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Is UFC/Mixed Martial Arts fixed?

13»

Comments

  • #62
    pmasterson95
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,074 ✭✭✭pmasterson95


    Dana White and that ex Manchester City chairman run this business. Lets ignore McGregor and look at say Rousey. She earns them how many millions in revenue? If some unheard of woman has a chance of beating her do you think that they will risk Rousey loosing? She'll be perfectly safe at #1 until someone more profitable comes along. They wont let Rousey loose to someone unmarketable that will punish profit. McGregor is now the male marketing money cow. Why fight Aldo lastnight when you can get to hype a second Aldo vs. McGregor title fight for months. Nothing to do with bank balance at all at all. Granted that Chad fella can get his jaw smashed and nasty injuries happen sure, but it will never happen to one of the major attractions or earners. When McGregor gets #1 hes guaranteed safe until a new poster boy appears. Money is king.


  • #63
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,115 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Many people question the validity of the UFC as a legitimate competition.

    How in the name of muppetry is it not a legitimate competition? If anything man-to-man combat its the essence of competition.
    I guess one factor is the fact that it's effectively owned and run by one man, Dana White,

    Dana White does not own the UFC franchise.
    Zuffa, LLC is an American sports promotion company specializing in mixed martial arts. It was founded in January 2001 in Las Vegas, Nevada, by Station Casinos executives Frank Fertitta III and Lorenzo Fertitta to be the parent entity of the Ultimate Fighting Championship (UFC) after they purchased it from the Semaphore Entertainment Group. Lorenzo Fertitta is the company’s CEO and chairman while Dana White runs the day-to-day operations. Zuffa is co-owned by Fertitta brothers (40.5% each), Dana White (9%) and Flash Entertainment (10%).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuffa


  • #64
    Gatling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    How in the name of muppetry is it not a legitimate competition? If anything man-to-man combat its the essence of competition.



    Dana White does not own the UFC franchise.

    They believe only what they want to believe without putting up one piece of evidence to back up there claim .
    Oh i heard from a chap in a pub who's mate once watched a ufc at KFC and he heard it's yada yada yada .
    But it's others said it !
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #65
    zzfh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭zzfh


    Back when Lesnar was what Conor is now,UFC s cash cow,hyping up all the fights he was gold for Dana,just like Conor is now.

    Look back to Lesnar v Carwin..Lesnar was in the position Mendes was in last night at the finish for 30+ seconds without a ref even contemplating stopping it,he got pummeled for the remaining 2 mins iirc.

    Last night,sure Mendes was caught,he was in the same position as Lesnar got hit twice on the wrist and the ref couldnt get in quick enough to stop it.

    2 situations were very similar but 2 totally different outcomes.

    Decisions like this always seem to favour the money maker.

    not a begrudger,just a neutral fan.I do believe Conor will beat Aldo when they meet.


  • #66
    RedemptionZ
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,758 ✭✭✭RedemptionZ


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ah, so the match ups are arranged on the basis of money rather than merit.

    Thanks, we seem to be getting nearer each other at least.

    I said he prefers, not selects fights that will generate the most money. Merit is a matter of subjectivity. Get five hardcore fans and give them five names from a division and chances are there wouldn't be a unanimous decision.
    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    How in the name of muppetry is it not a legitimate competition? If anything man-to-man combat its the essence of competition.



    Dana White does not own the UFC franchise.

    The guy is talking out of his arse, thinks Dana White is a modern day Lex Luthor hell bent on controlling everything in the UFC. He knows all this despite not watching any of the UFC.


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  • #67
    RedemptionZ
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,758 ✭✭✭RedemptionZ


    Gatling wrote: »
    They believe only what they want to believe without putting up one piece of evidence to back up there claim .
    Oh i heard from a chap in a pub who's mate once watched a ufc at KFC and he heard it's yada yada yada .
    But it's others said it !

    It's weird how much knowledge they have of the sport and how in depth they know what goes on behind the scenes when they don't actually watch or have any interest in it!


  • #68
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    How in the name of muppetry is it not a legitimate competition? If anything man-to-man combat its the essence of competition...

    Ah come on, combat doesn't preclude the possibility that the outcomes are arranged. In fact it would be far easier to arrange than team sports or sports with multiple competitors.

    Are match ups arranged on the basis of what generates the most money? Surely that in itself would show that at the very least it's not a fair and open competition.


  • #69
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Deleted User wrote: »
    It's not my argument.

    Many people question the validity of the UFC as a legitimate competition.

    I guess one factor is the fact that it's effectively owned and run by one man, Dana White, who seems to do very well from the rise of McGregor. Like the McMahons and WWE. It's a question that has arisen in other sports that are effectively one persons business.

