Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

wes · 17-11-2015 06:24PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

it was posted on another thread, but it applies to ye perfectly ..

You seem to hate the left far more than ISIS, who brutally murder people on a regular basis.

jmayo · 17-11-2015 06:26PM

seamus wrote: »

What I love is the people calling the EU a "failed project" and calling for the reinstatement of all borders.

The formation of the United States and the EU have both proven beyond doubt that when you dissolve borders between states and engage in close economic and political ties, conflict ends, states prosper and citizen's lives become safer.

EU = USA ???
Oh yeah maybe in the wet dreams of Angela Merkel, Van Rompuy, Schulz, Baroso, Junker, Draghi, etc.

PS you do know there is a border between USA and Canada and it is actually ok to cross it.
Ooh and the countries don't collapse into economic ruin over it.

Peist2007 wrote: »

If anything it confirms that, wait for it, drum roll, maybe Islam is not the only factor involved in this matter? As i and a few others have been saying on here for days. Surely there is another water protest some of you gowls can be attending?

Mind coming back to me on that when you find a few Jews, Christians, Buddists, Hindus, Sikhs, atheists in ISIS or Al-Qaeda ?

Ok so far we have had ...
racists - check
xenophobics - check

Now
gowls - check

Any other disparagaing terms you would like to throw out.

One can only marvel at the intellectual superiority and moral superiority of some.

The salient truth you seem to miss though is you die like the rest of us from their bombs and their bullets.

Junkyard Tom · 17-11-2015 06:27PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

So terrorist attacks in 9/11 and previous were due to acts in 2003??

What are you on about?

Have another go.

Peist2007 · 17-11-2015 06:27PM

take everything wrote: »

Dunno why you're insulting me tbh.
I would regard myself as a rationalist.

I've no time for people whose ideology is influenced by a man in the sky and hurts others. Whether that stems from fundamental Christianity/Islam/whatever.

No, apologies! I wasnt insulting you. I was using your post and the info contained in it to insult those who have shouted down people on this thread (Bannasaide immediately springs to mind) who didnt have a National Front black and white attitude to the problem.

I personally found it amazing that so many were willing to discount the effects of Middle Eastern oil grabbing by the West in the creation of this issue. The fact that the two brothers owned a bar - a bar that sells alcohol - would tell me that they are not quite on the same page as the ISIS "idolators at a party of perversity" statement on Saturday.

This issue is about far more than religion and there is blood on the hands of both sides. Foreign policy in the middle east needs to be overhauled. Maybe then they wont be producing such angry youth and we wont be seeing immigrants picking up on and acting on that anger "in the name of Islam" in Western capitals.

Apologies again

Colonialboy · 17-11-2015 06:28PM

wes wrote: »

You seem to hate the left far more than ISIS, who brutally murder people on a regular basis.

In the above ladies and gentlemen we have classic use of options 2 with a hint of 3.

ah i see the classic liberal 3Ds are coming up...

Deny the argument at all costs get it banned, get it shut down whatever..... then onto

deflect the argument at all costs, move attention away so the uneducated oiks can biker about something else.. if that doesnt work then its onto

Defame... I mean who likes racists.

But boards is growing up in some parts i think and people are cottoning on to the tactics.

Bannasidhe · 17-11-2015 06:30PM

jmayo wrote: »

The salient truth you seem to miss though is you die like the rest of us from their bombs and their bullets.

The salient truth you seem to miss though is you will die like the rest of us from Fascist bombs and their bullets.

I don't want any black shirts ruling Europe - what ever their ideology, it's same slaughter different 'reasons'.

Peist2007 · 17-11-2015 06:30PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

it was posted on another thread, but it applies to ye perfectly ..

What are you actually talking about? You'd think with a name like yours you'd at least have been able to work out why they want you dead. But it still evades you. I pity you to be honest.

