Austrian ISIS 'poster girl' reportedly beaten to death after trying to escape Syria

opiniated · 26-11-2015 12:39AM

Sand wrote: »

But the issue is, she was being indoctrinated by a Western education system in her school, in her media, by her colleagues which broadly praised western values. If she was some empty headed eejit ready to accept whatever story was being told why isn't she swooning over the likes of One Direction?

She was not kidnapped and forced to attend ISIS brainwashing camp. She self-radicalised. She sought out ISIS material, she agreed with it, and she sought out more. She got to the point where she planned and researched a complex and difficult journey to join her ISIS brethren back in the 7th century. She wilfully chose this path, despite all competing indoctrination by the Western society her parents and family has escaped to. She is not a victim. She chose her course, and the end was perfectly predictable.

And she fell out with her ISIS brethren and probably found out why ISIS 7th century justice system she wanted to impose on others isn't actually all that great when it was imposed on her. Maybe all that western education she ignored and sneered at had a point.

This is not a great tragedy. It was someone who made their own fate and no one and no thing can save someone from stupid.

Exactly.
So, young Irish girl gets the same indoctrination, and (rightly), would run a mile from Daesh.

What was different?
Where did she get the idea that Daesh was some kind of worthy Utopia?

You're right, no-one can save someone from stupid, and joining Daesh is beyond stupid in Western eyes. So, what made her think it was OK, even something to be desired?

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 12:41AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

Put it this way. Let's say she killed 100 people for ISIS, and then she thought same as she did before she was killed and she wanted out, would you be so forgiving? If you say Yes, I'll show you a liar.

Lets put it another way, would I have sympathy for someone who joined a cult, killed 100 people, realised somewhere in that time how horrific it is, had to continue to kill people with that knowledge, try to escape and then be brutally murdered? Yes, I would. You can call me a liar if you want, but you would be wrong. If that person did escape, would I agree to allow her to be beaten to death? No, I wouldn't. Would I agree to bring in the death penalty? No, I wouldn't.

You may not have any sympathy for her. That doesn't make those who do for a variety a reasons, a liar.

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 12:44AM

sup_dude wrote: »

Lets put it another way, would I have sympathy for someone who joined a cult, killed 100 people, realised somewhere in that time how horrific it is, had to continue to kill people with that knowledge, try to escape and then be brutally murdered? Yes, I would. You can call me a liar if you want, but you would be wrong. If that person did escape, would I agree to allow her to be beaten to death? No, I wouldn't. Would I agree to bring in the death penalty? No, I wouldn't.

You may not have any sympathy for her. That doesn't make those who do for a variety a reasons, a liar.

So have you sympathy for her?

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 12:48AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

So have you sympathy for her?

I've repeated my views on the subject multiple times on this thread.

Azalea · 26-11-2015 12:49AM

sup_dude wrote: »

Lets put it another way, would I have sympathy for someone who joined a cult, killed 100 people, realised somewhere in that time how horrific it is, had to continue to kill people with that knowledge, try to escape and then be brutally murdered? Yes, I would.

After they'd killed 100 people, sympathy would be quite a stretch for me. I know I wouldn't feel sympathy for e.g. a loyalist or republican killer who saw the error of their ways and then met the same fate. I would prefer for them to atone rather than be killed but sympathy is a strange thing to have for such a person, in my opinion.

FluffyMcCardy · 26-11-2015 12:53AM

Never ever undestimate people's stupidity, of any age. We live in an age where everything is dissected and analysed yet we see people sleep walk into crazy cults. Freedom isn't for everyone, many people want to be told what to do. Daesh is just the latest example.

My impression of most Daesh recruits is of losers and nobodies. Look st the crop of nothings involves in the Paris slaughter. Petty thieves, nothings and nobodies going for their moment of glory. They aren't even good Muslims, drinking etc. They are far more like the typical American gun crazy shooting up a cinema because his life is a ball of ****.

Daesh is nothing new. Just a bunch of crazies
They will be wiped out in due course. They literally have no friends only enemies. They've united the world against them. That's unique. They are doomed.

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 12:55AM

Azalea wrote:

After they'd killed 100 people, sympathy would be quite a stretch for me. I know I wouldn't feel sympathy for e.g. a loyalist or republican killer who saw the error of their ways and then met the same fate. I would prefer for them to atone rather than be killed but sympathy is a strange thing to have for such a person, in my opinion.

