BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

KD345 · 11-09-2018 12:23pm

MJohnston wrote: »

As has been pointed out - if they're getting on Liffey Valley, they're not going to have any good reason for getting on a 14 bus anyway, other than because they are specifically going to somewhere within Chapelizod. From LV, they can get the S4 route, or, more importantly, the entire C spine (which has a 3 minute peak frequency).

This 14 + Chapelizod issue is a complete non-issue, from the looks of the facts.

If you look at the Kennelsfort Road stop on the N4, at morning peak there is already a 3 minute frequency. Capacity is a big issue here.

At the moment the 26 only operates from Palmerstown Cemetery and is full by Chapelizod. Such was the problem, the NTA approved Dublin Bus to add additional route 26 departures from West County Hotel to help.

I think solution here is to increase the frequency of the 14 to deal with these loads. Dismissing it as a non-issue does not help here, if people cannot get on a bus then this plan will fail.

Podge_irl · 11-09-2018 1:00pm

The 14 is going to be every 15 mins at peak though, which matches the 26 service (including the extra departures). Maybe a slightly higher frequency than that is needed, that is something the consultation will highlight if it is such an issue.

Wheety · 11-09-2018 1:14pm

Podge_irl wrote: »

The 14 is going to be every 15 mins at peak though, which matches the 26 service (including the extra departures). Maybe a slightly higher frequency than that is needed, that is something the consultation will highlight if it is such an issue.

Even an extra few 14s starting at the West County at rush hour would make a massive difference. I'm not even in Chapilizod so I'm not just arguing for my own route to be given preferential treatment but I have seen how bad it can get.

I've often waited while 5 or 6 buses go past packed, both Chapilizod buses and bypass buses, but at least I have a choice.

CatInABox · 11-09-2018 1:59pm

Wheety wrote: »

Forget about Liffey Valley. The 26 can fill up at the first stop in Palmerstown some mornings.

People on the 14 will be better off getting off at Palmerstown bypass and getting onto one of the C spine buses into town, avoiding Chapelizod and Islandbridge altogether.

The entire purpose of the 14 along Kennelsfort Rd is to get people in that area to the C spine, not to get them into town.

Wheety · 11-09-2018 2:05pm

CatInABox wrote: »

People on the 14 will be better off getting off at Palmerstown bypass and getting onto one of the C spine buses into town, avoiding Chapelizod and Islandbridge altogether.

The entire purpose of the 14 along Kennelsfort Rd is to get people in that area to the C spine, not to get them into town.

Just because it's better does not mean it will happen.

MJohnston · 11-09-2018 2:34pm

Wheety wrote: »

Forget about Liffey Valley. The 26 can fill up at the first stop in Palmerstown some mornings.

I love how people who don't live in the area can say it's a non issue and what are these facts you speak of?

Some mornings I've gotten a bus which goes through Chapilizod and there are more than 20 people waiting at the bus stop at the school. There are 3 Chapilizod stops before the school too.

Right now if you get the 26 at the terminus in Palmerstown, you have a couple of other options too - there's a few different services that go to the city centre along the N4 bypass, but most of them detour through Chapelizod, and there is an okay frequency on each route, but they aren't synchronised, so there's a lot of frequency overlap. You can also walk down to the Ballyfermot Road and get on a bus there, but there's only 3 routes, and only 1 with decent frequency.

Under BusConnects, from that same terminus in Palmerstown, you could walk to the N4 bypass (which, from my experience of Palmerstown traffic would be faster than taking the bus that same short distance) and you'll have access to the full C-spine route, which will strive to synchronise to avoid overlap, and therefore provide a 3 minute frequency, and the route uses the full bypass rather than going through Chapelizod. You can also walk down to the Ballyfermot Road, where there will now only be 2 routes (S4 and G2), but both with higher frequencies, combining to offer another high frequency connection to the city (with the S4 you'll eventually have to switch in Ballyfermot village to a G-spine bus, but there frequency will be 6 minutes). You can also get on the 14 which will take the Chapelizod detour and go into town after that (and you can use the 14 to get to both the N4 and the Ballyfermot Road where those spine routes await).

