Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

Augme · 14-11-2015 08:39PM

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

I see loads of muslims every day with full on head to toe veils, how were there left into this country.
We need to start deporting en masse, but that will never happen and we will see attacks here too.
Write to all td's and tell them we do not want islamic immigration into this country.

Can we not just deport you instead?

darkpagandeath · 14-11-2015 08:40PM

Tasden wrote: »

How quick people are to forget the outrage they expressed at the poor little boy washed up on a beach. But when the terror is closer to home they suddenly don't care all that much about those who are also trying to get away from it. Some absolutely horrible comments on this thread.

Yes parents killing their children is horrible. The children don't have a choice in getting on the boats.

A Primal Nut · 14-11-2015 08:40PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

So because a very very very very very small % of people that came have attacked Paris, you think Ireland and the rest of the world should close its borders and say no you can't come in?

Can i ask - do we then stop holiday markers coming to this country - just in case they are ISIS members who have gone below the radar - after all one of the attackers was a 30 year old french citizen?

The majority of the refugees are running for their lives, trying to escape death, and your attitude is simple, i don't give a f**K about you - stay in your own country.

Why should we sacrifice our peaceful existence for them?

IrishTrajan · 14-11-2015 08:41PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

So because a very very very very very small % of people that came have attacked Paris, you think Ireland and the rest of the world should close its borders and say no you can't come in?

Why should we let in people who could be radicalised? There's not a single benefit to our economy to taking in 4-30,000 people.

Ace2007 wrote: »

Can i ask - do we then stop holiday markers coming to this country - just in case they are ISIS members who have gone below the radar - after all one of the attackers was a 30 year old french citizen?

We should of course have stringent security checks like every sane country does. Canada, Australia, the US, for example.

Ace2007 wrote: »

The majority of the refugees are running for their lives, trying to escape death, and your attitude is simple, i don't give a f**K about you - stay in your own country.

Running for their lives? You know it's safe in Greece, Macedonia, Serbia, Hungary, Croatia, Slovenia, Austria? Why then are we seeing hundreds of thousands heading for Germany, refusing to accept the laws we have in place? What's worse is that they're being enabled by hand-wringing fools with "welcome" placards.

XR3i · 14-11-2015 08:41PM

berlin could be next

Facekicking 2 The Future · 14-11-2015 08:41PM

I've been reading about ISIS main aim:

These people do not fear death. I'm not saying a clear cut no holds barred approach is right or wrong. I don't know. I'm saying the solution to this issue is not so obvious.

Not only do they not fear death, they're actively seeking it. Their entire ideology is based on provoking a boots-on-the-ground Western intervention; they believe that the "armies of Rome" will confront of the armies of the "caliphate" at Dabiq, in Syria, and that will trigger the start of the apocalypse. They are actively trying to provoke what they think will be the end of the world. This world means nothing to them - it's pure insanity.

I do wonder, though, if a ground intervention in Syria took place, a battle went down at Dabiq, and not only did the world not end but they also got their arses handed to them - what would happen then? How would they rationalise that one away?

A Primal Nut · 14-11-2015 08:42PM

Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »

But there is likewise a rise in white supremacy and indigenous right wing support in Europe...Anders Breivik and the assailant at the school in Sweden last month being cases in point....their children and grandchildren and admirers may harbour extremist views into the future. What are we supposed to do? Expel or imprison whole swathes of various types of people to try and prevent psychopaths wreaking havoc in civilised society?

There must be a better way.

We can't expel them once they are here, that's the problem, but we can reject them in the first place.

I'd be in favor of blocking white supremacists and people from extremist Christian groups as well.

Once they get in, then they are here forever, kids, grandchildren, etc.

Ace2007 · 14-11-2015 08:42PM

rolliepoley wrote: »

I'm not bother by what some of these idiots say i'm just showing people what the world is seeing and reading at the moment.

What the world are seeing and reading at the moment though is based off what the media/government want them to see and react to.

There are terrorist attacks everyday day of the week in parts of the world which get no air time at all, but when it happens in the west - it's big news, every station goes into full commentary.

Look at FB for example - you can put up the French flag, what about the lenience flag for the terrorist attacks there - No one cares.