My name is URL · 17-11-2015 06:31PM

MPFGLB wrote: »

There is no neutral against ISIS. Its not 1939

And it would be shameful to not stand with the rest of Europe especially when Ireland has been so ready to take their euros in the past

Will you still be of that opinion the next time there's a European wide agreement on taking in certain numbers of refugees?

Colonialboy · 17-11-2015 06:31PM

Peist2007 wrote: »

No, apologies! I wasnt insulting you. I was using your post and the info contained in it to insult those who have shouted down people on this thread (Bannasaide immediately springs to mind) who didnt have a National Front black and white attitude to the problem.

and in the above boys and girls the poster has gone direct to Option 3...

ah i see the classic liberal 3Ds are coming up...

Deny the argument at all costs get it banned, get it shut down whatever..... then onto

deflect the argument at all costs, move attention away so the uneducated oiks can biker about something else.. if that doesnt work then its onto

Defame... I mean who likes racists.

But boards is growing up in some parts i think and people are cottoning on to the tactics.

Peist2007 · 17-11-2015 06:31PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

So terrorist attacks in 9/11 and previous were due to acts in 2003??

No, that would be impossible. His point is completely correct though.

Bannasidhe · 17-11-2015 06:32PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

and in the above boys and girls the poster has gone direct to Option 3...

Is it driving you wild?

jackofalltrades · 17-11-2015 06:33PM

wes wrote: »

I would disagree that multi culturism is a default, as it would require active policies for it to exist, as would need the active promotion of multiple cultures. So it can't exist as a default, unless you radically change the meaning, and the term is rendered meaningless (I would argue that we are well on our way to make the term meaningless, and its used inaccurately a lot).

France and other EU countries do have policies that are expressly not multi cultural in nature at all. In France, your French or your not.

IMHO, multi culturalism can't have failed in France for example, as it never existed there in the 1st place.

From Wiki.

Multiculturalism describes the existence, acceptance, or promotion of multiple cultural traditions within a single jurisdiction, usually considered in terms of the culture associated with an ethnic group.

As such while French policy is inter-cultural, multi-culturalism exists.

wes · 17-11-2015 06:33PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

In the above ladies and gentlemen we have classic use of options 2 with a hint of 3.

You mean exactly like how you keep going on about the left, and not the actual perpetrators of the violence? Its a simple observation, you seem to hate and blame the left far more than ISIS for some reason. Otherwise, almost every post wouldn't be about the left.

Peist2007 · 17-11-2015 06:33PM

jmayo wrote: »

EU = USA ???
Oh yeah maybe in the wet dreams of Angela Merkel, Van Rompuy, Schulz, Baroso, Junker, Draghi, etc.

PS you do know there is a border between USA and Canada and it is actually ok to cross it.
Ooh and the countries don't collapse into economic ruin over it.

Mind coming back to me on that when you find a few Jews, Christians, Buddists, Hindus, Sikhs, atheists in ISIS or Al-Qaeda ?

Ok so far we have had ...
racists - check
xenophobics - check

Now
gowls - check

Any other disparagaing terms you would like to throw out.

One can only marvel at the intellectual superiority and moral superiority of some.

The salient truth you seem to miss though is you die like the rest of us from their bombs and their bullets.

:pac: what is salient about the last point?

:pac:

Peist2007 · 17-11-2015 06:36PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

and in the above boys and girls the poster has gone direct to Option 3...

You cannot deal with any of the points made so you are resorting to childish attacks. Showing your true colours at every turn. Keep it up. More is the pity on you.

wes · 17-11-2015 06:37PM

jackofalltrades wrote: »

From Wiki.

As such while French policy is inter-cultural, multi-culturalism exists.

What policy exactly? Care to point out the policy? I am well aware of the definition, and that is all you have provided and 0 evidence of any such French policy of multi-cultirism. Everything I have read about France shows no such policy in existence.

I see no promotion of any other culture except French culture. France doesn't have any such policy. The policy is promote French culture and see 0 evidence to suggest otherwise.

