Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Warning link in OP 20/3

Quandary · 01-03-2016 10:33AM

What Rashford has done in the past two matches was pretty amazing but it would be massively premature to start expecting anything of him.

If he goes on to score another few goals between now and end of the season it will be great. Anything more than that would be cause for excitement

Lord TSC · 01-03-2016 10:35AM

The injuries excuse annoys me.

Noit just because, as said, its because he trimmed the squad down himself, but because for the majority of the season, we've been able to field 9 or 10 senior players for the majority of games.

When we went on our winless streak before Xmas, when we weren't scoring goals, it wasn't injuries that was the problem; by and large, Martial, Rooney, Memphis, Mata and Lingard have been fit and available, and thats the front line he wanted going into the season. Likewise, in midfield, we've had enough depth that we've not had to be fielding kids there, even when one or two players were out.

Defense, our wingbacks situation has been a disaster with injuries; our 1st, 2nd and 3rd choices have been out, and I accept that hurts a lot. But on the flipside, Smalling and Blind were the first choice defence at the start of the season, and have largely remained uninjured for the season too.

The last 2 weeks has sucked, injury wise, but its the first time I'd say that its really stripped the team down to bear bones. And, ironically, it's also been when we've been playing our best football! The last two games, in spite of an injury crisis, have been the most enjoyable as a United fan all season.

Injuries impacting the season as a whole is being overstated; outside of the RB and LB, this is the team he wanted, with the depth and coverage he wanted. And he couldn't get that team firing the way he needed to. It says something that we have scored more goals when we had to lose Rooney, had to stop relying on Martial, and turned to a kid who was 7th choice, and a kid who has been ostracized (rightly or wrongly) since last November. He is extremely lucky that Rashford and Memphis, two players he wouldn't have played unless forced to, have stepped up in the biggest way possible.

01-03-2016 10:36AM

Daily Fail with the bull****. With absolutly no source they are saying Rashford is refusing the contract offer he's recived

Flint Fredstone · 01-03-2016 10:37AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

80 minutes over 4 sub appearances. Rashford already has more time on the field in 2 games than Periera has had all season.

Thats not giving the lad a chance, thats stringing him along all season, so to return to the point you either completely missed or deliberately ignored in my original post, of course it has an effect on these young lads mentally. Just ask Pogba what he thinks of that sort of thing.

How is it stringing him along? If he's not deemed to be good enough by the manager then that's just the way it is.
Just because an armchair fan on a message board thinks he should be getting more time doesn't mean sh1t.
Are you watching him in training? Do you think he is a shoe-in for how Van Gaal wants the team to set up?
What would he offer the team that we are currently lacking?

Oh and Pogba hit the ground running at Juve iirc, the detrimental effect of not playing for United's first team didn't seem to stop him playing for another team.
I definitely don't remember anybody whinging about him not playing well for Juve because of Fergie. They were pretty much amazed over there United let him go.

beno619 · 01-03-2016 10:38AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

This place is laughable. A couple of good performances and there's nothing to whinge about so they whinge about an academy player not getting a game at fúcking Brighton. Well done lads, you've surpassed my expectations.

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

That's the truth, that was the sole purpose of Tyson Fury's post.

This implies your referring to multiple posters.

Flint Fredstone · 01-03-2016 10:41AM

beno619 wrote: »

This implies your referring to multiple posters.

Yeah well the cavalry arrived.

beno619 · 01-03-2016 10:41AM

StringerBell wrote: »

In all fairness you can't expect me to spoon feed this to you and since you are now just making things up, i.e. rant, I suppose its time to end this one.

It was nice while it lased though wasn't it

Another good result during the week might buy a few more hours peace in here!

Apologies mother. I'll only make posts you deem acceptable from now on. :rolleyes:

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beno619 · 01-03-2016 10:42AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

Yeah well the cavalry arrived.

Like I said lovely strawman

01-03-2016 10:44AM

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

Yes which one?? Popcorn anyone??

This also applies to this thread :P

Mitch Connor · 01-03-2016 10:44AM

So - how do we reckon we will get on in March?

Win every game and we will be in a very good position I reckon!

Through the FA Cup semi, EL quaters and a much better chance of getting CL football.

Can we win every game.... sure why not! Lets start with keeping this little run going and stuffing Watford tomorrow.

Flint Fredstone · 01-03-2016 10:45AM

See, even Mitch is positive.

The_Kew_Tour · 01-03-2016 10:46AM

Choo choo!!!

bucketybuck · 01-03-2016 10:49AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

How is it stringing him along? If he's not deemed to be good enough by the manager then that's just the way it is.

If he isn't good enough then what is he doing on the bench? Is he considered a viable option or is he not?

