Evil as an entity?

Ray Palmer · 29-02-2016 11:51AM #1

If you follow news and comments from people you will notice people refer to people being evil and talk about it like an entity. It just amazes me people think you can sort of be taken over by some force and then you are evil yourself. It is akin to believing in the devil. Not attacking religion but in Christianity the devil doesn't actually exist as a being trying to win souls so it isn't religious.
Now if you say somebody has a mental illness and not in control of themselves when they do some horrendous act people go on about how the person is just evil and mental illness is some cover story.
Do people really think as evil as a thing as opposed to people who are just horrible people or horrible acts by a person?

BTW "The greatest trick the devil ever pull was making people believe he didn't exist" is a complete cop out and while a nice turn of phrase it isn't a clever answer

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 29-02-2016 11:53AM

What?

Panthro · 29-02-2016 12:03PM

Ara, better the devil you know.
So... when's the Coke n Hookers party?

Chris_Bradley · 29-02-2016 12:07PM

What the fcuk?

Badly Drunk Boy · 29-02-2016 12:07PM

Ray, are you related to Leland Palmer from Twin Peaks? I reckon he was the embodiment of evil. Or was he?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 29-02-2016 12:08PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

... in Christianity the devil doesn't actually exist as a being trying to win souls...

I don't know where you got that notion from because it's completely wrong.

Milly33 · 29-02-2016 12:15PM

I love that saying...The greatest trick the devil ever pull was making people believe he didn't exist or the Devil is a Gentleman

Must say I kinda believe in both...

Whilst saying evil being an entity I would think lets say someone being mislead, the evilness is there someplace whether it be in someone else, or from a situation that has come about... There is something there

But then I also think people can be evil, you can just tell I think from people..The eyes say it all, if the eyes look sneaky then no doubt there is sneakiness (quote myself

)

One kid I would know from a young age, I swear his evil. He just has these nasty eyes i wouldn't be surprised if when he grows up there is something, again for another young adult I know..I would say she is evil...

Ray Palmer · 29-02-2016 12:21PM

Vincenzo Pitiful Ration wrote: »

I don't know where you got that notion from because it's completely wrong.

Go check it out. It certainly isn't catholic. There are of course the loony ones that believe in the rapture which is a very weird reading of the bible. People often join up different demons and say it is the devil in the bible but they aren't the same being. Story of Eden serpent isn't the guy in revelations for example.

King George VI · 29-02-2016 12:23PM

The Tayto company is evil. They changed the recipe for Snax and Jonnie Onion Rings and now they taste shite. And Chickatees aren't covered in the flavouring anymore. Childhood ruined.

ScumLord · 29-02-2016 12:24PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

BTW "The greatest trick the devil ever pull was making people believe he didn't exist" is a complete cop out and while a nice turn of phrase it isn't a clever answer

I heard the devil is doing street magic now, just to make ends meet. There just isn't a living in magic these days.

Johnny Carson wrote: »

The Tayto company is evil. They changed the recipe for Snax and now they taste shite. Childhood ruined.

Did they manage to change the recipe throughout time?

Corvo · 29-02-2016 12:26PM

When people hear of a terrible crime such as acts of great violence, rape etc. people have to talk about evil as an entity as it so difficult to understand from a normal persons view as to how anyone can do something like that. Simple as that.

Milly33 · 29-02-2016 12:28PM

They have ruined Taytoes..Even the cheese and onion ones tis like stop messing with them....

eviltwin · 29-02-2016 12:33PM

It's a get out clause. ' It wasn't me it was the devil' is a handy way of putting the responsibility onto something else plus I think society still has a hard time accepting some folk are just bad. It's easier to personify evil that admit the problem might be with us.

King George VI · 29-02-2016 12:36PM

ScumLord wrote: »

Did they manage to change the recipe throughout time?

Yep. Pure scum is what they are. Snax used to be little fluffs of tasty goodness. Now they're thin strips of filth.

Ray Palmer · 29-02-2016 12:38PM

Corvo wrote: »

When people hear of a terrible crime such as acts of great violence, rape etc. people have to talk about evil as an entity as it so difficult to understand from a normal persons view as to how anyone can do something like that. Simple as that.

