Journalism and cycling

zell12 · 19-02-2019 3:14pm

Liveline callers criticising RSA ads on motorist road deaths, now
apparently too graphic

CramCycle · 19-02-2019 3:46pm

zell12 wrote: »

Liveline callers criticising RSA ads on motorist road deaths, now
apparently too graphic

I actually thought it was a great ad and only graphic in how it brought the point home. The father who lost his wife and child, christ of almighty that packed a punch to the gut but like everything, i doubt it made one iota of difference to a poor drivers behaviour.

Cetyl Palmitate · 19-02-2019 3:49pm

https://castbox.fm/vb/129372650

https://open.spotify.com/episode/1jCg3Ma8NckFE4HnKsR2Mz?si=hCMWCNgcSFykU-TPqi019Q

Interesting podcast on the history of infrastructure funding.
It contains some interesting details on the powerful US cycling lobby of the 19th century, the league of American wheelmen, being overtaken by the motorcar lobby of the early 20th century.
Also contains a history of policy making differences in post war Europe and USA.

zell12 · 19-02-2019 3:49pm

RSA CEO Moya Murdock currently live on Liveline

Fian · 19-02-2019 4:18pm

zell12 wrote: »

RSA CEO Moya Murdock currently live on Liveline

And what did she say?

Muahahaha · 19-02-2019 4:51pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Possibly the word "audit" creates that impression, whereas if she had said "Look will ya check that your brakes are working and your trouser leg isn't going to catch in your chain" it might have been less of a big deal.

I think its just the usual 'elf and safety gone overboard. Its similar with motorbiking, anyone gone through the biking tests will remember learning the acronym Powder BC which is an eight point check of petrol, oil, water, damage, electrics, rubber, brakes and cables that you are told to do every time before you get on the motorbike. I seriously doubt anyone actually does it but you have to know it to pass the test.

Anyway I thought the program last night was decent enough. Also I was surprised to learn that it is not just a one off feature as I thought but its actually a series of four programs. That's a fair undertaking by RTE on the subject of cycling/vulnerable road users, they are giving it the attention it needs so kudos where its deserved. Hopefully over the four programs it will finally provide some balance to the way the likes of Newstalk cover cycling knowing well their audience is all motorists stuck in evening traffic.

Corca Baiscinn · 19-02-2019 5:53pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

Overall it was a good program and certainly made me very envious of people who cycle in Copenhagen!

Yea, by end of Programme 4 we'll all have decamped to Copenhagen, Seville, Eindhoven and Amsterdam but sure with only a quarter of us in each city, we can sneak in and they wont really notice!

magicbastarder · 19-02-2019 6:18pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

Anyway I thought the program last night was decent enough.

agreed, and as it was more than just the motorists vs. cyclists stuff, e.g. talking to leisure cyclists who use it for health and social benefits, it helps normalise cycling.

the only issue i have with the program is that those likely to benefit most from it are probably those least likely to watch it.

07Lapierre · 19-02-2019 6:30pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Yea, by end of Programme 4 we'll all have decamped to Copenhagen, Seville, Eindhoven and Amsterdam but sure with only a quarter of us in each city, we can sneak in and they wont really notice!

What really struck me was how Normal cycling in Copenhagen is! No helmets, No Hi-Viz, Young, Old, Male, Female, Kids on bikes, Kids in cargo bikes etc. etc.....everyone cycles!

the key points from the programme for me were:

1. There has to be a will/desire from the general public to make change happen.
2. Segregated cycle ways that keep interaction between Bikes and cars to a minimum.
3. where there is interaction, bikes are given their own traffic lights, priorities etc.
4. Enforcement! Enforcement of the ROTR for cyclists, motorists and pedestrians.

We've a long way to go.

Also. What i didn't like was....why do people in Copenhagen ride such crappy looking bikes!

secman · 19-02-2019 6:46pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

Also. What i didn't like was....why do people in Copenhagen ride such crappy looking bikes!

