Billy Walsh quits ** SEE MOD WARNING #643 BEFORE POSTING

Dodge · 28-10-2015 10:27AM

barney4001 wrote: »

Eamon Dunphy in Mondays Irish Star hit the nail on the head walsh shafted by the blazer brigade of the I A B A,Walsh managed to keep his focus and managed and prepare these teams brilliantly while having to deal so much nonsence and disruption behind the scenes,he is an outstanding individual one of the greatest or irish sports people ,That he has been treated so badly is an utter disgrace

Don't be listening to Dunphy on any topic. Never mind boxing. A sport he hasn't spoken about at all in the past.

I'm not saying he's wrong, but Dunphy's opinion is no more valid than any other punter here (and in fact less valid than a lot of people here as they know the game better than him)

Deise Vu · 28-10-2015 11:53AM

Dodge wrote: »

Don't be listening to Dunphy on any topic. Never mind boxing. A sport he hasn't spoken about at all in the past.

I'm not saying he's wrong, but Dunphy's opinion is no more valid than any other punter here (and in fact less valid than a lot of people here as they know the game better than him)

Also, what qualifies you to not be a blazer? Joe Christle and his two brothers were national champions. Fergal Carruth's brother is an Olympic champion, their dad,Austin, was his coach. Michael O'Reilly's coach is also on the board (which I think has only a half dozen members).

Who the hell would you have on the board? Dunphy is a broken record, a paid-up member of the elite inner circle that he pretends to despise.

efb · 28-10-2015 12:56PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

Also, what qualifies you to not be a blazer? Joe Christle and his two brothers were national champions. Fergal Carruth's brother is an Olympic champion, their dad,Austin, was his coach. Michael O'Reilly's coach is also on the board (which I think has only a half dozen members).

Who the hell would you have on the board? Dunphy is a broken record, a paid-up member of the elite inner circle that he pretends to despise.

Nepotism is a legitimate qualifier???

What qualifications had Fergal???

Strazdas · 28-10-2015 01:12PM

efb wrote: »

Nepotism is a legitimate qualifier???

What qualifications had Fergal???

Good question. Carruth seemed to have virtually nothing of note on his CV before becoming CEO of the IABA.

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 01:22PM

Strazdas wrote: »

Good question. Carruth seemed to have virtually nothing of note on his CV before becoming CEO of the IABA.

The position of CEO in Irish boxing does not seem to be the same as iin other sporting organisations. Instead of being your own man with a plan and a vision, you are merely a puppet of the board, it's tail wagging the dog in there. I doubt that if they got a serious candidate with a proven track record and a truckload of new ideas, he'd last more than a year working under the prevailing conditions. Amateurs still run the show and that won't change despite the interventions of government or Sports Council or Kofi Annan himself.

walshb · 28-10-2015 01:44PM

Strazdas wrote: »

Good question. Carruth seemed to have virtually nothing of note on his CV before becoming CEO of the IABA.

I had intended asking about the position of HP sports director. This seems to be what Billy wanted. Out of interest, is there a certain qualification level as regards education/business that must be met before this title can be conferred on person wanting to be HP sports director?

BTW, do we have inside info on Fergal's CV or credentials?

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 01:53PM

walshb wrote: »

I had intended asking about the position of HP sports director. This seems to be what Billy wanted. Out of interest, is there a certain qualification level as regards education/business that must be met before this title can be conferred on person wanting to be HP sports director?

BTW, do we have inside info on Fergal's CV or credentials?

I suppose they're going on his Linkedin page, doesn't seem to be a wealth of experience listed there which would be strange if he was leaving stuff off.

Billy wasn't aiming to be the HP director. He WAS the de facto director, that's the job he was doing (brilliantly to unanimous consensus). Zaur was the de facto head coach. The issue was he was not being recognised or paid for the position he was doing by this own employers, where the issue of lack of respect comes in. If you can't understand that much, there's not much hope really.

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 02:03PM

walshb wrote: »

I had intended asking about the position of HP sports director. This seems to be what Billy wanted. Out of interest, is there a certain qualification level as regards education/business that must be met before this title can be conferred on person wanting to be HP sports director?

BTW, do we have inside info on Fergal's CV or credentials?

