Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 2:52pm

Stark wrote: »

The new Lombard street cycle lane is the worst for that https://goo.gl/maps/oeBeiYPw8LkvegGD8 .

The guy on the nice cube when you scroll into the junction has magnificent taste in matching his bottoms with the bike.

https://goo.gl/maps/3X9rDvuJM5BpH5ay5

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 2:54pm

meeeeh wrote: »

I onced walked from a friends flat to a car park in the middle of the night. A man on a bike cycled around me with his pants off telling me he will **** me. Should I make your type of assumption about the cyclist hostility towards drivers or should I conclude that there are deckhands in this world who will find someone to target.

Edit: I don't think I typed deckhands but I guess autocorrect decided it was too vulgar...

I'm a driver, I only know them too well. That guy was obviously not a serious deckhand though, has he been he'd be wearing Navy standard bell bottoms which have a rather roomy fly, hence no need for pants off.

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 2:56pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

Why would I need re-training? Just like the cyclist who hogs the bus lane on the N11, I've done nothing illegal.

You have the strange mentality that the bus lanes are only for buses and admitted to having issues with others in them, who are legally entitled to be there. In fact you'd be hard pressed to find many bus only bus lanes.

A quick course will clarify all that for you, you could even do that online.

meeeeh · 01-07-2020 3:00pm

Hurrache wrote: »

I'm a driver, I only know them too well. That guy was obviously not a serious deckhand though, has he been he'd be wearing Navy standard bell bottoms which have a rather roomy fly, hence no need for pants off.

Yes isn't sexual harassment funny. hahaha

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 3:06pm

meeeeh wrote: »

Yes isn't sexual harassment funny. hahaha

Oh, you've changed tact again from being flippant to serious?

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 3:09pm

Hurrache wrote: »

You have the strange mentality that the bus lanes are only for buses and admitted to having issues with others in them, who are legally entitled to be there. In fact you'd be hard pressed to find many bus only bus lanes.

A quick course will clarify all that for you, you could even do that online.

And I'm legally entitled (contractually obliged, tbh) to stop at bus stops - even if I've just overtaken a cyclist who has chosen to use the bus lane. Some cyclists on here seem to have issues with that. Is there a course they could do to resolve those issues?

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 3:16pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

And I'm legally entitled (contractually obliged, tbh) to stop at bus stops - even if I've just overtaken a cyclist who has chosen to use the bus lane. Some cyclists on here seem to have issues with that. Is there a course they could do to resolve those issues?

The issue that you like to provoke by admitting to purposely obstructing them because they're in the bus lane?

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 3:18pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

And I'm legally entitled (contractually obliged, tbh) to stop at bus stops - even if I've just overtaken a cyclist who has chosen to use the bus lane. Some cyclists on here seem to have issues with that. Is there a course they could do to resolve those issues?

Don't over take cyclist just before stops so? Why would you add the stress of mamuvering a bus around a cyclist only to pull in a few seconds later?

meeeeh · 01-07-2020 3:31pm

Hurrache wrote: »

Oh, you've changed tact again from being flippant to serious?

I was being truthful that's all.

Casey78 · 01-07-2020 3:47pm

Hurrache wrote: »

But sadly this is the behaviour that threads like this leads to, roads are full of cowards, reflective of these type of threads.

https://twitter.com/SafeCyclingEire/status/1278238610899304449

Hope the younglad is ok of course before I'm accused of condoning what happened, but what you posted is ridiculous even for this thread.

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 3:51pm

Casey78 wrote: »

Hope the younglad is ok of course before I'm accused of condoning what happened, but what you posted is ridiculous even for this thread.

This is the issue, people think there's no association between peoples attitude to cyclists and ultimately violence towards. It's not, and it either manifests itself in dangerous driving around cyclists, or physical violence.

I of course don't know the reason here, I was being pretty Maude Flanders'ers, but it's not unheard of, and naïve to think otherwise.

AndrewJRenko · 01-07-2020 4:07pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

So, I get the "some cycle lanes are so **** I'm safer on the road" argument - for some cycle lanes. What about (to coin a phrase!) the ones that aren't? What about the ones where it's demonstrably safer to use the segregated cycle lane?

