No refund for families who have paid water charges

bmay529 · 02-03-2016 10:59AM #1

As someone who has paid their water charges I read this morning that FF say there will be No refund for families who have paid water charges. If true, as someone who felt they were meeting their civic duty, even though I did not like the charge, it would really **** me off if those who did not pay got off scot-free while those who did will face the hit. For sure I will remember it a) when deciding who to elect next time and b) I will remember this whenever any future charges our Government dream up are levied. SO FF find a way to recognise those who paid and don't pawn it off by saying someone else decided on the charge. Also am I right in saying every other country in Europe has water charges and that their removal will effect the country's balance sheet with many other negative implications

Mr.Micro · 02-03-2016 02:40PM

bmay529 wrote: »

As someone who has paid their water charges I read this morning that FF say there will be No refund for families who have paid water charges. If true, as someone who felt they were meeting their civic duty, even though I did not like the charge, it would really **** me off if those who did not pay got off scot-free while those who did will face the hit. For sure I will remember it a) when deciding who to elect next time and b) I will remember this whenever any future charges our Government dream up are levied. SO FF find a way to recognise those who paid and don't pawn it off by saying someone else decided on the charge. Also am I right in saying every other country in Europe has water charges and that their removal will effect the country's balance sheet with many other negative implications

Did you expect anything different. Water charges are here to stay.

vg88 · 02-03-2016 02:40PM

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Water charges are here to stay.

lol

cruizer101 · 02-03-2016 02:42PM

It happened before, years ago I think the 80's they brought in water charges, some people paid some didn't got scrapped no refund. Madness but that politicians for you

mcgovern · 02-03-2016 02:45PM

If they scrap the charges without refunds, I won't be voting for any parties involved in the future.

tipptom · 02-03-2016 02:55PM

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Did you expect anything different. Water charges are here to stay.

I await to hear what government formation you have made up that is going to carry on with the water charges.

oscarBravo · 02-03-2016 03:37PM

tipptom wrote: »

I await to hear what government formation you have made up that is going to carry on with the water charges.

It'll be interesting to see how long a cobbled-together populist government's plan to scrap water charges lasts in the face of EC fines for WFD breaches.

tipptom · 02-03-2016 04:06PM

oscarBravo wrote: »

It'll be interesting to see how long a cobbled-together populist government's plan to scrap water charges lasts in the face of EC fines for WFD breaches.

Would be interesting to see how long a party would last if they go in and implement FG/Labs policy when they have said its a red line issue.

I would say FG is delighted to get out of the mess they have made of it and they get to save face.

Sure don't the EU allow countrys to evade breeches the whole time and we have Endas special relationship with Angela.

IW has not a chance unless FG go back to the electorate and get an overall majority.

Mr.Micro · 02-03-2016 04:15PM

tipptom wrote: »

I await to hear what government formation you have made up that is going to carry on with the water charges.

Do you really think that we can continue to supply water in a vague unregulated fashion, with no standardisation of quality or supply, as we move forward, or backwards as Ireland frequently does? Water charges will be in place one way or another, it is naive to believe otherwise.

zl1whqvjs75cdy · 02-03-2016 04:19PM

As long as there is this uncertainty people will stop paying, myself included. Why would I pay money to an entity that may not exist in 6 months time when it's clear there will be no refunds? I'll sit tight and ignore Irish water until we see what's what, and I'd imagine that I'm not the only one.

vicwatson · 02-03-2016 04:22PM

oscarBravo wrote: »

It'll be interesting to see how long a cobbled-together populist government's plan to scrap water charges lasts in the face of EC fines for WFD breaches.

EU fines, we might not even be in, and there might not even be, an EU in 12 months time

Jim2007 · 02-03-2016 07:45PM

bmay529 wrote: »

As someone who has paid their water charges I read this morning that FF say there will be No refund for families who have paid water charges. If true, as someone who felt they were meeting their civic duty, even though I did not like the charge, it would really **** me off if those who did not pay got off scot-free while those who did will face the hit.

If and it is only if the charge was to be abolish, it will be from some date in the future and those who did not pay will still be liable for the charges during the period they were enforce.

Charles Babbage · 03-03-2016 12:55AM

Jim2007 wrote: »

If and it is only if the charge was to be abolish, it will be from some date in the future and those who did not pay will still be liable for the charges during the period they were enforce.

Will these spongers be pursued for their payments?

micosoft · 03-03-2016 01:09AM

Effectively FF are proposing to legalise tax evasion on the principle that any tax could at any point in the future be cancelled without recourse for those who have paid said charge and no penalties for those who have not. Why would you pay anything on that basis!

That said, I don't believe for a second they mean it. This is without doubt the most cynical political move I have ever seen - some element of electoral gain in return for undermining the states authority. Along with their "new form of Dail" this is nothing less then a ploy to have their cake and eat it in opposition and then return to single party FF govt in 2 years time when they pull the rug. FG should step back and let them form a Govt.

micosoft · 03-03-2016 01:10AM

Jim2007 wrote: »

If and it is only if the charge was to be abolish, it will be from some date in the future and those who did not pay will still be liable for the charges during the period they were enforce.