    They do?


  • #70
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    RedemptionZ wrote: »
    I said he prefers, not selects fights that will generate the most money...

    I'll dance on the head of that pin with you.

    Money "influences match ups", rather than "dictates outcomes". So money decides which 2 might be top of the pile, but doesn't decide amongst them. I'll accept that.


  • #71
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nodin wrote: »
    They do?

    Yep, Google is your friend.


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  • #72
    pmasterson95
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,074 ✭✭✭pmasterson95


    zzfh wrote: »
    Back when Lesnar was what Conor is now,UFC s cash cow,hyping up all the fights he was gold for Dana,just like Conor is now.

    Look back to Lesnar v Carwin..Lesnar was in the position Mendes was in last night at the finish for 30+ seconds without a ref even contemplating stopping it,he got pummeled for the remaining 2 mins iirc.

    Last night,sure Mendes was caught,he was in the same position as Lesnar got hit twice on the wrist and the ref couldnt get in quick enough to stop it.

    2 situations were very similar but 2 totally different outcomes.

    Decisions like this always seem to favour the money maker.

    not a begrudger,just a neutral fan.I do believe Conor will beat Aldo when they meet.

    Exactly if the big draw looses they loose a crap ton of money. The lower fighters fighting each other results are fair. When the big profit fighter is involved they wont loose.


  • #73
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    zzfh wrote: »
    Back when Lesnar was what Conor is now,UFC s cash cow,hyping up all the fights he was gold for Dana,just like Conor is now.

    Look back to Lesnar v Carwin..Lesnar was in the position Mendes was in last night at the finish for 30+ seconds without a ref even contemplating stopping it,he got pummeled for the remaining 2 mins iirc.

    Last night,sure Mendes was caught,he was in the same position as Lesnar got hit twice on the wrist and the ref couldnt get in quick enough to stop it.

    2 situations were very similar but 2 totally different outcomes.

    Decisions like this always seem to favour the money maker.

    not a begrudger,just a neutral fan.I do believe Conor will beat Aldo when they meet.

    Again, interesting to hear someone who follows the sport conclude that decisions follow the money maker. Some posters seem appalled to hear this suggested and apparently think I'm the only one who does so!


  • #74
    darced
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,056 ✭✭✭darced


    This post has been deleted.


  • #75
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    It's not my argument.

    Many people question the validity of the UFC as a legitimate competition.

    I guess one factor is the fact that it's effectively owned and run by one man, Dana White, who seems to do very well from the rise of McGregor. Like the McMahons and WWE. It's a question that has arisen in other sports that are effectively one persons business.

    That does nothing to explain the crossovers with the tonnes of different companies and associations that a lot of these guys started in, wind up in after their prime, or in some cases compete(d) in while in the UFC. Dana White doesn't own them, and many are based in different continents.

    Essentially your point would need to be that ALL MMA (and probably all martial arts) are staged on a global level. It is laughable.


  • #76
    Dr. Mantis Toboggan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,278 ✭✭✭Dr. Mantis Toboggan


    darced wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    Barbaric.


  • #77
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,115 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ah come on, combat doesn't preclude the possibility that the outcomes are arranged.

    Are you saying that you believe the UFC choreographs fights like they do in WWE? Is this your contention?
    Are match ups arranged on the basis of what generates the most money?

    Not exactly, a guy can't come along out of nowhere and pay a couple of hundred thousand to fight the champion.

    Seriously, you've a very poor understanding of MMA and the UFC franchise.


  • #78
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Essentially your point would need to be that ALL MMA (and probably all martial arts) are staged on a global level. It is laughable.

    The topic title refers to the UFC. That's a privately owned organisation.

    Which doesn't mean, of itself, that it's fixed. Take the PDC in darts, where there is a qualifying school and competitions can see anyone end up playing anyone, subject to seeding.

    But you are entitled to say any questions are laughable. I was interested to hear fans of it here say money dictates, or at least influences, the match ups. Which to me seems to be slightly at odds with the idea of open competition based on merit.


  • #79
    Irelandcool
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 266 ✭✭Irelandcool


    Mcgregor haters have pretty much given up 99% reasonable excuses but so now they enter the realm of conspiracy theory when no other explanation is good enough for them.

    On the night of the fight Mcgregor did enough to get the win that is all that matters in a sport even though it looked like he could lose it.


