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DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread
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Yep I'm on for a LSR and tea on 8/8 also good for me PJD.
Did my 6 miles easy last night and the same tonight but the route in reverse and did this one without looking at the garmin but brought it with me so that I could see splits after
Tues
with Garmin avg pace 11.09
mile 1 10.53 (downhill)
mile 2 11.02
mile 3 11.01
mile 4 11.24 (incline)
mile 5 11.33 (incline)
mile 6 11.03
Wed
Same route but in reverse and no garmin avg pace 10.57 ( a little faster than what I am supposed to do)
mile 1 10.44
mile 2 10.48 (downhill)
mile 3 11.00 (downhill)
mile 4 10.52
mile 5 10.58
mile 6 11.16 (incline)
Happy enough with that I think (unless DG tells me otherwise) easy pace should be 11.05 - 11.51 with my marathon pace at 10.18.
I am sooooooo excited for my rest day tomorrow, what on earth am I going to do !!!
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Great stuff PJD . Can I suggest that you make it two groups to accommodate the different plans? Perhaps one group for the 14mile boards plan and another for the 12 mile HHN1?
There is generally one rule for these types of run i.e., no one runs alone. Within these groups I imagine there will be different paces so I'll be happy to volunteer to stay with anyone struggling in the 12 mile group in such a case. Maybe another boardsie or two would be able to do the same for the 14 mile group?[/QUOTE]
I'd be happy to jump in from around mile 7, ( isn't that when the fun starts
) but no doubt there'll be a few more experienced boardies around too.0 -
This Fat Girl Runs wrote: »I'll have to give the group run on the 8th a miss as I'll be in Sweden on holiday
Ah, poor old you....
(I'm heading the same direction mid-August) 0 -
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Just came across this thread - great stuff and plenty of motivation.
I've just signed up to DCM - it'll be my second marathon. I did Belfast last year in the wind and rain in 3:59:24 (how's that for 4 hour pacing!!). I've been running a fair bit since and did a park run in 21:06 a few weeks ago.
When I did Belfast I followed a 16 week plan but not religiously - in fact, very badly. I missed a lot of runs and didn't care for pacing at all - I was aiming for 4 hours all along so following the great advice here I should have been completing my LSRs at around 10 minute miles (or slower). However I remember completing an 18 mile run in an average of 8:22 and thinking I was Clarke Kent himself. My shorter runs (4 - 7 miles) were often well inside 7:30 and my mid runs were mostly around the 8 minute mark. In hindsight I was very badly prepared.
With an extra 1 on my age and that extra bit of wisdom, I'm aiming at a 3:30 finish and have started a training plan accordingly. However I'm not sure it tallies with the advice here on pacing and wouldn't mind if someone would tell me either A) stop it now and adjust your plan; or
It's ok, there's different theories and your current plan is ok.
I'm following a plan on the runkeeper app on my phone created by a fella called Jeff Gaudette. Below is an extract from the plan for next week:
Monday - 7 miles slow (08:30 - 09:00 min/mile) with 5 95% 20 sec intervals after the 7 miles (2:00 recovery between each one)
Tuesday - 4 miles slow (08:30 - 09:00 min/mile)
Wednesday - 2 miles slow, 2 x 3 mile fast interval (07:15 - 07:30 per mile) with 3 min recovery in between, and 1 mile slow cool down (is this a tempo run??)
Thursday - Rest
Friday - 1 mile slow, 4 miles steady (07:40 - 08:10 per mile), and 1 mile slow cool down
Saturday - 12 miles steady (07:40 - 08:10 per mile)
Sunday - Rest
I've had no issues with the plan so far - I've comfortably completed all the runs with plenty left in the tank and could actually do with slowing down by about 20 seconds per mile across all runs. I'll get there! My issue is the long run on Saturdays - my target marathon pace for 3:30 is 8 mins per mile and even if I go to the slower end of the recommended pace on this plan, I'm still only 10 seconds slower than MP. Below is an extract about this from the creator of the plan:
<b><I>...this plan places runs on both weekend days, which will allow you to carry the fatigue of Friday's run into Saturday, which will simulate the latter stages of the marathon without having to run 20 miles first. However, in this program, you won't be so fatigued from Friday that you can't run fast at the end of the long run on Saturday, which will teach you how to burn fat while running marathon pace. This plan has two 18-milers and one 20-miler. All slow easy runs should be completed at 8:30 to 9:00 pace or slower if you are tired.</i></b>
Does this sound ok? Am I ok doing my longer runs closer to MP based on this logic? I hope so as I'm really enjoying the plan.