Peist2007 · 17-11-2015 06:38PM

wes wrote: »

You mean exactly like how you keep going on about the left, and not the actual perpetrators of the violence? Its a simple observation, you seem to hate and blame the left far more than ISIS for some reason. Otherwise, almost every post wouldn't be about the left.

Actual agendas coming to the fore. Pity there wasnt enough subtlety to hide it. Then again, those are the folks to be worried about.

seamus · 17-11-2015 06:44PM

Was this posted yet? A satirical article written 13 years ago which perfectly predicted the mistakes that were about to be made.

http://www.theonion.com/multiblogpost/this-war-will-destabilize-the-entire-mideast-regio-11534

And now we have people telling us to make the same mistakes again, insisting that things will be different this time.

Colonialboy · 17-11-2015 06:47PM

anyone for fundamentaliberalism bingo..

just stick the usual sad and tired buzzwords, jaded historical references, left of left field accusations , hackneyed assumptions, absurb conclusions etc into your responses to other posters and soon we can put any reasonable chance of a informative discussion and respectful debate to rest.

wes · 17-11-2015 06:51PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

anyone for fundamentaliberalism bingo..

just stick the usual sad and tired buzzwords, jaded historical references, left of left field accusations , hackneyed assumptions, absurb conclusions etc into your responses to other posters and soon we can put any reasonable chance of a informative discussion and respectful debate to rest.

You complain about buzzwords right after using "fundamentaliberalism"..............

My name is URL · 17-11-2015 06:55PM

Colonialboy wrote: »

anyone for fundamentaliberalism bingo..

just stick the usual sad and tired buzzwords, jaded historical references, left of left field accusations , hackneyed assumptions, absurb conclusions etc into your responses to other posters and soon we can put any reasonable chance of a informative discussion and respectful debate to rest.

He said, without a single hint of irony

Junkyard Tom · 17-11-2015 06:57PM

seamus wrote: »

And now we have people telling us to make the same mistakes again, insisting that things will be different this time.

Most likely those very people who masturbated furiously to 'Shock and Awe' and gleefully cheered on every failed western misadventure in the Middle East that has contributed to this blood-soaked situation.

ihatemyfish · 17-11-2015 07:14PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Simples - because there are calls for closing borders to wide groups of people because less than 1% of them might be terrorists.

Non Europeans have no unfettered right to live in Europe and when ISIS are using the migrant routes to smuggle in their operatives, then it most certainly is time to close our borders. Over a million "refugees" will enter Europe this year. If 1% are terrorists then that is over 10k terrorists in Europe. Considering the damage that 8 unleashed on Paris, this is suicidal policy.

wes · 17-11-2015 07:18PM

ihatemyfish wrote: »

Non Europeans have no unfettered right to live in Europe and when ISIS are using the migrant routes to smuggle in their operatives, then it most certainly is time to close our borders. Over a million "refugees" will enter Europe this year. If 1% are terrorists then that is over 10k terrorists in Europe. Considering the damage that 8 unleashed on Paris, this is suicidal policy.

Last I checked the passport was a fake (i can't be the only one who finds it hard to believe someone would bring there passport on a suicide mission), and the terrorists identified were born in Europe.

Secondly, ISIS want Europe to reject refugees, as with people fleeing there losing a huge pool of potential conscripts. Personally, I rather not give ISIS what they want.

zeffabelli · 17-11-2015 07:22PM

wes wrote: »

Last I checked the passport was a fake (i can't be the only one who finds it hard to believe someone would bring there passport on a suicide mission), and the terrorists identified were born in Europe.

Secondly, ISIS want Europe to reject refugees, as with people fleeing there losing a huge pool of potential conscripts. Personally, I rather not give ISIS what they want.

Taking a reactive position to an enemy is a dumb strategy, whether it is doing what they want or NOT doing what they want, you are still letting them run the show in a reactive way, not a pro active leadership way.

