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Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VI: End of the MOC [Revenge of the STH]

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    #7802
    vienne86
    Registered Users Posts: 17,075 ✭✭✭✭vienne86


    scott1974 wrote: »
    Struass and SOB failed the HIA tests and won't be available for this week.
    I'd say it'll be a bit more of a mixed team than that..

    Is Maccer OK so? Good if he is - he's going very well this season.


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    #7803
    errlloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 12,603 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    former total wrote: »
    No, I don't think Kearney ever played wing and Nacewa full-back. Nacewa only really got a run at FB when Kearney was injured (mumps?) for the closing stages of 2008-9 season, turned out he was actually half decent there...

    RK started his pro career on the wing alright, for both Leinster and Ireland, but it was when Girve was the FB. Think Kearney actually played centre a couple of times too.

    I stand corrected! I'd still like to see him being given a go in the left wing position perhaps. I think he can do a real job there.


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    #7804
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 16,816 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Kearney is a completely different player to what he was when he broke through. Had a lovely step and shimmy and broke the line quite easily. These days it seems like he picks the biggest forward the opposition has and runs straight into them. He's probably being told to do that so we can reset and build phases in places our forwards can get to. I think it might have been the 2012 6Nations when he was making line breaks for fun. I want to see him counter attack more.

    On the Kearney at centre thing, I think he played there a few times and was pretty crap. One thing I wish we could've done differently was giving Horgan a greater crack at 12.


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    #7805
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Horgan a greater crack at 12? He played there loads of times! He was pretty poor, didn't have the skills to play in midfield at the time.


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    #7806
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,144 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Clegg wrote: »
    Kearney is a completely different player to what he was when he broke through. Had a lovely step and shimmy and broke the line quite easily. These days it seems like he picks the biggest forward the opposition has and runs straight into them. He's probably being told to do that so we can reset and build phases in places our forwards can get to. I think it might have been the 2012 6Nations when he was making line breaks for fun. I want to see him counter attack more.

    On the Kearney at centre thing, I think he played there a few times and was pretty crap. One thing I wish we could've done differently was giving Horgan a greater crack at 12.

    i still think Kearney is our best striker runner from first phase play, his timing is impeccable.


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    #7807
    scott1974
    Registered Users Posts: 1,319 ✭✭✭scott1974


    vienne86 wrote: »
    Is Maccer OK so? Good if he is - he's going very well this season.

    Yeah, he is o.k. according to I.T.


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    #7808
    Quint2010
    Registered Users Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭Quint2010


    .ak wrote: »
    It's hilarious that people still think madigan is a better out half than gopperth.

    Put the pitch forks away lads.

    I would say they are pretty even. Gopperth is a better line kicker, better defender. Madigan a better place kicker and better passer. Dont think one is better at reading and controlling a game than the other. But Madigan has proved himself competent at the highest level. Has Gopperth?


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    #7809
    Pudsy33
    Registered Users Posts: 10,736 ✭✭✭✭Pudsy33


    Quint2010 wrote: »
    I would say they are pretty even. Gopperth is a better line kicker, better defender. Madigan a better place kicker and better passer. Dont think one is better at reading and controlling a game than the other. But Madigan has proved himself competent at the highest level. Has Gopperth?

    Was Gopperth playing 10 in the semi final vs Toulon? I'd says that's the highest level you'll get bar international rugby. Madigan has never really shone at international or European level for me.


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    #7810
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 41,144 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Quint2010 wrote: »
    I would say they are pretty even. Gopperth is a better line kicker, better defender. Madigan a better place kicker and better passer. Dont think one is better at reading and controlling a game than the other. But Madigan has proved himself competent at the highest level. Has Gopperth?

    Gopperth was brought in to take over from Jonny Wilkinson at Newcastle, and Jonny sexton at Leinster. Not a bad endorsement.


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    #7811
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    Gopperth was brought in to take over from Jonny Wilkinson at Newcastle, and Jonny sexton at Leinster. Not a bad endorsement.

    And Andy Goode at Wasps! :pac:


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    #7812
    JPNelsforearm
    Registered Users Posts: 2,147 ✭✭✭JPNelsforearm


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    Gopperth was brought in to take over from Jonny Wilkinson at Newcastle, and Jonny sexton at Leinster. Not a bad endorsement.

    Did he set the world alight with either club? Forget the world, did he set the backline alight? He's a handy kicker, thats about it.


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    #7813
    errlloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 12,603 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Deleted User wrote: »
    And Andy Goode at Wasps! :pac:

    Not a bad word will be said about the man, he's a legend.