As an aside, I've just signed up for the Dam Busters Silent Valley half marathon on 22 August. It falls nicely in with my long run distance for that weekend and I'm hoping to get inside 1:40. Anyone else doing it?0 -
take_yer_points wrote: »Just came across this thread - great stuff and plenty of motivation.
I've just signed up to DCM - it'll be my second marathon. I did Belfast last year in the wind and rain in 3:59:24 (how's that for 4 hour pacing!!). I've been running a fair bit since and did a park run in 21:06 a few weeks ago.
When I did Belfast I followed a 16 week plan but not religiously - in fact, very badly. I missed a lot of runs and didn't care for pacing at all - I was aiming for 4 hours all along so following the great advice here I should have been completing my LSRs at around 10 minute miles (or slower). However I remember completing an 18 mile run in an average of 8:22 and thinking I was Clarke Kent himself. My shorter runs (4 - 7 miles) were often well inside 7:30 and my mid runs were mostly around the 8 minute mark. In hindsight I was very badly prepared.
With an extra 1 on my age and that extra bit of wisdom, I'm aiming at a 3:30 finish and have started a training plan accordingly. However I'm not sure it tallies with the advice here on pacing and wouldn't mind if someone would tell me either A) stop it now and adjust your plan; or It's ok, there's different theories and your current plan is ok.
I'm following a plan on the runkeeper app on my phone created by a fella called Jeff Gaudette. Below is an extract from the plan for next week:
Monday - 7 miles slow (08:30 - 09:00 min/mile) with 5 95% 20 sec intervals after the 7 miles (2:00 recovery between each one)
Tuesday - 4 miles slow (08:30 - 09:00 min/mile)
Wednesday - 2 miles slow, 2 x 3 mile fast interval (07:15 - 07:30 per mile) with 3 min recovery in between, and 1 mile slow cool down (is this a tempo run??)
Thursday - Rest
Friday - 1 mile slow, 4 miles steady (07:40 - 08:10 per mile), and 1 mile slow cool down
Saturday - 12 miles steady (07:40 - 08:10 per mile)
Sunday - Rest
I've had no issues with the plan so far - I've comfortably completed all the runs with plenty left in the tank and could actually do with slowing down by about 20 seconds per mile across all runs. I'll get there! My issue is the long run on Saturdays - my target marathon pace for 3:30 is 8 mins per mile and even if I go to the slower end of the recommended pace on this plan, I'm still only 10 seconds slower than MP. Below is an extract about this from the creator of the plan:
<b><I>...this plan places runs on both weekend days, which will allow you to carry the fatigue of Friday's run into Saturday, which will simulate the latter stages of the marathon without having to run 20 miles first. However, in this program, you won't be so fatigued from Friday that you can't run fast at the end of the long run on Saturday, which will teach you how to burn fat while running marathon pace. This plan has two 18-milers and one 20-miler. All slow easy runs should be completed at 8:30 to 9:00 pace or slower if you are tired.</i></b>
Does this sound ok? Am I ok doing my longer runs closer to MP based on this logic? I hope so as I'm really enjoying the plan.
As an aside, I've just signed up for the Dam Busters Silent Valley half marathon on 22 August. It falls nicely in with my long run distance for that weekend and I'm hoping to get inside 1:40. Anyone else doing it?
Hi TYP, well done on Belfast. Any day you hit your target is a good one!
I would make a couple of general comments on your plan as follows:- Definitely not a novice plan;
- Looks pretty intensive so big question will be if your body can hold up to get through it as it will only get tougher;
- Looks light on the long run side but presume the theory is that what you lose in straight endurance you make up in speed endurance via intensity;
- In the context of the above the paces look fine....IMO.
I am sure you will pick up some tips here but you might get more relevant information over on one of the Graduate threads from their experiences of going again and upping the intensity.0 -
Hi Take_yer_poînts and welcome You've over a solid year of running under your belt and would - IMO - be considered intermediate for the purpose of the Jeff Gaudette plan. I followed the Jeff sub 3:45 plan last year (like you, a bit loosely
) but would have benefitted from another cycle or two of endurance under my belt before attempting that - or the 3:30 - kind of plan. What this plan attempts to achieve is build enough strength/endurance with the back-to-backs and make MP feel slow with the faster-paced runs.
Choosing a plan is a personal thing and lots of factors need to be taken into consideration: lifestyle, work, other commitments, family, running background, experience etc. In addition, some of the elements of some plans might not gel with your particular set of circumstances or ability, for example the commitment to a lsr once a week. Breaking it down into two days might suit your lifestyle better. On boards, yes, we recommend the running long and running slow approach, but also recognise that there is more than one way to train for a a marathon.
