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03-02-2012, 12:15   #16
jack presley
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Originally Posted by dojojoe View Post

That's the one alright. We caught her at our bin and our neighbours bin on separate occasions.
While I've never seen her go through bins I did always wonder what she was doing walking around the estate as I'd be leaving for work at about 6:30am.
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17-02-2012, 20:45   #17
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Any update on this situation? My friend has apparently also received a fine like this for a letter she threw away in Sligo in 2007, which was found in an abandoned house in Tallaght last month...
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18-02-2012, 18:55   #18
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Blimey, your friend is unlucky, what are the odds? No update on our situation. Haven't heard anything since husband filled out the appeal form. I'll post any developments.
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18-02-2012, 19:33   #19
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Blimey, your friend is unlucky, what are the odds? No update on our situation. Haven't heard anything since husband filled out the appeal form. I'll post any developments.
Thanks! I'm the friend mentioned in the above post! My parents are also currently making out an appeal (since the letter is in Sligo and I now live in Dublin) but I think we might have a pretty good case. The 'litter' that was found is a certificate stating I passed my driver theory test. That certificate has to be brought to the Motor Tax Office in order to obtain a provisional licence. The key part here is that the MTO don't give you back the cert (as far as I am aware - have to ring on Monday for definite confirmation on this!). Therefore I was never the one who binned it at any point - Sligo's Motor Tax Office is.

What's most worrying about this is that the certificate had my PPS number on it. Great protection of confidential information there! I couldn't understand how I could ever have dumped a letter with such important information on it. In 2007 I was still in secondary school and my Mum meticulously shreds anything with our names on it, always has done so this may explain how it escaped my hands intact!

The whole situation is very frustrating and even though I now have a good case against the littering fine I'm perturbed that my name, address, date of birth and PPS No. were floating around the country for anyone to find!
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21-02-2012, 22:13   #20
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It seems that if the Council can't get the culprits they'll just go after anyone they can pin it to. Maybe they get a pat on the back for each successful fine.
Considering the issues of your case, it being 5 years ago and the MTO were in possession of the document, if they pursue the fine then the law really is an ass.

The update on my issue is not good. Co.Council sent us a letter this morning saying they are rejecting our appeal based on that the 'large amount of household rubbish' could not have escaped from our bin while it was being emptied. They seem to be ignoring our idea that our single piece of paper could have blown onto someone else's dumped rubbish. They also said that it is the householder's responsibility to make sure that the lid of the bin is closed and that the bin is not overflowing. I always make sure of this (I hate when birds are able to peck at rubbish and scatter it). They're also ignoring when the litter warden found the 'evidence', 9th Jan, when we had a few days of extremely high winds which were so bad it was all over the news. I remember on bin collection day a number of bins were on their sides having been blown over before collection. What does the Council expect us to do, bolt our bins to the ground? We were invited to pay the fine or go to court, we'll go to court because if this ever happens again the second fine would be enormous and an appeal probably wouldn't work 'cos it would look like we're guilty a second time.
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30-05-2012, 10:26   #21
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same thing happened to me.mine was an axa insurance disc.in a bag of rubbish.the bag was found in the trees at the pavillions shopping centre.how it got there il never know.150 euro fine .i was told i could appeall it which i did.only got a letter back last week saying theres nothing they could do as the fine has gone through.wants the point in an appeal then.im not paying it.i use black bins so i have no reason to dump anything.bit strange how it seems to be insurance stuff that was found
by the way dont sign for any registered letters that u dont know of.the council are dead wide knowing that if they send out registered letters that the recipient will think ooohh i wonder wats in that.the post man told me a couple of yrs ago.dont sign stuff that u dont know about as there could be a fine in one of them.once u dont sign for a registered letter theres nothing they can do as u havent recieved signed for that letter.think about it how often would u get a registered letter with a cheque in it.all they can do is keepsending them out.the police cant get involved.and they cant make u sign for a letter either

Last edited by ann0; 30-05-2012 at 10:32.
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30-05-2012, 10:33   #22
gizmo555
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Originally Posted by Konata View Post
T The 'litter' that was found is a certificate stating I passed my driver theory test. That certificate has to be brought to the Motor Tax Office in order to obtain a provisional licence. The key part here is that the MTO don't give you back the cert (as far as I am aware - have to ring on Monday for definite confirmation on this!). Therefore I was never the one who binned it at any point - Sligo's Motor Tax Office is.

What's most worrying about this is that the certificate had my PPS number on it. Great protection of confidential information there!
You should make a complaint to the Data Protection Commissioner: www.dataprotection.ie

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Originally Posted by razzler View Post
They seem to be ignoring our idea that our single piece of paper could have blown onto someone else's dumped rubbish.
That's what we did, and drove back to the church, had a thanksgiving
dinner that couldn't be beat, went to sleep and didn't get up until the
next morning, when we got a phone call from Officer Obie. He said, "Kid,
we found your name on an envelope at the bottom of a half a ton of
garbage, and just wanted to know if you had any information about it." And
I said, "Yes, sir, Officer Obie, I cannot tell a lie, I put that envelope
under that garbage."


