UFC 196: McGregor v Diaz

Gamebred · 10-03-2016 08:22PM

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

Just watched the full fight back for the first time since the original viewing.

When I seen it live I thought Conor was butchering him in the first round. He landed some good shots but most of what he threw hit thin air.

At the start of the second round he was catching Diaz a lot more. I don't buy the story about being gassed either. He was controlling the fight until Diaz rocked him and once he was rocked Diaz kept enough pressure on to ensure he didn't recover.

Once it went to the ground Diaz controlled him easily. Again people say he was gassed but he was getting caught and getting hurt before he shot, so he went to ground because Diaz had him in all sorts of trouble standing up and once on the ground Diaz just knew how to control him. Conor tried to move and tried to get out but Diaz just didn't let him.

All in all regardless of what anyone says Diaz simply outfought him. He took what Conor landed, dodged most of what was thrown, landed himself with more damage, rocked Conor in the stand-up, kept the pressure on, was on the verge of knocking Conor out, controlled him on the ground, got the win.

Conor is a good fighter and a good striker but he was beaten by a better fighter imo.

Even the biggest McGregor doubters would concede he was gassed by the 2nd round,he was standing flat footed when Diaz landed that cracking 1-2 to wobble him,to say he was in fine condition is absolute garbage talk and this is coming from someone who is making no excuses for him just reasons for how the fight went.

Thelomen Toblackai · 10-03-2016 08:37PM

Gamebred wrote: »

Even the biggest McGregor doubters would concede he was gassed by the 2nd round,he was standing flat footed when Diaz landed that cracking 1-2 to wobble him,to say he was in fine condition is absolute garbage talk and this is coming from someone who is making no excuses for him just reasons for how the fight went.

Who says he was in fine condition ? He wasn't completely gassed though, he wasn't 100%, I'm sure Nate wasn't either given his lack of preparation and the fact he was fighing without a cut just like Conor was. He was breating heavy like many a fighter who stepped into the octagon before him was on many an occasion. But Conor was still landing and controlling until Diaz rocked him. Had Diaz not landed that would Conor have just fallen over with exhaustion ?

What decided that fight was the fact that the percentage and damage of what Conor landed vs the percentage and damage of what Diaz landed were two completely different things.

He was beaten by a better fighter no matter how you want to look at it.

Gamebred · 10-03-2016 08:41PM

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

Who says he was in fine condition ? He wasn't completely gassed though, he wasn't 100%, I'm sure Nate wasn't either given his lack of preparation and the fact he was fighing without a cut just like Conor was. But Conor was still landing and controlling until Diaz rocked him. Had Diaz not landed that would Conor have just fallen over with exhaustion ?

What decided that fight was the fact that the percentage and damage of what Conor landed vs the percentage and damage of what Diaz landed were two completely different things.

He was beaten by a better fighter no matter how you want to look at it.

Dont disagree with the last statement whatsoever cant take anything away from Nate,

To say you dont believe he gassed is fine thats your opinion I disagree strongly,he wound up bombs and punched himself out in the first round,he was physically and mentally drained in the 2nd round before being rocked and having to shoot a takedown for survival,when have you ever seen him stand square flat footed in the centre of the octagon before?

Thelomen Toblackai · 10-03-2016 08:53PM

Gamebred wrote: »

Dont disagree with the last statement whatsoever cant take anything away from Nate,

To say you dont believe he gassed is fine thats your opinion I disagree strongly,he wound up bombs and punched himself out in the first round,he was physically and mentally drained in the 2nd round before being rocked and having to shoot a takedown for survival,when have you ever seen him stand square flat footed in the centre of the octagon before?

That's over exaggerating it though. He was tired but he wasn't completely physically and mentally ****ed after 6 minutes of fighting. Another fighter he'd have been able to keep picking away at and take a decision.

Diaz though was just too good for him. Took what Conor threw and then when the time came landed hard Conor was pretty much ****ed as soon as he got caught.

Paully D · 10-03-2016 10:10PM

Does anyone have that .gif of Nate trapping Conor's leg preventing him from sliding into side control before taking his back for the RNC please? I know it was posted here earlier in the week but I can't find it. Thanks.

