Is a dog owner liable if his dog bites cat?

JimiTime · 08-02-2016 12:19PM #1

I witnessed a dog (Off the lead and out of control), attack a local cat in my garden recently. The poor cat was in a bad way afterward (big puncture and seemingly unable to use back legs in the immediate aftermath). Dog would not listen to owner, and then owner sped off in car.
I'm now curious, is he liable for the vets bill for the cat? Its also on the dangerous dog breed list and wasn't muzzled neither. I know if it attacked a person, there would be serious consequences, but IIRC, cats are almost considered vermin in terms of the law?

Nody · 08-02-2016 12:43PM

Can't remember the exact legal details but I think the cat would be counted as property of the owner and hence the dog's attack would be damage to property which he'd be liable for.

ganmo · 08-02-2016 12:48PM

JimiTime wrote: »

I witnessed a dog (Off the lead and out of control), attack a local cat in my garden recently. The poor cat was in a bad way afterward (big puncture and seemingly unable to use back legs in the immediate aftermath). Dog would not listen to owner, and then owner sped off in car.
I'm now curious, is he liable for the vets bill for the cat? Its also on the dangerous dog breed list and wasn't muzzled neither. I know if it attacked a person, there would be serious consequences, but IIRC, cats are almost considered vermin in terms of the law?

as far as cats are concerned the law sees it at your possession so damage done to your possession by someone else's possession you are entitled to chase for compo...or a conviction

intheclouds · 08-02-2016 01:01PM

Property damage, he might be able to do the dog owner on trespassing in his garden too.

VickieVexed1 · 08-02-2016 01:07PM

It astounds me that a living being can be considered 'property'.

Our garden is well fenced off to keep the little man safe (JRx), but we get so many cats visiting and on more than one occasion he's chased them and almost caught them. It would kill me if they got hurt.

OP, I hope the poor cat survived the attack.

intheclouds · 08-02-2016 01:10PM

VickieVexed1 wrote: »

It astounds me that a living being can be considered 'property'.

Farm animals are property and it is legal to shoot a dog worrying sheep.

I dont know where the law stands on someone injuring or killing a dog in their own front garden that is damaging their property (cat, duck, rabbit etc...), although I imagine that the dog owner is going to be the one in strife due to not having the animal under control.

ganmo · 08-02-2016 01:20PM

VickieVexed1 wrote: »

It astounds me that a living being can be considered 'property'. .

:eek:

grass and flowers are alive too :P

JimiTime · 08-02-2016 01:23PM

Thanks for the feedback guys. I have a cat myself, so it got me wondering.

are you serious · 08-02-2016 01:27PM

Not saying I think they are but they are legally classed as vermin..

Plus the "dangerous dog breed list" that doesn't exist

Knine · 08-02-2016 02:16PM

If an out of control dog attacked & injured my cat then the owner will be paying vet bills, the same way if they attacked my dog.

JimiTime · 08-02-2016 02:56PM

are you serious wrote: »

Not saying I think they are but they are legally classed as vermin..

Plus the "dangerous dog breed list" that doesn't exist

This is the list I refer to:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1998/si/442/made/en/print

muddypaws · 08-02-2016 03:34PM

JimiTime wrote: »

This is the list I refer to:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1998/si/442/made/en/print

It isn't called the dangerous dog list, and dogs covered by that legislation aren't called dangerous dogs, that is a different thing altogether. May not seem important, but unfortunately it does have consequences, as use of the wrong language leads people to think that all dogs covered by this legislation are aggressive and/or dangerous, when they most certainly aren't.

andreac · 08-02-2016 04:19PM

JimiTime wrote: »

This is the list I refer to:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1998/si/442/made/en/print

Restricted breeds list, totally different to a Dangerous dogs list.

intheclouds · 08-02-2016 04:40PM

Do we all have to be so pedantic? 3 posts pointing it out!

Everyone knows what is being referred to whether or not someone used the term "Restricted Breeds List" or "Dangerous Dogs List"?

Now we are all off topic discussing the name of the list that we all know is being referred to.

marmurr1916 · 08-02-2016 04:46PM

intheclouds wrote: »

Do we all have to be so pedantic? 3 posts pointing it out!