    B6H4cTPCEAA9rHt.jpg


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    #7814
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    JPNelsforearm wrote: »
    Did he set the world alight with either club? Forget the world, did he set the backline alight? He's a handy kicker, thats about it.

    He was pretty successful for Newcastle, yes. When Schmidt went after him Leinster were European champions, so obviously not too shabby.

    Hes a good Pro 12 level player. He was the best option we had as long as he was here.


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    #7815
    errlloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 12,603 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Jaysus lads, Gopperth wasn't bad. The only reason I was frustrated he was started was because I felt the difference between him and Madigan was marginal, and the youth and Irishness of Madigan should have been a deciding factor.

    The tactics we were playing were dreadful. I was inclined to blame MO'C, not a lot has changed since he left, so maybe it was 10% MO'C and 90% "NOT JOE" that caused the decline.


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    #7816
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    errlloyd wrote: »
    Jaysus lads, Gopperth wasn't bad. The only reason I was frustrated he was started was because I felt the difference between him and Madigan was marginal, and the youth and Irishness of Madigan should have been a deciding factor.

    The tactics we were playing were dreadful. I was inclined to blame MO'C, not a lot has changed since he left, so maybe it was 10% MO'C and 90% "NOT JOE" that caused the decline.

    In fairness up until the last 2 weeks we'd been playing a hell of a lot more rugby than we had been under MOC. Not all of it smart and not all of it effective, but with 20+ players missing we still managed to throw the ball around a bit and win more than we lost. It was a far more pleasing period than most of MOCs reign.


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    #7817
    Felexicon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    Pudsy33 wrote:
    Was Gopperth playing 10 in the semi final vs Toulon? I'd says that's the highest level you'll get bar international rugby. Madigan has never really shone at international or European level for me.


    He was very good against France in the RWC to be fair.


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    #7818
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Felexicon wrote: »
    He was very good against France in the RWC to be fair.

    France were crap.


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    #7819
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 16,816 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Thornley was on Off The Ball and is convinced Henshaw to Leinster will happen. If it's him to partner Ringrose then I'd be pretty happy tbh. Although, as mentioned before, we'd still need more centres even if we signed him.


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    #7820
    Felexicon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    Deleted User wrote:
    France were crap.


    That's true but he can only play against the opposition on the day. He could have played poorly and Ireland still could have won but the fact is he had a very good game that day.
    I don't think he's what Leinster or Ireland need at number 10 in the long term but he's certainly had some good games there


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    #7821
    Felexicon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    Clegg wrote:
    Thornley was on Off The Ball and is convinced Henshaw to Leinster will happen. If it's him to partner Ringrose then I'd be pretty happy tbh. Although, as mentioned before, we'd still need more centres even if we signed him.


    You feel the options are move to Leinster or go abroad. Doesn't seem like the kind of young lad who wants to move away just yet.
    At this point in his career he needs to be playing EEC rugby and Leinster is the most likely to be able to offer him that (well at least 6 games) every year for the foreseeable future.


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    #7822
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Felexicon wrote: »
    You feel the options are move to Leinster or go abroad. Doesn't seem like the kind of young lad who wants to move away just yet.
    At this point in his career he needs to be playing EEC rugby and Leinster is the most likely to be able to offer him that (well at least 6 games) every year for the foreseeable future.

    Over the last 3 / 4 seasons Leinster are very much still well out in front of the other provinces and also house the core of the Ireland team so it would make the most sense if he is ambitious.

    That said, I'd hate to lose Te'o and I'm not sure I see both at Leinster at the same time.


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    #7823
    Journeyman_1
    Registered Users Posts: 841 ✭✭✭Journeyman_1


    I was at a Q&A thing with Mads, reddan and sob earlier. Sob said he was 'not sure' if he'd be passed fit to play on Friday, and it sounded like he thought he wouldn't.

    The lads talked about being disappointed in the results recently and that they didn't want to look for excuses, they underperformed. The acknowledged the external factors of integrating the WC players back in and adapting to the style of play Leo is trying to get them to play. It's "the old Leinster way" according to Madigan. All in all, it sounded positive. They want to put on a good performance on Friday naturally enough.


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    #7824
    case885
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭case885


    You'd think Leinster would trust their home grown centres rather than bringing in henshaw. Reid, Fitzgerald, Ringrose, O Shea, Farrell, Daly seems like plenty depth. Henshaw missing big chunks of the season away with Ireland won't be great either when Leinster are already depleted enough at those times.