Uncle Ben · 14-11-2015 08:42PM

XR3i wrote: »

berlin could be next

Doubt it. Their best friend lives there.

fr336 · 14-11-2015 08:43PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

The majority of the refugees are running for their lives, trying to escape death, and your attitude is simple, i don't give a f**K about you - stay in your own country.

I doubt they think this. They merely don't want to be essentially invaded by a group of people some whom may already be terrorists or liable to be turned that way. You clearly don't value the culture and values of the west very much - what our ancestors fought to protect. Let's go to caveman mentality and a free for all eh? Everyone doing whatever they want, whenever they want, wherever they want. Lovely.

IrishTrajan · 14-11-2015 08:43PM

Tasden wrote: »

How quick people are to forget the outrage they expressed at the poor little boy washed up on a beach. But when the terror is closer to home they suddenly don't care all that much about those who are also trying to get away from it. Some absolutely horrible comments on this thread.

You mean the little boy whose father was driving the boat? The little boy whose father put his life at risk?

NomadicGray · 14-11-2015 08:44PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Don't forget to read the comments to get an idea of the type of people watching and agreeing with it!

I believe its made by, & promoted by, posters of 4chan with the idea it will create as much Islamophobia as possible. Thats not to see it contains anything thats not factual, but its important to note its origin

RobertKK · 14-11-2015 08:44PM

Custardpi wrote: »

How far would you go with that appeasement approach (make no mistake that's exactly what it is)? Should the Satanic Verses have been banned to avoid offending their sensitivities? Bending the knee to religious fascism will ultimately do far more harm than Charlie Hebdo's cartoons could ever have done. As long as they are publishing at all that is a victory for free speech & a tribute to their bravery.

I am not calling for appeasement, just if you annoy someone enough you have to be prepared for a response. The people at Charlie Hebdo were naive as their security was so poor, it is not as if we didn't know how extreme some of these terrorists are.

You might think having to live your life in hiding as a victory, it is moral victory that they still publish but they have to operate like an illegal organisation for their safety.
Now Paris is at a center of a war.

TommyKnocker · 14-11-2015 08:45PM

c_man wrote: »

Not sure why people have a problem with passports being found. Do ye think everything around a suicide bomber vaporises or something?

No, but I also find it strange. You are going out to commit a suicide attack or an attack that will most likely result in your death, so how does a passport make it onto your checklist of things to carry with you? It not as if you are a law abiding citizen looking to do your civic duty now, is it?

So check list. AK47 check. Extra magazines, check. explosive vest, check. Detonator, check. Passport...

Just seems strange to me.

Also I imagine a suicide bomber is pretty unrecognisable after they detonate their vest, so it seems strange how quickly it was reported that the owner of the passport was a refugee.

fr336 · 14-11-2015 08:46PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

There are terrorist attacks everyday day of the week in parts of the world which get no air time at all, but when it happens in the west - it's big news, every station goes into full commentary.

Because such countries tend to be stuck in the stone age. The west went away from that quite a while ago, and on top of that wanted to welcome anyone who wished to be a part of that. Turns out such people want to attack us. Maybe you should go live in a stoneage country, you don't seem to see any difference between them and the west.

Stinicker · 14-11-2015 08:46PM

Carnacalla wrote: »

With a move away from religious dependence in most countries in the world, will the long-term effect be a weakening in the endless supply of Muslim terrorist groups. A key in reducing the dependence on religion is economic prosperity, and with oil riches in this country, there's plenty of scope to allow the riches to be spread along the local populace. Main barrier is corruption though, so maybe we should focus on combating corruption in these countries as a long term goal for reducing terrorism?

Saudi Arabia and most of the Gulf, U.A.E, Bahrain, Qatar are all loaded with money yet their people behave like savages from the 6th century. It from these areas which Islamic state are funded also btw. Look at how they treat Gay people and women, and most despicable of all is how they treat migrant workers particularly Indians and Filipinos. Economic Prosperity for Muslim countries only allow them to behave even worse and treat those around them like dirt.

I find Muslims hypocritical because a few years ago I flew Etihad to Bangkok and there were a few arab lads sitting around me on the plane (from Abu Dhabi) dressed in traditional costume and I figured they were holy men, a few hours later that evening in Bangkok I saw the same lads again this time dressed in Western clothes feeling up hookers in the Bangkok Red Light District which was right where I'd booked my hotel

before flying down to the islands two days later.