Everyone knows what is being referred to whether or not someone used the term "Restricted Breeds List" or "Dangerous Dogs List"?

Now we are all off topic discussing the name of the list that we all know is being referred to.

The use of precision in language is necessary in law and a legal issue is being discussed here.

Would you prefer if speed limit laws said 'Yerrah not so fast now there boss' instead of setting out precise upper speed limits?

Complaining about people insisting on precision in a thread about legal issues is pretty fecking stupid. :rolleyes:

intheclouds · 08-02-2016 04:51PM

marmurr1916 wrote: »

The use of precision in language is necessary in law and a legal issue is being discussed here.

Would you prefer if speed limit laws said 'Yerrah not so fast now there boss' instead of setting out precise upper speed limits?

Complaining about people insisting on precision in a thread about legal issues is pretty fecking stupid. :rolleyes:

We are not in a court room here and the list being referred to has no bearing on the dog damaging someones property.

Id thank you not to personally insult me either.

sillysmiles · 08-02-2016 05:00PM

are you serious wrote: »

Not saying I think they are but they are legally classed as vermin..

Cats are legally classed as vermin????

loveisdivine · 08-02-2016 05:25PM

This is one of the things that scares me most about taking our cat out for walks on her lead. She's great at walking on the lead and really enjoys it, but most people with dogs won't have socialised them around cats at all, so I know if we came across an off lead dog it would probably be straight after her.

I can't blame people though as cats on leads is a fairly new thing, its just a shame that we can't walk her the way people walk dogs.

Knine · 08-02-2016 05:57PM

loveisdivine wrote: »

This is one of the things that scares me most about taking our cat out for walks on her lead. She's great at walking on the lead and really enjoys it, but most people with dogs won't have socialised them around cats at all, so I know if we came across an off lead dog it would probably be straight after her.

I can't blame people though as cats on leads is a fairly new thing, its just a shame that we can't walk her the way people walk dogs.

It is not about socialising dogs with cats. Some breeds of dogs will happily live with their own cats but would see outsiders as prey. I am as careful as I can be with my own dogs but they are terriers & will likely try to get any cat they come across. Personally I would not walk a cat on a lead where there are likely to be dogs.

Cherry Blossom · 08-02-2016 06:00PM

sillysmiles wrote: »

Cats are legally classed as vermin????

Pet cats who have an owner, particularly if they are microchipped are the property of that person. I think the vermin thing is something someone said on here once and it stuck. I think the vermin thing refers to feral cats that have no legal classification, the same as rats & mice as neither are classed as indigenous wildlife. I might be wrong but I don't know of any law that lists species of vermin. If someone knows otherwise, they should feel free to post a link to the relevant legislation.

Knine · 08-02-2016 06:10PM

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

Pet cats who have an owner, particularly if they are microchipped are the property of that person. I think the vermin thing is something someone said on here once and it stuck. I think the vermin thing refers to feral cats that have no legal classification, the same as rats & mice as neither are classed as indigenous wildlife. I might be wrong but I don't know of any law that lists species of vermin. If someone knows otherwise, they should feel free to post a link to the relevant legislation.

I think the same. I do know that a friend's cat was badly injured by dogs & the dogs owners had to pay a very hefty vet bill. The cat was in the owners front garden.

intheclouds · 08-02-2016 06:24PM

Knine wrote: »

I think the same. I do know that a friend's cat was badly injured by dogs & the dogs owners had to pay a very hefty vet bill. The cat was in the owners front garden.

I know someone this happened to and the poor cat was killed by 2 dogs. The cat was in his own front garden.

Because the cat was killed there were no vet bills, but what value is there on a cats life in law? Probably very little - they hadnt paid for the cat. They didnt pursue legally because they felt itd be a waste of time and money.

The dog owner btw, shrugged and said "dogs chase cats - thats life". He was a neighbour.

Knine · 08-02-2016 06:40PM

My own cat was killed in a similar way.

