Post Reply  
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
20-03-2012, 04:48   #1
tomasocarthaigh
Registered User
 
tomasocarthaigh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 220
Send a message via Yahoo to tomasocarthaigh Send a message via Skype™ to tomasocarthaigh
Force a Referendum on the Property Tax

Seeing as the governement are going to force deduction-at-source, why can we not as people force a referendum on the issue?

I propose the following to be campaigned for inclusion in the constitution -

"The family home, that is the primary residence of the family, shall be free from property taxes or rates"

Anyone with me?
tomasocarthaigh is offline  
Advertisement
20-03-2012, 04:57   #2
MadsL
Registered User
 
MadsL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 19,738
As delusional a response as Grover Norquist's campaign for pledges for No New Taxes in the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover_Norquist

Or more entertainingly...

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mo...rover-norquist

Watch and I think you will understand why absolute pledges or outright bans or restrictions on taxes are economically illiterate.
MadsL is offline  
20-03-2012, 09:09   #3
jank
Banned
 
jank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 12,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomasocarthaigh View Post
Seeing as the governement are going to force deduction-at-source, why can we not as people force a referendum on the issue?

I propose the following to be campaigned for inclusion in the constitution -

"The family home, that is the primary residence of the family, shall be free from property taxes or rates"

Anyone with me?
Eh, no. How are we going to pay for services? Property taxes is a thing that is very common in the western world.
jank is offline  
(4) thanks from:
20-03-2012, 09:20   #4
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 12,090
It's not new OP, these local rates existed before Jack Lynch abolished them

Though that was a right mess of a system with different valuations and waivers. It happens over time with complicated bureaucracies
Wasn't a very equal system, it could have been fixed but instead it was axed

Last edited by mikemac1; 20-03-2012 at 09:23.
mikemac1 is offline  
20-03-2012, 09:41   #5
BOHtox
Registered User
 
BOHtox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomasocarthaigh View Post
Seeing as the governement are going to force deduction-at-source, why can we not as people force a referendum on the issue?

I propose the following to be campaigned for inclusion in the constitution -

"The family home, that is the primary residence of the family, shall be free from property taxes or rates"

Anyone with me?
Hard luck, mate!
BOHtox is offline  
Advertisement
20-03-2012, 09:45   #6
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 21,288
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadsL View Post
As delusional a response as Grover Norquist's campaign for pledges for No New Taxes in the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover_Norquist

Or more entertainingly...

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mo...rover-norquist

Watch and I think you will understand why absolute pledges or outright bans or restrictions on taxes are economically illiterate.

Well said, the opposition to this tax has been delusional from the first.

From the so-called socialists of the ULA and SF opposing it on ideological grounds which makes the mind boggle to the more mainstream chattering classes opposing it on cost grounds when other tax increases are going to hit them by more, the opposition to the tax have been living in some sort of alternate reality.
Godge is offline  
20-03-2012, 12:05   #7
ednwireland
Moderator
 
ednwireland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 12,317
i actually object to the lack of billing, if these taxes are supporting local services i want to know what my local authority i sspending it on. we get this at budget time at a macro level for health social services etc.

if i'm paying a tax i want the council to tell me what they are spending it on (the only good thing about the council tax in the ulk you do get a breakdown - however arbitary)

anyway they've annoyed me so much i'll take th e10 euro hit at the end of march just to annoy the gov back so i'm now not paying, where i was going to before !
ednwireland is online now  
(3) thanks from:
20-03-2012, 12:11   #8
K-9
Registered User
 
K-9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 41,080
Quote:
Originally Posted by ednwireland View Post
i actually object to the lack of billing, if these taxes are supporting local services i want to know what my local authority i sspending it on. we get this at budget time at a macro level for health social services etc.

if i'm paying a tax i want the council to tell me what they are spending it on (the only good thing about the council tax in the ulk you do get a breakdown - however arbitary)

anyway they've annoyed me so much i'll take th e10 euro hit at the end of march just to annoy the gov back so i'm now not paying, where i was going to before !
Councils do publish Accounts every year and the manager usually outlines the main points at Council meetings. Donegal has made big cuts to wages in the couple of years for example. If they intend bringing in a proper tax and not this haphazard one, its something they should be mandated to do, say sending out a small leaflet on the actual budget.
K-9 is offline  
20-03-2012, 12:14   #9
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 21,288
Quote:
Originally Posted by ednwireland View Post
i actually object to the lack of billing, if these taxes are supporting local services i want to know what my local authority i sspending it on. we get this at budget time at a macro level for health social services etc.

if i'm paying a tax i want the council to tell me what they are spending it on (the only good thing about the council tax in the ulk you do get a breakdown - however arbitary)

anyway they've annoyed me so much i'll take th e10 euro hit at the end of march just to annoy the gov back so i'm now not paying, where i was going to before !

