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At what point does right wing just mean racist/d1ck/heartless baxtard?

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Permabear wrote: »
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    Probably your bias there pb!

    Hard to know, it definitely happens but I don't know if they get targeted more than the likes of AAA or SF. AAA/Socialist threads are a bit of a joke because I'd say you might have 10 posters at most on the site who actually support them, with only a few actually posting in threads. Go through the current thread in the cafe and I'd bet there is far more bashing them than supporting them, same in politics.

    SF would have more, but again it isn't as if there is a lack of opposite opinions there and a fair bit of those threads are North related not economics.

    There's a fair few centric or a bit either way that get drowned out by the loud, prolific posters. Look at the election, no increase in the left vote share with I'd say the previous hard left Labour vote going to SF, a softer vote for the SD's and maybe even FF.

    FF and Independents won the election, FF aren't anti business or the rich and most of the Indos are pork barrel type politicians, maybe 4 or 5 really left wing.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Icepick


    when they become a socialist


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,973 ✭✭✭RayM


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Certain wealthy people get criticised all the time. Much of it is justified. But at least they're becoming richer. We can agree on that, right? Must soften the impact of the 'bashing' the unfortunate souls receive.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    How many examples are there of people attacking people soley for being rich?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Jayop wrote: »
    There you go again. Magic money tree nonsense. Not all on the left in Ireland think like that and not all parties on the left are in fantasy land. Even if they are the point stands that you were crying that no one could insult the left then in your next two posts you do just that.

    This country spends a huge amount on SW, though I expect it has gone down recently with more employment. But you see people denying there is any recovery when Unemployment is about half of what it was at the height of the crash, go figure that one. Ireland really isn't a bad country to be unemployed in.

    Health is a problem but when you've welfare and ps pay taking up a lot of expenditure money isn't there to throw at it, and we did that before and it often got swallowed up. There are improvements from 20 years ago with heart disease down and better detection of cancer but waiting lists are under serious pressure after the crash, no doubt about that. Housing as well but there is not much money available given all the other expenditure.

    But we are paying for bad decisions made from about 2000 on, just as much as the crash. We couldn't afford the welfare, ps bill and other stuff because we didn't have a sustainable tax base. That has improved but parties clamouring to get rid of USC wouldn't give me much confidence for the future, at least the electorate didn't buy it this time and wanted services priortised.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Don't see much attacking the rich either!

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,363 ✭✭✭KingBrian2


    Their is a problem with bashing the wealthy as you well know. They will sue.:D


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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Jayop wrote: »
    Gimme a break. Go onto any single thread on here relating to the left in Ireland and you'll see a lot more abuse being spewed than what you say.
    I dunno about a lot more J, but the Left/Progressive/Liberal type stuff gets a fair share of the spewing alright. Hell, mea culpa, I am often one of the spewers. Even so, I have noticed more spewing aimed at the left of late. I have often found the more confused, off balance, even scared people, especially people in the middle get, the more Rightward they tend to lean. I suppose that's a natural human response. When shít goes down or is threatening to, the understandable reaction is to "protect what's mine". In times of want and chaos that's understandable, in times of plenty it veers towards sociopathy.

    Personally I would be an "extreme" centrist with Right leanings in some areas, Left in others. For me my main litmus test is how is this going to benefit society. We are in the end a social animal. We got to where we are on the back of that. Yes we most certainly need the individualists, indeed they should be encouraged, but the tide should rise as many boats as possible. As possible. Again for me, my take is that there likely will always be "broken" people of all stripes, no matter what system is in place. As the lad from Galilee said "the poor will always be with us". It's how we as people, we as societies deal with such souls is what marks the difference in approach and in my mind anyway, what marks out that all too noise tempered concept; morality.

    One of the earliest early human skeletons we have is that of a young Homo Erectus woman. An upright walking being, far removed from "Us". In her last month of life she suffered from hypervitaminosis(overdose of Vit A, likely from eating a predator liver). In constant pain, she could barely move as her bones and muscles scarred and stiffened by the day. She was rendered disabled, utterly useless to the group. A drain on them, at a time when any drain was far more acute and dangerous to those small bands of ickle pre humans. Yet the group cared for her, even to the possible detriment of themselves. For a month. For a long time people have looked for the Missing Link(™), the difference between us and what went before. For me, that's it right there writ large in her fossilised bones.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,973 ✭✭✭RayM


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    I can't find the link, but I read a particularly bad article in the Irish Times recently which basically advocated the exploitation of au pairs on the basis that they "aren't employees". Plenty of similar stuff over the years in the IT, Independent, etc, advocating cuts to the minimum wage and social protection rates. As you are never likely to suffer as a result of a minimum wage or social welfare cut, you might not regard calling for such cuts as poor-bashing, but it absolutely is.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Seems to more attacks on liberals these days all right, though maybe it was always there just it's more vitriolic now with all these buzzwords from reddit or stormfront or wherever.

