The Gay Megathread (see mod note on post #2212)

alma73 · 12-04-2016 10:26PM

aloyisious wrote: »

Seriously,,, your wife went into a MANS toilet???? :pac:

I know.. Only because there was a queue to the lads and my son had to go..

Cabaal · 14-04-2016 09:21AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

I'm disturbed when the Christianity forum is being used to discuss political issues. If people have issues with what the Bible teaches on this issue I'm happy to discuss it. As I've done on the abortion thread I've said that personally I refuse to discuss secular political matters on the Christianity forum.

Thats fine,
But that doesn't change the fact that religious organisations including the catholic church are deeply involved in politics in this country. As such issues that they are involved in are most certainly relevant to this forum.

As you don't apparently discuss political issues, can I ask did you ever previously make any comment in relation to the marriage equality ref last year?

solodeogloria · 14-04-2016 09:29AM

Cabaal wrote: »

Thats fine,
But that doesn't change the fact that religious organisations including the catholic church are deeply involved in politics in this country. As such issues that they are involved in are most certainly relevant to this forum.

As you don't apparently discuss political issues, can I ask did you ever previously make any comment in relation to the marriage equality ref last year?

Good morning all!

My thinking over the last few years has changed in respect to secularism. My present view is that the church should be separated from the State and vice versa.

I didn't make a huge amount of comment on the referendum as I am living outside of Ireland and I regard political matters within Ireland as a matter for the people.

Provided that religious liberty is maintained and churches are not obliged to change their views on marriage the State is free to define marriage in any way that they like. My only hope in any country I live in is that I am free to lead a peaceful quiet godly life in the present age as a follower of Jesus Christ. He said to Pilate that His kingdom isn't of this world, therefore I have no interest on imposing Christianity on others legally. I hope to share Christ with others and to build up those who already follow Him in the church so that they can lead countercultural lives.

I hope that clarifies my position.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Cabaal · 14-04-2016 09:52AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

My present view is that the church should be separated from the State and vice versa.

Thats great, I think thats a good view to have.
But sadly in the meantime they are not separate so until they separate the discussions need to happen and remain pretty relevant.

solodeogloria · 14-04-2016 10:02AM

Cabaal wrote: »

Thats great, I think thats a good view to have.
But sadly in the meantime they are not separate so until they separate the discussions need to happen and remain pretty relevant.

Good morning!

My point is though that Bruce Springsteen not going to a concert or Ronán Mullen running for senator in and of themselves aren't discussions about Christianity and what is Biblical or what Christians believe in respect to Christianity.

Where does or should the line be drawn? At the moment in many respects it seems that the Christianity forum is excessively political in nature. I'd love to actually get into the nitty gritty of what the Bible teaches on these subjects rather than what Bruce Springsteen decided to do which as far as I can tell has nothing to do with Christianity.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Kev W · 14-04-2016 10:56AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

I'd love to actually get into the nitty gritty of what the Bible teaches on these subjects rather than what Bruce Springsteen decided to do

Well frankly nothing's stopping you from doing that.

However there are those of us who feel that it's a relevant discussion and that this is an appropriate forum so that discussion will be had andvit will be had here.

If you don't want to discuss it you're under no obligation to do so.

aloyisious · 14-04-2016 11:27AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning!

My point is though that Bruce Springsteen not going to a concert or Ronán Mullen running for senator in and of themselves aren't discussions about Christianity and what is Biblical or what Christians believe in respect to Christianity.

Where does or should the line be drawn? At the moment in many respects it seems that the Christianity forum is excessively political in nature. I'd love to actually get into the nitty gritty of what the Bible teaches on these subjects rather than what Bruce Springsteen decided to do which as far as I can tell has nothing to do with Christianity.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

I'm thankful that you don't find it a conundrum that the Gay Megathread is on the Christianity forum giving that you are responding to O/P's posting here (and I mean that in a non-sarcastic way) as you are not going on a rant that the thread should be moved.

