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Sex dolls for paedophiles

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭Figbiscuithead


    There was an article a few weeks ago about sex dolls becoming more and more human-like and supposed experts were stating that people having relations with robots will become common place in the not-so-distant future and that it was already a reality for many people. I read the article with disbelief but got to the comments page of the article and I was surprised by how many people supported the idea and said they would consider it themselves if they had the money as they found it difficult to form relationships with real women and men for whatever reason.

    Humans are strange. I suppose if so many hetro/homosexual people could, and do, consider a robot enough to satisfy their urges, then perhaps someone who had these involuntary urges towards children but had no intention of acting on them might consider it as well and even those who could be tempted and are grappling with that temptation might be satisfied with a very realistic-looking doll. I think it could work for at least a minority of people with paedophilic urges and it's worth a shot.

    The idea of dolls being manufactured to look like sexualised children turns my stomach but it's an issue that can't be ignored; it has to be dealt with. Calls to arrest all of them, even those who haven't acted on it, and throw them in prison are ridiculous - you can't arrest people for simply thinking one way or another but you can try and do what you can to prevent further temptation.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,711 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    You would probably need to as dome one with paedophile tendency, who knows it would be harmful and wrong and intends to never act on their urges. Dan Savage calls them 'gold star paedophiles' because he says we should work with them and offer them the support they need to make sure they never act on their urges.

    It comes down to whether you're more interested in satisfying your urge to punish the (as yet) innocent person with paedophile tendency, or actually care about protecting children.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭Figbiscuithead


    ...saying all that, if they're ridiculously expensive, then the average person can't buy one. They'd have to come down in price for them to have any impact.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,173 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    JupiterKid wrote: »
    they may just end up in whetting the paedophile's appetite for more.
    This argument has been made a few times in this thread. The same argument is frequently made about porn, especially violent porn, yet there's no evidence to indicate that watching any kind of porn causes the viewer to be more likely to "act out" what they see. many would decry the existence of any sex doll as an objectification of women, yet again there's nothing to corralate use of sex dolls with mistreatment of women.

    There's not really any way to say whether these dolls could help or hinder those suppressing paedophile tendencies without more data. The word of the manufacturer certainly isn't good enough.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    These yokes are £14,000!!

    Paedoing aint cheap.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 182 ✭✭Disgruntled Badger


    Oh dear sweet baby Jesus. This is so wrong on so many levels.

    Legally, on face of it you'd have to assume it's not a crime. That said someone was recently prosecuted here for possession of animated pornography depicting children.

    There seems to no depravity that can't be pandered to now. I don't mean kinky or perverse. I'm all for 'whatever-floats-your-boat' but this? Very disturbing, even if labelled as harmless fantasy.

    The 14k would be much better spent on a psychiatrist.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭keeponhurling


    The 14k would be much better spent on a psychiatrist.

    But can a psychiatrist help change what somebody is into sexually ?

    They said the same thing about gay people years ok, but it doesn't rely make sense .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,711 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    There seems to no depravity that can't be pandered to now. I don't mean kinky or perverse. I'm all for 'whatever-floats-your-boat' but this? Very disturbing, even if labelled as harmless fantasy.

    I can't imagine life if I was told that my attraction to women was perverse and disordered. Imagine it youeself if acting on your natural attraction to whoever you're attracted to, would cause untold harm and you should NEVER act on it and should NEVER be sexually satisfied.

    Wouldn't a doll appear like a great compromise? I don't buy the argument that it would act as a gateway. That argument only makes sense if you're a sis person who's used to having their normal sexual urges satisfied. If you had paedophile tendency and had resigned yourself to never acting on them, then the doll might be all the outlet you need.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,312 ✭✭✭Paramite Pie


    Is paedophilia an actual orientation? Or something else?

    Back when I was in primary school, a had some crushes on girls my age. By the time I was a teen, my crushes were again the same age. And as an adult, now aged 28, I don't think I could get it on with anyone under the age of 20 without feeling like a mega creep. It would feel wrong.

    But what if the part of the brain that controls sexual attraction just stops developing at a certain age?? That as some young people grow older but their attraction never does? Has this ever been studied -- i assume it has... In that case could it be possible to spur any later brain growth/development??

    The dolls could be a useful (ugh!) outlet or a taste for the real thing.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 64 ✭✭22catch


    I'm not really sure how I feel about the dolls. I don't think that a doll is going to be an adequate substitute for sex. Most adults would prefer to have sex with another adult rather than a sex doll. I don't really care about the rights of pedophiles, if someone is proven to be a child predator then imo, they should be locked up for life where they can't access children or pornographic images of children.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,794 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Is paedophilia an actual orientation? Or something else?