So in comparison, right now the 26 is the no-brainer option for people living in Palmerstown, as there aren't really any more direct options (25a/25b aside) available to them - so most people take the 26, so it gets packed out, so it appears to be constantly full through Chapelizod. Under BusConnects, the C and G routes will be much more attractive options than the 14 being both higher frequency and importantly having faster journey times. So many more people will go to them, either walking directly or using the 14 to connect to them. This will reduce the pressure on the 14, and free up capacity for passengers from Chapelizod who need to use it.

Whether the frequency of the 14 should be increased or not is another question - but imo it's super clear that there will be a big reduction in passengers coming into Chapelizod from further out on the 14 compared to the existing situation.

Wheety · 11-09-2018 3:36pm

We're on opposite sides of this and obviously not going to change each others opinions here. I just don't think people are going to change their habits. Some people will just hop on the 14 outside their estate (Woodfarm) and stay on it. Even more will do it when it's cold and wet.

We're just going around in circles so I'll leave that as my final word on it.

schemingbohemia · 11-09-2018 4:11pm

Wheety wrote: »

We're on opposite sides of this and obviously not going to change each others opinions here. I just don't think people are going to change their habits. Some people will just hop on the 14 outside their estate (Woodfarm) and stay on it. Even more will do it when it's cold and wet.

We're just going around in circles so I'll leave that as my final word on it.

Plastic Bags
Smoking in pubs
Wearing Seatbelts
The list goes on, people complain do the usual chicken-licken approach and then adapt, it's why we're not living in caves any more.

ThunbergsAreGo · 12-09-2018 8:41am

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Plastic Bags
Smoking in pubs
Wearing Seatbelts
The list goes on, people complain do the usual chicken-licken approach and then adapt, it's why we're not living in caves any more.

You are comparing complying with laws to people's transport preferences........

schemingbohemia · 12-09-2018 10:46am

Wheety wrote: »

Even an extra few 14s starting at the West County at rush hour would make a massive difference. I'm not even in Chapilizod so I'm not just arguing for my own route to be given preferential treatment but I have seen how bad it can get.

I've often waited while 5 or 6 buses go past packed, both Chapilizod buses and bypass buses, but at least I have a choice.

So you currently have a choice of which bus you can't get on? That's not much of a choice.
The new routing will give you a much better chance of actually getting on a bus rather than watching them go past full and yet you're opposed to this.
You will also have the option of going the opposite direction and getting onto a C bus or walking to get a C bus, they seem to me like better options than the current set-up where you have a 1 in 5 chance of getting on a bus in Chapelizod.

Wheety · 12-09-2018 11:33am

schemingbohemia wrote: »

So you currently have a choice of which bus you can't get on? That's not much of a choice.
The new routing will give you a much better chance of actually getting on a bus rather than watching them go past full and yet you're opposed to this.
You will also have the option of going the opposite direction and getting onto a C bus or walking to get a C bus, they seem to me like better options than the current set-up where you have a 1 in 5 chance of getting on a bus in Chapelizod.

I'm not in Chapilizod. I should be fine because I have a choice of buses. I didn't say I was opposed to BusConnects, I just think the people in Chapilizod are being screwed and their concerns are being dismissed by people who don't even live in the area.

I currently have a choice of 25, 25A, 25B, 25X, 26, 51D, 66, 66X, 67, 67X. These can be on the RTPI as 3 due in the next minute, then another 2 within 5 minutes and then buses every few minutes after that. They are still packed and not stopping. If this happens and a 14 comes along with space, I can guarantee you people will get on at Palmerstown.

MJohnston · 12-09-2018 11:57am

Wheety wrote: »

I'm not in Chapilizod. I should be fine because I have a choice of buses. I didn't say I was opposed to BusConnects, I just think the people in Chapilizod are being screwed and their concerns are being dismissed by people who don't even live in the area.