Actually I don't think the IABA have ever publicly advertised for the HP director, so don't know what they're job requirements might be. But looking across the spectrum of the various sports, a HP director would desirably have a background or education in business or would tend to have worked their way up through a sporting organisation with a track record of success in their various guises.

walshb · 28-10-2015 02:06PM

Joe_ Public wrote: »

I suppose they're going on his Linkedin page, doesn't seem to be a wealth of experience listed there which would be strange if he was leaving stuff off.

Billy wasn't aiming to be the HP director. He WAS the de facto director, that's the job he was doing (brilliantly to unanimous consensus). Zaur was the de facto head coach. The issue was he was not being recognised or paid for the position he was doing by this own employers, where the issue of lack of respect comes in. If you can't understand that much, there's not much hope really.

I know what he was. For all intents and purposes he seemed to be doing the HP director job, or acting as the HP director.

I was asking if maybe he was not being given the recognition/pay due to a technicality in the rules/regulations concerning the term HP director?

Were the IABA getting a guy to do a certain job without having to compenaste him or recognise him as such? It may well be a gray area here.

There are many people in many organisations and business doing certain work that they are not getting recognised for or compensated for due to legal rules and policies in place.

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 02:16PM

walshb wrote: »

I know what he was. For all intents and purposes he seemed to be doing the HP director job, or acting as the HP director.

I was asking if maybe he was not being given the recognition/pay due to a technicality in the rules/regulations concerning the term HP director?

Were the IABA getting a guy to do a certain job without having to compenaste him or recognise him as such? It may well be a gray area here.

There are many people in many organisations and business doing certain work that they are not getting recognised for or compensated for due to legal rules and policies in place.

That's the job he was doing. They gave Zaur some ridiculous title like Head Tactical Coach or somesuch nonsense, just acting silly bggers, no other reason.

But I can't claim any expertise in employment law, so maybe somebody else is better placed to adjudge on this. However, I will say that there didn't seem to be any bar to Dominic O'Rourke being awarded the Director title when they tried to parachute him in a few years back, maybe he had some higher qualifications Billy didn't? The only thing I could see stopping it would be some kind of Sports Council statutes or guidelines, but I think we can safely rule out any contentious issues there!

Deise Vu · 28-10-2015 02:25PM

efb wrote: »

Nepotism is a legitimate qualifier???

What qualifications had Fergal???

I don't know what you mean by nepotism. Do the Carruths have a veto on the appointment of IABA directors? I was talking about people being brought up in boxing and having it's best interests at heart. They listed the board members in the Irish Times last week. I was expecting something like the FAI circa 1990. 50 Old farts who all knew each other socially and hadn't a clue about the sport but liked getting free tickets.

Instead there was a barrister who holds national titles, a coach of a World Championship bronze medallist, a solicitor, a business consultant and Fergal Carruth (whose background they didn't elaborate on) but his family background is, literally, gold-plated in boxing circles

To me it looks like a tight, professional, well balanced, extremely well educated group. Nothing like the bunch of yahoos that they are being portrayed by the lynch mob.

As disappointed as I am that Billy Walsh is leaving at this late stage before Rio, that board looks like it more than deserves a respectful hearing. On the other side we have Kieran Mulvey, who looks, acts and behaves like a grade A tosser. I am definitely waiting for the full story on this one.

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 02:26PM

walshb wrote: »

I know what he was. For all intents and purposes he seemed to be doing the HP director job, or acting as the HP director.

I was asking if maybe he was not being given the recognition/pay due to a technicality in the rules/regulations concerning the term HP director?

Were the IABA getting a guy to do a certain job without having to compenaste him or recognise him as such? It may well be a gray area here.

There are many people in many organisations and business doing certain work that they are not getting recognised for or compensated for due to legal rules and policies in place.

Out of curiosity, what sort of people would be doing work for organisations and businesses and not just not getting recognised for it, but not getting paid for it either? Is it fraudulent and are you trying to suggest that the IABA, in its relationship with Billy Walsh, might have been breaking the law?

Dodge · 28-10-2015 02:29PM

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Out of curiosity, what sort of people would be doing work for organisations and businesses and not just not getting recognised for it, but not getting paid for it either? Is it fraudulent and are you trying to suggest that the IABA, in its relationship with Billy Walsh, might have been breaking the law?

Pretty much every sporting body here relies on volunteers and for paid employees to be as flexible as possible.

Nothing fraudulent at all

walshb · 28-10-2015 02:29PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

On the other side we have Kieran Mulvey, who looks, acts and behaves like a grade A tosser. I am definitely waiting for the full story on this one.

