The US Think They Can Extradite Gary Davis

nxbyveromdwjpg · 15-07-2015 06:25PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Not their jurisdiction maybe ? The crimes being committed were not here.

For someone so thirsty to send someone off to face a life sentence in a foreign land you sure do have a lot of "maybe"s and "i imagine"s

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 06:28PM

nm wrote: »

For someone so thirsty to send someone off to face a life sentence in a foreign land you sure do have a lot of "maybe"s and "i imagine"s

What thirst ? If a person breaks the law they should be punished. Or should we not bother.

end of the road · 15-07-2015 06:30PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

A long time ago laws were put in place for cyber crime. If somebody facilitates a crime and that crosses into the US. They can seek to prosecute. It doesn't mean the Irish Government will allow the extradition but they could if the US can make a case for him breaking the law there.

doesn't matter. our law on our citizens trumps anyone elses

end of the road · 15-07-2015 06:32PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What's that got to do with this lad facilitating crime ?

what crime. murka claiming something doesn't make it true. infact, it probably makes it false

end of the road · 15-07-2015 06:35PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Why would Ireland throw it's toys out of the pram ? He's not been found guilty hence the request for an extradition to try him under law.

how would it be "throwing its toys out of the pram" . answer, it wouldn't. just protecting our jurisdiction from an empirialist nation

Eugene Norman · 15-07-2015 06:37PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

I would wager it's to do with Facilitation of crime and not just deleting forum posts. If the person involved was aware of crimes being committed they should have gone to the Garda.

You could be facilitating crime in another justification by criticising the prophet Mohammed.

If the criminal did his crime in person in a different country, and it's a crime here, then extradite him. Otherwise in terms of posts or criminality on the internet if it isn't a crime here no extradition, and if it is try it here.

end of the road · 15-07-2015 06:38PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What thirst ? If a person breaks the law they should be punished. Or should we not bother.

in cases where citizens will be extradited to america, yes

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 06:44PM

end of the road wrote: »

what crime. murka claiming something doesn't make it true. infact, it probably makes it false

:pac:

Eugene Norman wrote: »

You could be facilitating crime in another justification by criticising the prophet Mohammed.

If the criminal did his crime in person in a different country, and it's a crime here, then extradite him. Otherwise in terms of posts or criminality on the internet if it isn't a crime here no extradition, and if it is try it here.

Terrible example we have Blasphemy laws.

end of the road wrote: »

in cases where citizens will be extradited to america, yes

So only if it's America, Seems logical...

nxbyveromdwjpg · 15-07-2015 06:44PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What thirst ? If a person breaks the law they should be punished. Or should we not bother.

Who's law?

If the President of Iran decides tomorrow that boards.ie has broken their blasphemy law and wants to see a moderator here extradited to Iran to face the death sentence, are you still in full support?

I mean.. as you said, they probably have proof and there is probably a reason that we didn't prosecute here but sure what of it, that's enough for you.. ship em off right?

If not, why have you given America the divine right to preside it's laws over the world?

hatrickpatrick · 15-07-2015 06:44PM

Forget about the Aspergers or harsh sentencing debate for a second - as with Eric Eoin Marques and Kim Dotcom, I want to know in what crackpot universe the FBI believes that it has jurisdiction over the entire internet? The offenses were committed in Ireland. They violated US laws, but the US does not have jurisdiction over the internet as a whole and should never be allowed to claim that it does.

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 06:47PM

nm wrote: »

Who's law?

If the President of Iran decides tomorrow that boards.ie has broken their blasphemy law and wants to see a moderator here extradited to Iran to face the death sentence, are you still in full support?

I mean.. as you said, they probably have proof and there is probably a reason that we didn't prosecute here but sure what of it, that's enough for you.. ship em off right?

If not, why have you given America the divine right to preside it's laws over the world?

Nice hyperbole.

nxbyveromdwjpg · 15-07-2015 06:51PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Nice hyperbole.

Valid retort. Good job answering the questions and backing up your position.

/s

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 06:52PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Forget about the Aspergers or harsh sentencing debate for a second - as with Eric Eoin Marques and Kim Dotcom, I want to know in what crackpot universe the FBI believes that it has jurisdiction over the entire internet? The offenses were committed in Ireland. They violated US laws, but the US does not have jurisdiction over the internet as a whole and should never be allowed to claim that it does.

Most of the drugs sold on there would be illegal pretty much everywhere.

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 06:53PM

nm wrote: »

Valid retort. Good job answering the questions and backing up your position.

/s

Our legal system is deciding whether or not to send this guy to stand trial.

secman · 15-07-2015 06:58PM

Who would you like to play his character in the Movie ?

ohnonotgmail · 15-07-2015 06:59PM

nm wrote: »

For someone so thirsty to send someone off to face a life sentence in a foreign land you sure do have a lot of "maybe"s and "i imagine"s

nicely counteracted by the certainty of you and others.

SpaceSasqwatch · 15-07-2015 07:00PM

nm wrote: »

That winky face is pretty weird. Do you know something about that forum he allegedly moderated that the rest of the world and the US authorities do not?

the poster hasnt a fukking clue.

Eugene Norman · 15-07-2015 07:00PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

:pac:

Terrible example we have Blasphemy laws.

So only if it's America, Seems logical...

If you think that our blasphemy laws are anything like Iran etc you deluded.

Once again you fail to understand the point made to you. You don't seem to understand arguments to generality.

You said that we should extradite people who "facilitate crimes in another country". This would demand, logically, that we extradite to Iran (etc) both people on this site who criticise the prophet and the moderators who "facilitate" them.