All shapes and sizes, both bikes and riders, odd looking handlebars, long coats draping down over back wheels , civvy clothes, no helmet, no highviz, weird looking bunch, and 10kph !
Not real cyclists

Muahahaha · 19-02-2019 7:31pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

the only issue i have with the program is that those likely to benefit most from it are probably those least likely to watch it.

yeah thats a fair point, those with entranched views against cyclists are not likely to watch a program showing them a different viewpoint. Public broadcasting like this can only bring the horse to the water at the end of the day but it is better than nothing. And by doing a series of four programs instead of one at least they are covering it in depth rather than packing all issues into a rushed 30 minutes. And it provides some balance to the otherwise motor-centric type of cycling coverage we see every week so that can be no bad thing imo.

Corca Baiscinn · 19-02-2019 8:20pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

yeah thats a fair point, those with entranched views against cyclists are not likely to watch a program showing them a different viewpoint. Public broadcasting like this can only bring the horse to the water at the end of the day but it is better than nothing. And by doing a series of four programs instead of one at least they are covering it in depth rather than packing all issues into a rushed 30 minutes. And it provides some balance to the otherwise motor-centric type of cycling coverage we see every week so that can be no bad thing imo.

Fair enough as change only comes when there are votes in it so we do need to get people on board but I hope the powers that be were or will be watching it too because providing for cycling would tick a lot of boxes for urban living. More cycling would make urban areas more attractive, relieve congestion, reduce noise and pollution, help to tackle transport emissions, be cheaper than car spaces so shouldn't Pascal and Leo be all over it!

I saw a reply to Ciaran Cannon somewhere online though when he was asked why progress was so slow and in effect he said it was because there were not enough people making their voices heard on the streets. I was reminded of that the other day when I saw a photo, in a guide book funnily enough, of one of the many cycling demonstrations in Amsterdam in the 70's.

Whenever there's discussion on a protest in this forum, some people attend, some say they'd like to but can't and others say "What do they mean having it at 5 o' clock, 1 o' clock, on a Sunday" etc?

Cycling Campaigns are trying to build on the #ibikeivote meme used in the 2 Referenda for the Local, European (and who knows GE) Elections in May so even if we can't take to the streets we could ask the candidates on our doorsteps if they're supportive of provision for cycling

Seth Brundle · 19-02-2019 9:51pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

maybe it's something to do with the fact that to install/maintain CCTV, you need a licence - perhaps CCTV footage from a licenced system carries more credibility than a dashcam?

Are you sure that one needs a licence to install and maintain cctv?

rubadub · 19-02-2019 10:03pm

just found this

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/evidence/real_evidence.html

Information
Real evidence is material, tangible evidence such as an object, a tape recording, a computer printout or a photograph. Real evidence does not usually stand alone. The court will normally hear evidence from a witness (often an expert witness) explaining the significance or the relevance of the real evidence.

Some examples of real evidence are covered in this document.

Photographs
Since 1864, photographs have been admissible in evidence. Photographs can be introduced as evidence of what they depict. For example, in a murder trial, photographs may be introduced as evidence of the position and state that the deceased's body was in when it was found.

In order for a photograph to be admitted in evidence, it is first necessary to prove its authenticity. The photographer must prove that he or she took the photograph and the person who has processed the photograph must also give a statement that the photograph is untouched.

For a photograph to be admitted in evidence, the person who took the photograph does not need to be a professional photographer. For example, in a civil case, photographs that you have taken of damage done to your car in a road traffic accident will be admissible (as long as you are available to give evidence in court about when and how you took them).

Video recordings
Increasingly, incidents or crimes are being captured and recorded on video or CCTV (Closed Circuit Television) recorders. Such recordings are accepted by the courts in Ireland as being real evidence. Indeed, where evidence of a crime is caught on a street or shop camera, there is a duty on the Gardao seize and retain the recording for a reasonable time, even if they do not intend to use the recording as part of the prosecution case.

In order to use video/tape recordings as evidence, the prosecution must prove that the tape or video recording is authentic or genuine. The prosecution must explain how and why the recording was made and who had control of the recording afterwards.

The defence may object on these grounds and it will then be a matter for the judge to decide whether or not to allow the recording to be put to the jury.

