Property Market 2020

MrMusician18 · 23-05-2020 1:41pm

cnocbui wrote: »

The amount of energy is essentially no different. If you add 10 more houses to an existing route, the An Post driver doesn't drive any further. The amount of time might increase marginally, but could be more than offset by requiring houses to have a roadside mailbox, like I do, rather than most of the farms and houses on my road that don't have one and expect the mail to be delivered to their door.

You get this same nonsense argument endlessly on Boards from the urbanites. Oh, the cost of a one-off house in the country is so much more to society to provide services for. Absolute rubbish. I live in a one-off on a rural road. There was already a power line running down the road, there was already a phone line running down the road, there was already a road, there was already a school. These things are already there, and have to be to service farms. What my living here actually did was average down the cost of providing services to the existing farms. Oh, and I provided my own well and water supply so no cost there.

High density accommodation is great for pandemics, crime and other social aberrations.

You are absolutely 100% incorrect on the cost to service one off housing to society. I've posted at length previously on the topic, and I don't think this thread is the place so won't go further than that.

Back to the topic at hand, I'll be honest and say I would've expected some softening of the rental market by now, but that hasn't happened. The apartment neighbouring ours went on the market at a price I would've considered well overvalued but its gone now and with no real in-person viewings.

Maz2016 · 23-05-2020 2:15pm

Was talking to an estate agent today regarding a 3 bed property I liked. The asking price is 185k. He sent me a video (very detailed in fairness) showing every aspect of the duplex apartment. Even down to where power points/tv points were etc. Told him I was interested. He has arranged a viewing for next week as it’s within the 5k. The current owners and the EA are happy for me to tour the property while the owners wait outside and the EA will be at the door. I asked him was there much interest. He said I’ll be the 4th viewing. I asked about price. He said put it this way - no point going in under 195k. I was a little taken a back. I am a first time buyer so pretty new and I’m experienced but I would have been thinking of offering on the lines of 160-165k as a first offer. Am I deluded?

cnocbui · 23-05-2020 2:22pm

Maz2016 wrote: »

Was talking to an estate agent today regarding a 3 bed property I liked. The asking price is 185k. He sent me a video (very detailed in fairness) showing every aspect of the duplex apartment. Even down to where power points/tv points were etc. Told him I was interested. He has arranged a viewing for next week as it’s within the 5k. The current owners and the EA are happy for me to tour the property while the owners wait outside and the EA will be at the door. I asked him was there much interest. He said I’ll be the 4th viewing. I asked about price. He said put it this way - no point going in under 195k. I was a little taken a back. I am a first time buyer so pretty new and I’m experienced but I would have been thinking of offering on the lines of 160-165k as a first offer. Am I deluded?

Work out what it would cost you to buy a piece of land and have someone build something on it with the same floor area to the same level of finish, and you will have your answer.

retalivity · 23-05-2020 2:24pm

Maz2016 wrote: »

Was talking to an estate agent today regarding a 3 bed property I liked. The asking price is 185k. He sent me a video (very detailed in fairness) showing every aspect of the duplex apartment. Even down to where power points/tv points were etc. Told him I was interested. He has arranged a viewing for next week as it’s within the 5k. The current owners and the EA are happy for me to tour the property while the owners wait outside and the EA will be at the door. I asked him was there much interest. He said I’ll be the 4th viewing. I asked about price. He said put it this way - no point going in under 195k. I was a little taken a back. I am a first time buyer so pretty new and I’m experienced but I would have been thinking of offering on the lines of 160-165k as a first offer. Am I deluded?

The EA is working for the seller, not you.
Offer what you think is a fair price, and see the response.

Umaro · 23-05-2020 2:45pm

cnocbui wrote: »

Work out what it would cost you to buy a piece of land and have someone build something on it with the same floor area to the same level of finish, and you will have your answer.

Why would you compare the purchase of a second-hand apartment that could've been built 30 years ago, with building a house from scratch? Am I missing something?

Alrigghtythen · 23-05-2020 3:02pm

Maz2016 wrote: »

Was talking to an estate agent today regarding a 3 bed property I liked. The asking price is 185k. He sent me a video (very detailed in fairness) showing every aspect of the duplex apartment. Even down to where power points/tv points were etc. Told him I was interested. He has arranged a viewing for next week as it’s within the 5k. The current owners and the EA are happy for me to tour the property while the owners wait outside and the EA will be at the door. I asked him was there much interest. He said I’ll be the 4th viewing. I asked about price. He said put it this way - no point going in under 195k. I was a little taken a back. I am a first time buyer so pretty new and I’m experienced but I would have been thinking of offering on the lines of 160-165k as a first offer. Am I deluded?

