Train stations in Ireland that used to have "refreshment rooms"?

L1011 · 12-11-2015 11:34AM

Some of the stations in towns or suburbs could probably have some business for 'refreshment rooms' operating basically as pubs, I'd imagine. Would require the kind of thinking that Irish Rail don't have, though (and which other railways do - DSB in Denmark is a franchiser for shops it runs itself rather than renting them out, and so on)

n97 mini · 12-11-2015 05:14PM

L1011 wrote: »

Some of the stations in towns or suburbs could probably have some business for 'refreshment rooms' operating basically as pubs, I'd imagine. Would require the kind of thinking that Irish Rail don't have, though (and which other railways do - DSB in Denmark is a franchiser for shops it runs itself rather than renting them out, and so on)

The amount of stations across the water with pubs is enough to warrant a book about the unusual ones alone!

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Losty Dublin · 12-11-2015 11:16PM

n97 mini wrote: »

They actually do need a licence, renewable every year at a cost (like a pub) which I suspect aided their disappearance. The difference is the licence is automatically granted to railway refreshment rooms, it's not to other buildings.

Edit; all trains which serve alcohol also need to renew their licence, at a cost, annually.

Pretty much on the ball, sir. There are two main different legal permissions available to them depending on what sort of terms they wish to trade. The long accepted tradition of their serving drink to those traveling are based on what are termed exemptions which were provided for under various Transport Acts; these allowed for them to serves outside regular hours. To serve drink those who aren't traveling still requires traditional pub licences; most station bars have both for handiness sake.

There are a few obscure laws under which bar licences can be issued; one was availed of in Donegal a few years ago.

L1011 · 13-11-2015 07:19PM

n97 mini wrote: »

The amount of stations across the water with pubs is enough to warrant a book about the unusual ones alone!

A rail-ale-trail is always something on my list of things to eventually do, along with the Caledonian Sleeper (fly back from INV)

Extremely limited weekend service makes some of the published ones pretty difficult though

LXFlyer · 13-11-2015 08:00PM

L1011 wrote: »

A rail-ale-trail is always something on my list of things to eventually do, along with the Caledonian Sleeper (fly back from INV)

Extremely limited weekend service makes some of the published ones pretty difficult though

Far better to do the sleeper in the other direction, and I would also go from Fort William towards Euston (and in the summer) - depart at 19:50 and have dinner as you cross Rannoch Moor and enjoy the scenery.

The Chieftain · 11-01-2016 06:22AM

n97 mini wrote: »

There is a bar in the ferry terminal (formerly the ferry terminal and train station)... is it closed now too?

I believe so, very sad looking last time I was there, a few years ago.

n97 mini · 11-01-2016 11:24AM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

To serve drink those who aren't traveling still requires traditional pub licences; most station bars have both for handiness sake.

This isn't bourne out by the Revenue's liquor licence register, published monthly.

The only licences attached to train stations on the register are Publican's Ordinary Railway Refreshment Rooms Licences and the following stations have those licences:
Oakfiled Demense, Raphoe
Hartley's Restaurant, Dun Laoghaire Station
The Bloody Stream, Howth Station
The Oslo Partnership, Connolly Station
Sublounge, Tara Street Station
The Galway Hooker, Heuston Station

While I'm surprised at some entries, none of those have a regular pub licence.

loyatemu · 11-01-2016 01:55PM

there was a bar in Bray station until a couple of years ago, forget the name, it was never very busy possibly because there are several better pubs within a 5 minute walk.

n97 mini · 11-01-2016 03:25PM

I don't see it on the public register so it's probable it's not licensed atm. I do remember there was a lot of trouble in it which lead to its demise.

Fred Swanson · 11-01-2016 04:50PM

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Losty Dublin · 11-01-2016 05:26PM

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Licenses and exempions issued under the Transport acts allow them to serve to nomadic me passengers at any time provided that trains are running, Christmas Day and Good Friday included. Regular bar licences allow them to serve non passengers and at times when no trains are running, subject to lawful hours.

bren2002 · 11-01-2016 05:30PM

Was going to suggest bray too. But a long the dart I can think of a few there's the bloody stream in howth, there's one in Tara St too.

highdef · 11-01-2016 05:38PM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Licenses and exempions issued under the Transport acts allow them to serve to nomadic me passengers at any time provided that trains are running, Christmas Day and Good Friday included. Regular bar licences allow them to serve non passengers and at times when no trains are running, subject to lawful hours.

So in theory, I could have a pint or two in The Bloody Stream on any given Good Friday (or any of the other aforementioned pubs......in theory?

Fred Swanson · 11-01-2016 05:44PM

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GM228 · 11-01-2016 06:09PM

Fred Swanson wrote: »

If you have a ticket to a destination at least 30 miles away.

