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Direct Debits from Non-Irish Accounts

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    #32
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    So I just received an e-mail from the financial ombudsman (wow at 1750 on a Friday evening) telling me that they recommend mediation instead of an investigation. Mediation, I'm no fan of conspiracy but to me it's clear that GloHealth is infringing on my rights, so what do I need mediation for?


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    #33
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,539 ✭✭✭JTMan


    Mediation obviously means that GloHealth and yourself will sit down in a room with an independent person and trash out the issue. You are 100% correct and GloHeath are 100% wrong so there is not much to trash out but you can make them realise that they are wrong.

    I would say go for it. One of two things will happen:
    (1) GloHeath will see the request from the Financial Ombudsman and change their mind and accept SEPA DD's or
    (2) An in-person debate occurs. You are smart and clued in when it comes to SEPA. You will win the debate.


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    #34
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #35
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    That is exactly my feeling, the options they offer (keep Irish Bank account, pay yearly via check, pay yearly via credit card) are not acceptable to me and hence mediation would be a waist of time.


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    #36
    josephsoap
    Registered Users Posts: 655 ✭✭✭josephsoap


    josephsoap wrote: »
    Has anyone tried to pay Electric Ireland DD via number 26 bank a/c?

    Just posted off the mandate myself, fingers crossed :-)


    Just to update this - Electric Ireland have accepted DD from my N26 A/C (via paper mandate).


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    #37
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    ceroc81 wrote: »
    That would be with paper mandate that's how I originally sent the mandate, just checked the online option and still only has Irish banks.

    I was able to also set up direct debit with Number 26 account. They sent me direct debit form by post and I filled it, scanned it and emailed to my active support thread with them on info@bordgais.ie


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    #38
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    Moved Greenstar from refusing to accepting online (took a complaint but is now available).

    Added Virgin Media Mobile (not ex UPC) into requiring Paper Mandate. Virgin Media (ex UPC Broadband, TV etc.) is still online.


    Refusing to accept non-irish accounts

    Accepting non-irish accounts online
    • Greenstar
    • IDMobile
    • Revenue Commissioners
    • Virgin Media (Broadband, TV, Home Phone)


    Accepting non-irish accounts via paper mandate


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    #39
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users Posts: 5,710 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    I phoned Three a few weeks ago to change DD, was told to send in a paper mandate. Got a letter back asking me to contact them by online chatvto confirm the details. The person I chatted to told me they didn't accept non-Irish bank accounts and refused to say anything else.

    I phoned them straight away and got the same answer. In the end, to try and get rid of me, she said she'd try entering it in the system. She seemed surprised when it was accepted...


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    #40
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    McGaggs wrote: »
    I phoned Three a few weeks ago to change DD, was told to send in a paper mandate. Got a letter back asking me to contact them by online chatvto confirm the details. The person I chatted to told me they didn't accept non-Irish bank accounts and refused to say anything else.

    I phoned them straight away and got the same answer. In the end, to try and get rid of me, she said she'd try entering it in the system. She seemed surprised when it was accepted...

    I'm really struggling with them for weeks. Can you confirm you managed to set it up with your Number 26 account and exactly how you got through to them at the end? Which department were you talking to?


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    #41
    GreatDefector
    Registered Users Posts: 540 ✭✭✭GreatDefector


    I'm in this boat now with Number26

    Renault Finance wont accept a non Irish account. Cop out is that it's to ensure the car is still in Ireland. They wont accept any account not in my name either or payment by card

    I tried to call BPFI today but no answer, or is there someone else I should complain to?

    I am certainly not maintaining an Irish bank account just for them. Tough if they can't do it


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    #42
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    GreatDefector wrote: »
    I'm in this boat now with Number26

    Renault Finance wont accept a non Irish account. Cop out is that it's to ensure the car is still in Ireland. They wont accept any account not in my name either or payment by card

    I tried to call BPFI today but no answer, or is there someone else I should complain to?

