Turkey shoots down Russian fighter plane

The Backwards Man · 24-11-2015 12:11PM

Nothing to see here.

Russia gets a chance to show it's not a lapdog of the West Coalition. Turkey gets a chance to show it's protecting its airspace. Carry on.

keithclancy · 24-11-2015 12:11PM

Turkey has released an image of the flight path:
https://twitter.com/CNNTURK_ENG/status/669098577524822016/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

suicide_circus · 24-11-2015 12:13PM

Without labels that image is incomprehensible

nxbyveromdwjpg · 24-11-2015 12:17PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

Without labels that image is incomprehensible

Someone overlaid it with a map, the blue line is the flight, red is the border

https://twitter.com/NoMoreEds/status/669103692986097664

Dyr · 24-11-2015 12:18PM

I don't like ISIS, therefore I don't the Turkey. Go get em Vlad, war on terror and all that

seamus · 24-11-2015 12:18PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

Without labels that image is incomprehensible

The red path is the Russian jet, the grey path is presumably one of the Turkish ones.

It's a small incursion, downing the aircraft probably an overreaction, but with a massive civil war raging on its border, Turkey has been strictly defending that airspace, and can't really be blamed for doing so.

Turkey is also a bit pissed that some areas in Northern Syria are under attack from Russia, as Turkey claims some kind of ethnic ties to those areas.

So this is far from a simple, "Defending our airspace" incident for Turkey.

smash · 24-11-2015 12:21PM

The jet was only in their airspace for a matter of seconds. There's a shitstorm coming!

24-11-2015 12:24PM

Christmas is coming early for the PKK I'd say

Canis Lupus · 24-11-2015 12:28PM

Nothing will happen here.

Russia will be all like, BLYAT!.

Turkey will be all like.. so what dood

The world will keep on turning. I am tempted to go look in the conspiracy theory forum though. I imagine the orgy going on in there right now would be interesting...

keithclancy · 24-11-2015 12:30PM

smash wrote: »

The jet was only in their airspace for a matter of seconds. There's a shitstorm coming!

Doesn't matter how long they were in their airspace for, it was a loaded military plane on a bombing mission.

If a fighter jet of unknown nationality violated US or Russian airspace even for a few seconds I'm pretty sure they would be shot down also.

Best reply so far on reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/3u1zrs/fighter_jet_goes_down_in_flames_near_syrian/

Sorry for hijacking top comment, but just wondering IF this was shot down in Turkey side does this trigger any NATO actions? Hope not, I hope cooler heads prevail.
EDIT: Inbox is full of similar replies so bulk reply. Add to this soon the prospect of multiple world powers, Rus China and US all flying missions, each with a slightly different agenda. **** like this is only going to get more common.
I agree nothing will happen, short term. That said, somethings explode with a slow fuse, some a quick fuse but both need to be lit at some stage.
Official statement by Turkish Military:
On 24th of November around 9.20 am near Hatay Yayladağı region, a plane, nationality unknown, violated the Turkish airspace despite having been warned 10 times over a period of 5 minutes. The aforementioned plane was intercepted at 9.24 by 2 Turkish F-16s which were patrolling the area.
permalinkparent

[–]Aesyn 170 points 2 hours ago
Without answering your actual question first, don't worry, 99% no military action will follow this incident.
Second, nowadays this "NATO Article 5" is thrown a lot by everyone. For things to reach that scale, you need more than a single aircraft shot down, because no country in their right mind will declare war over this incident. So NATO countries (obviously other than Turkey) will just put up a statement, saying "please tread carefully" and that's it.
What happens between Russia and Turkey now? Probably a political crisis, nothing more. Russia has already invaded Turkish airspace numerous times in recent history and Turkey repeatedly warned them. If you don't carry out your promises, you will get bullied by stronger nations all the time, that was what's happening. So Turkish military decided to shoot it down this time. And to be honest, Russian military was expecting this at some point. A single aircraft doesn't worth that much in the grand scheme of things, Russia won't make a big deal of this.
Tl;dr: Minor political crisis between Russia and Turkey, a little weakened relationship between two countries, other than these nothing will change.