It's any passenger arriving from or going to a destination which is 10 miles away or more, not 30.

Another interesting one to note is a person who has a ship ticket can also buy alcohol in a train station if the ship journey was/will be at least 50 miles.

Losty Dublin · 11-01-2016 06:28PM

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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The distance seems to vary depending on whomever it is who tells the story. The book on the Harcourt line recounts a story whereby a ticket to Bray covered you and was used by Behan (I think and will check this out when I get home.) to dodge restrictions regarding Holy Hour

GM228 · 11-01-2016 06:30PM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

The distance seems to vary depending on whomever it is who tells the story.

Indeed it does, but the distance is 10 miles (as per legislation).

n97 mini · 11-01-2016 07:25PM

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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I need to look it up again, but it's not as high as 30. That railway in Raphoe wouldn't be long enough.

EDIT: I think it might be 6.

GM228 · 11-01-2016 07:34PM

Fred Swanson wrote: »

I assume such licences allow them to serve earlier than normal pubs?

There are no time limits on serving alcohol in train stations (or onboard trains).

Fred Swanson wrote: »

If you have a ticket to a destination at least 30 miles away.

n97 mini wrote: »

I need to look it up again, but it's not as high as 30. That railway in Raphoe wouldn't be long enough.

EDIT: I think it might be 6.

Not 30 or 6, it's 10 miles with a train ticket (or 50 miles with a ship ticket) as I stated already.

14.—Nothing in this Act shall be deemed to prohibit or restrict—

(a) the sale at any time at a railway station of intoxicating liquor on arrival or departure of trains to passengers who have travelled or hold tickets entitling them to travel on those trains for a distance of not less than ten miles to or from such railway station

The ship ticket seems to be the one nobody is aware of.

n97 mini · 11-01-2016 08:34PM

GM228 wrote: »

Not 30 or 6, it's 10 miles with a train ticket (or 50 miles with a ship ticket) as I stated already.

No mention of the ticket needing to be current either!

n97 mini · 11-01-2016 08:38PM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Regular bar licences allow them to serve non passengers and at times when no trains are running, subject to lawful hours.

As stated none of those have ordinary 7 day licences. Check the register yourself, every licensed premises in the country, and its licence type, is on it.

GM228 · 11-01-2016 08:53PM

n97 mini wrote: »

As stated none of those have ordinary 7 day licences. Check the register yourself, every licensed premises in the country, and its licence type, is on it.

Indeed they only hold Publican's Ordinary Railway Refreshment Rooms Licences which only allow them to serve rail passengers (subject to the minimum 10 mile limit) and ship passengers (subject to the minimum 50 mile limit).

They can't legally serve alcohol to anybody else or rail passengers who travel less than 10 miles.

magentis · 11-01-2016 08:56PM

Its a shame really,looking back at the bars and restaurants that used to be in the stations now closed.Especially in Cork,the glanmire buffet was a nice place to be.

And getting the proper breakfast on the Cork-Dublin train too,It would be lovely to be able to do that now!

tabbey · 11-01-2016 09:40PM

n97 mini wrote: »

I don't see it on the public register so it's probable it's not licensed atm. I do remember there was a lot of trouble in it which lead to its demise.

I patronised this bar a couple of times to give it my support, but no pub could survive on my custom, or even a thousand of my type. I was disappointed that it did not survive.
Without being too explicit, could you elaborate on the trouble that led to its demise.

n97 mini · 11-01-2016 10:27PM

Someone from Bray told me that it was fine until they got in "the sports on the tellies" and it went downhill. There was a mass brawl in it one afternoon, women glassing each other(!), and it closed shortly after that. That incident made the papers.

Victor · 11-01-2016 11:30PM

GM228 wrote: »

Not 30 or 6, it's 10 miles with a train ticket (or 50 miles with a ship ticket) as I stated already.

Then how does Raphoe have a licence?

tabbey · 11-01-2016 11:57PM

Victor wrote: »

Then how does Raphoe have a licence?

Perhaps it does ten laps of the circuit.

n97 mini · 12-01-2016 12:53AM

Victor wrote: »

Then how does Raphoe have a licence?

It may not be possible to implement the Act, but unless someone is there to enforce the law....

xband · 12-01-2016 12:58AM

The food available on the Cork-Dublin train is pretty poor compared to the previous generation. It actually makes paying for 1st class a bit of a pointless exercise if you can't get a decent meal most of the time.

Losty Dublin · 12-01-2016 01:10AM

Victor wrote: »

Then how does Raphoe have a licence?

Under an act of 1902. Presumably it has different critiera and condidions applicable to it.

Train stations in Ireland that used to have "refreshment rooms"?

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