Case in point: North Strand Road, inbound. Approaching the canal and railway bridge, steep enough hill, with a two lanes. One is a bus lane. There's a segregated cycle lane, behind a wall, from the entrance to Costcutter all the way up to the traffic lights. This morning (and many morningS), there's a guy huffing and puffing his way up the hill, in the middle of the bus lane, with two full double deckers following him at something like 5kmh.

I'd totally get it if there wasn't a cycle lane, but there is, and it's perfectly fine and unobstructed, and much safer. He's possibly one here now, wondering why some buses get so aggressive with some cyclists...

Do you mean this cycle lane, which seems to be designed for particularly skinny cyclists ?

https://twitter.com/Nialltoner/status/1131545713085751297?s=19

https://twitter.com/chaarlone/status/1121476665337626624?s=19

Can anyone think of any possible reason why cyclists might not choose this lane?

https://twitter.com/AlanDub13/status/1152945554382557184?s=19

Anyone at all?

https://twitter.com/moran_anto/status/1060454647066955776?s=19

Last call for suggestions?

https://twitter.com/SkepticalSeamus/status/1169224858779230208?s=19

07Lapierre · 01-07-2020 4:15pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Case in point: North Strand Road, inbound. Approaching the canal and railway bridge, steep enough hill, with a two lanes. One is a bus lane. There's a segregated cycle lane, behind a wall, from the entrance to Costcutter all the way up to the traffic lights. This morning (and many morningS), there's a guy huffing and puffing his way up the hill, in the middle of the bus lane, with two full double deckers following him at something like 5kmh.

I'd totally get it if there wasn't a cycle lane, but there is, and it's perfectly fine and unobstructed, and much safer. He's possibly one here now, wondering why some buses get so aggressive with some cyclists...

Its crap! its a pavement with a white line painted on it.

this is a bike lane:

https://youtu.be/By1DoD3X4Go

FinnC · 01-07-2020 4:17pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

this is a bike lane:

https://youtu.be/By1DoD3X4Go

That looks class.

TaurenDruid · 01-07-2020 4:18pm

I must actually find out how this multiquote thing works at some point.

But:

Yes, I mean that cycle lane, Andy and magic.

I know you may find this hard to believe, Andy, but just because a vehicle is photographed somewhere, it doesn't get frozen in place! There were no lorries, trucks, vans, cars, helicopters, jeeps, roadworks, pathworks or anything else blocking the cycle lane.

There were no pedestrians.

There were a couple of other cyclists.

It did look a little like that guy, as it happens.

There are traffic lights at the top, and a cyclist can see them, and can tell when it's safe to enter the road. Which is just before the lights, so if he's going to get hit by left-turning traffic (inbound) that traffic is already taking out any pedestrians at the crossing, and the traffic light, and if it's right-turning traffic (outbound) then they have a filter light.

It's not a terrible design, in other words.

The one at Lombard Street is - I dunno wtf they were thinking with that.

I don't think anyone came back about to my question about how come the lobby/activist groups aren't actively invited to be involved in design decisions. It hopefully isn't that they never got invited back after being so incredibly negative about everything... "You're giving us a segregated cycle lane, separated from the traffic by a wall, but sometimes people might step on it or have to make deliveries? YOU MONSTERS!"

ewc78 · 01-07-2020 4:20pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

this is a bike lane:

https://youtu.be/By1DoD3X4Go

That would be ideal for running on!!

TaurenDruid · 01-07-2020 4:22pm

Also - amazing how quickly Andy came back with a pic of where I meant.

Do you have the whole of Dublin's cycling lanes all indexed by tweet, youtube upload and facebook post, with matching photos and videis?! Let's try another... North Circular Road, junction of Russell St. Aaaand... GO!

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 4:29pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Also - amazing how quickly Andy came back with a pic of where I meant.

Do you have the whole of Dublin's cycling lanes all indexed by tweet, youtube upload and facebook post, with matching photos and videis?! Let's try another... North Circular Road, junction of Russell St. Aaaand... GO!

When pretty much all cycling infrastructure in the city is ****e, you don't need to go looking for any issues, they're there all day, every day.