Compare it to what else is going for 165000 assess if they also meet your requirements with regards to bedrooms, garden, location, etc. If yes, 165,000.

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 3:29pm

Julissa Bitter Jeep wrote: »

So you've no incentive to get the best price possible for your client?

There's no such thing as "the best possible price" - there is the market price as determined by what the highest bidder is willing to pay. Estate agents facilitate offers to be made on properties. The idea that the market value of an asset varies by whom the agent is charged with selling it is a nonsense in our view.
Every agent brings the market price to the vendor. The vendor decides to accept or reject that.

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 3:40pm

Maz2016 wrote: »

Was talking to an estate agent today regarding a 3 bed property I liked. The asking price is 185k. He sent me a video (very detailed in fairness) showing every aspect of the duplex apartment. Even down to where power points/tv points were etc. Told him I was interested. He has arranged a viewing for next week as it’s within the 5k. The current owners and the EA are happy for me to tour the property while the owners wait outside and the EA will be at the door. I asked him was there much interest. He said I’ll be the 4th viewing. I asked about price. He said put it this way - no point going in under 195k. I was a little taken a back. I am a first time buyer so pretty new and I’m experienced but I would have been thinking of offering on the lines of 160-165k as a first offer. Am I deluded?

Be sure to ask the estate agent to email you the current situation in relation to offers ie what, if any, offers are there currently on the property. Get this in writing as an unscrupulous agent may say there are offers when there are not. This is known as "ghost bidding." If there are no offers on the property, then obviously don't offer over the asking price.

Maz2016 · 23-05-2020 3:42pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

Be sure to ask the estate agent to email you the current situation in relation to offers ie what, if any, offers are there currently on the property. Get this in writing as an unscrupulous agent may say there are offers when there are not. This is known as "ghost bidding." If there are no offers on the property, then obviously don't offer over the asking price.

Good advice , thanks.

c.p.w.g.w · 23-05-2020 3:53pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

Be sure to ask the estate agent to email you the current situation in relation to offers ie what, if any, offers are there currently on the property. Get this in writing as an unscrupulous agent may say there are offers when there are not. This is known as "ghost bidding." If there are no offers on the property, then obviously don't offer over the asking price.

Good luck trying to get an estate agent doing that tho. I was looking a gaff before Xmas last year, made an offer and was declined and I asked for the above and they rang me back to literally laugh at my request...house is still for sale and my buddy who was selling didn't go with this EA

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 3:59pm

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

Good luck trying to get an estate agent doing that tho. I was looking a gaff before Xmas last year, made an offer and was declined and I asked for the above and they rang me back to literally laugh at my request...house is still for sale and my buddy who was selling didn't go with this EA

All estate agents in Ireland are regulated by the PSRA. We are required by law to disclose the current offers on a property. We put all latest offers on our website and think that every estate agent should do this.

23-05-2020 4:13pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

All estate agents in Ireland are regulated by the PSRA. We are required by law to disclose the current offers on a property. We put all latest offers on our website and think that every estate agent should do this.

I think you are doing a bit of shilling here auctioneera. By law you are required to keep a record of bids, are you required to give in to bidders in writing?

Graham · 23-05-2020 4:13pm

Mod Note

Auctioneera, please limit your posts to responding to specific questions or mentions of Auctioneera.

Any posts outside of this will be deleted.

Donald Trump · 23-05-2020 4:22pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

There's no such thing as "the best possible price" - there is the market price as determined by what the highest bidder is willing to pay. Estate agents facilitate offers to be made on properties. The idea that the market value of an asset varies by whom the agent is charged with selling it is a nonsense in our view.
Every agent brings the market price to the vendor. The vendor decides to accept or reject that.

You are hardly doing a good job of advertising your own business with "come to us. we'll won't do any better than the others"

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 4:27pm

Dav010 wrote: »

I think you are doing a bit of shilling here auctioneera. By law you are required to keep a record of bids, are you required to give in to bidders in writing?