The reasoned don't extradite to Iran is because it's jurisdiction does not run to here. Neither does the US although the U.S. thinks it does.

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 07:04PM

Eugene Norman wrote: »

If you think that our blasphemy laws are anything like Iran etc you deluded.

Once again you fail to understand the point made to you. You don't seem to understand arguments to generality.

You said that we should extradite people who "facilitate crimes in another country". This would demand, logically, that we extradite to Iran (etc) both people on this site who criticise the prophet and the moderators who "facilitate" them.

The reasoned don't extradite to Iran is because it's jurisdiction does not run to here. Neither does the US although the U.S. thinks it does.

You or me don't get to decide if they get extradited. The silk road is a tad different to mocking sky wizards. The stuff on there would be Illegal here, So it's only a question of does America has jurisdiction over this issue. And our courts are deciding that.

end of the road · 15-07-2015 07:40PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

You or me don't get to decide if they get extradited. The silk road is a tad different to mocking sky wizards. The stuff on there would be Illegal here, So it's only a question of does America has jurisdiction over this issue. And our courts are deciding that.

well they would want to decide that it doesn't to protect irelands jurisdiction

Yawns · 15-07-2015 07:47PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

The silk road is a tad different to mocking sky wizards..

Ok that line alone about sky wizards that you just typed. How about if a middle east country wanted to extradite you for it, so that you could stand trial for your blasphemy?

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 07:48PM

Yawns wrote: »

Ok that line alone about sky wizards that you just typed. How about if a middle east country wanted to extradite you for it, so that you could stand trial for your blasphemy?

I'm not posting on Middle eastern sites....

Timberrrrrrrr · 15-07-2015 07:59PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What thirst ? If a person breaks the law they should be punished. Or should we not bother.

So why don't America extradite people who are wanted for murder?

darkpagandeath · 15-07-2015 08:00PM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So why don't America extradite people who are wanted for murder?

One would have to ask them.

Wompa1 · 15-07-2015 08:09PM

Eugene Norman wrote: »

You are basically accepting that the U.S. has jurisdiction over the world/Internet in most circumstances.

They do and that's why there's a fevered race right now to get cabling put down which circumvents data going through data centers in the US. Like it or lump it, right now if you commit a crime and it goes through the Data centers there, they do have jurisdiction. This story seems to suggest it was all over non-American servers. So, it should be fine.

But I'd bet something went through the US.

Eugene Norman wrote: »

But not the reverse. I mean the U.S. is probably in violation of European laws every day.

So are you angry with the American government or the EU? It's up to the EU to rule itself.

end of the road · 15-07-2015 08:17PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

They do and that's why there's a fevered race right now to get cabling put down which circumvents data going through data centers in the US. Like it or lump it, right now if you commit a crime and it goes through the Data centers there, they do have jurisdiction. This story seems to suggest it was all over non-American servers. So, it should be fine.

But I'd bet something went through the US.

So are you angry with the American government or the EU? It's up to the EU to rule itself.

they have no jurisdiction

Wompa1 · 15-07-2015 08:18PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Forget about the Aspergers or harsh sentencing debate for a second - as with Eric Eoin Marques and Kim Dotcom, I want to know in what crackpot universe the FBI believes that it has jurisdiction over the entire internet? The offenses were committed in Ireland. They violated US laws, but the US does not have jurisdiction over the internet as a whole and should never be allowed to claim that it does.

Were the transactions completely based in data centers outside of the US? Did any data or money transfer into data centers in the US. Even for just routing back to Europe or where ever else?

If no, they don't have any jurisdiction. If transactions took place in the US, which you can be pretty sure they did. That's a different story, particularly if they facilitated a crime taking place in the US. The US would be well within their rights to request extradition based on that and then it's up to the Irish Government whether they accept the extradition request.

I don't see where the outrage is.

Wompa1 · 15-07-2015 08:41PM

end of the road wrote: »

they have no jurisdiction

To request that he's extradited? Why not?

dissed doc · 15-07-2015 09:01PM

Back in 2003 or 2004 Ireland approved some scantily publicised law allowing CIA and jurisdiction of the US in Ireland. I can't find the link on Google, but it definitely happened around 10 years ago. Basically, the US can operate and arrest people with impunity in Ireland if the need arises for things like this, from my (aging) memory. Nothing to do with Interpol or Europol or the approval for rendition flights, it predated all of that.

This became an issue indirectly, when as far back as 2007 the Irish government resisted attempts by the EU Parliament and IHRC to investigate the rendition flights properly. Gardai were instructed via political departments to not interfere with CIA run flights.

I would assume, as Ireland is effectively the legal bitch of the US and the social bitch of the UK, that this guy is going to be arrested and moved with little upset, unless there is something magical that has happened since the past decade. There was probably so much dirty money flowing between criminals and governments and contractors on Silk Road that he has no rights most likely to be kept in Ireland, as the the crimes were all in the US and Ireland is legally subject to whatever the US decides, despite the protestations.

They could try and extradite him, or, simply grab him on some street and dump him on a plane at Shannon (which is what would happen to the Wikileaks guy as well).

Eugene Norman · 15-07-2015 10:07PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

They do and that's why there's a fevered race right now to get cabling put down which circumvents data going through data centers in the US. Like it or lump it, right now if you commit a crime and it goes through the Data centers there, they do have jurisdiction. This story seems to suggest it was all over non-American servers. So, it should be fine.

But I'd bet something went through the US.

Apparantly you are ok with world police Team America. Empires always have slaves and hangers on.

So are you angry with the American government or the EU? It's up to the EU to rule itself.

Both. I'd like a European alliance with Russia and others to oppose American hegemony.

The US Think They Can Extradite Gary Davis

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