It's a certainty that as far as LGBT rights issues are concerned here, a lot of people (and I include some LGBT folk in that group) opposing the extension of rights generally available to straight folk on to LGBT folk do so within a political sphere - but make their opposition from a decidedly religious P.O.V. - as that sphere is where the decision of passing new civil (temporal) law or extending existing civil (temporal) law rests. LGBT and other folk (inclusive) accept that it is in the political sphere that some issues have to be resolved.

Another fact of life is that LGBT folk here are not solely either Christian or non-belief folk, we are from Jewish, Muslim and a variety of other religions and beliefs That make's it necessary for civil law to be the arbiter on temporal matters.

On the P.O.V issue of religion, in particular Christianity, it seem's to me that Jesus (Teacher or Rabbi) made clear he knew the difference between temporal (civil) and secular matters: render unto Caesar (a temporal ruler and layer of laws) etc... as he (Jesus) knew human acts and deeds are of the temporal world alone. I agree with him on that and am of a fixed P.O.V. there. Proselytizing and splitting hairs don't work here.

P.O.V. = point of view.

tommy2bad · 20-04-2016 07:33PM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning!

My point is though that Bruce Springsteen not going to a concert or Ronán Mullen running for senator in and of themselves aren't discussions about Christianity and what is Biblical or what Christians believe in respect to Christianity.

Where does or should the line be drawn? At the moment in many respects it seems that the Christianity forum is excessively political in nature. I'd love to actually get into the nitty gritty of what the Bible teaches on these subjects rather than what Bruce Springsteen decided to do which as far as I can tell has nothing to do with Christianity.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Just a quick response to the emboldened bit

Are you saying that biblical is the defining measure for Christians or that you would prefer to discus Christianity only in a biblical context?
Either way isn't that a bit of a dead end? Christians have to live in and deal with the world as it is, yes we can be guided by the bible ) which btw I don't see as a definitive last word on things christian) but unless we relate our Christianity to the world we live, what use is it?

solodeogloria · 20-04-2016 07:42PM

tommy2bad wrote: »

Just a quick response to the emboldened bit

Are you saying that biblical is the defining measure for Christians or that you would prefer to discus Christianity only in a biblical context?
Either way isn't that a bit of a dead end? Christians have to live in and deal with the world as it is, yes we can be guided by the bible ) which btw I don't see as a definitive last word on things christian) but unless we relate our Christianity to the world we live, what use is it?

Good evening!

I'm saying both. The Biblical text as far as I can tell is the only reliable text from the apostolic period in respect to the Christian faith. The Bible tells us most reliably what Jesus said and taught and it most reliably shows us the unfolding of God's plan from creation until the future day when Jesus returns.

The Bible and what it says has clear relevance to the world today. There is barely an area of my life where I find it doesn't speak into. God speaks into every age of history through His Word and His Word often sits and grates uncomfortably with every age but this doesn't mean it is wrong or irrelevant. I don't believe it is a dead end in that respect.

If your question is do I believe in sola scriptura? The answer is definitely yes. Feel free to ask about that on the solas thread.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

aloyisious · 26-04-2016 10:21AM

In today's Irish Indo, report on 1st use of the Children and Family Relationships Act 2015. The couple plan on getting married in May next year. http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/as-far-as-our-daughter-knows-she-has-her-mammy-and-her-mama-34659590.html

solodeogloria · 26-04-2016 10:24AM

aloyisious wrote: »

In today's Irish Indo, report on 1st use of the Children and Family Relationships Act 2015. The couple plan on getting married in May next year. http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/as-far-as-our-daughter-knows-she-has-her-mammy-and-her-mama-34659590.html

Good morning!

Forgive me for asking again but what relevance does this post have to Christianity? I'm just trying to work out what the purpose of this thread is?

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

galljga1 · 26-04-2016 10:26AM

aloyisious wrote: »

In today's Irish Indo, report on 1st use of the Children and Family Relationships Act 2015. The couple plan on getting married in May next year. http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/as-far-as-our-daughter-knows-she-has-her-mammy-and-her-mama-34659590.html

That is great to see. Another small step in the right direction.

aloyisious · 26-04-2016 10:43AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning!