We are obliged to disclose the current bidding situation yes. If someone asks us, or any agent, "are there any offers?" we must answer that question truthfully....as you would expect.

EagerBeaverton · 23-05-2020 4:31pm

Dav010 wrote: »

I think you are doing a bit of shilling here auctioneera. By law you are required to keep a record of bids, are you required to give in to bidders in writing?

Good question, be interested to know that myself particularly if it's law to provide that info in writing/email. Also a good reason why it's useful to have an actual EA here who can provide potentially verifiable information to us that we might not have known about.

Donald Trump wrote: »

You are hardly doing a good job of advertising your own business with "come to us. we'll won't do any better than the others"

In fairness to them they're being transparent about their business model. EAs get a lot of flack but they're upfront about their offering. Horses for courses.

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 4:31pm

Donald Trump wrote: »

You are hardly doing a good job of advertising your own business with "come to us. we'll won't do any better than the others"

Our view is that the market (the bidders) determine the price a property sells for, not the estate agent. You wouldn't expect to pay a different price for a share in a company for example, depending on the broker through which you bought it - why is a house any different. The market determines the price, not the agent.
We charge a lower price than other agents so we let our vendors keep more of the value of their property.

EagerBeaverton · 23-05-2020 4:38pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

We are obliged to disclose the current bidding situation yes. If someone asks us, or any agent, "are there any offers?" we must answer that question truthfully....as you would expect.

Is it a requirement to provide that information in writing / email so there's a record that the PSRA can check against the EAs own records if a complaint of suspected ghost bidding was made?

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 4:45pm

EagerBeaverton wrote: »

Is it a requirement to provide that information in writing / email so there's a record that the PSRA can check against the EAs own records if a complaint of suspected ghost bidding was made?

An agent can provide the information verbally over the phone. However, I would request it in writing myself if I was buying as I think if an agent was inclined to ghost bid, he would prefer to do that over the phone as opposed to in writing.
Sorry if I caused confusion: there is no requirement to email the latest bidding position - you can do that over the phone. I was advising that you should ask for it in writing.
In fairness, the vast, vast majority of agents won't ghost bid anyway as that would risk their license, reputation and so their livelihood.

Mic 1972 · 23-05-2020 5:17pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

All estate agents in Ireland are regulated by the PSRA. We are required by law to disclose the current offers on a property. We put all latest offers on our website and think that every estate agent should do this.

An agent told me the current offer over the phone, when i said I wasn't interested in viewing the property because the offer was too high he sounded surprised, i had a feeling that he gave some bull**** figure over the phone and probably regretted it because I lost interest in the property
<SNIP>

Donald Trump · 23-05-2020 5:21pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

Our view is that the market (the bidders) determine the price a property sells for, not the estate agent. You wouldn't expect to pay a different price for a share in a company for example, depending on the broker through which you bought it - why is a house any different. The market determines the price, not the agent.
We charge a lower price than other agents so we let our vendors keep more of the value of their property.

Bidders have to know about the property though. You need to know where to advertise it. That probably isn't as important for residential houses. And they have to be convinced of the merits of buying it. Certain Estate agents might have built up lists of people looking to buy that type of property too (depending on the type).

Cyrus · 23-05-2020 7:24pm

PokeHerKing wrote: »

1.2 million would buy close to 100% of properties in Enniskerry currently on my home.

How many are big detached houses on a 2 acre site ?

Graham · 23-05-2020 8:30pm

Mod Note

folks, I've deleted a few completely off-topic posts.

Welcome back to the Property Market 2020 thread

hurikane · 23-05-2020 10:58pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

Fair play Graham - deleting an interesting, engaging, informative and stimulating conversation. Nice job

Your posting style and attitude, would put me off ever using your service.

Icepick · 23-05-2020 11:10pm

Auctioneera wrote: »

Our view is that the market (the bidders) determine the price a property sells for, not the estate agent. You wouldn't expect to pay a different price for a share in a company for example, depending on the broker through which you bought it - why is a house any different. The market determines the price, not the agent.
We charge a lower price than other agents so we let our vendors keep more of the value of their property.

There is only two ways this can go. You either can't offer the same services as other agents or you never grow and can't attract the best talent.

q85dw7osi4lebg · 23-05-2020 11:39pm

hurikane wrote: »

Your posting style and attitude, would put me off ever using your service.