StewartGriffin · 24-11-2015 12:31PM

Surprising how ill informed some of the Rambo types here are.

Syrian Rebels are fighting the Assad Regime. (These are the rebels the U.S and U.K have been vaguely supporting.)

Russia is attacking the Syrian Rebels to help the Assad Regime.

Syrian Rebels are not Daesh.

Turkey is not Daesh.

Putin is not going to be your friend. Ever. No matter how much you drool over his topless photo's.

jmayo · 24-11-2015 12:33PM

ronan45 wrote: »

I am surprised the Russians dont have contingency plans for a situation like this, Have they not got something like a C130 that can orbit the site where the pilots came down to ward off rebels from locating and apprehending the pilots... then while this plane lends air support await some Attack helicopters to get the pilots out?!?

Gatling wrote: »

Unfortunately russia doesn't have C130 spectre Gunships .

Made in America .

It is the AC-130 which is the gunship variant of the C-130 Hercules.

The Russian/Soviet equivalent of the C-130 was the Antonov-12 (cub), but I don't know if they ever developed a gunship variant.

Some did have big cannon in the rear and they developed number of anti submarine, tankers, electronic countermeasures and tank transport variants.

The big thing the Russians have and in Syria are Mi-24 Hind helicopter gunships and they are very impressive pieces of kit.

Maybe they have some Mi-28s there as well?

The pilots lives will depend on who has them.

This is going to get interesting.
Not so nice Russia versus not so nice Turkey.
Two countries amongst many stirring the sh** in Syria.

StudentDad · 24-11-2015 12:35PM

I don't know why people are so upset by this. The Turkish military warned the Russian aircraft that they were in their airspace and for want of a better phrase told them to bugger off or there would be consequences. The Russians it would appear continued to ignore these warnings and the Turks responded.

Are there other factors in play here that we don't know about? Most probably. Do the Turks like the fact that the Russians are stirring up a hornets nest in their back yard? Probably not. Do the Turks have the right to defend their airspace? Yes they do.

SD

Wibbs · 24-11-2015 12:36PM

I'm confused(no shock there), but looking at the flight path and map the aircraft would have been in Turkish airspace for a matter of minutes, so how could they have warned them "10 times over a period of 5 minutes" and where was it actually engaged and shot down?

smash · 24-11-2015 12:38PM

keithclancy wrote: »

Doesn't matter how long they were in their airspace for, it was a loaded military plane on a bombing mission.

If a fighter jet of unknown nationality violated US or Russian airspace even for a few seconds I'm pretty sure they would be shot down also.

Would they also shoot them down outside their airspace?

osarusan · 24-11-2015 12:38PM

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm confused(no shock there), but looking at the flight path and map the aircraft would have been in Turkish airspace for a matter of minutes, so how could they have warned them "10 times over a period of 5 minutes" and where was it actually engaged and shot down?

Possibly warning them that they were approaching Turkish airspace?

24-11-2015 12:39PM

Based on the flight path turkey has released, apart from a small circle on the right hand side of turkish land, isnt the Russian plane heading straight across?

If turkey warned the plane to leave, isnt that what they were doing?

Lovely Bloke · 24-11-2015 12:42PM

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm confused(no shock there), but looking at the flight path and map the aircraft would have been in Turkish airspace for a matter of minutes, so how could they have warned them "10 times over a period of 5 minutes" and where was it actually engaged and shot down?

warned them they were getting too close, and that if they came in they'd be shot down.

they came in

they got shot down

jmayo · 24-11-2015 12:46PM

StudentDad wrote: »

I don't know why people are so upset by this. The Turkish military warned the Russian aircraft that they were in their airspace and for want of a better phrase told them to bugger off or there would be consequences. The Russians it would appear continued to ignore these warnings and the Turks responded.

Are there other factors in play here that we don't know about? Most probably. Do the Turks like the fact that the Russians are stirring up a hornets nest in their back yard? Probably not. Do the Turks have the right to defend their airspace? Yes they do.

