Giant Propel Advanced SL2 Sizing

Glencairin18 · 18-08-2015 10:18PM #1

Bought a (2015) size S Giant Propel Advanced SL2 in July as the giant dealer recommended that size as recommended by Giant . I'm 5'6" . Took it to a leading bike fitter and the bike is too big !!!
The height of the integrated seat post will do a 5'9"/5'10" the way it is !
Giant or Dealer do not want to know !!
Bike was only put together and took to fitters , never cycled .
Any advice here ? Anyone had trouble with a Propel sizing ?

ricardospeedo · 18-08-2015 10:29PM

Glencairin18 wrote: »

Bought a (2015) size S Giant Propel Advanced SL2 in July as the giant dealer recommended that size as recommended by Giant . I'm 5'6" . Took it to a leading bike fitter and the bike is too big !!!
The height of the integrated seat post will do a 5'9"/5'10" the way it is !
Giant or Dealer do not want to know !!
Bike was only put together and took to fitters , never cycled .
Any advice here ? Anyone had trouble with a Propel sizing ?

Having bought a small propel I understand your dilemma .The top tube is approx 54cm ctc and the small propel does not equate to a small tcr which has a virtual top tube of 52cm.

The sizing on the propels are definetly not right when comparing most other bikes and I would say you would have to be 5 foot nine to make it work properly .

Glencairin18 · 18-08-2015 10:41PM

ricardospeedo wrote: »

Having bought a small propel I understand your dilemma .The top tube is approx 54cm ctc and the small propel does not equate to a small tcr which has a virtual top tube of 52cm.

The sizing on the propels are definetly not right when comparing most other bikes and I would say you would have to be 5 foot nine to make it work properly .

Yes I had a TCR size S and had no problems !
They definitely have this one got wrong ?!!

eeeee · 18-08-2015 10:48PM

Moved to main forum as it appears you're after advice. If you want to sell the bike I can move it back to adverts where that charter will apply.

jon1981 · 18-08-2015 11:03PM

Have you asked the store if they'd swap it for another brand or model

shaka · 18-08-2015 11:03PM

Lbs advised anyone buying to go down one size , I'm 5 11 and size I'd of needed was S. The next frame up had me too stretched out (lumbar disc issues ).

What was the dealers reply when you went back to him ?

Glencairin18 · 18-08-2015 11:15PM

jon1981 wrote: »

Have you asked the store if they'd swap it for another brand or model

No , I might know more tomorrow hopefully

Glencairin18 · 18-08-2015 11:17PM

shaka wrote: »

Lbs advised anyone buying to go down one size , I'm 5 11 and size I'd of needed was S. The next frame up had me too stretched out (lumbar disc issues ).

What was the dealers reply when you went back to him ?

Dealer won't take it back and is leaving it in Giants hands and they are saying no as well.

Glencairin18 · 18-08-2015 11:19PM

jon1981 wrote: »

Have you asked the store if they'd swap it for another brand or model

I did suggest another frame but Dealer is saying that it's Giants decision .

Glencairin18 · 19-08-2015 07:24AM

jon1981 wrote: »

Have you asked the store if they'd swap it for another brand or model

They are not budging

jon1981 · 19-08-2015 09:04AM

Thats poor form. Given that the LBS doesn't stock all bikes and sizes therefore you cannot try the bike for size in the store, there should be some comeback in the event the bike is ordered but doesn't fit.

I presume the sales of good act here applies? Something about entitlement to a refund or exchange at least? I assume the LBS made the judgement of the size and advised you it was the size for you, which turns out is not the case?

Leroy42 · 19-08-2015 09:07AM

Well, if the bike is too big then you need to replace it. If the LBS is unwilling to be of help then you may need to sell it privately, but make sure you tell all your cycling buddies, this thread, etc that the LBS, refused to help you out.

This local knowledge and help is supposed to be the USP of the LBS, but it appears that this one seems intent on screwing you over. They could very easily work with Giant to move on the bike without too much fuss (and nobody losing any money) and replace it with a proper sized one.

Very short sighted by the LBS to be so unhelpful. I actually cannot fathom how the LBS thinks this is an issue that he should not resolve.

BTW, you bought the bike from the dealer, not Giant. The LBS is making the decision. Whether they get any help from Giant is not your issue.

TBH, if the LBS relied solely on the Giant rep for a sizing guide then I would question whether they have any knowledge of cycling at all. These things are all guidelines and I know my LBS has (or at least pretends to have) knowledge of the workings of different frames.groupsets etc as they have dealt with them before and have the feedback

jon1981 · 19-08-2015 09:09AM

Indeed, i'm in the market for a new bike and I am relying on the LBS to help me pick the right fit. I want to stay clear of this place if this is how they treat buyers, and you're spending a good few pennies!