I currently have a choice of 25, 25A, 25B, 25X, 26, 51D, 66, 66X, 67, 67X. These can be on the RTPI as 3 due in the next minute, then another 2 within 5 minutes and then buses every few minutes after that. They are still packed and not stopping. If this happens and a 14 comes along with space, I can guarantee you people will get on at Palmerstown.

The concerns aren't being dismissed at all - you and some of us just have a fundamental difference of opinion as to whether people will make small adjustments to their commuting behaviour.

Also notable is that what you're talking about for the current situation doesn't solve anything for people in Chapelizod either. If all those routes are currently packed, forcing them to go through Chapelizod without being able to stop and pick anyone up doesn't add any value.

LeinsterDub · 12-09-2018 12:05pm

naughtb4 wrote: »

You are comparing complying with laws to people's transport preferences........

People used to transfer on the trams in Dublin
People used to expect food on a flight
People used to expect to bring their bags for free
People used to not get the Luas
People used to not get the Dart

Wheety · 12-09-2018 12:08pm

MJohnston wrote: »

The concerns aren't being dismissed at all - you and some of us just have a fundamental difference of opinion as to whether people will make small adjustments to their commuting behaviour.

Also notable is that what you're talking about for the current situation doesn't solve anything for people in Chapelizod either. If all those routes are currently packed, forcing them to go through Chapelizod without being able to stop and pick anyone up doesn't add any value.

Cutting it from 25, 26, 66 and 67 to one bus can't help. While I said several buses go past packed, the 4 buses above stop sometimes to allow people on in Palmerstown.

And I know you'll say everyone will just get a bypass bus under the new system and won't be on the 14. But there are large queues at the 2 stops in Palmertown before the fork every day.

I said I wouldn't be back, but just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!

LeinsterDub · 12-09-2018 12:16pm

hmmm wrote: »

10-15 minutes best case. Do you think people are going to get off a bus in bad weather, queue at a location which potentially is exposed to the elements, and take their chances at getting on another bus?

Apparently we are supposed to trust our transport planners will have the infrastructure in place at the time this plan is launched, and we won't all be standing out in the rain waiting for non-existent buses.

The more I think about this plan, the less I like it. I don't trust our transport planners, certainly not after the cross-city shambles and the way bus passengers were treated, and I'm not alone in this.

Your essentially saying you're opposed to all change. Not a particularity helpful stance.

LeinsterDub · 12-09-2018 12:20pm

Wheety wrote: »

Even an extra few 14s starting at the West County at rush hour would make a massive difference. I'm not even in Chapilizod so I'm not just arguing for my own route to be given preferential treatment but I have seen how bad it can get.

I've often waited while 5 or 6 buses go past packed, both Chapilizod buses and bypass buses, but at least I have a choice.

And how many of those on the buses where taking the 14 not because it went where the needed but because it was their only option
And how many of those on the buses where taking the 14 not because it the quickest option because it was cheaper than taking the Luas or the Dart.

Wheety · 12-09-2018 12:32pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

And how many of those on the buses where taking the 14 not because it went where the needed but because it was their only option
And how many of those on the buses where taking the 14 not because it the quickest option because it was cheaper than taking the Luas or the Dart.

The 14 I'm talking about is the new route under Busconnects so there is no Luas or Dart near the route.

I'm not sure what your first sentence is about because the new 14 could be people's only choice if several of the C buses go past packed.

LeinsterDub · 12-09-2018 1:05pm

Wheety wrote: »

The 14 I'm talking about is the new route under Busconnects so there is no Luas or Dart near the route.

I'm not sure what your first sentence is about because the new 14 could be people's only choice if several of the C buses go past packed.

Sorry , I thought you were referring to the existing 14. Both the 14 and the C meet commuter trains and the Luas at Island Bridge

Because BusConnects has both orbitals and free interchanges . People will be able to get the bus they want to quickest interchange instead of having to go to town.

Wheety · 12-09-2018 1:26pm

In theory.