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 4:32pm

A rather coincidental story pops up today in Forbes, maybe experts are even watching from afar

Some motorists object to the presence of cyclists on roads, claiming a reduction in speed causes traffic snarl-ups. However, a study said to be the first to use on-road speed measurement data, has found that the loss of time to be “negligible.”

“Bicycles are not likely to lead to reduced passenger car travel speed, despite their differences in performance capabilities,” says the study, conducted in Portland, Oregon, on roads without bicycle lanes.
........

overtakes by motorists desperate to get past, even in dense traffic, when motor vehicles are likely to get stuck ahead anyway. The “must get in front” maneuver, or MGIF, is well known to regular cyclists.

The Portland study was published June 12 in the Transportation Research Record, the journal of the National Academy of Sciences’ Transportation Research Board.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2020/07/01/cyclists-dont-cause-congestion-must-get-in-front-maneuvers-by-motorists-pointless-finds-study/#1f9036b21e3e

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 5:04pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

Its crap! its a pavement with a white line painted on it.

this is a bike lane:

https://youtu.be/By1DoD3X4Go

Now now its fairly simple. Cycling in the footpath is reckless and dangerous, unless someone randomly painted a white line on it in which case it becomes reckless and dangerous not to use it

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 5:08pm

Hurrache wrote: »

A rather coincidental story pops up today in Forbes, maybe experts are even watching from afar

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2020/07/01/cyclists-dont-cause-congestion-must-get-in-front-maneuvers-by-motorists-pointless-finds-study/#1f9036b21e3e

And in shocking and surprising news. Traffic caused by cars which are the traffic. Shocked for sure

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 5:46pm

Hurrache wrote: »

The issue that you like to provoke by admitting to purposely obstructing them because they're in the bus lane?

I'm not purposely obstructing them; I'm just doing my job, and not showing them the added courtesy that I show towards the majority of cyclists (i.e. the ones who don't feel the need to use bus lanes).

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Don't over take cyclist just before stops so? Why would you add the stress of mamuvering a bus around a cyclist only to pull in a few seconds later?

You mean don't overtake a cyclist, full-stop? Because there's always a bus stop within a few hundred metres. If there is enough space to overtake and also pull back in safely, it's not stressful at all.

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 5:55pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

You mean don't overtake a cyclist, full-stop? Because there's always a bus stop within a few hundred metres. If there is enough space to overtake and also pull back in safely, it's not stressful at all.

No it's fairly clear. Don't overtake if you'll have to pull in pretty much directly after overtaking. As a professional driver you'll know the difference.

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 5:58pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

No it's fairly clear. Don't overtake if you'll have to pull in pretty much directly after overtaking. As a professional driver you'll know the difference.

Once I'm back in the bus lane, having safely cleared the obstruction, it is perfectly legal to pull in at the next bus stop. Just like it's perfectly legal to cycle in a bus lane.

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 6:10pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

I'm not purposely obstructing them; I'm just doing my job, and not showing them the added courtesy that I show towards the majority of cyclists (i.e. the ones who don't feel the need to use bus lanes).

I do think you're talking nonsense too. If there's a road with a bus and cycle lane, all cyclists on the road will be in the bus and cycle lane. There's no cyclists who will cycle in the adjoining traffic lane rather than the adjacent bus and cycle lane.

You've yet to show us the number of bus only 'bus' lanes?

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 6:14pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

Once I'm back in the bus lane, having safely cleared the obstruction, it is perfectly legal to pull in at the next bus stop. Just like it's perfectly legal to cycle in a bus lane.

It's not perfectly legal to overtake and then come to an immediate stop. There are two different situations at play here. Fish hooking is illegal

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 6:16pm

Hurrache wrote: »

I do think you're talking nonsense too. If there's a road with a bus and cycle lane, all cyclists on the road will be in the bus and cycle lane. There's no cyclists who will cycle in the adjoining traffic lane rather than the adjacent bus and cycle lane.

You've yet to show us the number of bus only 'bus' lanes?

I'm talking about stretches of road like this, where there is a cycle lane and also a bus lane.