Dtp1979 · 10-03-2016 10:20PM

Paully D wrote: »

Does anyone have that .gif of Nate trapping Conor's leg preventing him from sliding into side control before taking his back for the RNC please? I know it was posted here earlier in the week but I can't find it. Thanks.

https://giant.gfycat.com/LinearDeafeningColt.gif

Simply Red · 11-03-2016 02:48AM

Jon Anik keeps his word

slicus ricus · 11-03-2016 10:42AM

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

At the start of the second round he was catching Diaz a lot more. I don't buy the story about being gassed either. He was controlling the fight until Diaz rocked him and once he was rocked Diaz kept enough pressure on to ensure he didn't recover.

The reason Diaz was able to catch him and rock him like that was because Conor was completely gassed - watch it back, at that point, Conor's fluid movement stops and is practically a sitting target, standing right in front of Nate. John Kavanagh said on the MMA hour that he has seen Conor go through an inordinate amount of rounds in training and never seen him breathe heavy and that he was shocked to see Conor breathing heavy after that first round in a way he had never seen from him.

Thelomen Toblackai wrote:

I'm sure Nate wasn't either given his lack of preparation and the fact he was fighing without a cut just like Conor was.

Nate definitely did cut to make 169, no way he was that light on fight night. Chael Sonnen is reporting that Nate was 183lbs on fight night.

11-03-2016 10:47AM

and did kavanagh have his own thoughts for a reason on this? did he say what he suspected was the cause of him gassing or was he just saying conor spars all day and so he's at a loss?? strange really.

I dont think the bulk suited him but without it, he'd be worse ipso facto stay at 155, happy medium???.

slicus ricus · 11-03-2016 10:51AM

rusty cole wrote: »

and did kavanaghhave his own thoughts for a reason on this? did he say what he suspected was trhe cause of him gassing or was he just saying conor spars all day and so he's at a loss?? strange really.

I dont think the bulk suited him but without it, he'd be worse ipso facto stay at 155, happy medium.

Kavanagh said that McGregor overloaded on the left hand and that Nate defended the shots exceptionally well, particularly in rolling the shoulder. Basically that he punched himself out and shouldn't have gone for the knockout left so often in the first. He played down the weight element of it completely, said it didn't make much difference.

Here's the link to it if you want to have a listen to the man himself: http://www.mmafighting.com/2016/3/7/11170782/the-mma-hour-with-rafael-dos-anjos-john-kavanagh-paige-vanzant-in

11-03-2016 10:54AM

slicus ricus wrote: »

Kavanagh said that McGregor overloaded on the left hand and that Nate defended the shots exceptionally well, particularly in rolling the shoulder. Basically that he punched himself out and shouldn't have gone for the knockout left so often in the first. He played down the weight element of it completely, said it didn't make much difference.

I agree, conor was trying to fulfill his own prediction .i.e destroy em in the first and threw everything and the kitchen sink at him.

no shame at I don't think, both were great on the night, there had to be one loser. just bad planning, would be worse if he was being smashed from the bell in round 1.

slicus ricus · 11-03-2016 10:56AM

rusty cole wrote: »

I agree, conor was trying to fulfill his own prediction .i.e destroy em in the first and threw everything and the kitchen sink at him.

no shame at I don't think, both were great on the night, there had to be one loser. just bad planning, would be worse if he was being smashed from the bell in round 1.

Exactly. A fine strategy against featherweights who are much smaller than him with less reach. Not so against a much bigger guy in Diaz who has a longer reach that you have to work hard to get on the inside of to hit.

Spudman_20000 · 11-03-2016 11:27AM

slicus ricus wrote: »

Exactly. A fine strategy against featherweights who are much smaller than him with less reach. Not so against a much bigger guy in Diaz who has a longer reach that you have to work hard to get on the inside of to hit.

One could argue that it's an awful strategy against any fighter in any weight class, because no one can predict how someone will respond to being hit.

Were they actually that naïve to think they were going to KO a much bigger guy and someone who had never been KO'd, or least have a Plan B?

Surely Kavanagh or someone on the coaching staff has a say on strategy, or does Conor have the final word on that? If Kavanagh was surprised at how gassed Conor was on the way back to his stool, couldn't he have advised Conor to change tact and ease up on the haymakers?

Anyway, lots to be learned from this fight. Certainly more lessons than knocking a guy out in 13 seconds. Sickened for Conor, but if he was to lose, at least this was about as "good" of loss as he could have had i.e. not injured or KO'd, didn't lose his title.