Don't forget Michael Ring and his fake shock and disgust tactics!

efb · 28-10-2015 02:32PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

I don't know what you mean by nepotism. Do the Carruths have a veto on the appointment of IABA directors? I was talking about people being brought up in boxing and having it's best interests at heart. They listed the board members in the Irish Times last week. I was expecting something like the FAI circa 1990. 50 Old farts who all knew each other socially and hadn't a clue about the sport but liked getting free tickets.

Instead there was a barrister who holds national titles, a coach of a World Championship bronze medallist, a solicitor, a business consultant and Fergal Carruth (whose background they didn't elaborate on) but his family background is, literally, gold-plated in boxing circles

To me it looks like a tight, professional, well balanced, extremely well educated group. Nothing like the bunch of yahoos that they are being portrayed by the lynch mob.

As disappointed as I am that Billy Walsh is leaving at this late stage before Rio, that board looks like it more than deserves a respectful hearing. On the other side we have Kieran Mulvey, who looks, acts and behaves like a grade A tosser. I am definitely waiting for the full story on this one.

You describe respected IR negotiator a tosser????

From the reports to that he IABA board behaved far from professionally

And Fergal is OK to be CEO cos he's from a "boxing family"???

This isn't Eastenders Peggy!

Strazdas · 28-10-2015 02:41PM

walshb wrote: »

I had intended asking about the position of HP sports director. This seems to be what Billy wanted. Out of interest, is there a certain qualification level as regards education/business that must be met before this title can be conferred on person wanting to be HP sports director?

BTW, do we have inside info on Fergal's CV or credentials?

All I can find is that he has a business degree from an Institute of Technology. No mention of a wealth of experience in administration or management.

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 02:42PM

Dodge wrote: »

Pretty much every sporting body here relies on volunteers and for paid employees to be as flexible as possible.

Nothing fraudulent at all

Ok it didn't strike me that he was talking about volunteers, because I can't for the life of me see what that might have to do with the actual issue of Billy Walsh's employment details. But anyway...

Deise Vu · 28-10-2015 03:08PM

efb wrote: »

You describe respected IR negotiator a tosser????

From the reports to that he IABA board behaved far from professionally

And Fergal is OK to be CEO cos he's from a "boxing family"???

This isn't Eastenders Peggy!

You seem fixated on Carruth. Do you have some information that Fergal Carruth grew up oblivious to boxing? What about about Joe Christle or Michael O'Reilly's coach? Do these people not know anything about boxing either?

Kieran Mulvey's profession is teacher. He made a name for himself by bringing ASTI out on strike whenever there was a non-FF Govt in power and got his reputation as a mediator by not rocking the boat when FF were in power. He has, to my knowledge, no experience whatsoever in sport. Not in Boxing certainly. If I was drawing a picture of a bearded, self-satisfied champagne socialist, sucking on the public teat his face would be the first to come to mind. But you go ahead and see if you can jump on to the back of his high horse behind him. Its a free country Peggy!

efb · 28-10-2015 03:18PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

You seem fixated on Carruth. Do you have some information that Fergal Carruth grew up oblivious to boxing? What about about Joe Christle or Michael O'Reilly's coach? Do these people not know anything about boxing either?

Kieran Mulvey's profession is teacher. He made a name for himself by bringing ASTI out on strike whenever there was a non-FF Govt in power and got his reputation as a mediator by not rocking the boat when FF were in power. He has, to my knowledge, no experience whatsoever in sport. Not in Boxing certainly. If I was drawing a picture of a bearded, self-satisfied champagne socialist, sucking on the public teat his face would be the first to come to mind. But you go ahead and see if you can jump on to the back of his high horse behind him. Its a free country Peggy!

Having a familial knowledge of boxing does not a ceo make...

Mulvey's Resume looks for more impressive than Carruth's....

efb · 28-10-2015 03:21PM

efb wrote: »

Having a familial knowledge of boxing does not a ceo make...

Mulvey's Resume looks for more impressive than Carruth's....

Bless your little 'thanker' too... He's marvellous

Deise Vu · 28-10-2015 03:22PM

efb wrote: »

Having a familial knowledge of boxing does not a ceo make...

Mulvey's Resume looks for more impressive than Carruth's....