If he is on the bench and is considered an option, then why is he not used considering the players in front of him were playing terribly? The likes of Depay and Mata were putrid at times this season and yet Periera never got a look in, so why is he even there?

Maybe you have never played a sport before, but most people that have know full well the corrosive effects to morale of sitting on the bench behind underperforming players without ever getting a chance, especially when you consider that other, younger and less established players are thrown in no problem. You don't think the situation could make Periera doubt himself, question himself as to why he doesn't get a chance, or make him feel more pressure to perform in the five minutes he gets here and there?

And you don't think the same might possibly have applied to Wilson before he was shipped out?

Alf Veedersane · 01-03-2016 10:49AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So - how do we reckon we will get on in March?

I think we'll win March. It's going to be that good.

Your Airbag · 01-03-2016 10:50AM

So a very good & interesting week UTD just had. It leads to a few discussion points.

LVG said something very interesting in his post match bbc interview after the Arsenal victory. He was asked was he surprised by the kids coming in and doing so well and he said "not really, this is why i like to work with smaller squads so I can give youth a chance, I have done this at all my clubs".

Well that statement really stood out to me and it leads towards some questions.

1) LVG only brought the majority of the kids in recently due to our injury crisis, yes he has started others before and not due to injury, and in total I think its 11 reserve players he has given a start to since he took over, thats showing good faith in youth but again the likes of McNair and Blackett were only in because of injuries. But why does it take an injury crisis for the recent batch to come in and do so well as opposed to the mainly static displays we have seen from more senior squad selections?

The smaller squad issue is a huge problem for UTD fans, if the reason LVG likes doing this is for youth to come through then why has he mainly picked senior players with only the odd reserve player getting the nod when all are fit (Lingrad mainly). I have heard it said before LVG lucked into this form due to injuries and also did likewise last season at a similar point. Its definitely a plausible theory.

2) Should LVG continue with this current selection even with a fully fit squad to pick from? Rashford has been a revelation, Varela has been awesome and Tim Fosu-Mensah looks like he has ability.

Lingard I wanted dropped as I thought the experiment wasn't working but he's show slight signs of improvement lately. The pace and fearlessness the youth have offered has also improved the play of some of the other squad members. Mata and Memphis for example look much more free with pace and directness around them. Herrera too.

I think Varela and Rashers should be kept on as they offer pace and directness. Also maybe see how Mensah handles a full 90. Rashers and Varela have given us two great selection options, I don't see why that should be stopped.

3) If we go with youth (class of 16 anyone?) who gets cut? Is there a balance to be struck to keep the squad happy

DDG

Varela --- Smalling --- Blind --- Rojo
Schneiderlin/Basti --- Herrera
Lingard -- Mata/Rooney -- Memphis/Martial
Rashford

Mitch Connor · 01-03-2016 10:52AM

March 2nd - home vs Watford
March 6th - away vs West Brom
March 10th - away vs Liverpool (EL)
March 13th - home vs West Ham (FAC)
March 17th - home vs Liverpool (EL)
March 20th - away vs City.

I reckon the Watford and West Brom games are must wins matches. I reckon the City game is the only game LVG could afford to lose without coping a servious amount of flak (not that it matters) - going through in the Cups vs Liverpool and West Ham is important. Liverpool only because it is Liverpool though, imo. If we were playing anyone else it would be a low priority game I think.

01-03-2016 10:52AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So - how do we reckon we will get on in March?

Win every game and we will be in a very good position I reckon!

Through the FA Cup semi, EL quaters and a much better chance of getting CL football.

Can we win every game.... sure why not! Lets start with keeping this little run going and stuffing Watford tomorrow.

Won't be easy away from home.
Good news is that Smalling & Martial look set for a return.
Going to be interesting as to what happens the midfiled considering Carrick will no longer be needed as a makeshift CB if Smalling slots back in.
Rojos injury is also no serious.

The_Kew_Tour · 01-03-2016 10:55AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Won't be easy away from home.
Good news is that Smalling & Martial look set for a return.
Going to be interesting as to what happens the midfiled considering Carrick will no longer be needed as a makeshift CB if Smalling slots back in.
Rojos injury is also no serious.

We're at home tomorrow, away to West Brom then Sunday

Mitch Connor · 01-03-2016 10:58AM

Your Airbag wrote: »

DDG
Varela --- Smalling --- Blind --- Rojo
Schneiderlin/Basti --- Herrera
Lingard -- Mata/Rooney -- Memphis/Martial
Rashford

I would think Varela has done enough to keep his place over Darmian, Valencia or Young.

The only change I would make is Martial up front in place of Rashford. Rashford has done well, but I think a longer span of performances is required before he would become a first choice player. Could just be a flash in the pan whose finding everything is just rolling for him at the moment.