Forgive me for asking again but what relevance does this post have to Christianity? I'm just trying to work out what the purpose of this thread is?

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

The title of this particular thread (if that's the right word) is The Gay Megathread. My last post above is about an LGBT couple being allowed by our country's laws to have joint-guardianship of their daughter. Maybe you should direct your question to the Boards.ie Mods. The site give's you a route to do so.

solodeogloria · 26-04-2016 10:45AM

aloyisious wrote: »

The title of this particular thread (if that's the right word) is The Gay Mega-thread. My last post above is about an LGBT couple being allowed by our country's laws to have joint-guardianship of their daughter. Maybe you should direct your question to the Boards.ie Mods. The site give's you a route to do so.

Good morning!

I know what the title of the thread is, but it is in the Christianity forum.

We have a forum dedicated to LGBT issues also. Surely it's reasonable to expect that content in this thread should be about the relationship between LGBT issues and Christianity given that it is in this forum?

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

aloyisious · 26-04-2016 11:02AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning!

I know what the title of the thread is, but it is in the Christianity forum.

We have a forum dedicated to LGBT issues also. Surely it's reasonable to expect that content in this thread should be about the relationship between LGBT issues and Christianity given that it is in this forum?

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Can I read into your last above that you see there is no problem with a lesbian couple being legally allowed to have joint guardianship rights and a Christianity view on traditional parentship, through traditional marriage?

On the issue of discussing LGBT issues, --- EDIT: if you do have problems with the above --- could you tell us what standards you use to differentiate between LGBT issues, given how Christianity has such an interest in ruling on traditional and non-traditional relationships?

2nd edit: re the below from robdonn, I second it. I want you to know that, as a Christian-minded person, I favour the Christian ethic of not heaving rocks at people and welcome your input.

robdonn · 26-04-2016 11:05AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

aloyisious wrote: »

The title of this particular thread (if that's the right word) is The Gay Mega-thread. My last post above is about an LGBT couple being allowed by our country's laws to have joint-guardianship of their daughter. Maybe you should direct your question to the Boards.ie Mods. The site give's you a route to do so.

Good morning!

I know what the title of the thread is, but it is in the Christianity forum.

We have a forum dedicated to LGBT issues also. Surely it's reasonable to expect that content in this thread should be about the relationship between LGBT issues and Christianity given that it is in this forum?

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Good morning solodeogloria,

A topic within a forum does not need to be about the topic of the forum itself but instead can simply be informed by the opinions of the people in said forum. As a Christian, as well as a unique human person, your views on the topic may be informed by your faith and may be unpopular within the LGBT forum which may discourage you from discussing the topic there. Having a discussion on LGBT rights, within the confines of the dedicated Christianity forum, allows you to express you views in relation to your faith and be protected by the Christianity forum charter from attack.

Also, Christianity and religion very much influences someone's worldview and opinions on moral and social topics, so discussion of said topics can be quite relevant, or at least far more relevant than discussing such topics in a forum dedicated to architecture, for example.

solodeogloria · 26-04-2016 11:13AM

robdonn wrote: »

Good morning solodeogloria,

A topic within a forum does not need to be about the topic of the forum itself but instead can simply be informed by the opinions of the people in said forum. As a Christian, as well as a unique human person, your views on the topic may be informed by your faith and may be unpopular within the LGBT forum which may discourage you from discussing the topic there. Having a discussion on LGBT rights, within the confines of the dedicated Christianity forum, allows you to express you views in relation to your faith and be protected by the Christianity forum charter from attack.

Also, Christianity and religion very much influences someone's worldview and opinions on moral and social topics, so discussion of said topics can be quite relevant, or at least far more relevant than discussing such topics in a forum dedicated to architecture, for example.

Good morning!

robdonn I agree that Christianity influences our thinking about all things. That's the type of motivation I think this thread can serve.