They make up an imaginary enemy and they think that is the best option. That is more difficult to understand than a people do bad things

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 29-02-2016 12:42PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Go check it out. It certainly isn't catholic. There are of course the loony ones that believe in the rapture which is a very weird reading of the bible. People often join up different demons and say it is the devil in the bible but they aren't the same being. Story of Eden serpent isn't the guy in revelations for example.

I don't need you to tell me to check it out. I know my Catholicism. Many Catholic prayers specifically asks for us to be defended "against the wickedness and snares of the devil."

The very physical process of exorcism is used within the Catholic Church against the devil.

keano_afc · 29-02-2016 12:44PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Go check it out. It certainly isn't catholic. There are of course the loony ones that believe in the rapture which is a very weird reading of the bible. People often join up different demons and say it is the devil in the bible but they aren't the same being. Story of Eden serpent isn't the guy in revelations for example.

"Not attacking religion but..."

Alcoheda · 29-02-2016 12:46PM

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

Ray, are you related to Leland Palmer from Twin Peaks? I reckon he was the embodiment of evil. Or was he?

It's Bob who's evil.

Fire walk with me!

manonboard · 29-02-2016 01:43PM

Great Topic OP

I used to believe in Evil. Heck some people including myself even believed there was some of it in me. I had psychopathic tendencies or such.
Turns out I was just un-diagnosed autism!

However, I developed a keen interesting psychology and emotions.
From what I've learned, Evil is just a external concept imposed on us to blame external things for our internal ignorance and feelings.
There's no such thing at all in reality.

There's some fundamental truths that show me that it doesn't exist.
1: People self serve.. always.
2: People try to move away from suffering towards pleasure.
3: People use the best mechanism they are capable of to comply with their learned values/motivations.

Every act a person commits, is to serve. In that way its a constructive force.
If this affect has negative consequences for others, It is often labeled as bad, or evil.
However that's just that persons own ignorance showing. Any act that is completely understood is never labeled as evil. It's only when we lack understanding do we assign judgement or blame.

Drugs are evil? Nonsense. Killing is evil? Nonsense. Terrorism is evil? Nonsense.
These things are all done for a constructive purpose. Just because that constructive purpose does not suit you. Does not make them evil.
It simply you being vulnerable, and that fear expressing itself usually as anger. Anger and ignorance is what hate is composed of, and hate is mechanism that we use to decide we are good and they are evil.

manonboard · 29-02-2016 01:48PM

Vincenzo Pitiful Ration wrote: »

I don't need you to tell me to check it out. I know my Catholicism. Many Catholic prayers specifically asks for us to be defended "against the wickedness and snares of the devil."

The very physical process of exorcism is used within the Catholic Church against the devil.

I think there's much room for interpretation of these things.

If you consider that evil might be the resultant concept of a person that has ignorance and fear (manifesting as anger).
Then delivering person from wickedness and snares of the devil could be interpreted as simply choosing the path of light and goodness. This can be accomplished by increasing our awareness to remove the ignorance we have about the person/topic (eg stop choosing our thoughts that the person is trying to hurt us, and instead recognize they are trying to help themselves).
This fits in with Jesus's teachings of turning the other cheek. Instead of choosing anger, we turn the other cheek and give the person another chance, we do this in the form of learning about them, and helping them to form a better mechanism to obtain their needs.
It allows us to remove the enemy from our enemy. Leaving a friend and ally.

Easier said than done.

Much of catholic teachings shows us that goodness and evil are inside us, that all of heaven can be obtain within ourselves. If such things as a piece of god, or the holy spirit exists within us, then its the inner journey we must walk to turn away from evil and towards good.

donegaLroad · 29-02-2016 01:49PM

eviltwin wrote: »

It's a get out clause. ' It wasn't me it was the devil' is a handy way of putting the responsibility onto something else plus I think society still has a hard time accepting some folk are just bad. It's easier to personify evil that admit the problem might be with us.

and I will swear on the bible that this is so..

brevity · 29-02-2016 01:52PM

Alcoheda wrote: »

It's Bob who's evil.