Dublin Bus will still be running the buses. Another issue which will crop up is when a bus doesn't run 'due to operational reasons'. This has happened on the 26 at least 5 times over the last few weeks when I have been going home from work. If it's your only bus, you're kinda stuck.

(I haven't changed my opinion on how Chapilizod will be affected by Busconnects but I'm just gong around in circles here.)

Peregrine · 12-09-2018 1:26pm

Wheety wrote: »

People in Chapilizod are up in arms as this will now be their only bus. The buses are currently full to capacity before Chapilizod. We're being told that the people getting on the 14 before Chapilizod will simply hop off on the N4 and get a bypass bus.

You have to be very naive to believe that will actually happen. If someone has a seat on the 14, they will stay where they are, especially if it's wet and cold out. It's not like the bypass saves you a huge amount of time, maybe 10 or 15 minutes.

I've held my tongue for a bit but I just can't let this one go.

If there was a metro line built along the C spine instead, we'd have you claiming that people will continue to get the long winded bus route through Chapelizod instead of walking 5 mins to get the metro.

Or that the the passenger numbers on the two Luas lines are an illusion and that everyone is actually still getting their local bus.

Habits change when better options are made available to them. We can discuss capacity issues at Chapelizod but the idea that people's commutting habits will remain set in stone even at the face of great change is pure nonsense and isn't something we should be entertaining.

Wheety · 12-09-2018 1:32pm

Peregrine wrote: »

If there was a metro line built along the C spine instead, we'd have you claiming that people will continue to get the long winded bus route through Chapelizod instead of walking 5 mins to get the metro.

Or that the the passenger numbers on the two Luas lines are an illusion and that everyone is actually still getting their local bus.

Habits change when better options are made available to them. We can discuss capacity issues at Chapelizod but the idea that people's commutting habits will remain set in stone even at the face of great change is pure nonsense and isn't something we should be entertaining.

The first 2 paragraphs are nonsense.

It's not going to be 'great change'. People can walk down tomorrow morning and get a bypass bus but they still get the 26.

And you're not going to 'entertain' a difference of opinion? :rolleyes:

MJohnston · 12-09-2018 1:52pm

Wheety wrote: »

Cutting it from 25, 26, 66 and 67 to one bus can't help. While I said several buses go past packed, the 4 buses above stop sometimes to allow people on in Palmerstown.

And I know you'll say everyone will just get a bypass bus under the new system and won't be on the 14. But there are large queues at the 2 stops in Palmertown before the fork every day.

I said I wouldn't be back, but just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!

But the bolded bit is a big miscategorization of what is actually happening. It's a surface level interpretation that doesn't take into account the more subtle issues that the rest of us have mentioned.

I presume by "before the fork" you mean the Kennelsfort Road, but I already mentioned the rationale that I see there. People on that road currently use the 26 because there's no point walking to the N4 for other services - either those services already follow the exact same slower path into the city as the 26 (ie. via Chapelizod), or there's not enough frequency on the two services (25a and b) that use the quicker route via the N4 bypass instead. So, of course you're going to jump on the 26.

But in BusConnects, you'll be able to walk 5 minutes to the N4 and jump on a C-spine bus, all of which will use the quicker N4 bypass route. I believe that most Palmerstown people will be attracted to do this for two reasons, first is that as someone said, there's possibly a 10-15 minute time saving by taking a bus that uses the N4 bypass; second is that the traffic from Kennelsfort onto the N4 is bad enough that walking to the N4 is usually quicker than taking the bus that same distance.

So the 14 will have less pressure on it from Palmerstown passengers compared to the 26. And additionally, while the 26 is currently strictly a 30 minute frequency service, the 14 will have a 15 minute frequency between 7-9am and 3-6pm. So there's an increased number of buses available to the people of Palmerstown and Chapelizod.

By the way, in addition to the proposed 3 minute frequency of the C-spine routes on the N4 at Palmerstown, there will be peak-only routes for the 321, 322, 323, 324, 325, and the 326 all passing through and stopping in Palmerstown on the N4 - this will add an extra 16 buses stopping at Palmerstown between 7am and 8am during the week. So that 3 minute frequency could well end up being even better, or at least with higher capacities for passengers.