I would keep Carrick, Schweinsteiger, Fellaini and Rooney out of the team with the current front 6 (though Martial in for Rashford) retaining their places in the team and positions on the pitch. Mata playing centrally at 10, for example, is better than Rooney at the moment and better than Mata wide right.

I would, and have, argued his use of young players has been forced rather than planned and paced development of the players and his play that it was all part of some master plan is annoying.

Flint Fredstone · 01-03-2016 11:03AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

If he isn't good enough then what is he doing on the bench? Is he considered a viable option or is he not?

If he is on the bench and is considered an option, then why is he not used considering the players in front of him were playing terribly? The likes of Depay and Mata were putrid at times this season and yet Periera never got a look in, so why is he even there?

Maybe you have never played a sport before, but most people that have know full well the corrosive effects to morale of sitting on the bench behind underperforming players without ever getting a chance, especially when you consider that other, younger and less established players are thrown in no problem. You don't think the situation could make Periera doubt himself, question himself as to why he doesn't get a chance, or make him feel more pressure to perform in the five minutes he gets here and there?

And you don't think the same might possibly have applied to Wilson before he was shipped out?

Players sit on the bench every week and get feck all game time. It's a small, depleted squad, surprised you're using that line of arguing because you've been banging on about that all season iirc.

I'm not even going to bother getting into the psychological effects on a player. It's the managers job to pick what he considers the best team, any mental byproduct of that is just an unfortunate reality for a lot of young players.

bucketybuck · 01-03-2016 11:03AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I would, and have, argued his use of young players has been forced rather than planned and paced development of the players and his play that it was all part of some master plan is annoying.

To add, he is welcome to prove us wrong on this. All he has to do is keep using those young players when the injuries clear up.

I know what I think will happen.

bucketybuck · 01-03-2016 11:05AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

I'm not even going to bother getting into the psychological effects on a player.

Of course you aren't, that would involve actually debating my point.

Flint Fredstone · 01-03-2016 11:08AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Of course you aren't, that would involve actually debating my point.

And you accuse me of skipping over points :rolleyes:

I've said it's an unfortunate byproduct of the game. He has no right to think he should be getting regular game time. If everybody is fit he might not even make the bench.

jayo26 · 01-03-2016 11:17AM

Well this place escalated quickly..... No need to look at the Arsenal thread for entertainment now.

bucketybuck · 01-03-2016 11:17AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

He has no right to think he should be getting regular game time.

Strawman.

Mitch Connor · 01-03-2016 11:18AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

To add, he is welcome to prove us wrong on this. All he has to do is keep using those young players when the injuries clear up.

I know what I think will happen.

Indeed - CBJ over Rojo at LB is one you can argue on merit and I can't see an argument for dropping Varela for anyone unless Darmian can remember how to football again.

I think Rashford should retain his place in the match day squad but I would be fine with Martial coming back in for him.

If we go back to the ponderous central midfield of BS and MS, dumping Herrera out or Fellaini comes back in over any of the current midfield selections it will be disappointing.

I don't think any of Riley, Weir, Love, McNair have done anything to have a place over current member of the first team squad.

Flint Fredstone · 01-03-2016 11:21AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Strawman.

So should Weir, Riley, Fosu-Mensah, Love etc all expect to be given plenty of minutes now? I mean they've been on the bench and played lately, it might affect their career if we don't get them on. Or is it just Pereira because you rate him?

bucketybuck · 01-03-2016 11:25AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

So should Weir, Riley, Fosu-Mensah, Love etc all expect to be given plenty of minutes now?

More straw.

beno619 · 01-03-2016 11:29AM

Your Airbag wrote: »

So a very good & interesting week UTD just had. It leads to a few discussion points.

LVG said something very interesting in his post match bbc interview after the Arsenal victory. He was asked was he surprised by the kids coming in and doing so well and he said "not really, this is why i like to work with smaller squads so I can give youth a chance, I have done this at all my clubs".

Well that statement really stood out to me and it leads towards some questions.

1) LVG only brought the majority of the kids in recently due to our injury crisis, yes he has started others before and not due to injury, and in total I think its 11 reserve players he has given a start to since he took over, thats showing good faith in youth but again the likes of McNair and Blackett were only in because of injuries. But why does it take an injury crisis for the recent batch to come in and do so well as opposed to the mainly static displays we have seen from more senior squad selections?

Great post.

This is something certain section's have been calling for.

He created a small squad and claims its because he wants to give kids a chance but in the end we shoehorned players everywhere.

If he actually used the youngsters throughout the season, there would be fewer complaints about his squad management, it would have been harder to criticise him if he had actually been giving youth a chance.

ElChe32 · 01-03-2016 11:29AM

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2016 - Mod Warning link in OP 20/3

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