    I am certainly not maintaining an Irish bank account just for them. Tough if they can't do it

    Log a complaint with them, demand a final answer from them in writing and than complain to the Financial Services Ombudsman https://www.financialombudsman.ie/.

    Also log a complaint with the central bank, they won't tell you what happens to your complaint but at least you complained.


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    #43
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users Posts: 5,710 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    Bhangraman wrote: »
    I'm really struggling with them for weeks. Can you confirm you managed to set it up with your Number 26 account and exactly how you got through to them at the end? Which department were you talking to?

    It seems to be all set up, I'll wait and see if the DD actually comes out.

    I originally called up someone competent and was told to download and fill in a ddm. If you google three sepa DD you'll get it. Send it in and see how you get on. I got a letter asking me to confirm a few details by phone or chat. If I had've got through to someone competent, it probably would be been OK.


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    #44
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users Posts: 5,710 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    McGaggs wrote: »
    It seems to be all set up, I'll wait and see if the DD actually comes out.

    I originally called up someone competent and was told to download and fill in a ddm. If you google three sepa DD you'll get it. Send it in and see how you get on. I got a letter asking me to confirm a few details by phone or chat. If I had've got through to someone competent, it probably would be been OK.

    DD went through this morning.


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    #45
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    McGaggs wrote: »
    It seems to be all set up, I'll wait and see if the DD actually comes out.

    I originally called up someone competent and was told to download and fill in a ddm. If you google three sepa DD you'll get it. Send it in and see how you get on. I got a letter asking me to confirm a few details by phone or chat. If I had've got through to someone competent, it probably would be been OK.
    Thanks. I did download and fill the mandate, then scanned and direct emailed it to some reps who gave me their contact after calling their phone support but it has been stuck for weeks at their finance department with no update. Latest attempt today by phone with yet another rep (got 3 direct email addresses at this stage of Sven, Vivienne and Rachel as this has been dragging on so long!) to have them escalate.
    Each time it is the same act, after a call, they send an email along those lines "Thanks for your email, I will do my best to get this issue resolved for you in a promptly fashion" but it then goes into a black hole with almost no reply from them (or at least all useless), no-one to proactively follow-up with you, it's exasperating.


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    #46
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    Bhangraman wrote: »
    Thanks. I did download and fill the mandate, then scanned and direct emailed it to some reps who gave me their contact after calling their phone support but it has been stuck for weeks at their finance department with no update. Latest attempt today by phone with yet another rep (got 3 direct email addresses at this stage of Sven, Vivienne and Rachel as this has been dragging on so long!) to have them escalate.
    Each time it is the same act, after a call, they send an email along those lines "Thanks for your email, I will do my best to get this issue resolved for you in a promptly fashion" but it then goes into a black hole with almost no reply from them (or at least all useless), no-one to proactively follow-up with you, it's exasperating.

    Log a formal complaint, demand a final answer and than contact the regulator.

    The REGULATION (EU) No 260/2012 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL is quite clear about this:
    Article 9 Point 2

    2. A payee accepting a credit transfer or using a direct debit to collect funds from a payer holding a payment account located within the Union shall not specify the Member State in which that payment account is to be located, provided that the payment account is reachable in accordance with Article 3.

    if they are deploying delaying tactics complain and escalate it to the regulator.


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    #47
    BrookieD
    Registered Users Posts: 2,702 ✭✭✭BrookieD


    Concern Worldwide will accpet paper mandate from a non irish account and are looking into accepting online.