Just had a flashback of that TV show; God, The Devil and Bob.

manonboard · 29-02-2016 01:54PM

eviltwin wrote: »

It's a get out clause. ' It wasn't me it was the devil' is a handy way of putting the responsibility onto something else plus I think society still has a hard time accepting some folk are just bad. It's easier to personify evil that admit the problem might be with us.

Is this not a contradiction in itself?
Is the concept that some people are just bad, not the result of personifying evil?

Richard Hillman · 29-02-2016 02:00PM

Johnny Carson wrote: »

The Tayto company is evil. They changed the recipe for Snax and Jonnie Onion Rings and now they taste shite. And Chickatees aren't covered in the flavouring anymore. Childhood ruined.

chipsticks too

Speedwell · 29-02-2016 02:01PM

There's no such thing as "evil as an entity". Evil is an adjective. Things can be more evil or less evil. Evil is a nontangible property of things that we make a moral judgment on. We can't even agree on an objective definition of evil.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 29-02-2016 03:41PM

manonboard wrote: »

I think there's much room for interpretation of these things.

If you consider that evil might be the resultant concept of a person that has ignorance and fear (manifesting as anger).
Then delivering person from wickedness and snares of the devil could be interpreted as simply choosing the path of light and goodness. This can be accomplished by increasing our awareness to remove the ignorance we have about the person/topic (eg stop choosing our thoughts that the person is trying to hurt us, and instead recognize they are trying to help themselves).
This fits in with Jesus's teachings of turning the other cheek. Instead of choosing anger, we turn the other cheek and give the person another chance, we do this in the form of learning about them, and helping them to form a better mechanism to obtain their needs.
It allows us to remove the enemy from our enemy. Leaving a friend and ally.

Easier said than done.

Much of catholic teachings shows us that goodness and evil are inside us, that all of heaven can be obtain within ourselves. If such things as a piece of god, or the holy spirit exists within us, then its the inner journey we must walk to turn away from evil and towards good.

Just for clarity. I wasn't expounding the notion, just pointing out to the OP what the Catholic Churches teaching is on the matter. Your interpretation may well be true but it's not what the CCC teaches.

Badly Drunk Boy · 29-02-2016 03:56PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Go check it out. It certainly isn't catholic. There are of course the loony ones that believe in the rapture which is a very weird reading of the bible. People often join up different demons and say it is the devil in the bible but they aren't the same being. Story of Eden serpent isn't the guy in revelations for example.

As Srameen was saying, the Devil is real, according to the Church.

Does the Catholic Church believe in the Devil?

Based on the teaching and example of Jesus (Mt 4:1-11; 12:22-30; Mk 1:34; Lk 10:18; 22:31; Jn 8:44), the Catholic Church has always held that the devil is real, not a mythical personification of evil. The Fourth Lateran Council (1215), in its decree condemning the Manichaean dualism of the Catharists, taught that "the devil and the other evil spirits were created good in nature, but they became evil by their own actions."

The Church's teaching on the subject is clear from its liturgy. At baptism, those to be baptized are called upon to reject Satan, his works, and his empty promises. The Church provides an official rite of exorcism, which presupposes, of course, the existence of Satan.

In 1975 the Sacred Congregation for Divine Worship issued a document called Christian Faith and Demonology. It explained the Church's teaching on the subject. This document quotes Pope Paul VI's teaching regarding the devil:

It is a departure from the picture provided by biblical and Church teaching to refuse to acknowledge the devil's existence; to regard him as . . . a conceptual and fanciful personification of the unknown causes of our misfortunes. . . . Exegetes and theologians should not be deaf to this warning.

Presumably this exhortation extends to priests who appear on television.

More recently, Pope John Paul II, in his general audience of August 13, 1986, expounded at length on the fall of the angels and, in speaking on the origin of Satan, said,

When, by an act of his own free will, he rejected the truth that he knew about God, Satan became the cosmic "liar and the father of lies" (Jn 8:44). For this reason, he lives in radical and irreversible denial of God and seeks to impose on creation--on the other beings created in the image of God and in particular on people--his own tragic "lie about the good" that is God.

By the way, I don't even believe that God exists either so I'm not trying to evangelise or owt...

Speedwell · 29-02-2016 04:14PM

If this is going to turn into a discussion of Christian dogma, I suggest we move it to the Christianity forum.

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