Going back more then 10 years now there was an issue where I live. 2 locals were allowing their dogs out to roam each morning. The dogs both foxhound types would seek out cats & kill them. After 3 cats on my road in one morning died, the dogs owners were located & we informed them about what their dogs were up to. Their response was dogs will be dogs. The dead toll mounted up & The dog Warden was informed. It was really horrific. The warden teamed up with The cats protection association or whatever it was called at the time & paid a visit. The owners did not listen so the warden removed the dogs. Dogs killing peoples cats will not be tolerated.

Dial Hard · 08-02-2016 07:06PM

VickieVexed1 wrote:

Our garden is well fenced off to keep the little man safe (JRx), but we get so many cats visiting and on more than one occasion he's chased them and almost caught them. It would kill me if they got hurt.

That's an interesting one. Our dog caught a cat that was in our back garden a few months back. My sister was in the garden at the time and called the dog away, cat went over the wall and no harm done. But if the dog had actually injured the cat, would there be any comeback seeing as it was in our back garden at the time?

JimiTime · 08-02-2016 08:02PM

Dial Hard wrote: »

That's an interesting one. Our dog caught a cat that was in our back garden a few months back. My sister was in the garden at the time and called the dog away, cat went over the wall and no harm done. But if the dog had actually injured the cat, would there be any comeback seeing as it was in our back garden at the time?

I don't think there should be, and I say that as a cat owner. If a cat is allowed to roam, these are the environmental dangers it will be exposed to. Out in a public space uncontrolled etc, then yes, but if its in the back garden, you can't expect dog owners to chain them up.

JimiTime · 08-02-2016 08:04PM

andreac wrote: »

Restricted breeds list, totally different to a Dangerous dogs list.

Why are they restricted? I was always under the impression that it was because they were considered dangerous. As in, if a jack russell goes nuts, someone might get a nip, but if an Akita goes nuts, someone will lose an arm. Is hat not the logic behind it?

loveisdivine · 08-02-2016 09:43PM

Knine wrote: »

Personally I would not walk a cat on a lead where there are likely to be dogs.

It's difficult to find places where there won't also be dogs being walked.

What am I supposed to do? If I walk her on a lead and she got attacked by an off lead dog, people would probably say I had it coming as "dogs chase cats", if I let her out alone (which I can't because she's deaf, but wouldn't do even if she wasn't) then it would probably still be my fault because she was roaming unsupervised.

So whats left, keep her inside incase someone can't control their off lead dog?

Joeseph Balls · 08-02-2016 09:49PM

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

Pet cats who have an owner, particularly if they are microchipped are the property of that person. I think the vermin thing is something someone said on here once and it stuck. I think the vermin thing refers to feral cats that have no legal classification, the same as rats & mice as neither are classed as indigenous wildlife. I might be wrong but I don't know of any law that lists species of vermin. If someone knows otherwise, they should feel free to post a link to the relevant legislation.

You're right, there is no 'vermin' list anymore. There is a protected species list. Where pet cats come into that I'm not sure. Feral cats would be classed as unprotected.

Knine · 08-02-2016 09:52PM

loveisdivine wrote: »

It's difficult to find places where there won't also be dogs being walked.

What am I supposed to do? If I walk her on a lead and she got attacked by an off lead dog, people would probably say I had it coming as "dogs chase cats", if I let her out alone (which I can't because she's deaf, but wouldn't do even if she wasn't) then it would probably still be my fault because she was roaming unsupervised.

So whats left, keep her inside incase someone can't control their off lead dog?

I think many dogs even those with great recall would find a cat too tempting so no way would I risk my cat like that.

loveisdivine · 08-02-2016 10:04PM

Oh I agree and that's why I don't really take her out. I just think it's a shame, she should be able to enjoy a walk just like any dog.

I did ask here before if anyone knew any parks where dogs are required to be on leads at all times but no one knew of anywhere.

In an ideal world we'd have some kind of cool cat park where you can go and sit with your cat and wait for a leaf to blow past!

On topic, if my cat was on my private property or on a lead and she was attacked I would expect the owners to pay.

Knine · 08-02-2016 10:17PM

I think a compromise for you would be an enclosed outside area where she could get some outside time safely.

I miss having a cat!

Is a dog owner liable if his dog bites cat?

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