    Back when I was in primary school, a had some crushes on girls my age. By the time I was a teen, my crushes were again the same age. And as an adult, now aged 28, I don't think I could get it on with anyone under the age of 20 without feeling like a mega creep. It would feel wrong.

    But what if the part of the brain that controls sexual attraction just stops developing at a certain age?? That as some young people grow older but their attraction never does? Has this ever been studied -- i assume it has... In that case could it be possible to spur any later brain growth/development??

    The dolls could be a useful (ugh!) outlet or a taste for the real thing.

    that could very well be the reason for all this


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,711 ✭✭✭✭El_Duderino 09


    22catch wrote:
    I don't really care about the rights of pedophiles, if someone is proven to be a child predator then imo, they should be locked up for life.

    I don't think you want to live in a world where you can dismiss someone's basic human rights if they haven't actually harmed anyone.

    Assuming that you mean by predator.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Azalea


    22catch wrote: »
    I don't really care about the rights of pedophiles, if someone is proven to be a child predator then imo, they should be locked up for life where they can't access children or pornographic images of children.
    If someone has harmed a child of course they should go to prison. We're talking about people who haven't, though, and just have the thoughts.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 499 ✭✭Shep_Dog


    Azalea wrote: »
    If someone has harmed a child of course they should go to prison. We're talking about people who haven't, though, and just have the thoughts.
    A private discussion of harming children was successfully prosecuted in Ireland as production of child pornography.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Azalea


    Shep_Dog wrote: »
    A private discussion of harming children was successfully prosecuted in Ireland as production of child pornography.
    That's a trickier one. I can see both the prosecution and defence's points of view there.
    Cannibal cop in the US is a similar case.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 64 ✭✭22catch


    I don't think you want to live in a world where you can dismiss someone's basic human rights if they haven't actually harmed anyone.

    Assuming that you mean by predator.

    Of course not, however we're talking about pedophiles. They have a compulsion to have sex with children. As a society we have a moral obligation to protect children and personally I'd prefer if all known pedophiles were taken away from society where they wouldn't have access to children. The risk they pose is too great, and I think the rights of children take precedence over the rights of pedophiles.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Azalea


    The only known paedophiles are the ones who have abused. Nobody is going to admit to fancying children. The mere desire doesn't necessarily make them a risk either (although of course nobody would want their children near anyone who has those thoughts, understandably) they are not all unable to control their desire.

    Secret treatment centres is the way forward imo (having looked at the German model).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,052 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    There was a programme in Channel 4 a few years ago in which a paedophile was interviewed.

    Although according to himself he would never act on his feelings towards children but it still made for very uncomfortable viewing listening to someone say they are attracted to kids.

    It made me realise though that there are good people who are like this and would never act on it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,586 ✭✭✭Canadel


    Shep_Dog wrote: »
    A private discussion of harming children was successfully prosecuted in Ireland as production of child pornography.
    Saoirse Ronan thread >>>>>>>>>>>>>>


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,643 ✭✭✭R.D. aka MR.D


    You are right about chemical castration. Does it only take away the physical urge though? I mean the mind, the pathology, they must stay the same. I don't think there is an answer unfortunately.

    I'm not an expert by any means but apparently the drug reduces sexual thoughts or at very least decreases the amount and intensity of the thoughts.

    For those who are attracted to children and are plagued by the thoughts, surely it would offer some relief at least. Especially if it is combined with therapy.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    Azalea wrote: »
    The only known paedophiles are the ones who have abused. Nobody is going to admit to fancying children. The mere desire doesn't necessarily make them a risk either (although of course nobody would want their children near anyone who has those thoughts, understandably) they are not all unable to control their desire.

    Secret treatment centres is the way forward imo (having looked at the German model).

    I'd imagine that 'hunt em down, lock em up, throw away the key' attitude is something that prevents people seeking help, too.

    There was an interview on the radio a while back with an American man who runs something called The Virtuous Paedophile association or something (really don't feel like googling that, sorry), he regularly gets death threats, is estranged from some family members and so on, because he 'came out' in order to find and support other paedophiles in their efforts not to become abusers. When he was younger, the only outlet he had for talking about that part of himself was online paedophile chat rooms, and he really didn't want to read and see the things he was seeing on there.

    It really is a subject that society in general is incapable of being rational about. Child abuse is abhorrent, of course, but we need to understand it to stop it, not turn away in disgust


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,452 ✭✭✭✭The_Valeyard


    I'd imagine that 'hunt em down, lock em up, throw away the key' attitude is something that prevents people seeking help, too.

    There was an interview on the radio a while back with an American man who runs something called The Virtuous Paedophile association or something (really don't feel like googling that, sorry), he regularly gets death threats, is estranged from some family members and so on, because he 'came out' in order to find and support other paedophiles in their efforts not to become abusers. When he was younger, the only outlet he had for talking about that part of himself was online paedophile chat rooms, and he really didn't want to read and see the things he was seeing on there.