It's not perfectly legal to overtake and then come to an immediate stop. There are two different situations at play here. Fish hooking is illegal

I never said anything about coming to an immediate stop.

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 6:20pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

I never said anything about coming to an immediate stop.

I did. Perhaps you reply to what I actually said

AndrewJRenko · 01-07-2020 6:29pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Yes, I mean that cycle lane, Andy and magic.

I know you may find this hard to believe, Andy, but just because a vehicle is photographed somewhere, it doesn't get frozen in place! There were no lorries, trucks, vans, cars, helicopters, jeeps, roadworks, pathworks or anything else blocking the cycle lane.

There were no pedestrians.

There were a couple of other cyclists.

You might find this hard to believe, but if you find that your route is regularly blocked by illegally parked vehicles, you're probably going to choose a different route in future.

TaurenDruid wrote: »

I don't think anyone came back about to my question about how come the lobby/activist groups aren't actively invited to be involved in design decisions. It hopefully isn't that they never got invited back after being so incredibly negative about everything... "You're giving us a segregated cycle lane, separated from the traffic by a wall, but sometimes people might step on it or have to make deliveries? YOU MONSTERS!"

Lots of these designs are historical, so there was probably no consultation at the time. There is consultation around new developments, and they get loads of feedback, most of which they ignore.

No-one 'has to make deliveries' on a cycle lane. There are always other options, legal options, safe options - even if these might involve a slightly longer walk for the delivery crew.

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 6:30pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

I'm talking about stretches of road like this, where there is a cycle lane and also a bus lane.

It's bad when you refer to the N11 cycle 'lane' as a back up to your argument.

I also refer you to this
https://goo.gl/maps/FzaH2LuaLEjpcQrL9

micar · 01-07-2020 6:33pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

I'm talking about stretches of road like this, where there is a cycle lane and also a bus lane.

I never said anything about coming to an immediate stop.

This is what we are talking about

https://twitter.com/HughManning/status/1230155661398487040?s=19

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 6:38pm

Based on what the poster has been saying, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if that was him driving. It's a dick move that fits in exactly what this guy describes.

Casey78 · 01-07-2020 6:42pm

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2020/0701/1150834-road-deaths-eu/

I guess Greece is the place to go if you want to cycle, surprised The Netherlands and Denmark are so high for cyclists deaths considering how they are famed for their cycling infrastructure, especially in the Netherlands. Yes there is a higher percentage of people cycling but I assumed it would also be a safer place to cycle because of all the brilliant cycling infrastructure.

Anyway it's good to see Ireland as one of the safest countries in Europe even if one death is too many of course.

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 6:44pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

I did. Perhaps you reply to what I actually said

It's irrelevant because I don't do it. Here's what I do when I get stuck behind a bike on a road like the Stillorgan dual carriageway and it's possible to safely overtake - I indicate, fully change lanes when it's safe to do so, and when I've cleared the obstacle, I indicate again and pull back in. Having already completed the overtake (i.e. I am now in front of the bike), I indicate again and pull in at the bus stop further down the road. I accept that it must be very annoying for the cyclist, but it's perfectly legal, just like cycling in a bus lane.

Hurrache wrote:

It's bad when you refer to the N11 cycle 'lane' as a back up to your argument.

The bus lane is no better. Full of potholes and as you can see here, nowhere near wide enough for moving buses.

Based on what the poster has been saying, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if that was him driving. It's a dick move that fits in exactly what this guy describes.

Nope. That driver didn't give enough space while overtaking in the first place, and was already on the brakes before clearing the cyclist. I always make sure I'm well in front before stopping. I've never had any complaints either.

Hurrache · 01-07-2020 6:50pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

The bus lane is no better.

Ah it is when you're on a bike, the token cycle lane is like a rollercoaster with all the ups and downs.

There's always a tweet...
https://twitter.com/BicesterBug/status/1278022669754085377

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 6:50pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

It's irrelevant because I don't do it. Here's what I do when I get stuck behind a bike on a road like the Stillorgan dual carriageway and it's possible to safely overtake - I indicate, fully change lanes when it's safe to do so, and when I've cleared the obstacle, I indicate again and pull back in. Having already completed the overtake (i.e. I am now in front of the bike), I indicate again and pull in at the bus stop further down the road. I accept that it must be very annoying for the cyclist, but it's perfectly legal, just like cycling in a bus lane.