Arlo Guthrie, "Alice's Restaurant"
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30-05-2012, 10:39   #23
ann0
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the county council are quick to whack out fines .but there not quick about fixing the pot holes and the crap roads that are actually damaging peoples cars
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01-06-2012, 18:50   #24
razzler
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ann0, don't pay. They said the same to us, the fine was gone through. We let the Council know we thought it was unfair and asked for copies of the "evidence" to be sent to us, which they did. That was two and a half months ago and we haven't heard anything since. The picture they sent to us didn't even show a pile of dumped rubbish, it showed papers and some plastic bottles strewn around on some grass with our paper among them, entirely consistent with rubbish from a blown over recycling bin and being tossed around in those gale force winds we had early in January.
Fines are for the guilty, not the innocent so stick to your guns.
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05-06-2012, 09:31   #25
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hi razzler,apparently the bag was found around patricks day gone at the side of the pavillions where the trees are.there not gettin a penny.but just to cover my self if it ends up in court i told them id pay a fiver a week even though i dident dump anything.they said they dont take by the week.well ive got a copy of my letter saying im willing to pay by the week and i have there letter saying they dont take by the week.most times a judge says the defendant is not refusing to pay and most cases gets dropped
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28-10-2012, 18:49   #26
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Hi All,
Finally there's been a resolution to this. We went to court last Tuesday and the judge dismissed the case. It is such a relief to have it finally behind us but the council really gave us the runaround. When my husband rang up after we got the letter rejecting his appeal the 'lady' in the Council was downright rude, ignored his question to why it was rejected saying the fine still stands and hung up on him mid sentence, all in less than a minute. I rang back straight away calmy stating we were entitled to ask and receive a few answers and that we want copies of the photos the litter warden took in case it goes to court, kept her on the phone about 10 mins (just in case she was busy). It's the attitude that really bugged me. We got free legal advice from FLAC where we were told we had a very good case and that any reasonable judge would think it ridicolous so that encouraged us.
But the end of July we get a letter saying the matter had come before the court, in our absence the judge imposed a fine of 300, adding costs of 208, 90 days to pay or prison.What?, we never even got the summons. Rang the Council, they said the summons had been sent weeks ago and signed for. She spelled out a foreign name we never heard of so it obviously didn't come to us. She just said go to the district court and explain. So off we go to the city a few days later, finally get directed to the summons office. Lady there said we can get a new date (Sept 11) but we have to sign a document, bring a copy of that to the Council in Swords to sign agreeing to the new date and then bring this to a peace commissioner to sign, and bring these back to the summons office. Took a whole day cos of a lot of waiting around and misdirections. The Council let our summons be handed to a complete stranger, can you imagine. So Sept 11 comes round and we're all ready for husband to plead his case. His turn is called and he swears in and gives his address. Judge says he has a different address before him whereupon the legal lady of the council says that this hearing is to apply for a new court date cos the Council sent the summons to the wrong house, she even said the address of the wrong house, similar to ours. This was the first we heard of what happened our summons, they could have told us this when we were on the phone in July. Judge gives a new court date of 23 Oct. Turned out this hearing was just to apply for a new date. So back we were going to have to come AGAIN.
So, on 23 Oct the litter warden gave his evidence, my husband gave his (making some points the solicitor from FLAC suggested), judge called back the warden and quizzed him in more detail and eventually said he is 'willing to believe the defendant's explanation' and dismiss the case. On stepping down my husband was tempted to give the warden a nod and wink, the way the wardens were doing to each other each time the judge convicted on previous cases. I wish he had.
I know a litter fine is not the most serious case in the world but we don't like to see abuse of power. And all the running around they made us do cos they sent our summons to the wrong address, not to mention loss of earnings to appear twice in court. But I think it was worth it in the end just not to give in to bullying.
Sorry for the lengthy story, but this is the shortened version.
And thank you for the encouragement given to us by other posters.
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28-10-2012, 23:49   #27
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I guess you could say that the prosecutions case was trashed. Now you can just bin this whole episode and get on with your life.
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29-10-2012, 02:04   #28
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I'd make a complaint to the Data Protection Commissioner about them sending your private information to a 3rd party.
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29-10-2012, 02:25   #29
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Razzler
Did you get costs or was it just dropped? I would want compensated for loss of earnings and expenses.
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29-10-2012, 20:48   #30
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We didn't ask for compensation/costs of any kind even though the soliciter from FLAC, when we got advice months ago, said we could suggest it to the judge before he made his decision. We were both new to these kind of legal proceedings and didn't want to seem cheeky in case it made a bad impression with the judge.
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