SD

Don't try and spin this that Russia is somehow the only one stirring up the hornets nest.
The Turks are one of the ones ultimately responsible for starting the mess in Syria.
They backed the rebels and then they have also gone on to help ISIS both by letting supplies/people in and people out.

Then to add insult to injury they initially refused to let US overfly them when they were bombing ISIS and tried to make sure no help went to the most effective enemy of ISIS on the ground, the Kurds.

So please less of the shyte that somehow the Turks are not in any way responsible for the mess that is Syria and that is Russia that is sh** stirring.

emo72 · 24-11-2015 12:46PM

questionmark? wrote: »

LOL. Ya a world war would never impact on little old Ireland

It was an attempt at dry humour. I crashed and burned though.

seamus · 24-11-2015 12:47PM

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm confused(no shock there), but looking at the flight path and map the aircraft would have been in Turkish airspace for a matter of minutes, so how could they have warned them "10 times over a period of 5 minutes" and where was it actually engaged and shot down?

osarusan wrote: »

Possibly warning them that they were approaching Turkish airspace?

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Based on the flight path turkey has released, apart from a small circle on the right hand side of turkish land, isnt the Russian plane heading straight across?

If turkey warned the plane to leave, isnt that what they were doing?

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

warned them they were getting too close, and that if they came in they'd be shot down.

they came in

they got shot down

I'm sure there are very specific rules about the correct way to do this. One key point seems to be the Russian aircraft's refusal to identify itself or respond to the Turks.

It probably doesn't matter that the aircraft appears to be on the way out of your airspace. If it is refusing to identify itself despite repeated warnings and is known to be armed, then you're probably entitled to treat it as hostile and take action.

The Russian pilots on the flipside are probably instructed to not respond to anyone contacting them but just leave the airspace. If they respond or otherwise acknowledge their incursion, that could be a diplomatic issue.

In hindsight though it's probably better than dying.

RobertKK · 24-11-2015 12:47PM

I hope ISIS have not captured the Russian pilots, last time they captured a pilot who was bombing them, it was a Jordanian and they put him in a cage and burned him alive.

ronan45 · 24-11-2015 12:48PM

Anyone know whats the background of this trending on Twitter Russian Helicopter downed also??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UNkE7t6znU

keithclancy · 24-11-2015 12:49PM

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm confused(no shock there), but looking at the flight path and map the aircraft would have been in Turkish airspace for a matter of minutes, so how could they have warned them "10 times over a period of 5 minutes" and where was it actually engaged and shot down?

I'd assume each time the radar sweeps and the flight hasn't altered it's course away from your airspace you'd be warning them.

Would you warn someone that their going to drive into your car before they drive into you or after it happened already ?

Royal Irish · 24-11-2015 12:50PM

RobertKK wrote: »

I hope ISIS have not captured the Russian pilots, last time they captured a pilot who was bombing them, it was a Jordanian and they put him in a cage and burned him alive.

A video has already shown up online showing one of the pilots dead. If the other one is in "moderate" rebels hands the world will finally get to see how moderate they really are.

snubbleste · 24-11-2015 12:51PM

RobertKK wrote: »

I hope ISIS have not captured the Russian pilots, last time they captured a pilot who was bombing them, it was a Jordanian and they put him in a cage and burned him alive.

Well, Russia is slaughtering IS fighters from the sky

Royal Irish · 24-11-2015 12:53PM

snubbleste wrote: »

Well, Russia is slaughtering IS fighters from the sky

Is that a bad thing?

BoJack Horseman · 24-11-2015 12:54PM

ronan45 wrote: »

Anyone know whats the background of this trending on Twitter Russian Helicopter downed also??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UNkE7t6znU

I've a feeling that is a regime helicopter, rather than a russian.

Gatling · 24-11-2015 12:54PM

ronan45 wrote: »

Anyone know whats the background of this trending on Twitter Russian Helicopter downed also??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UNkE7t6znU

Seems pretty recent hard to tell haven't come across the video before

Dyr · 24-11-2015 12:55PM

Royal Irish wrote: »

Is that a bad thing?

It is for the turkish and israeli regimes

Turkey shoots down Russian fighter plane

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