It's just annoying to see all the backlash from the haters. And listening to Nate in the post-presser saying he was the superior boxer and martial artist. Conor done well to bite his lip. I would have been like "I must have hit you in the head harder than I thought, if you think you were the superior anything".

JustShon · 11-03-2016 11:32AM

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

does Conor have the final word on that?

I'm not saying Kavanagh has no say, or that Conor ignored him necessarily but obviously Conor does have the final word given that Kavanagh can hardly go into the octagon and force Conor to fight a certain way. If there were a hypothetical disagreement then Conor can just go ahead and do whatever he wants come fight time.

slicus ricus · 11-03-2016 11:48AM

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

One could argue that it's an awful strategy against any fighter in any weight class, because no one can predict how someone will respond to being hit.

One could argue that alright but the key thing is that at featherweight, going for those knockout shots doesn't take as much energy due to the reach advantage and general size difference. Much less likely to gas out and more likely to be able to win on points over 5 rounds.

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

Were they actually that naïve to think they were going to KO a much bigger guy and someone who had never been KO'd, or least have a Plan B?

There's more to it than him just being bigger and having a good chin. Nate's defensive boxing was superb. I'm sure there was a plan B, which I assume was to win on points over 5 rounds which in fairness Conor was doing up to the point where he gassed. I don't think they saw Conor gassing out as coming into the equation to be fair.

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

If Kavanagh was surprised at how gassed Conor was on the way back to his stool, couldn't he have advised Conor to change tact and ease up on the haymakers?

That's exactly what he did say. At that stage the damage was already done to Conor's gas tank.

Spudman_20000 wrote: »

Anyway, lots to be learned from this fight. Certainly more lessons than knocking a guy out in 13 seconds. Sickened for Conor, but if he was to lose, at least this was about as "good" of loss as he could have had i.e. not injured or KO'd, didn't lose his title.

Exactly and he is getting a lot of respect for the fact that he stepped up 2 divisions and the way he handled the loss.

F*ck the haters, they were around from day 1 even when he was winning fights!

akelly02 · 11-03-2016 01:05PM

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

Just watched the full fight back for the first time since the original viewing.

When I seen it live I thought Conor was butchering him in the first round. He landed some good shots but most of what he threw hit thin air.

At the start of the second round he was catching Diaz a lot more. I don't buy the story about being gassed either. He was controlling the fight until Diaz rocked him and once he was rocked Diaz kept enough pressure on to ensure he didn't recover.

Once it went to the ground Diaz controlled him easily. Again people say he was gassed but he was getting caught and getting hurt before he shot, so he went to ground because Diaz had him in all sorts of trouble standing up and once on the ground Diaz just knew how to control him. Conor tried to move and tried to get out but Diaz just didn't let him.

All in all regardless of what anyone says Diaz simply outfought him. He took what Conor landed, dodged most of what was thrown, landed himself with more damage, rocked Conor in the stand-up, kept the pressure on, was on the verge of knocking Conor out, controlled him on the ground, got the win.

Conor is a good fighter and a good striker but he was beaten by a better fighter imo.

I stopped reading after you said you dont think he gassed.
Absolutely ridiculous.

Swashbuckler · 11-03-2016 01:25PM

akelly02 wrote: »

I stopped reading after you said you dont think he gassed.
Absolutely ridiculous.

Of all the bullsh*t nonsense posts on here over the last week you pick on the guy who gives a detailed and reasoned account of his opinion. This is where all the fanboy vs hater crap is rooted.

Gamebred · 11-03-2016 01:29PM

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Of all the bullsh*t nonsense posts on here over the last week you pick on the guy who gives a detailed and reasoned account of his opinion. This is where all the fanboy vs hater crap is rooted.

Come on man,to say he was in grand shape in that 2nd round before he got lit up is absolute rubbish,weather he gassed himself or Nate made him gas what ever your opinion its very clear he was running on fumes.

Swashbuckler · 11-03-2016 01:33PM

Gamebred wrote: »

Come on man,to say he was in grand shape in that 2nd round before he got lit up is absolute rubbish,weather he gassed himself or Nate made him gas what ever your opinion its very clear he was running on fumes.