Likewise. Bizarre posts. Will stick with SF & the main agents myself !

Auctioneera · 23-05-2020 11:57pm

Julissa Bitter Jeep wrote: »

Likewise. Bizarre posts. Will stick with SF & the main agents myself !

Fair enough. We think paying several thousand Euro to sell a property is illogical. But that's what makes a market. Differences of opinion. I don't think any of our posts were "bizarre" though in fairness. We engaged meaningfully in the discussion. So we respectfully disagree with you paying SF et al so much.
We think we will ultimately become the main agent...but we would say that of course.

Auctioneera · 24-05-2020 12:00am

Icepick wrote: »

There is only two ways this can go. You either can't offer the same services as other agents or you never grow and can't attract the best talent.

I would politely encourage you to search for "auctioneera reviews" on google to see the opinion of those who have used our service to date. We think the market will ultimately eschew the high priced agencies in favour of ourselves. But of course we respect your different opinion. The market will ultimately decide.

q85dw7osi4lebg · 24-05-2020 12:07am

Auctioneera wrote: »

Fair enough. We think paying several thousand Euro to sell a property is illogical. But that's what makes a market. Differences of opinion. I don't think any of our posts were "bizarre" though in fairness. We engaged meaningfully in the discussion. So we respectfully disagree with you paying SF et al so much.
We think we will ultimately become the main agent...but we would say that of course.

You don't have a new business model. It's been tried and tested the world over, and there's a reason fees in the states remain a whopping 5-6% while in Ireland they are a measly .75-1.75%. you really do get what you pay for IMO.

It's not all about cost. Is all you grocery shopping from a retailers own brand because it's cheap?

q85dw7osi4lebg · 24-05-2020 12:10am

192 properties listed as sold, 96 Google reviews, that's some hit rate for reviews, congrats.

hurikane · 24-05-2020 12:16am

Julissa Bitter Jeep wrote: »

Likewise. Bizarre posts. Will stick with SF & the main agents myself !

It’s like an estate agent with a Conor McGregor type persona.

Does anyone remember privateseller.ie?

Empty_Space · 24-05-2020 1:22am

I can't get over auctioneras condescending and patronizing tone. It's a train wreck since they decided to join this threadðŸ˜‚.

Can they be removed for their own good and the good of the forum. Sick of reading them in every second post.

Graham · 24-05-2020 1:41am

Mod Note

on that note. A friendly reminder the discussion is Property Market 2020.

Any further off-topic posts will be deleted/infracted or result in a thread ban. If you have an issue with a post, please report it.

This applies to ALL posters.

celtic_oz · 24-05-2020 9:15am

I'm thinking there's some anxiety in this thread .. where do you think we are ?

combat14 · 24-05-2020 9:22am

celtic_oz wrote: »

I'm thinking there's some anxiety in this thread .. where do you think we are ?

Some denial too

addaword · 24-05-2020 12:56pm

celtic_oz wrote: »

I'm thinking there's some anxiety in this thread .. where do you think we are ?

At the anxiety stage. Prices have a lot to drop yet.

Graham · 24-05-2020 12:59pm

addaword wrote: »

At the anxiety stage. Prices have a lot to drop yet.

There's an entire "market completely frozen" point missing on that chart!

Hubertj · 24-05-2020 1:00pm

combat14 wrote: »

Some denial too

Egypt?

Mic 1972 · 24-05-2020 1:22pm

kippy wrote: »

To support those that can't...... Among other reasons.

If I could afford a house being single with an average salary anybody can, but most people aren't willing to make sacrifices

Captainsatnav · 24-05-2020 1:24pm

Mic 1972 wrote: »

If I could afford a house being single with an average salary anybody can, but most people aren't willing to make sacrifices

This old chestnut agian.

If only I could kick my blasted avocado habit...then I could buy a house. Oh well...

Mic 1972 · 24-05-2020 1:26pm

Captainsatnav wrote: »

This old chestnut agian.

If only I could kick my blasted avocado habit...then I could buy a house. Oh well...

self entitlement isn't going to help, that's for sure

The_Conductor · 24-05-2020 1:48pm

Mic 1972 wrote: »

self entitlement isn't going to help, that's for sure

Some people are willing to make sacrifices that others consider too extreme or excessive. I never really 'got' that whole avocado thing- but there are people out there who smoke, drink, have gym memberships, decent VHI, Sky packages, iPhone 11s, regularly eat take-aways, go on 1-2 sun holidays a year etc. Then there are people who don't do any of these things.