Maybe, but sympathy for their death doesn't mean sympathy for their actions or a lack of sympathy for those they killed.

Benteke · 26-11-2015 12:55AM

I can't believe this thread has gone so long, The little tramp lived by the execution and died by one, The only shame here is she did not stay alive a little longer so she could feel another brick smashed across her face

No sympathy for terrorists

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 12:55AM

sup_dude wrote: »

I've repeated my views on the subject multiple times on this thread.

OK, so you also have sympathy for the Paris attack killers.

They deserved to live too. Barbaric that the Police moved in wasn't it.

Ya...

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 12:56AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

OK, so you also have sympathy for the Paris attack killers.

I didn't once say or imply that in any way. Don't dare twist my posts and then ironically call me a liar.

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 12:57AM

sup_dude wrote: »

I didn't once say or imply that in any way. Don't dare twist my posts and then ironically call me a liar.

If you have sympathy for Girl, then why don't you have sympathy for Paris killers?

Both had same views.

What's there to twist from that?

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 12:59AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

If you have sympathy for Girl, then why don't you have sympathy for Paris killers?

Read my posts.

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 01:03AM

sup_dude wrote: »

Read my posts.

Reading your posts don't answer the question.

So I'll say it again and in big caps

YOU HAVE SYMPATHY FOR THE GIRL, THE PARIS KILLERS HAD THE SAME VIEW OF THE WORLD, HAVE YOU SYMPATHY FOR PARIS KILLERS??

Azalea · 26-11-2015 01:04AM

Benteke wrote: »

I'm sure she is enjoying her 72 man gang bang in heaven

Do female muslims get 72 virgin men after death?

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 01:05AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote:

YOU HAVE SYMPATHY FOR THE GIRL, THE PARIS KILLERS HAD THE SAME VIEW OF THE WORLD, HAVE YOU SYMPATHY FOR PARIS KILLERS??

Okay, read my posts more slowly then because I've explained this multiple times. There's no need for the crappy tone in your posts. I'm starting to think you just want to be offended by something and will turn a blind eye to whatever contradicts your reasoning for being offended.

Azalea · 26-11-2015 01:06AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Reading your posts don't answer the question.

So I'll say it again and in big caps

YOU HAVE SYMPATHY FOR THE GIRL, THE PARIS KILLERS HAD THE SAME VIEW OF THE WORLD, HAVE YOU SYMPATHY FOR PARIS KILLERS??

This isn't bringing anything to the table - the Paris killers didn't try to leave, and weren't executed by Isis. The girl in this case didn't carry out an atrocity like that carried out in Paris. I understand why you have no sympathy for this particular girl but twisting people's words doesn't make for effective discussion.

jeremymurphy · 26-11-2015 01:07AM

Hardly. It is in no way a female fantasy

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 01:07AM

sup_dude wrote: »

Okay, read my posts more slowly then because I've explained this multiple times. There's no need for the crappy tone in your posts. I'm starting to think you just want to be offended by something and will turn a blind eye to whatever contradicts your reasoning for being offended.

I'm not the one being crappy at all. Simple Yes or No will do just fine.

I'm not offended, why in any persons name would I be offended? In all fairness, you seem shaken?

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 01:10AM

Azalea wrote: »

This isn't bringing anything to the table - the Paris killers didn't try to leave, and weren't executed by Isis. The girl in this case didn't carry out an atrocity like that carried out in Paris. I understand why you have no sympathy for this particular girl but twisting people's words doesn't make for effective discussion.

But she had the weapons in her hand at one stage to carry out such a huge atrocity

Sure if that's the case give the Paris Killers another week and maybe they have walked away too.

KERSPLAT! · 26-11-2015 01:13AM

Mod

Keep it civil or don't post, fair warning.

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 01:16AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I'm not the one being crappy at all. Simple Yes or No will do just fine.

I'm not offended, why in any persons name would I be offended? In all fairness, you seem shaken?

I'm not shaken at all, I'm genuinely bewildered at your logic here and what's motivating you to try so hard to twist what I'm saying when I've already said in just about every single post exactly what my views are on the very thing you are asking.

Benteke · 26-11-2015 01:17AM

Azalea wrote: »

Do female muslims get 72 virgin men after death?