    The doomsdayers seem to have come back as well, went quiet after 10/11.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Seriously, is that the best you could come up with?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    K-9 wrote: »
    Seems to more attacks on liberals these days all right, though maybe it was always there just it's more vitriolic now with all these buzzwords from reddit or stormfront or wherever. Murica.
    By your leave, FYP K. That's a helluva lot of the problem. We - and not just we in Ireland - are importing this dopey extremist nonsense from the US of A. Pretty much all of the guff we're discussing and linking to "statistics" on an overwhelmingly Irish community is US based nonsense.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,570 ✭✭✭Ulysses Gaze


    RayM wrote: »
    I can't find the link, but I read a particularly bad article in the Irish Times recently which basically advocated the exploitation of au pairs on the basis that they "aren't employees". Plenty of similar stuff over the years in the IT, Independent, etc, advocating cuts to the minimum wage and social protection rates. As you are never likely to suffer as a result of a minimum wage or social welfare cut, you might not regard calling for such cuts as poor-bashing, but it absolutely is.

    This I see in the UK papers like the Mail all the time.

    I have yet to see it in the Irish papers.

    If you have no links, then you don't have any evidence.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    K-9 wrote: »
    Seriously, is that the best you could come up with?
    Colour(with a U) me surprised K.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,940 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Monsters.
    Hope all those affected by that article are recovering well. There literally is no god in a world where that can happen.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Two Tone


    RayM wrote: »
    Certain wealthy people get criticised all the time. Much of it is justified. But at least they're becoming richer. We can agree on that, right? Must soften the impact of the 'bashing' the unfortunate souls receive.
    Of course not. Although I don't understand for the life of me why it is fashionable to criticise people increasing their own private wealth (once there is no exploitation/abuse/insane greed involved). Entrepreneurship is a great thing in my opinion - it is what allows any of us start a business. Doing same and having a social conscience are not mutually exclusive.

    I agree the rich get a free pass from some media outlets - most of all Independent Newspapers, with its embarrassing fawning over Ireland's "elite". I remember that item about au pairs too - I think it was an opinion piece by some bloke who was trying to be controversial. Generally I don't think the Times would be like that.

    But I do not agree poor people are badly treated in this country. I think they are in e.g. the United States for sure (great country in many ways but the social inequalities are abysmal, and it's a cop-out to say everyone is born with the same chances - balderdash) but in Ireland there is a fair social supports system and much more opportunities. Poverty is not always the fault of the government or that handy faceless group (yet which we are all part of): "society". But compassion is, and despite what the relentless naysayers about Ireland claim, we (and heartless bankers are not the only people among "we") are a caring bunch when put to the test.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Two Tone


    K-9 wrote: »
    Seriously, is that the best you could come up with?
    Crap article though. Not being rich does not make a person "poor". Perhaps the article was just tongue-in-cheek though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,116 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    The huge difference between 'the left' and 'the right' caricatures is that the former is largely confined to university campuses while the latter makes decisions that affect us all in the halls of power.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 39,019 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,116 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Marx's central thesis was derived from dialectical materialism i.e. viewing the world in terms of competition for resources between social groups which leads to conflict theory. That's a genie that's never going back in the bottle because all it did was put words to reality.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,387 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Fwiw I don't think there's a vilification of the poor/jobless (the working poor are OK in everyone's book it seems) in the mainstream media in Ireland. You certainly do see it in the comments section of the articles and in forums like this though. Hard to really give a fk if you don't read these forums or comment section.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Two Tone


    Jayop wrote: »
    Fwiw I don't think there's a vilification of the poor/jobless (the working poor are OK in everyone's book it seems) in the mainstream media in Ireland. You certainly do see it in the comments section of the articles and in forums like this though. Hard to really give a fk if you don't read these forums or comment section.
    I make a point of not reading the comments to online articles, as the stupidity (whatever political angle they're coming from) is just too dismaying. I don't mean things I merely disagree with - I mean falsehoods and presumptions presented as fact.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,387 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Two Tone wrote: »
    I make a point of not reading the comments to online articles, as the stupidity (whatever political angle they're coming from) is just too dismaying. I don't mean things I merely disagree with - I mean falsehoods and presumptions presented as fact.

    The comments section on the Guardian is hilarious. For a middle left paper it seems almost all who post on the comments are Raving rw lunatics lol. Facebook comments on articles relating to immigration or anything Muslim are always good for a laugh.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 798 ✭✭✭LightsStillOn


    Jayop wrote: »
    The comments section on the Guardian is hilarious. For a middle left paper it seems almost all who post on the comments are Raving rw lunatics lol. Facebook comments on articles relating to immigration or anything Muslim are always good for a laugh.

    Never mind Facebook, if you want a laugh read The Journal when either of those two topics are brought up! They posted a story the other day explaining what ramadan was and people lost their sh*t :pac:


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