If the Gardaecide not to use a recording (seized during the investigation) as evidence at the trial, the prosecution or Gardare under a duty to notify the defence of the existence of the recording. They are are also required to give advance notice of their intention to destroy it. The reason for this is that although the recording may not be of any use to the prosecution, the recording may assist the accused in proving that he/she was not at the scene of the crime.

While there is a duty on the Gardao collect video evidence, they do not have to go to extreme lengths to do so. For example, it would not be necessary for the Gardao collect every piece of video evidence on O’Connell Street in Dublin if there was a theft from a shop on the street.

what_traffic · 19-02-2019 11:37pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

I saw a reply to Ciaran Cannon somewhere online though when he was asked why progress was so slow and in effect he said it was because there were not enough people making their voices heard on the streets. I was reminded of that the other day when I saw a photo, in a guide book funnily enough, of one of the many cycling demonstrations in Amsterdam in the 70's.

Was in response to the Galway Cycling Bus.

https://twitter.com/cycle_bus/status/1097549382965252097

what_traffic · 19-02-2019 11:39pm

what_traffic wrote: »

Was in response to the Galway Cycling Bus.

https://twitter.com/cycle_bus/status/1097549382965252097

@ciarancannon

Galway could become the template for all other Irish cities in developing proper cycling infrastructure.

Galway School Cycle Bus
‏

It certainly could. All it requires is political will and ambition.

@ciarancannon

That’s a start, but it also requires massive momentum from the ground up, led by community activists who are unrelenting in their determination to make change happen. Politicians respond to pressure, always have, always will.

Cookie_Monster · 20-02-2019 1:36am

4 abreast :eek:

Idleater · 20-02-2019 8:39am

07Lapierre wrote: »

What really struck me was how Normal cycling in Copenhagen is!

If you're ever there, it's terrible as a pedestrian with all those bikes!

magicbastarder · 20-02-2019 10:39am

going a bit meta; journalism about journalism about cycling:

Now You See Me: When cyclists and motorists collide
Review: In RTÉ’s new road safety magazine show, do cyclists or motorists have to give an inch?

The laziest answer to road safety concerns is always a matter of visibility. If only every cyclist wore a luminous hi-vis vest, an array of front and back lights and, preferably, a motorised steel and glass casing with two extra wheels, then, finally, there would be peace and harmony on the roads, goes one argument, entirely from the motorist’s perspective.

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/now-you-see-me-when-cyclists-and-motorists-collide-1.3799047

Chips Lovell · 20-02-2019 10:49am

Later episodes promise to follow Delaney, always an amiable presence, as he mounts the experience of two-wheeled transport in the city. It can be hairy, as we see in ample evidence of flung-open car doors, lane-cutting van swerves, and lycra-swaddled macho racers.

No, no, please don't. We've had more than enough of these "let's put someone who doesn't cycle on a bike to see what it's really like cycling in Dublin" pieces.

It's like putting a first-time driver in a car and saying that's what it's like driving in Dublin. You're stressed out to f**k, you're sweating bullets, and you think the entire journey is a series of hazards to be avoided.

But I guess filming an ordinary cyclist commuting isn't going to make for good TV.

Steoller · 20-02-2019 11:15am

Idleater wrote: »

If you're ever there, it's terrible as a pedestrian with all those bikes!

No it's not. The footpaths are wide and flat, and public transport is widely available and frequent.

Amsterdam is a little harder to negotiate as a pedestrian because some of the canalside footpaths are narrow, but I had no issues in Copenhagen as a pedestrian.

droidus · 20-02-2019 11:24am

magicbastarder wrote: »

going a bit meta; journalism about journalism about cycling:

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/now-you-see-me-when-cyclists-and-motorists-collide-1.3799047

(Personally speaking, as a driver, my biggest aggravation is other drivers; as a cyclist, it’s other cyclists... Hell is other road users.)

Any cyclist who claims that other cyclists are his biggest problem... obviously doesn't cycle much.

Duckjob · 20-02-2019 11:41am

I thought the Now You See Me episode on monday wasn't bad at all. For me, it correctly put strong emphasis on the need for proper infrastructure to create a safe environment for people to cycle.

