own hands or you will/can be charged,The jury saw that this was a heat in the moment reaction and could understand and maybe relate to that.

On a different note that money the burglar got should not have been paid,To me its saying crime pays,what about the stress & fear to the householders wife & children in having the likes of that creeping around your bedrooms, will they be compensated ? :mad:

Delighted to see tis gent acquitted. I was astonished to learn that the burglar had won €170k in damages in a civil case.:eek: The law should be changed to allow the householder to counter sue for the trauma caused by this home invasion.

Freddie59 · 16-02-2012 9:39am

benway wrote: »

Seems like.

I just find the level of bile against lower-class "scumbags" to be wildly disproportionate to the damage they do, by comparison with upper-class "scumbags". Seems to me that we're hating the wrong people.

Excuse me? FFS.:mad:

AudreyHepburn · 16-02-2012 9:51am

Tigger wrote: »

not "someone" only people that break into your house

Well you are of course entitled to your opinions but I don't see how maiming a criminal makes you any better than them.

16-02-2012 9:59am

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Well you are of course entitled to your opinions but I don't see how maiming a criminal makes you any better than them.

Don't you see?!

Working class idiot stuck in a perpetual state of no education and no hope in life; robs someone's house = scum who deserves to die.

Suit who runs over another person while blinded by vengeance = productive member of society who does not deserve to be charged, but instead needs a medal.

Man who knocked down burglar in court

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