However I don't see how the post is relevant to the Christianity forum. I think there's lots and lots of scope for discussing secular pieces of legislation which affect LGBT people across boards.ie. I do have concerns about the Christianity forum becoming excessively political.

There's lots to be said about how Christianity relates to the area of sexual morality in general. Honestly speaking my Christian faith can grate with how the world sees this subject. I think those are the areas where discussion could be useful and fruitful to build understanding.

I've personally got no interest in secular law because I see that as separate from the cause of the Gospel.

aloysius: on a secular level legislating for non-traditional relationships seems prudent and sensible. From a Biblical perspective these things are wrong in God's sight but the law shouldn't be used to coerce others to live a Christian life.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

gaynorvader · 26-04-2016 11:24AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

{...}

aloysius: on a secular level legislating for non-traditional relationships seems prudent and sensible. From a Biblical perspective these things are wrong in God's sight but the law shouldn't be used to coerce others to live a Christian life.
{...}

Is it though? As far as I can remember it's only mentioned in the Bible twice. Once in Leviticus alongside the laws about not eating shellfish, trimming beards or wearing two different cloths. The other in St.Paul's letters, alongside him declaring that women should not speak in church.
I'm not sure that it is particularly wrong from a Christian interpretation of the Bible as Jesus never mentions it.

robdonn · 26-04-2016 11:30AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning!

robdonn I agree that Christianity influences our thinking about all things. That's the type of motivation I think this thread can serve.

However I don't see how the post is relevant to the Christianity forum. I think there's lots and lots of scope for discussing secular pieces of legislation which affect LGBT people across boards.ie. I do have concerns about the Christianity forum becoming excessively political.

There's lots to be said about how Christianity relates to the area of sexual morality in general. Honestly speaking my Christian faith can grate with how the world sees this subject. I think those are the areas where discussion could be useful and fruitful to build understanding.

I've personally got no interest in secular law because I see that as separate from the cause of the Gospel.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

I understand from reading some of your previous posts that you do believe that someone's personal religious beliefs and the secular laws put in place by governments should be separate, and I commend you for this, but not all people of faith agree with you.

Religious groups, including Christian groups, do try to influence law on social and moral matters such as the Children and Family Relationships Act 2015 and they do so based on their interpretation of the moral teachings of their religion. For as long as there are Christians that wish to influence the law of our nation based on their religious beliefs then the topics shall remain relevant to this forum.

You are under no obligation to participate in these discussions, and you can engage in and start discussions about the Gospel to your heart's content, but there are others who do wish to discuss these topics and as long nobody is being disrespectful or abusive then I'm afraid there is nothing you can do about it.

solodeogloria · 26-04-2016 11:34AM

robdonn wrote: »

Religious groups, including Christian groups, do try to influence law on social and moral matters such as the Children and Family Relationships Act 2015 and they do so based on their interpretation of the moral teachings of their religion. For as long as there are Christians that wish to influence
You are under no obligation to participate in these discussions, and you can engage in and start discussions about the Gospel to your heart's content, but there are others who do wish to discuss these topics and as long nobody is being disrespectful or abusive then I'm afraid there is nothing you can do about it.

Good morning all!

Last post till this evening.

As far as I can see on the Christianity forum the posts should be related to Christianity. There's lots and lots of secular fora on boards.ie and an LGBT forum. Whereas in the Christianity forum it makes sense that we should be discussing the relationship between these issues and the Gospel.

Perhaps a mod will tell me off but it's important to state that everything in the Christianity forum as far as I can see should relate to Christianity. Otherwise what's the point of posting here?

I'll answer the questions in respect to the Bible later.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

robdonn · 26-04-2016 12:05PM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning all!

Last post till this evening.

As far as I can see on the Christianity forum the posts should be related to Christianity. There's lots and lots of secular fora on boards.ie and an LGBT forum. Whereas in the Christianity forum it makes sense that we should be discussing the relationship between these issues and the Gospel.