Why would that be annoying? I'm able to share the road.

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 7:00pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Why would that be annoying? I'm able to share the road.

I would've thought losing momentum and having to start all over again was annoying. That's why, on roads where there is no bus or cycle lane, I tend to stay behind the cyclist, regardless of whether or not there is an opportunity to safely overtake. This road (along with its state-of-the-art cycle lane) on the 145/155 route between Bray and Shankill is a good example of that.

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 7:04pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

I would've thought losing momentum and having to start all over again was annoying. That's why, on roads where there is no bus or cycle lane, I tend to stay behind the cyclist, regardless of whether or not there is an opportunity to safely overtake. This road (along with its state-of-the-art cycle lane) on the 145/155 route between Bray and Shankill is a good example of that.

There's always a car or a bus or a red light coming up. The vast majority of cyclist are aware they aren't in the tour de France.

TaurenDruid · 01-07-2020 7:10pm

Hurrache wrote: »

Ah it is when you're on a bike, the token cycle lane is like a rollercoaster with all the ups and downs.

There's always a tweet...
https://twitter.com/BicesterBug/status/1278022669754085377

What county is Bicester in?

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 7:11pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

There's always a car or a bus or a red light coming up. The vast majority of cyclist are aware they aren't in the tour de France.

I think it's also fair to say that the vast majority don't use bus lanes when there's a cycle lane (albeit usually a very poor one) provided. Or at least they move aside as soon as they can when there's a bus behind them. The only ones I've ever had problems with are the male ones who dress like they're in the Tour de France.

Better Than Christ · 01-07-2020 7:15pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

What county is Bicester in?

They're arguably even worse in this country. This one on Leopardstown Rd in Dublin always strikes me as being particularly unusable.

LeinsterDub · 01-07-2020 7:15pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

What county is Bicester in?

Wow a great and in depth dismantling of their point

07Lapierre · 01-07-2020 7:40pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

I must actually find out how this multiquote thing works at some point.

But:

Yes, I mean that cycle lane, Andy and magic.

I know you may find this hard to believe, Andy, but just because a vehicle is photographed somewhere, it doesn't get frozen in place! There were no lorries, trucks, vans, cars, helicopters, jeeps, roadworks, pathworks or anything else blocking the cycle lane.

There were no pedestrians.

There were a couple of other cyclists.

It did look a little like that guy, as it happens.

There are traffic lights at the top, and a cyclist can see them, and can tell when it's safe to enter the road. Which is just before the lights, so if he's going to get hit by left-turning traffic (inbound) that traffic is already taking out any pedestrians at the crossing, and the traffic light, and if it's right-turning traffic (outbound) then they have a filter light.

It's not a terrible design, in other words.

The one at Lombard Street is - I dunno wtf they were thinking with that.

I don't think anyone came back about to my question about how come the lobby/activist groups aren't actively invited to be involved in design decisions. It hopefully isn't that they never got invited back after being so incredibly negative about everything... "You're giving us a segregated cycle lane, separated from the traffic by a wall, but sometimes people might step on it or have to make deliveries? YOU MONSTERS!"

Your right... it’s not a terrible design. ITS JUST PAINT! On a pavement that was already there. There is no design at all. The fact that you think this lane is “perfectly fine” shows just how little you know about commuting by bike.

pleasant Co. · 01-07-2020 8:05pm

I just use the road / bus & cycle lane, I will not use any of those insanely planned cycle obstacle courses tacked onto pavements that suddenly become parking spots, because of reasons.

AndrewJRenko · 01-07-2020 8:41pm

TaurenDruid wrote: »

No, I've been told I'm very acute rather than obtuse.

Pretty sure I said all parks in Dublin run/managed by DCC, seeing as we were referring to their bye-laws. Pretty sure I also said this wouldn't apply to the Phoenix Park as it's run by the OPW.

The signage exists. There are big circles with the number 10 inside the circles, and they're painted wherever there's a picture of a bicycle painted on a cycle track. You can't miss them. Please don't accuse me of being a liar, ok?