DirkVoodoo · 19-08-2015 09:47AM

Not sure what route you can go down, but if the sizing of the Propel is that different to the TCR, then I'd really be pointing out to the dealer that Giant's sizing charts are incorrect and use the same guide for TCR and Propel.

They recommend 5'4" to 5'9" for a Small.

jon1981 · 19-08-2015 10:02AM

OP, out of interest was it possible to shorten the stem or change the seat post to get it to fit? Some seat posts are set back a couple of cm.

vs

DirkVoodoo · 19-08-2015 10:17AM

Propel advanced SL2 has an integrated seatpost.

And he said he went for a bike fit, which didn't resolve the issue.

Glencairin18 · 19-08-2015 02:02PM

jon1981 wrote: »

Thats poor form. Given that the LBS doesn't stock all bikes and sizes therefore you cannot try the bike for size in the store, there should be some comeback in the event the bike is ordered but doesn't fit.

I presume the sales of good act here applies? Something about entitlement to a refund or exchange at least? I assume the LBS made the judgement of the size and advised you it was the size for you, which turns out is not the case?

LBS ?? Sales of Goods , I'll check it out ! Dealer made judgement on size , yes !
Dealer now says Giant Rep says to go to the Giant Store in Cork to get fitted on my own expense ! The Edge in Cork already told me the bike is too big !!

Glencairin18 · 19-08-2015 02:04PM

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Not sure what route you can go down, but if the sizing of the Propel is that different to the TCR, then I'd really be pointing out to the dealer that Giant's sizing charts are incorrect and use the same guide for TCR and Propel.

They recommend 5'4" to 5'9" for a Small.

I pointed out that but it's falling on deaf ears with the dealer and Giant Rep !

Glencairin18 · 19-08-2015 02:06PM

jon1981 wrote: »

Have you asked the store if they'd swap it for another brand or model

Yes but no joy with them and the Giant Rep .

jon1981 · 19-08-2015 02:09PM

Glencairin18 wrote: »

LBS ?? Sales of Goods , I'll check it out ! Dealer made judgement on size , yes !
Dealer now says Giant Rep says to go to the Giant Store in Cork to get fitted on my own expense ! The Edge in Cork already told me the bike is too big !!

Stand your ground, explain that you're paying them for their expertise , not just the bike, it's their job to advise the best bike for you and it's not good enough. Explain that they have a responsibility to ensure the bike is fit for purpose.

I don't know where you are located but there is a store in Dublin - http://www.giant-dublin.ie/en-IE/ ... why not there? Also why can't they take the advice from Giant and manage you as their customer.

Leroy42 · 19-08-2015 02:12PM

The LBS is being a dick, there are no two ways about it.

They recommended the size, sold it to you, and pocketed the profit. Now they want you to sort out the mess.

It's really simple to solve. LBS rings giant saying they made a bit of a mistake but the bike is hardly used so can easily be sold as ex-display. Can Ginat sent them a better fitting bike to allow the customer to be happy and they both will take a small hit on the profit they would have made.

If the LBS is good (all signs point to it isn't) then shifting on a ex-display model won't be particularly difficult.

Go back to the LBS and demand that they resolve the situation. It has nothing to do with you and Giant. The contract of sale is between you and the LBS. Mention the small claim court and you will gong to the Commission of Consumer affairs.

I have no issue with the LBS making a mistake on the sizing, plenty of things can and do go wrong with products, its how they are dealt with that makes the difference.

DirkVoodoo · 19-08-2015 02:16PM

ricardospeedo wrote: »

Having bought a small propel I understand your dilemma .The top tube is approx 54cm ctc and the small propel does not equate to a small tcr which has a virtual top tube of 52cm.

Just had a look at the geometry charts. Can you explain where you got this from?

Effective top tube length

Medium TCR: 555mm
Medium Propel: 555mm
Small TCR: 535mm
Small Propel: 535mm

I had a medium TCR with stock 100mm stem and it was a little short for me, I'm 177cm with a 71.1cm saddle height, can't remember reach off top of my head. By this, a Medium propel should fit me perfectly.

OP, did the bike fitter make a recommendation to cut the post or did he just size you on it as it is??

jon1981 · 19-08-2015 02:22PM

http://www.giant-bicycles.com/_pdf/bikes/uk/giantbicycles-77270-propel.advanced.pro.2.pdf
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/_pdf/bikes/uk/giantbicycles-77276-tcr.advanced.sl.2.pdf

The small TCR has 46.5cm in brackets beside the size and the small propel has 50cm. what does this mean? Is virtually the small propel larger than the TCR? I mean they both have 53.5cm top tubes so assuming the angles are vastly difference.