Perhaps a mod will tell me off but it's important to state that everything in the Christianity forum as far as I can see should relate to Christianity. Otherwise what's the point of posting here?

I'll answer the questions in respect to the Bible later.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

I agree that everything on the Christianity forum should relate to Christianity, but that also includes it's effects on the world and, in this case, it's effects on Irish law. What doesn't belong on this forum is Christian-bashing, abuse towards believers or soap-boxing (or cursing, which I personally think should be allowed but that's not my judgement to make).

I don't believe that a mod will, or should, tell you off as you are raising a legitimate concern but I personally think that you are incorrect in this case. But who knows, maybe I'm wrong and will be told off by a mod. :P

Have a nice day, talk to you later!

aloyisious · 26-04-2016 12:53PM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good morning all!

Last post till this evening.

As far as I can see on the Christianity forum the posts should be related to Christianity. There's lots and lots of secular fora on boards.ie and an LGBT forum. Whereas in the Christianity forum it makes sense that we should be discussing the relationship between these issues and the Gospel.

Perhaps a mod will tell me off but it's important to state that everything in the Christianity forum as far as I can see should relate to Christianity. Otherwise what's the point of posting here?

I'll answer the questions in respect to the Bible later.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

In reference to your use of the words "the Gospel" it seem's to me that you are trying to put a limit on what is being discussed on the thread and what you may wish others to discuss on the thread.

If that is the case, perhaps you might take a page from David Quinn's book, as he seem's to have no problem with accepting the existence of Christian lGBT folk, given how he had Paddy Manning as a crew-member on the secular constitutional law marriage equality issue and has him aboard on the other important issue of existing secular constitutional law.

You mention a link between the issues you want debated here and the gospel. In your use of the words "the gospel" do you mean "the bible", or the gospel according to.......

solodeogloria · 26-04-2016 05:38PM

aloyisious wrote: »

In reference to your use of the words "the Gospel" it seem's to me that you are trying to put a limit on what is being discussed on the thread and what you may wish others to discuss on the thread.

If that is the case, perhaps you might take a page from David Quinn's book, as he seem's to have no problem with accepting the existence of Christian lGBT folk, given how he had Paddy Manning as a crew-member on the secular constitutional law marriage equality issue and has him aboard on the other important issue of existing secular constitutional law.

You mention a link between the issues you want debated here and the gospel. In your use of the words "the gospel" do you mean "the bible", or the gospel according to.......

Good evening!

The word 'gospel' means 'good news'. When I use the phrase 'the Gospel' I'm referring to the specific good news of salvation from God's righteous judgement for sin and life eternal secured through Jesus' death and resurrection. It is the core of the Christian faith.

I don't base my life on what David Quinn says and does but on Jesus my Lord. We should discuss that.

I think you should be charitable towards me for raising a fair question. Every topic on this forum including this one should as far as I can tell be relevant to Christianity. How Christianity relates to the secular world is crucially important. Christianity pretty much relates to every possible topic and it would be wonderful if this forum could be the place where people happily discuss the intersection between Christianity and everything else! So yes I do want to discuss how these things relate to the good news of Jesus on the Christianity forum because that's what Christianity is about.

I'll come to the Bible question tomorrow when I get time to sit read and pray about how to respond.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

gaynorvader · 26-04-2016 05:54PM

solodeogloria wrote: »

{...}

I'll come to the Bible question tomorrow when I get time to sit read and pray about how to respond.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Thanks for the update solodeogloria, take your time and be happy in your reply

line console zero · 26-04-2016 11:28PM

Here is how I feel about same sex marriage as well as general lbgt issues as a Christian.

The bible clearly teaches that Christians must respect the laws of the state. There is no instruction in the bible to try create a Christian state or over ride secular laws. In fact we know from the bible that the only kingdom that will ever be Christian is under the Lords rule.

We walk the narrow path as christians, we are instructed to not condemn sinners as we are all sinners ourselves.