Up to you if you think you have a solid enough endurance base for this approach, only you can tell how the last year has gone. Have you had a good balance of long runs and faster-paced work over the winter and summer season? Most importantly, have you been consistent?
If you decide to go ahead with this plan, please try to keep your paces hush
otherwise I will have a chorus of "but miiiiissss heee's doing his lsr's at MP!!!"
No harm in keeping your long slow runs at the very slow edge of the Gaudette range, even outside. Most importantly, listen to how your body is responding to the demands and adjust accordingly.
Best of luck!0 -
Hi TYP, well done on Belfast. Any day you hit your target is a good one!
I would make a couple of general comments on your plan as follows:- Definitely not a novice plan;
- Looks pretty intensive so big question will be if your body can hold up to get through it as it will only get tougher;
- Looks light on the long run side but presume the theory is that what you lose in straight endurance you make up in speed endurance via intensity;
- In the context of the above the paces look fine....IMO.
I am sure you will pick up some tips here but you might get more relevant information over on one of the Graduate threads from their experiences of going again and upping the intensity.
Thanks FBOT01 - I didn't realise there was a graduates thread, just noticed the novice DCM thread and jumped in with both feet. I'm not a regular round here but could be for the next few months now.
RE: the long runs, it's a 16 week plan with next week the fourth. So it increases as below (all at steady pace except week 15 which is slow). I only went as far as 20 miles once for Belfast so doing more this time.
As for the body holding up, only one way to find out. I'm feeling perfect so far and like I said in the initial post, I could actually do with slowing up a bit.
Week 4: 12 miles
Week 5: 13 miles (including 4 miles fast)
Week 6: 8 miles
Week 7: 14 miles (including 4 miles fast) - planning half marathon this week
Week 8: 16 miles (including 4 miles fast)
Week 9: 18 miles (including 5 miles fast)
Week 10: 10 miles
Week 11: 20 miles (including 5 miles fast)
Week 12: 14 miles - planning Belfast half marathon this week
Week 13: 20 miles (including 5 miles fast)
Week 14: 13 miles (including 4 miles fast)
Week 15: 6 miles0 -
Hi Take_yer_poînts and welcome You've over a solid year of running under your belt and would - IMO - be considered intermediate for the purpose of the Jeff Gaudette plan. I followed the Jeff sub 3:45 plan last year (like you, a bit loosely ) but would have benefitted from another cycle or two of endurance under my belt before attempting that - or the 3:30 - kind of plan. What this plan attempts to achieve is build enough strength/endurance with the back-to-backs and make MP feel slow with the faster-paced runs.
Choosing a plan is a personal thing and lots of factors need to be taken into consideration: lifestyle, work, other commitments, family, running background, experience etc. In addition, some of the elements of some plans might not gel with your particular set of circumstances or ability, for example the commitment to a lsr once a week. Breaking it down into two days might suit your lifestyle better. On boards, yes, we recommend the running long and running slow approach, but also recognise that there is more than one way to train for a a marathon.
Up to you if you think you have a solid enough endurance base for this approach, only you can tell how the last year has gone. Have you had a good balance of long runs and faster-paced work over the winter and summer season? Most importantly, have you been consistent?
If you decide to go ahead with this plan, please try to keep your paces hush otherwise I will have a chorus of "but miiiiissss heee's doing his lsr's at MP!!!"
No harm in keeping your long slow runs at the very slow edge of the Gaudette range, even outside. Most importantly, listen to how your body is responding to the demands and adjust accordingly.
Best of luck!
Thanks Dubgal, great work here! Really enjoying reading all the posts and advice.
I've kept running up a fair bit since around last September - mostly a 5 mile loop I can do round work at lunch time and since March/April have been including 8/10/12 mile runs around every other week at the weekend. Have been keeping busy with indoor soccer over the winter as well but knocked that on the head now. Consistent? I wouldn't think so, but definitely feel like I've a good base level to start this off on. For Belfast last year my day 1 week 1 run was 2.5 miles, so I'm definitely starting in a better place this time.
In terms of getting the runs done, I'm fairly flexible with work so can get a lot done at lunch time (which suits really well with the 1 year old twins at home!!). On most weeks I'll get around 3 runs done at work - that'll leave me with one evening run and a long run on Saturday mornings. I've got the nod of approval from my wife for that so hopefully it'll fit in well with work/life.
Good to hear from someone who's followed a similar plan. Looking forward to the weeks ahead now and keeping up to date with everyone's progress0 -
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