I'm honestly not sure if the limit you mention applies to cyclists. The bye-law linked to by others refer to vehicles, so that's obviously nothing to do with cyclists. It sounds like the signage on the ground may well refer to that bye-law rather than to cyclists.

Having said that, it's clearly not a good idea to be speeding through a park on a bike. I recall one guy in Marlay Park on one of the evenings during March or April who was really pushing it - on his own, no kids, and going swiftly down busy pathways - no smart at all.

tnegun · 01-07-2020 8:49pm

Hurrache wrote: »

Ah it is when you're on a bike, the token cycle lane is like a rollercoaster with all the ups and downs.

There's always a tweet...
https://twitter.com/BicesterBug/status/1278022669754085377

The cycle lanes along the N4 from Leixlip to M50 are just like that unbelievably poor surface for whats a dedicated and reasonably new lane. I've changed my routes to avoid them almost completely now as they're so poor and I was fed up getting abuse in the shared(Sign posted as such) bus/cycle lane. On a positive note I passed today and I did see the council out with a proper sweeper and couple of guys cleaning the lane something I never saw in 2/3 years of using them.

ewc78 · 01-07-2020 8:59pm

Casey78 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2020/0701/1150834-road-deaths-eu/

I guess Greece is the place to go if you want to cycle, surprised The Netherlands and Denmark are so high for cyclists deaths considering how they are famed for their cycling infrastructure, especially in the Netherlands. Yes there is a higher percentage of people cycling but I assumed it would also be a safer place to cycle because of all the brilliant cycling infrastructure.

Anyway it's good to see Ireland as one of the safest countries in Europe even if one death is too many of course.

Interesting statistics indeed.

dashcamdanny · 01-07-2020 9:08pm

Better Than Christ wrote: »

It's irrelevant because I don't do it. Here's what I do when I get stuck behind a bike on a road like the Stillorgan dual carriageway and it's possible to safely overtake - I indicate, fully change lanes when it's safe to do so, and when I've cleared the obstacle, I indicate again and pull back in. Having already completed the overtake (i.e. I am now in front of the bike), I indicate again and pull in at the bus stop further down the road. I accept that it must be very annoying for the cyclist, but it's perfectly legal, just like cycling in a bus lane.

The bus lane is no better. Full of potholes and as you can see here, nowhere near wide enough for moving buses.

Nope. That driver didn't give enough space while overtaking in the first place, and was already on the brakes before clearing the cyclist. I always make sure I'm well in front before stopping. I've never had any complaints either.

Why are you even arguing with this lot.

If you can get in , in front of them without them hitting you, Stick her into the bus stop.. Let them deal with you instead of the other way around.

I like to keep a least 10 behind me at all times.

They are traffic. Treat them as such. They have brakes.

You are perfectly legally allowed to clearly indicate and pull in, as long as you are in front.

AndrewJRenko · 01-07-2020 9:09pm

dashcamdanny wrote: »

You are perfectly legally allowed to clearly indicate and pull in, as long as you are in front.

Please take some driving lessons before you get behind the wheel again Danny.

inforfun · 01-07-2020 9:12pm

Casey78 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2020/0701/1150834-road-deaths-eu/

I guess Greece is the place to go if you want to cycle, surprised The Netherlands and Denmark are so high for cyclists deaths considering how they are famed for their cycling infrastructure, especially in the Netherlands. Yes there is a higher percentage of people cycling but I assumed it would also be a safer place to cycle because of all the brilliant cycling infrastructure.

Anyway it's good to see Ireland as one of the safest countries in Europe even if one death is too many of course.

In general, the cycling infrastructure is pretty good in The Netherlands.
Doesnt mean it is great everywhere.
Certainly in old city centres it isnt always great.
2018 is also a bit of an "unlucky" pick for The Netherlands. Biggest increase since 1989. 10% up from 2017
https://www.cbs.nl/en-gb/news/2019/16/traffic-death-toll-up-by-11-percent-in-2018

Also... 90 of those cyclist killed were over 75.
Really wonder how many other countries have over 75's still cycling at a rate the Dutch do.

Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

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