This idea of enforcing Christian ethics upon others is not biblical. Gods kingdom is spiritual and we are instructed to spread the good news of our salvation, not to try and enforce our ways and change government policy to legislate for every sin. We are not like Islam, which instructs adherents to impose religious legalism and create religious rule. We believe in Jesus impending return and rule. No human nation will or can compare.

A person's lifestyle, however sinful, is for the Lord to judge, we can only try and lead by example and hope that by our Christian path others will come to the Lord. A LGBT person is a human being, a soul created by God. Jesus loves them and that's good enough for me. They are my brothers and sisters.

We all fall short of the Lord in our own ways. Many who are first will be last and many who are last will be first before the Lord. He will forgive all those who repent and have faith In him.

If a gay couple are married by law. I will respect that as I respect the law of the government. 'Give to Caesar what is Caesars. Is it wrong? Yes I believe it is wrong. However we are all 'wrong' in our ways. Everything is wrong by definition since the fall. Only Jesus is without sin. I cannot cast a stone at others as I am a sinner myself. So I say LBGT people sin, just like EVERYBODY else. They are human beings deserving of respect and equal treatment before the law.

The Lord says to love thy neighbour. I base my opinion on people by their behavior towards others and their deeds. Who they love and how they express it is none of my business.

aloyisious · 27-04-2016 12:20AM

solodeogloria wrote: »

Good evening!

The word 'gospel' means 'good news'. When I use the phrase 'the Gospel' I'm referring to the specific good news of salvation from God's righteous judgement for sin and life eternal secured through Jesus' death and resurrection. It is the core of the Christian faith.

I don't base my life on what David Quinn says and does but on Jesus my Lord. We should discuss that.

I think you should be charitable towards me for raising a fair question. Every topic on this forum including this one should as far as I can tell be relevant to Christianity. How Christianity relates to the secular world is crucially important. Christianity pretty much relates to every possible topic and it would be wonderful if this forum could be the place where people happily discuss the intersection between Christianity and everything else! So yes I do want to discuss how these things relate to the good news of Jesus on the Christianity forum because that's what Christianity is about.

I'll come to the Bible question tomorrow when I get time to sit read and pray about how to respond.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

Ta for the info on what the word "gospel" mean's. Relative to what you are posting, do you not think that using this thread to discuss the intersection between Christianity and everything else does take away from the purpose the thread was started for, discussing matters relative to Gays and other Christians? In regard to postings here, I am mindful of the fact that it is NOT merely Christians that are posting here.

With regard to your comment implying I am being uncharitable towards you re "the fair question" you are raising, I regret that I can't see how my failure to deny the fact that this thread is about discussing Gay matters, vis a vis Christianity, and NOT solely Christianity to the exclusion of Gays is uncharitable. I can only see that that comment, unfortunately, is a distraction from the purpose of this thread, so pardon me if I don't respond further to the distraction.

Delirium · 27-04-2016 09:05AM

MOD NOTE

The first post in the thread explains the genesis of this megathread:

PDN wrote: »

Certain individuals seem to be somewhat obsessed with the subject of homosexuality. To avoid the Forum being over-run with numerous threads on this subject, I am launching a MegaThread similar to the ones we already have on other subjects.

Please note that the Forum Charter still applies to megathreads - so try to treat each other with respect and courtesy, even if the subject is one that makes you hot and bothered.

The thread remains open to allow for discussion on the topic between Christians and non-Christians. It allows people to get opinions from Christians as to how different branches of the faith have different views on the topic (which obviously at times would include discussion of biblical text on the topic).

Back on topic everyone please.

Thanks for your attention.

robdonn · 27-04-2016 09:09AM

line console zero wrote: »

Here is how I feel about same sex marriage as well as general lbgt issues as a Christian.

The bible clearly teaches that Christians must respect the laws of the state. There is no instruction in the bible to try create a Christian state or over ride secular laws. In fact we know from the bible that the only kingdom that will ever be Christian is under the Lords rule.

