Couple in Kildare sentenced over 'one of largest welfare fraud cases

Wheeliebin30 · 23-03-2018 5:51pm #1

http://www.thejournal.ie/court-social-welfare-fraud-3920312-Mar2018/

Couple in Kildare sentenced over 'one of largest welfare fraud cases in the State'
The couple claimed rent allowance to pay off a mortgage that the husband got under a false name.

A 36-YEAR-old man has been jailed for two years and his wife received a three-year suspended sentence for what has been described as one of the largest welfare fraud cases in the State.

The combined fraud totals more than €400,000 and took place over a period of more than eight years.

Kenneth Gboboh and his 41-year-old wife Franca arrived in Ireland from Nigeria in 2006.

Both applied for and began to receive unemployment benefit. Mr Gboboh then established a second identity under the name Patrick Akim and worked as an IT project manager using this name. He also took out a €240,000 mortgage from EBS in 2008 using the name Patrick Akim.

But ruth koppinger tells us theres no welfare fraud?????

Baggly · 23-03-2018 5:52pm

I sense you are trying to tie two points together.

kylith · 23-03-2018 5:59pm

Do banks not look for proof of identity when giving out mortgages?

Greybottle · 23-03-2018 6:01pm

€400,000 for what will be 18 months in a prison, most of it in an open one.

Yep. Crime pays.

Hitman3000 · 23-03-2018 6:06pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

But ruth koppinger tells us theres no welfare fraud?????

Link please.

McGrath5 · 23-03-2018 6:07pm

Will they have to pay any of the money back?

Presumably the now have a highly valuable asset in their name that was paid for by means of deception.

pjohnson · 23-03-2018 6:08pm

I was wondering how long it would take a genius to claim that since these two commited welfare fraud all welfare is undeserved.

It happened in the OP

dr.fuzzenstein · 23-03-2018 6:09pm

kylith wrote: »

Do banks not look for proof of identity when giving out mortgages?

Yes the absolutely foolproof and impossible to forge utility bill. :rolleyes:

kumate_champ07 · 23-03-2018 6:10pm

fraud exists everywhere

mloc123 · 23-03-2018 6:11pm

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Yes the absolutely foolproof and impossible to forge utility bill. :rolleyes:

They look for passport, marriage cert, utility bill, payslips and 6 months bank account statements....

So not just a utility bill. The bill is only used as proof of address, not ID.

Kivaro · 23-03-2018 6:12pm

Turtwig; Did you delete the mob/populist-tainting-welfare-recipients post?

I was going to ask if you thought that the 'mob' in this instance are working people (those who pay tax).

duffysfarm · 23-03-2018 6:12pm

Can't wait till some one blames the bankers or fianna fail for this....

TheShow · 23-03-2018 6:15pm

kylith wrote: »

Do banks not look for proof of identity when giving out mortgages?

They do, but they guy is a fraudster so obviously had legit fake documents for the second identity.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 23-03-2018 6:17pm

pjohnson wrote: »

I was wondering how long it would take a genius to claim that since these two commited welfare fraud all welfare is undeserved.

It happened in the OP

He didn’t say that and how could you have been wondering for any length of time if it was in the op?

august12 · 23-03-2018 6:17pm

McGrath5 wrote:

Presumably the now have a highly valuable asset in their name that was paid for by means of deception.

40,000 arrears on mortgage, house will probably be repossessed and then what happens, they go on the housing/homeless list and guess what, they get rent allowance.

McGrath5 · 23-03-2018 6:21pm

august12 wrote: »

40,000 arrears on mortgage, house will probably be repossessed and then what happens, they go on the housing/homeless list and guess what, they get rent allowance.

Yeah, and we all know how fast repossessions go in this country :rolleyes:

Hitman3000 · 23-03-2018 6:24pm

McGrath5 wrote:

Yeah, and we all know how fast repossessions go in this country

If the house was bought with a mortgage that was obtained fraudulently I think there maybe a different route for the bank to pursue than the standard repossession . Highly unlikely the couple are going to try and fight a case brought by the bank.

Ultimate Seduction · 23-03-2018 6:26pm

Surprised he got a mortgage just under two years after getting here..

kumate_champ07 · 23-03-2018 6:27pm

august12 wrote: »

40,000 arrears on mortgage, house will probably be repossessed and then what happens, they go on the housing/homeless list and guess what, they get rent allowance.

who gets the house, a bank or the state? if its the bank they make a profit on this, and the state loses out again

Hitman3000 · 23-03-2018 6:30pm

kumate_champ07 wrote:

who gets the house, a bank or the state? if its the bank they make a profit on this, and the state loses out again

Why would the state get a house that the EBS technically owns?