DirkVoodoo · 19-08-2015 02:37PM

jon1981 wrote: »

http://www.giant-bicycles.com/_pdf/bikes/uk/giantbicycles-77270-propel.advanced.pro.2.pdf
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/_pdf/bikes/uk/giantbicycles-77276-tcr.advanced.sl.2.pdf

The small TCR has 46.5cm in brackets beside the size and the small propel has 50cm. what does this mean? Is virtually the small propel larger than the TCR? I mean they both have 53.5cm top tubes so assuming the angles are vastly difference.

Manufacturers traditionally give the seat tube measurement.

The TCR has a sloping (compact) frame that Giant prefer. They ditched this for the Propel to reduce front area, so it has a traditional horizontal top tube. The sizing will be the same, just the standover height and seat tube length will be different.

Just my interpretation, may be incorrect!

oconnpad · 19-08-2015 02:55PM

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Manufacturers traditionally give the seat tube measurement.

The TCR has a sloping (compact) frame that Giant prefer. They ditched this for the Propel to reduce front area, so it has a traditional horizontal top tube. The sizing will be the same, just the standover height and seat tube length will be different.

Just my interpretation, may be incorrect!

Yeah i thought that as well.

Using the Stack and Reach numbers are the best way to compare bikes i thought.

I suppose the issue comes up if someone thinks they are say a 50cm frame, that mean they'd be on a small propel and a medium TCR and when you compare those numbers you'd see the TCR is too big.

For OP, sorry to hear about this mess for you.
Would this not fall under consumer law that bike is not fit for purpose?
# Goods must be fit for their purpose – they must do what they are reasonably expected to do.

Glencairin18 · 19-08-2015 06:29PM

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Just had a look at the geometry charts. Can you explain where you got this from?

Effective top tube length

Medium TCR: 555mm
Medium Propel: 555mm
Small TCR: 535mm
Small Propel: 535mm

I had a medium TCR with stock 100mm stem and it was a little short for me, I'm 177cm with a 71.1cm saddle height, can't remember reach off top of my head. By this, a Medium propel should fit me perfectly.

OP, did the bike fitter make a recommendation to cut the post or did he just size you on it as it is??

The bike fitter took approximately took 48mm off the seat post but still at that it will still fit a 5'9" / 5'10" rider .

iwillhtfu · 19-08-2015 07:22PM

Glencairin18 wrote: »

The bike fitter took approximately took 48mm off the seat post but still at that it will still fit a 5'9" / 5'10" rider .

Ahh.. if he's already cut the seat post that's an entirely different matter tbh.

I'd be very suprised if you get any joy from them.

Surely the fitter had an idea before he took out the hack saw?

Glencairin18 · 19-08-2015 08:33PM

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Ahh.. if he's already cut the seat post that's an entirely different matter tbh.

I'd be very suprised if you get any joy from them.

Surely the fitter had an idea before he took out the hack saw?

Yes but Well , as I said earlier I was advised to go down a size to XL from my normal size if I was buying a propel , which is S and the dealer said NO, a size S in a propel is your size which Giant recommend . This dealer does not do fitting . The bike as it is , cut will still do a rider of 5'9"/5'10" . I told the dealer I don't want my money back and I would take a different frame of the same value but no he won't do that .
Even as it is unridden and yes , cut , Giant would still have a client for this be it sponsorship or sell on .

iwillhtfu · 19-08-2015 08:39PM

I feel your pain but I'd guess they're only sales men and the size "guide" is just that a guide not a guarantee of fitment

I'm 5'10 but my torso is longer than average therefore I take those guides with a pinch of salt.

Hopefully you get some good will but as far as selling on would you buy a frame that's been built up then fitted to someone (including cutting) and then taken apart again. I would myself but I'd want it heavily discounted.

shaka · 19-08-2015 09:28PM

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Ahh.. if he's already cut the seat post that's an entirely different matter tbh.

I'd be very suprised if you get any joy from them.

Surely the fitter had an idea before he took out the hack saw?

+1 on that one your lbs/rep isn't likely to do much after the seatpost has been cut.
Surely someone doing a proper bike fit would know prior to cutting the seat-post could they sort out your bike fit

oakley2097 · 19-08-2015 09:40PM

I'm 5'10' and I just got a medium propel advance and the reach is just perfect

How much have you cycled it ? what is wrong with the fit ?

Giant Propel Advanced SL2 Sizing

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