- Good infrastructure means more people take to cycling
- more people taking to cycling means cycling becomes more normalised.
- cycling more normalised means driver behaviour towards people on bikes automatically improves, since more and more drivers either cycle themselves or have family/friends cycling.

IMO, "driver education" is a part, but only a smallish part of the overall cyclist safety issue. If your cycling infrastructure relies something like 95% (as ours probably does) on drivers having kind thoughts and actions towards cyclists, then you've got a big problem (as we do now) In fact, that percentage should be the other way around - when people are travelling on bikes, what drivers think of them should be totally irrelevant from a safety point of view at least 95% of the time.

Hurrache · 20-02-2019 12:12pm

Journalism, albeit over a century ago. A thread on why women who cycle with go to hell. Some amusing reasons as to why women shouldn't be allowed near a bike in the thread.
https://twitter.com/jodyrosen/status/1096774333408657408

Idleater · 20-02-2019 1:16pm

Steoller wrote: »

No it's not. The footpaths are wide and flat, and public transport is widely available and frequent.

Amsterdam is a little harder to negotiate as a pedestrian because some of the canalside footpaths are narrow, but I had no issues in Copenhagen as a pedestrian.

The comment was in jest about the prolific bicycle use, I've posted my pictures of footpads and pedestrian crossings with maybe 1m between abandoned (parked) bikes.

Copenhagen has its share of narrow streets and canals, just as Amsterdam has its share of wide ones.

Off topic anyway, i have had no trouble in either country, nor here, and have most likely fallen foul of not including the :rolleyes:

xckjoo · 20-02-2019 1:31pm

Hurrache wrote: »

Journalism, albeit over a century ago. A thread on why women who cycle with go to hell. Some amusing reasons as to why women shouldn't be allowed near a bike in the thread.
https://twitter.com/jodyrosen/status/1096774333408657408

Don't see many tandem bikes around these days so maybe they were successful in their campaign

Macy0161 · 20-02-2019 1:35pm

I'm hoping to watch the show this evening. Probably wishful thinking they'd look at why sometimes we don't use the "perfectly good" cycle lanes that cede priority at junctions or dump you in a crap position at junctions (or both); the quality of the surface; up and down at every driveway; because of how they interact with pedestrians/ bus stops etc etc.

RHJ · 20-02-2019 2:02pm

Honestly, I can't see the Irish government on its own taking the measures necessary to implement the proper cycling infrastructure perhaps it will need to be forced on us by the EU somehow.

One action that could be taken straight away is dropping the requirement of developers to provide car parking spaces in residential apartment blocks this could, in turn, lead to more people having to the cycle or use public transport and thus increase the pressure on local politicians in Dublin to provide the necessary infrastructure.

It was an ok documentary looking forward to seeing the rest.

Grassey · 20-02-2019 3:21pm

RHJ wrote: »

One action that could be taken straight away is dropping the requirement of developers to provide car parking spaces in residential apartment blocks this could, in turn, lead to more people having to the cycle or use public transport and thus increase the pressure on local politicians in Dublin to provide the necessary infrastructure.

But... but... but... how would people be able to get to Howth/Glendalough etc in their weekend vehicles then :rolleyes:

RHJ · 20-02-2019 3:25pm

Grassey wrote: »

But... but... but... how would people be able to get to Howth/Glendalough etc in their weekend vehicles then :rolleyes:

I know imagine people's horror at having to rent a car either for the day or by the hour surely that must be a breach of one of their human rights lol

mr spuckler · 20-02-2019 3:27pm

RHJ wrote: »

I know imagine people's horror at having to rent a car either for the day or by the hour surely that must be a breach of one of their human rights lol

or just get the bus / DART in the case of Howth...

monument · 20-02-2019 3:45pm

secman wrote: »

All shapes and sizes, both bikes and riders, odd looking handlebars, long coats draping down over back wheels , civvy clothes, no helmet, no highviz, weird looking bunch, and 10kph !
Not real cyclists

The average km/h of cyclists in Denmark and the Netherlands is comparable to that of cyclists in Ireland.