MJohnston · 12-09-2018 1:53pm

Wheety wrote: »

The first 2 paragraphs are nonsense.

It's not going to be 'great change'. People can walk down tomorrow morning and get a bypass bus but they still get the 26.

And you're not going to 'entertain' a difference of opinion? :rolleyes:

As I just pointed out in the post above this, there's no point currently in walking to the bypass, as the options there, with only 2 exceptions, go through Chapelizod too. They won't in future, so there will be much more reason to walk to the bypass.

jd · 14-09-2018 9:57pm

Hugh Cregan (NTA) confirmed to local politicians that in the next design iteration the proposed C1 will go through Sandymount Village, and not take the coast road.

Qrt · 16-09-2018 1:08pm

Does anybody know if there's any indication that the new bus corridors will have high degree speed of priority? As in similar levels to the luas, where it arrives and usually goes through without stopping or just stopping for a short period? I was on the bus to Swords yesterday and the time it spent waiting at lights was awfully high.

AlekSmart · 16-09-2018 1:14pm

jd wrote: »

Hugh Cregan (NTA) confirmed to local politicians that in the next design iteration the proposed C1 will go through Sandymount Village, and not take the coast road.

Presumably Hugh is going to finally impliment measures to eradicate the continual and,by now,historic disregard for Parking Regulations endemic to Sandymount Village ?

If he is'nt,then he can kiss goodbye to the C1 offering ANY improvement over the 1,2 & 3 routes of old

punisher5112 · 16-09-2018 1:45pm

Qrt wrote: »

Does anybody know if there's any indication that the new bus corridors will have high degree speed of priority? As in similar levels to the luas, where it arrives and usually goes through without stopping or just stopping for a short period? I was on the bus to Swords yesterday and the time it spent waiting at lights was awfully high.

This technology has been around for years but there is no push to use it.

So much could be done to prioritize buses and hold cars back to give a safe space and a clear run.

Look at rathmines, Rathgar road for example they have lights to hold cars back to allow buses out but they don't do anything but stay green for everyone.

Sam Russell · 16-09-2018 1:50pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

This technology has been around for years but there is no push to use it.

So much could be done to prioritize buses and hold cars back to give a safe space and a clear run.

Look at rathmines, Rathgar road for example they have lights to hold cars back to allow buses out but they don't do anything but stay green for everyone.

Actually, all they need to do is make it that a bus pulling out from a stop has priority absolutely, and in the event of an accident, the other driver has to prove the bus driver acted 'recklessly'. So a bus indicated to pull out causes vehicles behind to give way, just like they do for blue flashing lights.

Also, traffic lights keep green for oncoming buses, rather than changing as they arrive.

punisher5112 · 16-09-2018 1:54pm

Sam Russell wrote: »

Actually, all they need to do is make it that a bus pulling out from a stop has priority absolutely, and in the event of an accident, the other driver has to prove the bus driver acted 'recklessly'. So a bus indicated to pull out causes vehicles behind to give way, just like they do for blue flashing lights.

Also, traffic lights keep green for oncoming buses, rather than changing as they arrive.

Fully agree and I'll be honest I find the worst for no patience or not letting a bus out to be women.

It's actually got like back in the Celtic tiger where everyone is racing to get ahead to then turn right or left or block the bus from proceeding.

Shocking how little thought is given to be honest.

Qrt · 16-09-2018 2:35pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

This technology has been around for years but there is no push to use it.

So much could be done to prioritize buses and hold cars back to give a safe space and a clear run.

Look at rathmines, Rathgar road for example they have lights to hold cars back to allow buses out but they don't do anything but stay green for everyone.

Do you have a picture of those lights by any chance?

AlekSmart · 16-09-2018 2:52pm

Qrt wrote: »

Do you have a picture of those lights by any chance?

Could it be these sets of signals ?