The right thing to do, is the smart thing to do, whether ISIS wants it or not, is secondary.

Bannasidhe · 17-11-2015 07:23PM

ihatemyfish wrote: »

Non Europeans have no unfettered right to live in Europe and when ISIS are using the migrant routes to smuggle in their operatives, then it most certainly is time to close our borders. Over a million "refugees" will enter Europe this year. If 1% are terrorists then that is over 10k terrorists in Europe. Considering the damage that 8 unleashed on Paris, this is suicidal policy.

Look - we all know that even before the events in Paris you didn't want Muslim refugees in Europe so at least be honest about that and stop using people's deaths as justification for your desire for Fortress Europe.

You want the same thing as Daesh - no possible means of escape for those who don't agree with them. Pretty it up all you want, blame who you want, use any excuse you want, but that won't change the fact that you share a common goal.

quiet_speaker · 17-11-2015 07:26PM

jmayo wrote: »

Well you will only defeat them by using people on the ground.
Why do some people now think that they win if we actually fight them with all the force at the disposal of the West.

I saw a recent documentary about WWII and some veterans reckoned the people of today would be capable of showing as much heroism and resolve as they did.
I do seriously wonder if the guy was just saying that more in hope than anything.

After all how could he square the circle of seeing all the sacrificing he and his buddies made only for the current generations not to give a cra*.

What is so wrong with closing the borders ?
Why should there be open borders between EU states and non EU states ?
Ok make exceptions for likes of Switzerland, Norway who have long had free movement with EU, but to hell with anyone else.

And what is even wrong with closing borders between EU countries ?
So long as we don't end up with massive queues and corrupt officials that need bribing ala some African countries then what is the big issue.

You queue up, present your passport of identification document, have a quick check done with interpol and hey presto you are through.

Just because I don't like people whose principles demand that we sell ourselves out.
Idiots like Corbyn have just shown themselves to be as good as enemies of their own people.

And don't worry I keep a certain amount of venom for certain other people, like the ones who refuse to condemn attacks on civilians and children in the name of some cause that they claim is a war.

closing the borders makes perfect sense as the only real weapon IS have is to infiltrate , they are incredibly weak millitarily in a conventional sense , its not like they can get hold of cruise misies or jet fighters and even they did , those are easily countered , whats near impossible to counter is random attacks from members of the population

it would be funny were it not so serious to give any creedance to the liberals who this past few days have been droning on about not giving in to IS by curtailing immigration

first of all , the assumption that liberals know what IS want , secondly the fact that liberals have been so wrong so far , why on earth would be start paying any heed to their views now

ihatemyfish · 17-11-2015 07:27PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

The irony meter of this middle aged Irish lesbian just exploded.

The irony in a lesbian calling for open borders for the very same people that would happily see her hanging from a crane or being thrown 20 foot off a roof in their own countries.

You're a turkey voting for Christmas and do you know what's the saddest thing? You don't even see it.

wes · 17-11-2015 07:28PM

zeffabelli wrote: »

Taking a reactive position to an enemy is a dumb strategy, whether it is doing what they want or NOT doing what they want, you are still letting them run the show in a reactive way, not a pro active leadership way.

The right thing to do, is the smart thing to do, whether ISIS wants it or not, is secondary.

I think doing what the other guy is trying to get you to do, is generally the stupid thing to do. Also, there will always be action and reaction. You can't avoid reaction in a conflict, as if the other guys changes things up, you react to that and vice versa.

wes · 17-11-2015 07:30PM

quiet_speaker wrote: »

first of all , the assumption that liberals know what IS want ,

ISIS have said it, thats how people know.

quiet_speaker wrote: »

secondly the fact that liberals have been so wrong so far , why on earth would be start paying any heed to their views now

You mean like the people who supported the Iraq war, that has led to the current mess.....

Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

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