People have a reasonable expectation to 'live' however, living and what are reasonable norms- will differ from person to person.

A singleton on a reasonable wage- could, if properly focused, save as much as an average couple on similar wages- but the singleton would be exceptional- and the couple would be using a chunk of their disposable income towards living expenses that the singleton might only dream about.

Swings and round-abouts. You only live once.

Experience_day · 24-05-2020 2:28pm

Mic 1972 wrote: »

If I could afford a house being single with an average salary anybody can, but most people aren't willing to make sacrifices

This. I didn't have TV, drank in rather than out, drove a 15 year old car and rented in a shít hole. Contrasted with my colleagues and peers who were out partying, nicer apartments etc.

Obviously no one shoe fits all but lots of those same friends and colleagues are bitching about not being able to afford places etc.

cnocbui · 24-05-2020 3:11pm

Captainsatnav wrote: »

This old chestnut agian.

If only I could kick my blasted avocado habit...then I could buy a house. Oh well...

Yeah, that old chestnut saw me buying my first house with a 65% deposit and paying the mortgage off within a year. But I didn't go on holidays, drink, smoke or spend money on having a good time, or drive a car that was less than 10 years old.

I certainly didn't buy a nice new build, I bought a relative dump.

awec · 24-05-2020 3:12pm

In fairness subjecting yourself to an utterly miserable existence shouldn’t be a prerequisite to buying a home.

I always found the avocado toast thing to be pretty patronising.

The_Conductor · 24-05-2020 3:13pm

awec wrote: »

In fairness subjecting yourself to an utterly miserable existence shouldn’t be a prerequisite to buying a home.

I agree.
Life is short enough- without spending a chunk of it in sheer misery.

cnocbui · 24-05-2020 3:45pm

awec wrote: »

In fairness subjecting yourself to an utterly miserable existence shouldn’t be a prerequisite to buying a home.

I always found the avocado toast thing to be pretty patronising.

The_Conductor wrote: »

I agree.
Life is short enough- without spending a chunk of it in sheer misery.

The dump I bought had 3" flying cockroaches courtesy of the US, a few German cockroaches, and then there were the normal ones. Bull ants would come and go as they pleased. It had no insulation what so ever, so when it was 3° in the morning outside it was 4° in the bedroom when you got up and when it was 30° at 1 am in the morning you sprayed water on towels in the bedroom and had a fan blowing over them just to be able to get to sleep. And guess what, I wasn't miserable, because I never thought I was entitled to better at that age.

Yeah, too much hardship for you lot, that life's to short trope. But you know what, I was only in there for two years and then sold it for 65% more than I paid for it. Now I own two properties, the one I live in has a lovely view, is roomy, no neighbours, no crime, and I haven't had a mortgage for a decade.

I don't regret the cockroaches, massive huntsman spiders or ants or the sloping floor one bit. There is a reason other countries refer to a property ladder - one rung at a time. You want a property elevator, fair do's if you can pull it off, I'd rather be free of a mortgage before I was 30.

Mic 1972 · 24-05-2020 3:45pm

awec wrote: »

In fairness subjecting yourself to an utterly miserable existence shouldn’t be a prerequisite to buying a home.

I always found the avocado toast thing to be pretty patronising.

Utterly miserable is not how I would describe my life, I can have fun without getting plastered at the pubs every week end, and I dont drive an expensive car and during my rent years I was sharing instead of having the place to myself

Now I'm mortgage free and planning to buy a second property. I would feel miserable if I was still paying rent or mortgage at my age

Mic 1972 · 24-05-2020 3:48pm

The_Conductor wrote: »

I agree.
Life is short enough- without spending a chunk of it in sheer misery.

A life spent complaining about high rent and greedy LLS doesn't sound much fun to me

Captainsatnav · 24-05-2020 3:53pm

cnocbui wrote: »

Yeah, that old chestnut saw me buying my first house with a 65% deposit and paying the mortgage off within a year. But I didn't go on holidays, drink, smoke or spend money on having a good time, or drive a car that was less than 10 years old.

I certainly didn't buy a nice new build, I bought a relative dump.

Fair play

Property Market 2020

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