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3203178,-6.2682842,3a,75y,10.94h,113.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s1_jVCj-NTGvtxn9YDmj-RA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

It is noteworthy that,in the absence of any priority signal,a Busdriver coming to the end of the Bus Lane MUST give way to traffic on the right hand side,ie: the cars in the outside lane,as is signified by the Yield sign specific to the Bus lane.

This is Bus Priority,as Gaeilge....:)

davetherave · 16-09-2018 2:59pm

IT's in the rules of the road alright but not a law or act.

http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/Learner%20Drivers/Rules_of_the_road.pdf
Section 5: Good driving practice

You should allow signalling buses back into the stream of traffic after they
let passengers on and of

Chris_5339762 · 16-09-2018 3:16pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

Could it be these sets of signals ?

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3203178,-6.2682842,3a,75y,10.94h,113.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s1_jVCj-NTGvtxn9YDmj-RA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

It is noteworthy that,in the absence of any priority signal,a Busdriver coming to the end of the Bus Lane MUST give way to traffic on the right hand side,ie: the cars in the outside lane,as is signified by the Yield sign specific to the Bus lane.

This is Bus Priority,as Gaeilge....:)

They have them in Terenure as well. I've only ever seen them red going eastbound, never once westbound.

MJohnston · 16-09-2018 7:44pm

Speaking of bus priority signals, the ones they installed on the Chapelizod N4 bypass westbound are so badly done. When you're driving up from the Kylemore Road onto the bypass, you get a flashing amber even when the bus lane on the N4 has a red light. The flashing amber is actually to indicate you need to give way to the bus lane on the slip road, not the N4, but you'd basically never know that.

The result is 90% of onramp traffic stops on the flashing amber to try and turn and look at the N4 bus lane, which is almost entirely physically impossible to see. They can make a couple of quick fixes here and solve it, but they never do.

KD345 · 16-09-2018 7:51pm

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

They have them in Terenure as well. I've only ever seen them red going eastbound, never once westbound.

Also one at Leeson Street/Burlington Road to allow route 11 pull out of the stop at the Burlington Hotel and cross three lanes. The problem is that motorists usually have the yellow box blocked, so the bus can't make any progress.

Chris_5339762 · 16-09-2018 8:55pm

And not just through people not stopping on the box. Regular motorists going up the bus lane and then blocking the box. Or taxis in the box.

punisher5112 · 16-09-2018 8:55pm

KD345 wrote: »

Also one at Leeson Street/Burlington Road to allow route 11 pull out of the stop at the Burlington Hotel and cross three lanes. The problem is that motorists usually have the yellow box blocked, so the bus can't make any progress.

At least it is in working order same outside oatlands college stillorgan

punisher5112 · 16-09-2018 9:01pm

I have emailed the council and nta about these sections and about making bus stop spaces bigger but got no answer.

Stephen15 · 16-09-2018 9:22pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

I have emailed the council and nta about these sections and about making bus stop spaces bigger but got no answer.

Bus Connects infrastructure consultation starts next month after the route consultation closes.

punisher5112 · 16-09-2018 9:46pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

Bus Connects infrastructure consultation starts next month after the route consultation closes.

I'll have to enter into that. Thanks.

schemingbohemia · 17-09-2018 12:16pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

Presumably Hugh is going to finally impliment measures to eradicate the continual and,by now,historic disregard for Parking Regulations endemic to Sandymount Village ?

If he is'nt,then he can kiss goodbye to the C1 offering ANY improvement over the 1,2 & 3 routes of old

Well, presumably the Garda balaclavas are stopping them from seeing this so nothing ever gets done. Not exactly within the NTA's purview unfortunately.

Bray Head · 17-09-2018 1:19pm

Bus Connects have paid for a four-page spread in the Bray People.

It's all about Bus Connects in general, not the changes for north-east Wicklow.

This publicity is pretty cheap, but it does show that the NTA are making an effort.

AlekSmart · 17-09-2018 1:25pm

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Well, presumably the Garda balaclavas are stopping them from seeing this so nothing ever gets done. Not exactly within the NTA's purview unfortunately.