I doubt it, Theirs no heaven

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 01:19AM

sup_dude wrote: »

I'm not shaken at all, I'm genuinely bewildered at your logic here and what's motivating you to try so hard to twist what I'm saying when I've already said in just about every single post exactly what my views are on the very thing you are asking.

You're bewildered at somebody who is glad that this earth is free of a person capable of such evil? Maybe happy to kill a child, man or woman?

Then I'm happy to be bewildered.

You did not answer the question. I'll give you the reason. Because you be contradicting yourself. That's why.

And that's fine with me.

Sand · 26-11-2015 01:20AM

opiniated wrote: »

Exactly.
So, young Irish girl gets the same indoctrination, and (rightly), would run a mile from Daesh.

What was different?
Where did she get the idea that Daesh was some kind of worthy Utopia?

You're right, no-one can save someone from stupid, and joining Daesh is beyond stupid in Western eyes. So, what made her think it was OK, even something to be desired?

Because she sought out and agreed with the ISIS view of the world. This was something she chose to do in the same way people choose to join various hate groups, or choose to shoot up cinemas or schools. What makes people like that think their hateful views are okay or something to be desired? This had to do with her and her own values and her own choices. Like others she wilfully decided to reject the society and its values, and her particular poison was ISIS, where it could have been racism, bigotry, fringe political with militant tendencies or a more ill-defined hate and bitterness against others. Look at the members of various Irish terrorist groups. The flavour might change, but the underlying rejection of society and all its compromises and values remains the same.

ISIS doctrines have to be sought out. They repel most people, even other Islamic jihadist groups. They interested her and she began the journey to her own fate. This was not something that was done *to* her. It was something she did to herself.

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 01:22AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

You're bewildered at somebody who is glad that this earth is free of a person capable of such evil? Maybe happy to kill a child, man or woman?

Then I'm happy to be bewildered.

You did not answer the question. I'll give you the reason. Because you be contradicting yourself. That's why.

And that's fine with me.

Please read my very first post on this thread, and my second and third... You're still trying to twist what I'm saying. But to be honest, I think at this stage, it doesn't matter what I say or clarify because I think you just want to make it seem like I'm saying what you think I'm saying... despite it not being what I said at all.

Subcomandante Marcos · 26-11-2015 01:26AM

This thread is full of hate filled irrational morons who just sit and wait for a green light to be horrible people.

A child made a mistake, a stupid mistake but a mistake all the same, that child then probably ended up being raped on her "wedding" night and ever since, ended up being impregnated and eventually decided it was so bad she wanted to leave. Rather than people being happy she tried to leave people are celebrating her death.

This planet is full of hateful, horrible, disgusting people.

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2015 01:28AM

sup_dude wrote: »

Please read my very first post on this thread, and my second and third... You're still trying to twist what I'm saying. But to be honest, I think at this stage, it doesn't matter what I say or clarify because I think you just want to make it seem like I'm saying what you think I'm saying... despite it not being what I said at all.

Your first post is Sympathy for the Girl
Your second post is Sympathy for the Girl again
Your third post is basically saying she deserves credit for leaving ISIS and is in your words "encouraging"

And I'm the one bewildered......

Ave Sodalis · 26-11-2015 01:30AM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Your first post is Sympathy for the Girl
Your second post is Sympathy for the Girl again
Your third post is basically saying she deserves credit for leaving ISIS and is in your words "encouraging"

And I'm the one bewildered......

I said in every one of those posts that it would be a different story if the girl was killed whilst committing an act for ISIS and as a response from committing an act for ISIS.

Eugene Norman · 26-11-2015 01:31AM

whatdoyouknow wrote: »

No. There were many places the British caused misery in. India especially and unfortunately many Irish joined their ranks throughout the years, some even reached high levels. Should we celebrate their deaths?

Yes why not if they tortured Indians ( in terms of achieving high ranks in the British Army it was structured so it's high ranking officer classes were Anglo, and in any case mostly the British army in India was Indian ). However if Indians killed empire troops, as they did in the 19th mutiny, then good on em.

Eugene Norman · 26-11-2015 01:33AM

sup_dude wrote: »

I said in every one of those posts that it would be a different story if the girl was killed whilst committing an act for ISIS and as a response from committing an act for ISIS.

She left the west to engage in the torture and killing of people with different views to her. Repentance was a bit late , if at all ( she might have been upset with her own personal treatment ).

Austrian ISIS 'poster girl' reportedly beaten to death after trying to escape Syria

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