    Some useful information

    4.2 Paperless Mandates - Phone & Internet Sign Up

    Creditors operating the SEPA Direct Debit Scheme can obtain authorisations from debtors to collect
    SEPA Direct Debits via the Phone or Internet subject to the following:

     Debtors must have an Irish Bank account – Debtors with European Bank accounts must
    sign a paper Mandate

     Creditors must contact their Bank to apply to operate paperless Mandates

     Creditors must submit their phone/internet templates including the confirmation letter to their
    Bank for approval to operate phone & internet sign up

     Creditors must keep a copy of the phone recording as proof of Mandate together with any
    related amendments/history/confirmation letter must be retained by the Creditor for the life
    of the Mandate and after expiry, for a period of 13 months after the date of the last collection

     Creditors must keep a record of the Internet application as proof of Mandate together with
    any related amendments /history must be retained by the Creditor for the life of the Mandate
    and after expiry, for a period of 13 months after the date of the last collection

     Creditors must issue a confirmation letter to the Debtor within 3 working days of the
    phone/internet sign up. The confirmation letter/email must include the following:
    o Debtor’s – Name, Address & Bank details (BIC if provided by debtor & IBAN)
    o Creditor ID
    o Unique Mandate Reference
    o Type of Payment: One-off or Recurrent
    o Date of Signing
    o Standard Legal Text (the authorisation and the Refund right)
    The confirmation letter or email should be substantially in accordance with the sample in the
    Guide

     Creditors must keep a copy of the confirmation letter which was sent to the Debtor.
    Creditors must keep record of the confirmation letter for the life of the Mandate and after
    expiry, for a period of 13 months after the date of the last collection

     The Creditor must be able to present a copy of the Mandate instruction & confirmation letter
    to the Debtor’s bank upon request.

     Creditors are responsible for ensuring their Phone/Internet sign up process and procedures
    are complaint with any regulatory/security requirements


    Taken from the SEPA - A Guide for Business Customers V1.0 located here


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    #48
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users Posts: 5,710 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    Bhangraman wrote: »
    Thanks. I did download and fill the mandate, then scanned and direct emailed it to some reps who gave me their contact after calling their phone support but it has been stuck for weeks at their finance department with no update. Latest attempt today by phone with yet another rep (got 3 direct email addresses at this stage of Sven, Vivienne and Rachel as this has been dragging on so long!) to have them escalate.
    Each time it is the same act, after a call, they send an email along those lines "Thanks for your email, I will do my best to get this issue resolved for you in a promptly fashion" but it then goes into a black hole with almost no reply from them (or at least all useless), no-one to proactively follow-up with you, it's exasperating.

    I posted the mandate, I wonder would that make a difference. Also, when I called it was late in their opening hours and I wouldn't take no for an answer. It seems to me that their systems are all set up to go, but the front line staff haven't been told (some of them have been, not sure if the rest haven't been or are just a bit thick).


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    #49
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    Yggr of Asgard wrote: »
    Log a formal complaint, demand a final answer and than contact the regulator.

    Sent an email to customer.care@three.ie to complain, quoting the article of the law, thanks for your help!


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    #50
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    McGaggs wrote: »
    I posted the mandate, I wonder would that make a difference. Also, when I called it was late in their opening hours and I wouldn't take no for an answer. It seems to me that their systems are all set up to go, but the front line staff haven't been told (some of them have been, not sure if the rest haven't been or are just a bit thick).

    Today in my call I actually mentioned your case and asked them to retry entering the BIC and IBAN on their end but it didn't work so I'm left now with my two bottles in the sea (my newly lodged complaint and waiting for them to contact me after they talk to their finance department) :(


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    #51
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users Posts: 5,710 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    Laya have told me they won't accept direct debits from banks that aren't registered with them(!?) and they only have Irish banks registered. I've already emailed the Central Bank who are going to look into it, and I'll get the finger out over the weekend to compose a complaint directly to them.