The more the better !

It is long past the time to remove this type of basic Traffic Law enforcement from the Gardai,who appear either unwilling or unable to perform it.

Get the semi catatonic Local Authorities back in the loop and force them to recruit and allocate Full Time Staff to parking control.

Use the readily available electronic means and issue Fixed Penalties as required,no more of this on-street negotiation as to what constitutes illegal or obstructive parking....Oh,and I almost forgot install a lot more kerbside barriers to frustrate the "Just nippin in for a Cappuccino" regulars !

Bray Head · 17-09-2018 1:26pm

Local authorites are not competent.

AGS are not interested.

What is needed is a dedicated transport police.

AlekSmart · 17-09-2018 1:56pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

I have emailed the council and nta about these sections and about making bus stop spaces bigger but got no answer.

Bus Stop specifications will become a far greater issue when Busconnects commences,the maintenance of even headway demands on-street layover space,and interconnecting services alre require it.

Currently,there are very few Bus Stops which meet the Dept of the Environment's own detailed criteria....

http://trafficsigns.ie/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/07-traffic-signs-manual-2010-chapter-7-road-markings.pdf

RRM 030:
Bus Stop Markings

7.7
Bus and Tram Markings

BUS STOP (RRM 030)
7.7.1
Bus Stop Markings, RRM 030, shall only be used to indicate the location of a bus stop, where they supplement a kerbside upright
Bus Stop Sign (RUS 031), or to indicate the location of a bus
stand.They indicate the area within which vehicles other than
buses may not stop or park.

7.7.2
It is important that buses should be able to dock parallel to and
close to the kerb, to assist passengers, particularly those with a
mobility handicap, to board and alight with ease.This can frequently be made difficult, especially in urban areas, by a variety of factors,some of which may be overcome by careful design.
7.7.3
The major factor in achieving parallel docking at a bus stop is the
entry and exit distance required. At a typical roadside bus stop, a
conventional 12m European standard bus requires a minimum
overall clearance of:D 37m of unimpeded access (see Figure 7.28);
an articulated bus needs 49m. Vehicles parked or loading adjacent to the bus stop can result in buses failing to achieve parallel docking or having to stop too far from the kerb, requiring passengers to step into the carriageway to board and alight.

There yiz have it...from the Horses mouth so to speak.

schemingbohemia · 17-09-2018 5:13pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

The more the better !

It is long past the time to remove this type of basic Traffic Law enforcement from the Gardai,who appear either unwilling or unable to perform it.

Get the semi catatonic Local Authorities back in the loop and force them to recruit and allocate Full Time Staff to parking control.

Use the readily available electronic means and issue Fixed Penalties as required,no more of this on-street negotiation as to what constitutes illegal or obstructive parking....Oh,and I almost forgot install a lot more kerbside barriers to frustrate the "Just nippin in for a Cappuccino" regulars !

Totally agree. The number of untaxed, uninsured, non-NCT'd vehicles I see every lunchtime whilst walking around would pay for the staff costs if the LA actually brought back traffic wardens.

ILBondo · 19-09-2018 9:46am

https://dublininquirer.com/2018/09/18/david-so-what-s-the-story-with-busconnects

Sense finally spoken by a media outlet.

schemingbohemia · 19-09-2018 10:50am

Yeah, it's a great article. Very interesting site generally.

CatInABox · 19-09-2018 11:31am

ILBondo wrote: »

https://dublininquirer.com/2018/09/18/david-so-what-s-the-story-with-busconnects

Sense finally spoken by a media outlet.

Dublin Inquirer have run a good few positive articles on BusConnects now, very impressive on how balanced they are. A few other outlets should take note of how to accurately portray the various pros and cons of an idea

jd · 19-09-2018 1:27pm

Fianna Fail doing exactly what I expected them to do

https://twitter.com/JohnLahart/status/1042387123373047810

https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/parliamentaryBusiness/orderPaper/dail/2018/2018-09-19_dail-order-paper-wed_en.pdf

BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

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