Guy:Incognito · 23-03-2018 6:31pm

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

Surprised he got a mortgage just under two years after getting here..

If you can forge official documents you could probably forge a bit of residency history too.......

Your Face · 23-03-2018 6:38pm

Whatever slant one wants to put on this case - its does show that there are serious problems in the welfare system.

NIMAN · 23-03-2018 6:40pm

....in before

"what about the bankers"

backspin. · 23-03-2018 6:40pm

Take the house and send them straight back to Africa after the sentence.

topper75 · 23-03-2018 6:42pm

May as well laugh.

Because, verily I tell thee, as a compliant PAYE Irish taxpayer - you will get damn all else out of this story.

enricoh · 23-03-2018 6:42pm

Best little country in the world to be on the dole.
We are here to be milked and many of our new arrivals are obliging wholeheartedly.
A mates new flame is non national and working away here. She is pestered by some of her fellow countrymen to go on the dole, they rig her up a new identity for it and split it 50/50. Tip of the iceberg stuff imo

ScouseMouse · 23-03-2018 6:43pm

Surely they will have to sell the house and the proceeds can repay EBS with balance to Social Welfare?

Even CAB may take an interest as it is proceeds of crime.

jmayo · 23-03-2018 6:45pm

to do what he did, he mustn't have any rich Nigerian relatives like I have.

But they are a very unlucky lot, always popping their clogs in unfortunate sudden accidents.

Have to say their lawyers are very nice always offering me money.

Atoms for Peace · 23-03-2018 7:04pm

Maybe I'm a racist, but I can't help but not feel a bit riled by thought of how somebody who hasn't been in the country a wet week manages to get a mortgage and social welfare entitlements.

Johnnycanyon · 23-03-2018 7:12pm

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

Maybe I'm a racist, but I can't help but not feel a bit riled by thought of how somebody who wasn't been in the country a wet week manages to get a morgage and social welfare entitlements.

I was thinking the very same thing and also wondering how Nigerians are getting in here in the first place? Is Nigeria not an oil rich country.

Kivaro · 24-03-2018 12:44pm

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

If you can forge official documents you could probably forge a bit of residency history too.......

And with all the forging, lying, and stealing from Irish tax payers, one would have to wonder if there was a possibility of deceit when they applied for asylum in Ireland?

Interesting to note from the Court papers that: “some friends may have advised him” when he came to Ireland before he undertook the fraud.
Would that imply that other Nigerians are also involved in similar scams and yet to be caught?

suicide_circus · 24-03-2018 1:28pm

People always laugh smugly at suggestions of non eu migrants receiving social welfare payments "yeah they all get free prams and taxis lol". Well actually, some do. These stories don't come from nowhere. This couple presumably have irish citizenship (because they love Ireland and the free cash it has given them) at this stage so can't be deported.

suicide_circus · 24-03-2018 1:30pm

Kivaro wrote: »

And with all the forging, lying, and stealing from Irish tax payers, one would have to wonder if there was a possibility of deceit when they applied for asylum in Ireland?

Interesting to note from the Court papers that: “some friends may have advised him” when he came to Ireland before he undertook the fraud.
Would that imply that other Nigerians are also involved in similar scams and yet to be caught?

You can't say dat! There is not a single recorded case in human history of a Nigerian person being involved in fraudulent activity.

James 007 · 24-03-2018 1:47pm

suicide_circus wrote: »

You can't say dat! There is not a single recorded case in human history of a Nigerian person being involved in fraudulent activity.

They are all nice people, really.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmvxYwI_y3U

Gatling · 24-03-2018 1:50pm

august12 wrote: »

40,000 arrears on mortgage, house will probably be repossessed and then what happens, they go on the housing/homeless list and guess what, they get rent allowance.

They were actually already getting rent allowance on the house they owned

punisher5112 · 24-03-2018 1:52pm

Why isn't all assets stripped and sent packing.

Why as a small island are we importing fraudsters, criminals etc.

I'm working and can't get a mortgage.

I've worked since I was 15 and haven't received anything for it apart from a wage.

begbysback · 24-03-2018 1:57pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

Why isn't all assets stripped and sent packing.

Why as a small island are we importing fraudsters, criminals etc.

To be fair though we are exporting a few too, plus they are no comparison to the homegrown ones

punisher5112 · 24-03-2018 1:59pm

begbysback wrote: »

To be fair though we are exporting a few too, plus they are no comparison to the homegrown ones

Well to be fair they are a separate ethnic minority now thanks to the fools in government.