We walk the narrow path as christians, we are instructed to not condemn sinners as we are all sinners ourselves.

This idea of enforcing Christian ethics upon others is not biblical. Gods kingdom is spiritual and we are instructed to spread the good news of our salvation, not to try and enforce our ways and change government policy to legislate for every sin. We are not like Islam, which instructs adherents to impose religious legalism and create religious rule. We believe in Jesus impending return and rule. No human nation will or can compare.

A person's lifestyle, however sinful, is for the Lord to judge, we can only try and lead by example and hope that by our Christian path others will come to the Lord. A LGBT person is a human being, a soul created by God. Jesus loves them and that's good enough for me. They are my brothers and sisters.

We all fall short of the Lord in our own ways. Many who are first will be last and many who are last will be first before the Lord. He will forgive all those who repent and have faith In him.

If a gay couple are married by law. I will respect that as I respect the law of the government. 'Give to Caesar what is Caesars. Is it wrong? Yes I believe it is wrong. However we are all 'wrong' in our ways. Everything is wrong by definition since the fall. Only Jesus is without sin. I cannot cast a stone at others as I am a sinner myself. So I say LBGT people sin, just like EVERYBODY else. They are human beings deserving of respect and equal treatment before the law.

The Lord says to love thy neighbour. I base my opinion on people by their behavior towards others and their deeds. Who they love and how they express it is none of my business.

That is a very interesting approach and I commend you for it, but it does raise a question for me.

When it comes to a matter such as the same-sex marriage referendum, how does one apply this? From one point you don't want to impose your religious beliefs on other people, but you are also asked to vote based on your own preferences and moral code. Does it cause any sort of internal debate? If you voted no (btw I won't be asking you which way you voted) then you are voting to impose your own moral judgement, inspired by your religion, on others in the community, but if you voted yes then you are not voting based on your own personal opinion on the matter even though that is what a referendum asks you to do as it is meant to gauge the true feelings of the people.

solodeogloria · 27-04-2016 09:14AM

aloyisious wrote: »

Ta for the info on what the word "gospel" mean's. Relative to what you are posting, do you not think that using this thread to discuss the intersection between Christianity and everything else does take away from the purpose the thread was started for, discussing matters relative to Gays and other Christians? In regard to postings here, I am mindful of the fact that it is NOT merely Christians that are posting here.

With regard to your comment implying I am being uncharitable towards you re "the fair question" you are raising, I regret that I can't see how my failure to deny the fact that this thread is about discussing Gay matters, vis a vis Christianity, and NOT solely Christianity to the exclusion of Gays is uncharitable. I can only see that that comment, unfortunately, is a distraction from the purpose of this thread, so pardon me if I don't respond further to the distraction.

Good morning all!

Where did I say anything of the sort? The answer is that I didn't.

Please use your posts for building me up rather than tearing me down. We can be civil towards one another and we ought to be.

My question was fair. I'm glad it has been answered. On the Christianity forum it is reasonable and fair to expect that we should discuss the intersection between Christianity and this subject. My only hope is to share the hope of my faith in Jesus and that my words might be gracious to you. (Ephesians 4:29)

Expect a reply to the Bible question this evening.

Much thanks in the Lord Jesus Christ,
solodeogloria

aloyisious · 27-04-2016 10:48AM

aloyisious wrote: »

In today's Irish Indo, report on 1st use of the Children and Family Relationships Act 2015. The couple plan on getting married in May next year. http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/as-far-as-our-daughter-knows-she-has-her-mammy-and-her-mama-34659590.html

Good morning, solodeogloria: Getting back to my post which began this interaction between you and I, do you know if there is anything written by Jesus or God which has a direct Christian relevance to: A. The woman who agreed to have her Lesbian-partner as an equal guardian to her daughter. B. The act of the other woman in agreeing to the legal agreement of guardianship. C. The legitimacy in Christian eyes of the legal agreement between the two women. D. The legitimacy in Christian eyes of the act which allows for such agreements.

The Gay Megathread (see mod note on post #2212)

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