I can only speak for my own local authority as I live in the area and keep up with their publications.
http://www.fingalcoco.ie/YourLocalCo...get%202012.pdf


read the link for their 76-page document on their 2012 budget which gives a huge amount of information on where they spend my money.

A lot of money is spent - €221m - but it is 11% down on last year.
Godge is offline  
Advertisement
20-03-2012, 12:17   #10
Manach
Moderator
 
Manach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 8,864
Speaking as someone as delusion to think that Governments should have a minimum impact on peoples lives and this includes the massive government expenditure that is designed in part to ensure the re-election of the politicians proposing. The Govern. wish to pass a referendum ensuring a balanced budget, and yet they insist on raising tax revenue where there is no generation - ie the family house which exists not as an economic right but a fundamental human right - that of as a shelter and not as a means to create a socialised state.
Manach is offline  
20-03-2012, 12:21   #11
GUIGuy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 245
Services? What services... if you live in an estate/apt block that is managed by a private company (which the council refuses to take charge for) we already pay for:
  • Trash Collection
  • Public Liability Insurance
  • Road, Paving & Street furniture maintenance
  • Street Lighting

Water is going to be charged separately
There are call out charges for emergency services
We already pay road tax for public road maintenance

... so what local 'service' is this tax to pay for? This tax will keep lots of local bureaucrats in jobs no doubt. Its another make work scheme where the 'services' are in fact just the jobs created to administer the tax.
GUIGuy is offline  
20-03-2012, 12:21   #12
xflyer
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,777
The problem with this charge is that's a crude attempt by the government to raise some more money to hand over to the banks and the rest. It's also an attempt to build up a database of people liable for further taxes like water rates and the the new 'Rates'.

Let no one pretend that this is for local services. Rates were abolished years ago because they were a mess. So after that we paid higher income taxes to fund local services.

You're the one who is delusional if you think this tax is for local services to bring us into line other countries. It's stretching coincidence to the limit to think this is being introduced now but it's nothing to do with the problems we face.

We don't need a referendum, failing to pay this tax is a referendum in itself.
xflyer is offline  
20-03-2012, 12:22   #13
ednwireland
Moderator
 
ednwireland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 12,317
Quote:
Originally Posted by Godge View Post
I can only speak for my own local authority as I live in the area and keep up with their publications.
http://www.fingalcoco.ie/YourLocalCo...get%202012.pdf


read the link for their 76-page document on their 2012 budget which gives a huge amount of information on where they spend my money.

A lot of money is spent - €221m - but it is 11% down on last year.
thanks for that but if its on donegal coco's website they sure dont make it easy to find - i looked through most of the relevant links and the search function doesnt work.
ednwireland is online now  
Thanks from:
20-03-2012, 12:27   #14
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 21,288
Quote:
Originally Posted by ednwireland View Post
thanks for that but if its on donegal coco's website they sure dont make it easy to find - i looked through most of the relevant links and the search function doesnt work.
Yeah, even though it was adopted in the end,

http://www.inishowennews.com/012DonegaBudget019.htm

it doesn't seem to have been published on the website. The 2011 budget is there fwiw.

http://www.donegalcoco.ie/council/pu...Budget2010.htm
Godge is offline  
Thanks from:
20-03-2012, 12:32   #15
schemingbohemia
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by ednwireland View Post
thanks for that but if its on donegal coco's website they sure dont make it easy to find - i looked through most of the relevant links and the search function doesnt work.
Not that difficult to find but not the most recent

http://www.donegalcoco.ie/council/pu...Budget2010.htm
schemingbohemia is offline  
Post Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Remove Text Formatting
Bold
Italic
Underline

Insert Image
Wrap [QUOTE] tags around selected text
 
Decrease Size
Increase Size
Please sign up or log in to join the discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Share Tweet