Cantona's Collars · 24-03-2018 2:00pm

suicide_circus wrote: »

People always laugh smugly at suggestions of non eu migrants receiving social welfare payments "yeah they all get free prams and taxis lol". Well actually, some do. These stories don't come from nowhere. This couple presumably have irish citizenship (because they love Ireland and the free cash it has given them) at this stage so can't be deported.

It was mentioned on The Last Word during the week that the highest uptake of citizenship in Ireland is from people who don't come from Europe. Africa had one of the highest rates of citizenship applications.
As much as people will shout to deport them,the odds are that they are citizens of Ireland. If the house is seized then the couple will go straight into local authority housing. Seeing as yer man is working under one alias then I'd refuse any application for social housing and let him go rent his own place out of his own pocket. I'd make him continue working and pay off the debt. If he's made unemployed then he'd only end up paying about €2 a week off the amount he fraudulently received.

Ultimate Seduction · 24-03-2018 2:02pm

begbysback wrote: »

punisher5112 wrote: »

Why isn't all assets stripped and sent packing.

Why as a small island are we importing fraudsters, criminals etc.

To be fair though we are exporting a few too, plus they are no comparison to the homegrown ones

Show me homegrown Irish people with 2 identities and a mortgage of over 400k, and getting rent allowance on there own house that they got with fraudulent mortgage? Doubt it happens often if at all. Seems Nigerians regularly have 2 identities

ChikiChiki · 24-03-2018 2:03pm

We are a very very soft touch. Now back to work plebs, be damn happy you have a job to cover your mortgage and pay your damn taxes. Take a few handy Credit cards and some pcp finance for your 181 Kia Sportage. Now we have you by the balls.

Them social welfare entitlements for fraudsters and scamsters are not growing on trees.

daheff · 24-03-2018 2:04pm

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Yes the absolutely foolproof and impossible to forge utility bill. :rolleyes:

And passport/driving license/ID card

Seems like a kyc problem at the bank. Wonder if anybody got fired?

Cantona's Collars · 24-03-2018 2:11pm

daheff wrote: »

And passport/driving license/ID card

Seems like a kyc problem at the bank. Wonder if anybody got fired?

Take a look at any of those shows on UK TV where people are being pursued for money,the amount of people from Africa with more than one identity is staggering. Loans, utility bills and more in different names yet all the one person.
If fraud is intended then you'd be amazed the lengths people will go to. I suppose the bank did all the checks on one of the identities and this showed adequate income and security while under the other identity the fraudsters were claiming as many social welfare benefits they could get.

CeilingFly · 24-03-2018 2:15pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

Why isn't all assets stripped and sent packing.

Why as a small island are we importing fraudsters, criminals etc.

I'm working and can't get a mortgage.

I've worked since I was 15 and haven't received anything for it apart from a wage.

I assure you, we export plenty of them ourselves - especially of a particular "ethnicity" .

Mark Henderson · 24-03-2018 2:20pm

We are an incredibly soft touch for those who scam us at the top and the bottom. I'm all for building social housing on a massive scale for those who are in employment and are prepared to work. Unfortunately because of years of corrupt FG/FF governance house prices have become out of reach to the majority of those in low to average paid employment thus making the criminal under investment in social housing all the more obvious.

We need a new political party that doesn't pander to vested interests and is interested in improving the lives of those PAYE workers that are the engine of this country.

SCOOP 64 · 24-03-2018 2:29pm

As well as how he done it i would like to know how did he tripped up to get caught, wonder how long he could have got away with it if he didn't.

Will I Am Not · 24-03-2018 2:36pm

Did anybody else guess right after seeing the thread title?

Ursus Horribilis · 24-03-2018 2:37pm

A fairer solution would be to deport this pair before they cost us another penny. Prison is expensive. The rent allowance and social welfare to keep them is expensive. Strip them of whatever residency rights they have and send them back to where they came from.

Will I Am Not · 24-03-2018 2:38pm

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

A fairer solution would be to deport this pair before they cost us another penny. Prison is expensive. The rent allowance and social welfare to keep them is expensive. Strip them of whatever residency rights they have and send them back to where they came from.

Sure they’ll probably come back with new identities :pac:

Ursus Horribilis · 24-03-2018 2:39pm

Will I Am Not wrote: »

Sure they’ll probably come back with new identities :pac:

Perhaps there's a case to be made for microchipping

Idbatterim · 24-03-2018 2:39pm

could the DSP be taken over by a private operation, you would give them a percentage of the savings made?

Id also have financial rewards for tip offs, if they dont already have it...

Couple in Kildare sentenced over 'one of largest welfare fraud cases

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