And what stick exactly will a non-existent entity (if IW is disbanded per FF policy) have to enforce this?

Arkady · 03-03-2016 01:11AM

Anyone who allowed a metered connection (under the false impression that everyone will have to have a meter installed), instead of insisting on retaining an un-metered connection, is also being doubly screwed. So much for being law abiding citizen in Ireland, even if you don't agree with a policy, and the authorities making sure breaking the law doesn't pay. What a gombeen hole this country is.

nhunter100 · 03-03-2016 02:02AM

Charles Babbage wrote:

Will these spongers be pursued for their payments?

Bitter?

nice_guy80 · 03-03-2016 09:09AM

FF agreed the establishment of Irish Water
FG then followed up on it in a shoddy shoddy way

both of them should be hung out to dry

Brussels Sprout · 03-03-2016 09:10AM

I paid my water bill last year and I'm annoyed, not at the loss of that money but at the thought we are going to continue to be the only developed country to allow people to waste as much water as they wish. Not only that but the water infrastructure will go back to being a second class, neglected government expense behind the likes of pensions, social welfare payments and public sector wages. Whenever the government need to save money they'll cut it first in other words

I read the other day that there are still 1.2 billion people in the world who live without electricity, mostly in sub-Saharan Africa and parts of south-east Asia. Part of the reason why it's so difficult to expand the electrical network in these countries is that people see power "as a right" and tap into the network illegally. This loses money for the supply companies and makes them shrink their networks. The idea of "unlimited free power as a right" seems as foreign to us here in Ireland as the idea of "unlimited free treated water as a right" seems to the rest of the OECD. In many ways we still are a bloody banana republic.

seamus · 03-03-2016 09:17AM

micosoft wrote: »

And what stick exactly will a non-existent entity (if IW is disbanded per FF policy) have to enforce this?

Irish Water won't be disbanded. FF's policy is to repaint it with a new logo.

The stick that will be used is a charge against your property preventing you from selling or transferring it until the charge is paid.

Tenants who do not clear their bill on moving out will have the balance taken out of their deposits, as the landlord isn't going to pay it himself.

Littlehorny · 03-03-2016 09:21AM

Irish water was a disaster from day one, to the way it was set up and structured to the monumental amount of our money that was wasted on consultancy fees to putting in meters before any money was spent on infrastructure. It has also been proved many times that we already paid for our water services. The government made such a balls of the whole thing.
I think it is a great thing that the Irish people have stood up to be counted and told the people who are supposed to be working for us in our best interests to stick this con job where the sun doesn't shine. As i heard someone say "don't p*ss on my head and tell me it's raining".

gladrags · 03-03-2016 09:23AM

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Will these spongers be pursued for their payments?

No

There will be no payback,from the banks or any financial institutions.Incuding estate agents,auditors and developers...

For the sponging that led to the breakdown of society.

Although we did have a banking inqiiry,that certainly brought the parasites to justice.

Permabear · 03-03-2016 09:58AM

This post has been deleted.

cml387 · 03-03-2016 10:05AM

I've paid water charges but will not be paying the next bill (Shane Ross reckons I'd "be a fool" to pay it).

God help any government attempting to bring in a "broadcasting charge " for example.

Phoebas · 03-03-2016 10:05AM

oscarBravo wrote: »

It'll be interesting to see how long a cobbled-together populist government's plan to scrap water charges lasts in the face of EC fines for WFD breaches.

Do you remember all that 'fiscal space'? I think we've just found a use for it.

Priorities eh?

Terri26 · 03-03-2016 10:06AM

People who didn't pay were taking a chance/risq themselves. I'll be annoyed if people do get refunded as they didn't take the risk.

mcko · 03-03-2016 10:09AM

Maybe use the refunds to get a backbone fitted.

seamus · 03-03-2016 10:10AM

Phoebas wrote: »

Do you remember all that 'fiscal space'? I think we've just found a use for it.

Priorities eh?

Yep. €7bn of it.

Like I've said all along, Irish Water and water charges are not going away.

At best IW will get a lick of paint and people will get a brief respite from receiving new water bills.

The cost of going back now will be multiple of what's been spent already.

KERSPLAT! · 03-03-2016 10:22AM

Terri26 wrote: »

People who didn't pay were taking a chance/risq themselves. I'll be annoyed if people do get refunded as they didn't take the risk.

Damn those of us who paid our bills!! Fools the lot of us.

People who haven't paid think this is great but as has been said already, numerous times, water charges as a whole aren't going away. Those who think they are, are the real fools.

screamer · 03-03-2016 10:23AM

Water charges are not taxes and they are not legally enforceable as yet. So far people have opted in or out of paying.....
Course they wont refund any monies paid where would they get it from? It's long gone down the drain.

Jack Killian · 03-03-2016 10:26AM

Will those looking for a refund return their grant ?

No refund for families who have paid water charges

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