Islam is totally incompatible with our way of life and alot of Muslims are total hypocrites especially those with Money in the Gulf, particularly in Dubai. Google "Dubai porta potty" (NSFW). What I'm basically trying to say is that economic prosperity and wealth doesn't reduce Islam it only serves to strengthen it and the absolute unethical disgraceful behaviour of Islamic businesses towards migrants and the hypocritical perversion of a minority of Muslim "believers".

IrishTrajan · 14-11-2015 08:46PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

What the world are seeing and reading at the moment though is based off what the media/government want them to see and react to.

There are terrorist attacks everyday day of the week in parts of the world which get no air time at all, but when it happens in the west - it's big news, every station goes into full commentary.

Look at FB for example - you can put up the French flag, what about the lenience flag for the terrorist attacks there - No one cares.

Stop pretending like you cared about the bombings in the rest of the world before this happened. You were likely just as ignorant as the majority about the goings on in Lebanon, or Turkey, or Kuwait. This "what about them?!" faux-outrage is nonsensical.

An outrage in one country does not somehow negate the anger felt at an attack directed against us. It doesn't lessen the importance of this attack. This was directed against us, against our entire way of life and our ideals. Of course it's going to get more air time, because this is us. It can't be hidden from, its impact is going to be felt in Europe.

ihatemyfish · 14-11-2015 08:47PM

Augme wrote: »

Can we not just deport you instead?

Where will you deport native Europeans who are scared and fed up of mass immigration from the developing world? Instead of radically changing the demographics of Europe, perhaps you open borders folk could radically change your current demographics and leave instead?

mfceiling · 14-11-2015 08:47PM

it's only a matter of time before some headcase goes to a mosque or a muslim area and shoots or blows up all around him.
It'll put the sh *ts up the muslim population and it will send the ISIS nut jobs into overdrive.

nxbyveromdwjpg · 14-11-2015 08:49PM

Facekicking 2 The Future wrote: »

I've been reading about ISIS main aim:

These people do not fear death. I'm not saying a clear cut no holds barred approach is right or wrong. I don't know. I'm saying the solution to this issue is not so obvious.

Not only do they not fear death, they're actively seeking it. Their entire ideology is based on provoking a boots-on-the-ground Western intervention; they believe that the "armies of Rome" will confront of the armies of the "caliphate" at Dabiq, in Syria, and that will trigger the start of the apocalypse. They are actively trying to provoke what they think will be the end of the world. This world means nothing to them - it's pure insanity.

I do wonder, though, if a ground intervention in Syria took place, a battle went down at Dabiq, and not only did the world not end but they also got their arses handed to them - what would happen then? How would they rationalise that one away?

They'd just come back again.

If ISIS ever were able to be located and properly identified like a conventional army force, it would definitely be better to just wipe them out completely.

Not much room for negotiation with those lads.

Fr_Dougal · 14-11-2015 08:50PM

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

I see loads of muslims every day with full on head to toe veils, how were there left into this country.
We need to start deporting en masse, but that will never happen and we will see attacks here too.
Write to all td's and tell them we do not want islamic immigration into this country.

:rolleyes:

And where would you deport Muslims that were born and raised in Ireland?

Not a very clever post, now is it? :rolleyes:

XR3i · 14-11-2015 08:50PM

Uncle Ben wrote: »

Doubt it. Their best friend lives there.

i hope you're right

but i have a bad feeling in my bones

spent some time there recently

freddiek · 14-11-2015 08:50PM

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

Islam is a cancer and islamic immigration has caused problems in every single western country where it is allowed.

i know this is After Hours but Mods, do decent people have to put up with this crap??

namloc1980 · 14-11-2015 08:50PM

Ace2007 wrote: »

So because a very very very very very small % of people that came have attacked Paris, you think Ireland and the rest of the world should close its borders and say no you can't come in?

Can i ask - do we then stop holiday markers coming to this country - just in case they are ISIS members who have gone below the radar - after all one of the attackers was a 30 year old french citizen?

The majority of the refugees are running for their lives, trying to escape death, and your attitude is simple, i don't give a f**K about you - stay in your own country.