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    #52
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    Added Laya Healthcare Insurance to refusing to accept non-irish accounts


    Refusing to accept non-irish accounts

    Accepting non-irish accounts online
    • Greenstar
    • IDMobile
    • Revenue Commissioners
    • Virgin Media (Broadband, TV, Home Phone)


    Accepting non-irish accounts via paper mandate


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    #53
    GreatDefector
    Registered Users Posts: 540 ✭✭✭GreatDefector


    This is like saying we take euro but so long as there's harps on them

    I'm emailing liveline, Dermot Jewell and whoever else I can think of to makes as much noise on this

    Those that refuse to accept SEPA accounts for no good reason are holding everyone back


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    #54
    Yggr of Asgard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,169 ✭✭✭Yggr of Asgard


    Just an update on GloHealth who is continuing to refuse to accept non Irish accounts.

    I declined the mediation by the Financial Services Ombudsman's Bureau and was told this was going into investigation.

    Today (4 weeks after my last exchange with them) I requested an update and was told that they have decided to change the process in which they address complaints and that they now have a dispute resolution's process that needs to be done before they do any arbitration.

    And giving that this dispute resolution department is not set up yet, it will another 2-3 weeks before someone will contact me to attempt a dispute resolution.

    So we are moving backwards instead of forward for a clear violation of my rights as a consumer.


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    #55
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    Bhangraman wrote: »
    Today in my call I actually mentioned your case and asked them to retry entering the BIC and IBAN on their end but it didn't work so I'm left now with my two bottles in the sea (my newly lodged complaint and waiting for them to contact me after they talk to their finance department) :(

    At last out of the blue on my complaint email thread with them on customer.care@three.ie, they replies saying "I have checked your account and I can see that direct debit is set on your account.", such a mess of a company!


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    #56
    JTMan
    Registered Users Posts: 5,539 ✭✭✭JTMan


    Well done Yggr of Asgard for fighting this. Consumer champion!
    Bhangraman wrote: »
    At last out of the blue on my complaint email thread with them on customer.care@three.ie, they replies saying "I have checked your account and I can see that direct debit is set on your account.", such a mess of a company!

    Good god. The offshored Three call center strikes again.

    Escalate the complaint inside Three or contact Comreg.


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    #57
    The J Stands for Jay
    Registered Users Posts: 5,710 ✭✭✭The J Stands for Jay


    JTMan wrote: »
    Well done Yggr of Asgard for fighting this. Consumer champion!



    Good god. The offshored Three call center strikes again.

    Escalate the complaint inside Three or contact Comreg.

    It's actually the dopes in the Limerick call centre who caused all the problems for me.


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    #58
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    McGaggs wrote: »
    It's actually the dopes in the Limerick call centre who caused all the problems for me.

    Oh joy to receive this SMS from Three for my first direct debit:

    From Three: Your Direct Debit has returned unpaid. Please pay urgently on 1800944933 to avoid service interruption or see your bill/Three.ie for ways to pay.

    Back to square one...

    When I called them, they said they had problems with my BIC code. I took the opportunity to say that by 1 Feb they shouldn't even ask for BIC code but nonetheless accomodated them by filling yet another SEPA direct debit mandate form (this has been dragging on for so long they had time to change the design of the form).
    I think this is enough and I am going to complaint to the regulator. I see the financial ombudsman does not handle complaints about telecom providers and refer to Comreg instead, should I complain to them?


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    #59
    Bhangraman
    Registered Users Posts: 282 ✭✭Bhangraman


    LeapCard.ie now allows their auto topup direct debit from non-Irish accounts using IBAN and BIC.


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    #60
    josephsoap
    Registered Users Posts: 655 ✭✭✭josephsoap


    Bhangraman wrote: »
    LeapCard.ie now allows their auto topup direct debit from non-Irish accounts using IBAN and BIC.

    I've never auto topped up my card, if you auto top does this avoid having to go to a pay zone shop to top up?

    I'm sure I read something before that if you topped up online you would still have to 'pick up' the top up from a shop :-/


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    #61
    Delta2113
    Registered Users Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭Delta2113


    Once it's set up no need to visit pay zone shop and no need to 'pick up' the top up.

    f you do not use your Leap Card within 42 days of your original application your Auto Top-Up request will be cancelled.


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