Last year while with a group on a cycling study tour in Amsterdam our guided at the time talked about the lower speeds but there were mothers zooming by on electric cargo bikes. I didn’t want to chalange her but later in the day I did a few tests with my phone’s GPS and found Dutch couples cycling on front of us at at 20km/h on up right bikes and chatting away. An engineer we were with at that stage confirmed that Dutch people don’t actually all cycle real slowly.

I think part of it is seeing people cycling upright and thinking that’s slow.

Mickiemcfist · 20-02-2019 4:21pm

RHJ wrote: »

One action that could be taken straight away is dropping the requirement of developers to provide car parking spaces in residential apartment blocks this could, in turn, lead to more people having to the cycle or use public transport and thus increase the pressure on local politicians in Dublin to provide the necessary infrastructure.

They removed that requirement in locations with transport links last year.
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/building-height-restrictions-in-towns-and-cities-lifted-37604346.html

JMcL · 20-02-2019 6:01pm

Grassey wrote: »

But... but... but... how would people be able to get to Howth/Glendalough etc in their weekend vehicles then :rolleyes:

Or more to the point, drive into town every weekend to collect the 65" TV, American fridge or whatever enormous appliance that they have to have driving access to the shop door for at that moment in time. Would that mean they'd have to get it delivered? The horror!

RHJ · 20-02-2019 6:05pm

JMcL wrote: »

Or more to the point, drive into town every weekend to collect the 65" TV, American fridge or whatever enormous appliance that they have to have driving access to the shop door for at that moment in time. Would that mean they'd have to get it delivered? The horror!

Slightly off Topic but just curious would many new apartment buildings have lifts suitable for moving large items I understand that in some apartment buildings in America they have dedicated cargo elevators for moving large things.

Cetyl Palmitate · 21-02-2019 12:11pm

https://rouleur.cc/editorial/ethics-cyclings-moral-compass/

axer · 21-02-2019 1:16pm

The Now You See Me episode did make some great points but it was ruined by whoever thought that interviewing a courier cyclist as being somewhat representative of cyclists in Dublin was a good idea. Courier cyclists from my experience are the worst type of cyclist out there. They make more money the quicker they get from A to B so its in their financial interest to break any rules that slow them down. The guy interviewed saying he breaks the law by cycling through red lights and the clips of him cycling aggressively and dangerously (for himself) and then saying it is the most dangerous city he has cycled makes it look (to the ordinary non-cyclist out there) like it is his own fault (and by extension the fault of all cyclists in Dublin due to their own behaviour). And then for him to criticise Dublin bike users... hypocracy at the highest order. What a twat.

Cetyl Palmitate · 21-02-2019 1:19pm

axer wrote: »

The Now You See Me episode did make some great points but it was ruined by whoever thought that interviewing a courier cyclist as being somewhat representative of cyclists in Dublin was a good idea. Courier cyclists from my experience are the worst type of cyclist out there. They make more money the quicker they get from A to B so its in their financial interest to break any rules that slow them down. The guy interviewed saying he breaks the law by cycling through red lights and the clips of him cycling aggressively and dangerously (for himself) and then saying it is the most dangerous city he has cycled makes it look (to the ordinary non-cyclist out there) like it is his own fault (and by extension the fault of all cyclists in Dublin due to their own behaviour). And then for him to criticise Dublin bike users... hypocracy at the highest order. What a twat.

No brakes either at first glance

Moflojo · 21-02-2019 3:23pm

I thought the Now You See Me programme was really progressive in the context of the Irish media landscape and how cycling is usually covered, but I think the episode fell into a couple of common traps:

- False Equivalence: There was repeated messaging of the notion that drivers and cyclists shoulder similar levels of responsibility. The random Paddy in Copenhagen endorsed this perspective.

- Cycling as an Extraordinary Activity: The depiction of the Donegal family's trial of cycling was ok, but it made it seem like cycling was a radical thing that people must go out of their way to attempt: Here's a senior executive from Cycling Ireland (not sure why they needed to send a member of senior management up to Donegal for that, ego?) to train you before you hit the road, help you to plan out your route, and get you all kitted out in your specialist clothing. It's very far from painting the picture of cycling as an everyday activity.