Point out anyone who said "stay in your own country".

The thing is these people were safe in Turkey as refugees. They didn't need to run to Europe for their lives as you put it. The minute they decided they wanted to get to Germany, Sweden etc they became migrants. We have processes for dealing with migrants and asylum seekers but the politicians decided to through all that out the window and open the borders en mass - Frau Merkel I'm looking at you.

Anyone who questioned this policy or suggested we needed to be careful who we let in, was shouted down by the bleeding heart right on crowd as a racist and xenophobic scare monger.

And now look where we are. No idea who we've left in or what terror threat they pose.

c_man · 14-11-2015 08:51PM

TommyKnocker wrote: »

Also I imagine a suicide bomber is pretty unrecognisable after they detonate their vest, so it seems strange how quickly it was reported that the owner of the passport was a refugee.

I wouldn't recommend it but if you've curious the likes of liveleak have plenty of footage of the aftermath of suicide bombs and the bombers. Depending on where the explosives were, there's no reason why the head/face etc wouldn't be identifiable.

RobertKK · 14-11-2015 08:52PM

IrishTrajan wrote: »

Stop pretending like you cared about the bombings in the rest of the world before this happened. You were likely just as ignorant as the majority about the goings on in Lebanon, or Turkey, or Kuwait. This "what about them?!" faux-outrage is nonsensical.

An outrage in one country does not somehow negate the anger felt at an attack directed against us. It doesn't lessen the importance of this attack. This was directed against us, against our entire way of life and our ideals. Of course it's going to get more air time, because this is us. It can't be hidden from, its impact is going to be felt in Europe.

I agree, it is an attack on how we live in Europe. They went after sport, music and entertainment, things ordinary people enjoy.

Bannasidhe · 14-11-2015 08:52PM

namloc1980 wrote: »

Where you think they'd land? Two miles away?

Custardpi wrote: »

What are the alternative theories? A plant by Mossad?

darkpagandeath wrote: »

it would take hundreds of G to destroy a passport, It's small and condensed. Why do people have a hard time grasping this. Depending on the explosive used Nothing tends to vaporise.

Jeeze.

A person says they find something a bit too convenient and a tad suspicious in the thread where nuking a large geographical area or we will all be murdered in our beds is a recurrent theme and people lose their minds demanding I suddenly acquire the skills of a C.S.I. and provide them with answers.

If I knew the fecking answers I wouldn't be asking the questions now would I?

fr336 · 14-11-2015 08:52PM

Ever get the feeling that those who think all Muslims are linked to terrorism (do some maths) would probably be a terrorist if they were a Muslim i.e. thick as two short planks.

RoyalCelt · 14-11-2015 08:53PM

A Primal Nut wrote: »

We can't expel them once they are here, that's the problem, but we can reject them in the first place.

I'd be in favor of blocking white supremacists and people from extremist Christian groups as well.

Once they get in, then they are here forever, kids, grandchildren, etc.

Not if we change the laws. Extremists get dumped out in the Sahara desert. **** em. They take advantage of our lenient rules so we should change them.

Will all the sympathisers change their tune if they kill hundreds more in Rome, Madrid, London, Berlin etc?

Because as others have pointed out these guys want to die and they'll take as many with them as they can. I'd be shocked if there are not more major attacks in the next 12 months.

A Primal Nut · 14-11-2015 08:54PM

NomadicGray wrote: »

I believe its made by, & promoted by, posters of 4chan with the idea it will create as much Islamophobia as possible. Thats not to see it contains anything thats not factual, but its important to note its origin

So, there are just as many videos on the opposite side of the debate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvOnXh3NN9w

It's important both sides of the debate are presented. When the people on the pro-open borders side make a video, like the one above, presented as purely facts, when it's clearly mostly opinions particularly at the end; it's accepted. But if someone dares make one for the opposite of the debate they are dismissed as:

Right-wing - it's ok to be left-wing, but being right-wing completely invalidates any facts you present as Nodin regularly points out.
Having an agenda - not sure what that's supposed to mean or why it's a negative thing, the people who made the above pro-open borders video have an agenda. If you have a political opinion and make a video promoting that opinion, you have an agenda.

Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

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