That's fine. I happen to think he was gassed. But if you disagree with the guy, then explain why instead of just ridiculing it. The reason these McG threads are such a trainwreck are because of the above.

akelly02 · 11-03-2016 01:34PM

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Of all the bullsh*t nonsense posts on here over the last week you pick on the guy who gives a detailed and reasoned account of his opinion. This is where all the fanboy vs hater crap is rooted.

Firstly im not picking on anyone.

Im just stating that what he said is absolute Garbage. Im no expert and God knows there is feck all of them in here either, but if you cant tell when a guy is clearly out of breath and out on his feet then forget about it.

He panic wrestled as he puts it, because he was lit up on the feet and he was gasping for air like a kid with no arm-bands for the first time in a swimming pool.

Gamebred · 11-03-2016 02:44PM

Dont know if anyone seen this but this kinda of illustrates the mind Diaz has,he got absolutely murdered in this fight and still sat in guard stockton slapping the **** out RDA taking the piss he is a legend,love to see him in shape fight him again.

JustShon · 11-03-2016 02:46PM

Gamebred wrote: »

Dont know if anyone seen this but this kinda of illustrates the mind Diaz has,he got absolutely murdered in this fight and still sat in guard stockton slapping the **** out RDA taking the piss he is a legend,love to see him in shape fight him again.

Hilarious

Zero-Cool · 11-03-2016 03:00PM

These are gas!

Swashbuckler · 11-03-2016 04:28PM

Dana White saying this event did 1.5 million ppv buys.....pinch of salt?

Gamebred · 11-03-2016 04:42PM

https://twitter.com/arielhelwani/status/708275433817694208

weather its accurate or not its incredible the numbers Conor brings for the UFC deserves every penny hes paid all his ppv number are incredible.

Swashbuckler · 11-03-2016 04:55PM

Gamebred wrote: »

https://twitter.com/arielhelwani/status/708275433817694208

weather its accurate or not its incredible the numbers Conor brings for the UFC deserves every penny hes paid all his ppv number are incredible.

I read that 1.5 million would break the record but i thought the record was 1.6 million for ufc 100. Huge numbers from Conor though. That's why he's paid so much and why everyone wants to fight him. All the more reason I want Frankie to get the next shot. If any man deserves a payday it's him.

sonofenoch · 11-03-2016 07:18PM

Swashbuckler wrote: »

I read that 1.5 million would break the record but i thought the record was 1.6 million for ufc 100. Huge numbers from Conor though. That's why he's paid so much and why everyone wants to fight him. All the more reason I want Frankie to get the next shot. If any man deserves a payday it's him.

Great if the fights arranged in advance and he turns up.....McGregor should stop this making everyman rich because opponents pull, if they pull so should he .....he goes into these fights with nothing to win, they go in with a ready made excuse and become very wealthy on the back of it.......tough for the fans but still

Gamebred · 11-03-2016 07:22PM

sonofenoch wrote: »

Great if the fights arranged in advance and he turns up.....McGregor should stop this making everyman rich because opponents pull, if they pull so should he .....he goes into these fights with nothing to win, they go in with a ready made excuse and become very wealthy on the back of it.......tough for the fans but still

Hes getting paid 10m plus,thats winning reguardless of what happens in the cage,your record wont secure your kids futures.

Swashbuckler · 11-03-2016 07:37PM

sonofenoch wrote: »

Great if the fights arranged in advance and he turns up.....McGregor should stop this making everyman rich because opponents pull, if they pull so should he .....he goes into these fights with nothing to win, they go in with a ready made excuse and become very wealthy on the back of it.......tough for the fans but still

Its easy say that now but until last week he hadn't lost one of those replacement fights. Plus as Gamebred pointed out, big bucks for him to take the fight. He fought Diaz, got paid 10m plus and broke the ppv record. Despite the loss he still did pretty good.

Thelomen Toblackai · 11-03-2016 07:53PM

Swashbuckler wrote: »

Of all the bullsh*t nonsense posts on here over the last week you pick on the guy who gives a detailed and reasoned account of his opinion. This is where all the fanboy vs hater crap is rooted.

There isn't much point in trying to discuss anything here from what I see. I'm pretty certain the only thing people here look for in posts is "Is he pro or anti Conor" and then design their responses accordingly "do I thank it or call it ****e". Certainly at this stage of the thread. You always get those few people living in a thread rubbishing everything people say if it doesn't fit with their own view.

UFC 196: McGregor v Diaz

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