The 7.30pm Monday time slot is also pretty rubbish. People who commute by car are probably still sitting in their cars. Parents who drive their kids to school are probably in the process of getting those kids into bed. Ideally this programme should have a 9.30pm slot, on a Sunday if possible, to reach a decent audience.

If cyclists are the only ones watching the programme then it's a case of preaching to the converted.

Duckjob · 21-02-2019 4:13pm

Moflojo wrote: »

- Cycling as an Extraordinary Activity: The depiction of the Donegal family's trial of cycling was ok, but it made it seem like cycling was a radical thing that people must go out of their way to attempt: Here's a senior executive from Cycling Ireland (not sure why they needed to send a member of senior management up to Donegal for that, ego?) to train you before you hit the road, help you to plan out your route, and get you all kitted out in your specialist clothing. It's very far from painting the picture of cycling as an everyday activity.

I get the point you're making, and part of me groaned when I saw the family getting kitted out in hi-viz etc. But then I got to wondering if maybe they were making a deliberate attempt to contrast the realities of cycling in Ireland today (armour up, prepare for battle) with the absolute normality of cycling in Denmark (don't even think about it - just hop on and go). In other words, juxtaposing how cycling is now on top on how it could/should be.

Whether they were in fact doing this, and if so, whether or not it was effective I guess is down to individual perspectives.

Moflojo · 21-02-2019 6:37pm

Duckjob wrote: »

I get the point you're making, and part of me groaned when I saw the family getting kitted out in hi-viz etc. But then I got to wondering if maybe they were making a deliberate attempt to contrast the realities of cycling in Ireland today (armour up, prepare for battle) with the absolute normality of cycling in Denmark (don't even think about it - just hop on and go). In other words, juxtaposing how cycling is now on top on how it could/should be.

Whether they were in fact doing this, and if so, whether or not it was effective I guess is down to individual perspectives.

My attitude is influenced by the fact that the RSA has (I think) at least partly funded the programme and is actively promoting it.

I also suspect the RSA had a strong hand in the naming of the programme "Now You See Me", which doesn't seem to make much sense outside of a hi-vis fetishization context.

ED E · 21-02-2019 7:10pm

Moflojo wrote: »

My attitude is influenced by the fact that the RSA has (I think) at least partly funded the programme and is actively promoting it.

I also suspect the RSA had a strong hand in the naming of the programme "Now You See Me", which doesn't seem to make much sense outside of a hi-vis fetishization context.

The RSA and RTE co funded it.

The same company, Oddboy Media, previously did "Hows your driving" with RSA sponsorship.

Chiparus · 21-02-2019 7:18pm

Moflojo wrote: »

My attitude is influenced by the fact that the RSA has (I think) at least partly funded the programme and is actively promoting it.

I also suspect the RSA had a strong hand in the naming of the programme "Now You See Me", which doesn't seem to make much sense outside of a hi-vis fetishization context.

I would disagree as the most common refrain I hear is "Sorry, I did'nt see you"

Now you see me, I feel is about building awareness in the 90% of motorists that don't cycle.

Moflojo · 21-02-2019 7:34pm

Chiparus wrote: »

I would disagree as the most common refrain I hear is "Sorry, I did'nt see you"

Now you see me, I feel is about building awareness in the 90% of motorists that don't cycle.

That's a fair point regarding SMIDSYs, and it hadn't really occurred to me that that was the connection to the title. It does give me grounds for further criticism though, when one compares the explicit nature of "How's My Driving?" with a programme about cycling entitled "Now You See Me" and the bizarre use of the hashtag #NYSM, as if #NowYouSeeMe is too long for people to cope with! It reeks of middle-aged PR types trying to be down with the kids.

eeeee · 21-02-2019 10:00pm

axer wrote: »

The Now You See Me episode did make some great points but it was ruined by whoever thought that interviewing a courier cyclist as being somewhat representative of cyclists in Dublin was a good idea. Courier cyclists from my experience are the worst type of cyclist out there. They make more money the quicker they get from A to B so its in their financial interest to break any rules that slow them down. The guy interviewed saying he breaks the law by cycling through red lights and the clips of him cycling aggressively and dangerously (for himself) and then saying it is the most dangerous city he has cycled makes it look (to the ordinary non-cyclist out there) like it is his own fault (and by extension the fault of all cyclists in Dublin due to their own behaviour). And then for him to criticise Dublin bike users... hypocracy at the highest order. What a twat.