    It really is a subject that society in general is incapable of being rational about. Child abuse is abhorrent, of course, but we need to understand it to stop it, not turn away in disgust

    Fair point, pretending it doesn't exist is not a rational way to help those inflicted with this attraction.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,796 ✭✭✭Azalea


    There seems to no depravity that can't be pandered to now. I don't mean kinky or perverse. I'm all for 'whatever-floats-your-boat' but this?
    I'm not sure the doll idea is mere pandering - it's an attempt (whether constructive or not) to stop them from abusing children.
    Pandering implies legitimisation. Child abuse has never been more abhorred (gladly). Even only in the 70s it was a bit more "normal".


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,529 ✭✭✭Paz-CCFC


    I'd imagine that 'hunt em down, lock em up, throw away the key' attitude is something that prevents people seeking help, too.

    It really is a subject that society in general is incapable of being rational about. Child abuse is abhorrent, of course, but we need to understand it to stop it, not turn away in disgust

    I very much agree with this. There are certain people that are very vocal in how they should be thrown in prison/violently killed etc., but they're always opposed to offering any sort of support or treatment. Even though talking about it and studying and researching it could lead to a breakthrough that could save thousands of innocent children from being abused, they don't want to listen. They seem very much to favour punishment over prevention, which is not at all in the best interests of the poor victims.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,305 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    It really is a subject that society in general is incapable of being rational about. Child abuse is abhorrent, of course, but we need to understand it to stop it, not turn away in disgust


    Rationality is subjective. Society IMO in general is perfectly rational in it's understanding of just who is the vulnerable party - it isn't paedophiles. People aren't turning away in disgust, they simply refuse to legitimise an abhorrent ideology that seeks to portray adults capable of controlling their thoughts and behaviour, as 'victims' of society.

    Azalea wrote: »
    I'm not sure the doll idea is mere pandering - it's an attempt (whether constructive or not) to stop them from abusing children.
    Pandering implies legitimisation. Child abuse has never been more abhorred (gladly). Even only in the 70s it was a bit more "normal".


    It's a cynical marketing ploy to sell €14k sex toys to those people who can afford them, attempting to legitimise a paraphilia. The idea of paedophilia is sexual and romantic intimacy with another human being, a living, breathing, pre-pubescent human being. There's no comparison between the gratification a paedophile gets from that, and then expecting that they should be satisfied with something that isn't even close to that.

    These dolls are nothing more than an expensive fetishistic sex toy for the Japanese market. I don't see Governments around the world buying them any time soon with the expectation that they will have any effect on reducing the numbers of adults who choose to commit sexual abuse against children.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,129 ✭✭✭PucaMama


    World is gone crazy. now it's wrong to mistrust them? There supposed to be safe around children? So long as they haven't offended (yet)? (Or been caught yet). And then pandering to them with dolls. It's too much. These are criminals with criminal thoughts. Dangerous people.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,417 ✭✭✭ToddyDoody


    I would say it's very unseemly but no harm done. The paedophilia is going to exist anyway, whether they have a sex doll or not.

    We could go a step too far and de facto want to murder paedophiles but they are human beings after all still.

    Nevertheless, we still need to be quite clear on the law regarding paedophilia and the protection of children, and enforce it as necessary.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,650 ✭✭✭✭JupiterKid


    22catch wrote: »
    I'm not really sure how I feel about the dolls. I don't think that a doll is going to be an adequate substitute for sex. Most adults would prefer to have sex with another adult rather than a sex doll. I don't really care about the rights of pedophiles, if someone is proven to be a child predator then imo, they should be locked up for life where they can't access children or pornographic images of children.

    You simly can't lock someone up for having an urge or attraction. If they act on it with a real child then yes, but otherwise no.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 499 ✭✭Shep_Dog


    ToddyDoody wrote: »
    I would say it's very unseemly but no harm done. The paedophilia is going to exist anyway, whether they have a sex doll or not.
    Under the forthcoming revision of the law, such a doll could be deemed to be illegal as it could be deemed to be a 'visual representation'. Same would go for any packaging showing the contents or for any advertisement for the product.
    "any visual representation.....that shows, for a sexual purpose, the genital or anal region of a child or a person depicted as being a child,”

    I'd agree with opinions that these products are a bad idea and provide reinforcment for maladaptive thought processes that really need to be dealt with by psychotherapy.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,586 ✭✭✭Canadel


    PucaMama wrote: »
    These are criminals
    They aren't really though.
    with criminal thoughts. Dangerous people.
    I have criminal thoughts. I don't consider myself dangerous. And I'm not a criminal if I don't act on those thoughts.


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