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    #7825
    Journeyman_1
    Registered Users Posts: 841 ✭✭✭Journeyman_1


    case885 wrote: »
    You'd think Leinster would trust their home grown centres rather than bringing in henshaw. Reid, Fitzgerald, Ringrose, O Shea, Farrell, Daly seems like plenty depth. Henshaw missing big chunks of the season away with Ireland won't be great either when Leinster are already depleted enough at those times.

    Reid is possibly never going to be good enough for top level rugby. Fitz is a better winger and the rest are all young and untested, even if some show potential. If we were to keep BT then I'd be more inclined to agree, but Leinster can well do with a high quality centre.

    *maybe not as necessary as it is at munster though


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    #7826
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    case885 wrote: »
    You'd think Leinster would trust their home grown centres rather than bringing in henshaw. Reid, Fitzgerald, Ringrose, O Shea, Farrell, Daly seems like plenty depth. Henshaw missing big chunks of the season away with Ireland won't be great either when Leinster are already depleted enough at those times.

    There's one thing trusting people but at the end of the day we're not a development side.

    Reid has come along bounds but his defending has been quite poor. Fitzgerald's best position is 11. Ringrose maybe the messiah but he'll get blown out of the water by bigger centres. O'shea is an out n out 13 but seems to get the yips whenever he lines out for the seniors. We'll have to see with Farrell and Daly but it's far too early to assume they'll make jump up.

    Relying on home grown talent for the sake of it is silly IMO.


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    #7827
    lesterfreeman
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 17 ✭lesterfreeman


    case885 wrote: »
    You'd think Leinster would trust their home grown centres rather than bringing in henshaw. Reid, Fitzgerald, Ringrose, O Shea, Farrell, Daly seems like plenty depth. Henshaw missing big chunks of the season away with Ireland won't be great either when Leinster are already depleted enough at those times.

    Reid has proven he isn't good enough for the top level, O'Shea isn't either.
    Teo is set to leave and Fitzgerald as a centre is a work in progress and better on the wing.
    Ringrose has the talent to be a star.
    Farrell, Daly haven't played above A level and are the same age as Henshaw.

    Henshaw wants to leave, Leinster would be crazy if they didn't try to sign him.

    Clear need for a top class 12 at leinster.


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    #7828
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 16,816 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Healy and SoB are out of contract in the summer. We'll start hearing contract rumours about them soon. If we can keep them for one more contract cycle then we'd be in a good position moving forward if we want to let them go after.


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    #7829
    lesterfreeman
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 17 ✭lesterfreeman


    Clegg wrote: »
    Healy and SoB are out of contract in the summer. We'll start hearing contract rumours about them soon. If we can keep them for one more contract cycle then we'd be in a good position moving forward if we want to let them go after.

    they'll be dealt with centrally.

    a lot of players out of contract this summer, will be a battle to keep the ones we want.


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    #7830
    case885
    Registered Users Posts: 2,536 ✭✭✭case885


    .ak wrote:
    There's one thing trusting people but at the end of the day we're not a development side.

    .ak wrote:
    Reid has come along bounds but his defending has been quite poor. Fitzgerald's best position is 11. Ringrose maybe the messiah but he'll get blown out of the water by bigger centres. O'shea is an out n out 13 but seems to get the yips whenever he lines out for the seniors. We'll have to see with Farrell and Daly but it's far too early to assume they'll make jump up.

    .ak wrote:
    Relying on home grown talent for the sake of it is silly IMO.

    What about playing VDF, Furlong, Luke Mc grath? They were trusted.
    Have Farrell and Daly even played for Leinsters first team?
    Fitzgerald was being hailed as Ireland's solution to 13 last season so why would he be put back on the wing.


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    #7831
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Over the last 3 / 4 seasons Leinster are very much still well out in front of the other provinces and also house the core of the Ireland team so it would make the most sense if he is ambitious.

    That said, I'd hate to lose Te'o and I'm not sure I see both at Leinster at the same time.

    Unless we keep Te'o and play Henshaw at 12 where he's playing for Ireland. We can then move Fitz out to the wing. We could be looking at a first choice of

    Healy Strauss Moore
    Toner McCarthy
    Ruddock Heaslip SOB

    McGrath Sexton
    Henshaw Te'o
    Fitz Kearney Kearney

    Cronin, McGrath, Furlong, Kearney, VDF, Reddan (!?), Madigan, Ringrose

    Now I know I said that I don't think we need yet another international in the squad but at the same time I'm not sure I'd do much complaining at a side like that. Get in a dog of a lock and a decent SH and we'd be laughing next season.


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