Disagree with this, he has obviously excellent bike handling skills and his point about Dublin bikers is warranted in my experience.
The brakes think wouldn't come into consideration for me at all. I ride, commute on and race fixed gear bikes and I feel a hell of a lot safer and I have feictonnes more control fixed than with a freewheel.
It was an honest interview I thought, and he actually acquitted himself well.
Couriers are professional bike riders, I can't remember the last time I heard of one being killed in action, which, when you think of the hours they spend in the busiest streets in the country speaks volumes about how they keep themselves safe. Also they can't work when injured.
I don't have the the skills to ride like a courier, so I don't. I don't condone everything they do, some ride like absolute arseholes, but I didn't hear or see anything to pull the courier up on in that programme.

axer · 21-02-2019 10:52pm

nee wrote: »

Disagree with this, he has obviously excellent bike handling skills and his point about Dublin bikers is warranted in my experience.
The brakes think wouldn't come into consideration for me at all. I ride, commute on and race fixed gear bikes and I feel a hell of a lot safer and I have feictonnes more control fixed than with a freewheel.
It was an honest interview I thought, and he actually acquitted himself well.
Couriers are professional bike riders, I can't remember the last time I heard of one being killed in action, which, when you think of the hours they spend in the busiest streets in the country speaks volumes about how they keep themselves safe. Also they can't work when injured.
I don't have the the skills to ride like a courier, so I don't. I don't condone everything they do, some ride like absolute arseholes, but I didn't hear or see anything to pull the courier up on in that programme.

Absolute rubbish. The clips of him cycling show him riding dangerously between traffic. He openly admitted to breaking red lights. Just because someone is paid to cycle or drive doesn't make them better at it. From my experience cycling through dublin daily I can say hands down courier cyclists are the most dangerous cyclists out there and the ones that give cyclists the worst name. We have no idea what the injury rate is for courier cyclists - we only hear about fatalities. I wouldn't call cycling in such a way that you are relying on others to keep you safe, because you are cycling dangerously, a skill. I have the skills to ride like a courier but im not so inconsiderate of others on the shared space (or care so little for my health/life) to ride like that.

eeeee · 21-02-2019 11:40pm

axer wrote: »

Absolute rubbish. The clips of him cycling show him riding dangerously between traffic. He openly admitted to breaking red lights. Just because someone is paid to cycle or drive doesn't make them better at it. From my experience cycling through dublin daily I can say hands down courier cyclists are the most dangerous cyclists out there and the ones that give cyclists the worst name. We have no idea what the injury rate is for courier cyclists - we only hear about fatalities. I wouldn't call cycling in such a way that you are relying on others to keep you safe, because you are cycling dangerously, a skill. I have the skills to ride like a courier but im not so inconsiderate of others on the shared space (or care so little for my health/life) to ride like that.

We'll have to agree to disagree - have met very, very few regular riders with courier like bike handling skills. Very few. The best bike handler I know even used to be one!
I didn't say that being a professional bike rider absolves him from all opprobrium.
I can honestly say courier riders aren't even on my radar day to day as far as dangerous riding goes.
The most dangerous cycling I see is people moving in and out around cars, holes on the road etc. without looking behind them. I see this several times a day. Or the old hand out and move. I haven't seen a courier wander out in front of traffic with no awareness the way the other riders do.

CramCycle · 22-02-2019 12:09am

I ride like that all the time. The camera makes it look far worse than it is.He will get a hard time for riding through the pedestrians because he did, even though he had a green, they are still pedestrians and you just have to suck that up.

22-02-2019 9:48am

Some flower pots were placed to protect the cycle lane on Ryders Row

http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/flower-boxes-dublin-cycle-lane/

Mc Love · 22-02-2019 9:51am

Are they official?

Journalism and cycling

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