I will make one more attempt at getting you to answer the question I asked: What about the board as a whole versus a teacher?

efb · 28-10-2015 03:24PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

I will make one more attempt at getting you to answer the question I asked: What about the board as a whole versus a teacher?

He is more than a teacher he has years of IR negation behind him. He wasn't the only critical voice either.

I'll ask again, what makes Fergal Carrith qualified to be CEO of the IABA???

efb · 28-10-2015 03:27PM

http://m.rte.ie/sport/boxing/2015/1028/737912-live-iaba-oireachtas-billy-walsh/

RTE report on it

Deise Vu · 28-10-2015 03:31PM

efb wrote: »

He is more than a teacher he has years of IR negation behind him. He wasn't the only critical voice either.

I'll ask again, what makes Fergal Carrith qualified to be CEO of the IABA???

Does Fergal Carruth make all the decisions of the IABA?

What about the bloody board as a whole???? A barrister with national boxing titles, a respected coach, a managing partner of a solicitor firm, a business consultant. Do you think these people know less about boxing and corporate governance than a teacher who has no background in neither but has a long history of getting cushy Government sinecures?

Strazdas · 28-10-2015 03:31PM

efb wrote: »

Having a familial knowledge of boxing does not a ceo make...

Mulvey's Resume looks for more impressive than Carruth's....

Mulvey has been CEO of the Labour Relations Commission for over 20 years and is a highly respected figure.

efb · 28-10-2015 03:33PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

Does Fergal Carruth make all the decisions of the IABA?

What about the bloody board as a whole???? A barrister with national boxing titles, a respected coach, a managing partner of a solicitor firm, a business consultant. Do you think these people know less about boxing and corporate governance than a teacher who has no background in neither but has a long history of getting cushy Government sinecures?

Do u think the board behaved correctly??? I don't. You are making very serious allegations against Mulvey btw- that could get boards in trouble...

I take it you have proof of your slurs on Mulvey though???

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 03:34PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

Does Fergal Carruth make all the decisions of the IABA?

What about the bloody board as a whole???? A barrister with national boxing titles, a respected coach, a managing partner of a solicitor firm, a business consultant. Do you think these people know less about boxing and corporate governance than a teacher who has no background in neither but has a long history of getting cushy Government sinecures?

I don't think it's a bad thing to have a guy in that position who has no direct sporting background and so is less likely to be associated with any paritcular agenda or favour any one side. I do agree his handling of this situation hasn't been great and he has a bit to learn from it, but the persistent IABA agenda to attack Mulvey and the ISC as if they are the real villains of the piece here is a bit disingenuous and transparent. I don't think it's distracting anybody from where the real issues lie.

Des Fitzgerald, I assume, would fill a similar role on the IABA board, don't think he has any boxing background that I'm aware of, though I could be wrong.

efb · 28-10-2015 03:35PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

Does Fergal Carruth make all the decisions of the IABA?

What about the bloody board as a whole???? A barrister with national boxing titles, a respected coach, a managing partner of a solicitor firm, a business consultant. Do you think these people know less about boxing and corporate governance than a teacher who has no background in neither but has a long history of getting cushy Government sinecures?

I'm asking you is Fergal Carruth suitabily qualified as CEO of IABA - YES OR NO???

Strazdas · 28-10-2015 03:37PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

Does Fergal Carruth make all the decisions of the IABA?

What about the bloody board as a whole???? A barrister with national boxing titles, a respected coach, a managing partner of a solicitor firm, a business consultant. Do you think these people know less about boxing and corporate governance than a teacher who has no background in neither but has a long history of getting cushy Government sinecures?

Said board don't appear to have covered themselves in glory. They have lost the services of a world class coach (a man who said he had no desire to leave his position and wanted to stay). That strikes me as a catastrophic failure on their part.

Joe_ Public · 28-10-2015 03:37PM

Deise Vu wrote: »

Does Fergal Carruth make all the decisions of the IABA?

What about the bloody board as a whole???? A barrister with national boxing titles, a respected coach, a managing partner of a solicitor firm, a business consultant. Do you think these people know less about boxing and corporate governance than a teacher who has no background in neither but has a long history of getting cushy Government sinecures?

You've also touched on a point here that still utterly baffles me. Given that they are all such successful and sharp businessmen (no irony intended here), how is it those IABA men could have turned out to be such crap negotiators when trying to keep a coach they apparently didn't want to lose?

Billy Walsh quits ** SEE MOD WARNING #643 BEFORE POSTING

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