  • #80
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    pmasterson95 wrote: »
    Dana White and that ex Manchester City chairman run this business. Lets ignore McGregor and look at say Rousey. She earns them how many millions in revenue? If some unheard of woman has a chance of beating her do you think that they will risk Rousey loosing? She'll be perfectly safe at #1 until someone more profitable comes along. They wont let Rousey loose to someone unmarketable that will punish profit. McGregor is now the male marketing money cow. Why fight Aldo lastnight when you can get to hype a second Aldo vs. McGregor title fight for months. Nothing to do with bank balance at all at all. Granted that Chad fella can get his jaw smashed and nasty injuries happen sure, but it will never happen to one of the major attractions or earners. When McGregor gets #1 hes guaranteed safe until a new poster boy appears. Money is king.
    You make some decent points, but how could Dana White "make sure" things like getting his jaw smashed would never happen to McGregor, who spent most of the fight yesterday on his back, eating Mendes' elbows?

    I mean we literally saw him get his face smashed in over and over and over last night. And as for nasty injuries, how about going for over half a fight (and winning) with a torn cruciate ligament in his knee? Because we quite literally saw that, too.


  • #81
    Alexis Sanchez
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 415 ✭✭Alexis Sanchez


    Dr. Mantis Toboggan wrote: »
    Barbaric.

    Awesome fight, I strongly implore people to watch it.


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  • #82
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 22,384 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Irelandcool wrote: »
    Mcgregor haters have pretty much given up 99% reasonable excuses but so now they enter the realm of conspiracy theory when no other explanation is good enough for them.

    The questions about the UFC predate McGregor and have been made by those outside Ireland.

    Maybe they predicted his rise and decided to hate him? Either way, I think it's great to see an Irishman top of the pile in anything, but it doesn't prevent questions about the organisation or sport.


  • #83
    RedemptionZ
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,758 ✭✭✭RedemptionZ


    pmasterson95 wrote: »
    Exactly if the big draw looses they loose a crap ton of money. The lower fighters fighting each other results are fair. When the big profit fighter is involved they wont loose.

    If that's the case why did Lesnar lose to Cain? Lesnar was a money making machine and a very entertaining fighter. Why would he be 'allowed' him to lose? Why did Kimbo lose?


  • #84
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Again, interesting to hear someone who follows the sport conclude that decisions follow the money maker. Some posters seem appalled to hear this suggested and apparently think I'm the only one who does so!

    Funny how he never even came close to saying he thought it was scripted and choreographed like the WWE, though.


  • #85
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I was interested to hear fans of it here say money dictates, or at least influences, the match ups. Which to me seems to be slightly at odds with the idea of open competition based on merit.
    No, you were comparing to the WWE which I'd scripted and makes no bones about that fact.

    As for money influencing decisions, it may well do. Show me a sport that certainly isn't though - the big clubs on soccer getting all the decisions, big name boxers like May weather being pretty much able to openly dictate how he wants the ref to approach the fight, big rugby nations getting 50/50 calls in rugby all the time, those mysteriously long injury time bouts that end the Second one team goes level in a big GAA match to secure a replay (or with almost no injury time as they enter it on a tie).

    Do you consider any sport in the world to be legitimate?


  • #86
    zzfh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭zzfh


    RedemptionZ wrote: »
    If that's the case why did Lesnar lose to Cain? Lesnar was a money making machine and a very entertaining fighter. Why would he be 'allowed' him to lose? Why did Kimbo lose?

    Lesnar was in and out with diverticulitis (sp?),pulling out of events and such,his time as the money maker was pretty much up.


  • #87
    Gatling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    The questions about the UFC predate McGregor and have been made by those outside Ireland.
    .

    By whom exactly random Internet posts ,boxing forums ,wwe forums .

    No point making claims with nothing to back up the claims other than those or people have said .

    People say Elvis is alive and well but we know otherwise
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • #88
    nxbyveromdwjpg
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,402 ✭✭✭nxbyveromdwjpg


    pmasterson95 wrote: »
    Dana White and that ex Manchester City chairman run this business. Lets ignore McGregor and look at say Rousey. She earns them how many millions in revenue? If some unheard of woman has a chance of beating her do you think that they will risk Rousey loosing? She'll be perfectly safe at #1 until someone more profitable comes along. They wont let Rousey loose to someone unmarketable that will punish profit. McGregor is now the male marketing money cow. Why fight Aldo lastnight when you can get to hype a second Aldo vs. McGregor title fight for months. Nothing to do with bank balance at all at all. Granted that Chad fella can get his jaw smashed and nasty injuries happen sure, but it will never happen to one of the major attractions or earners. When McGregor gets #1 hes guaranteed safe until a new poster boy appears. Money is king.

    This ignores the losses of Chael Sonnen, Brock Lesnar and countless others.

    It's just complete bollocks basically.


  • #89
    RedemptionZ
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,758 ✭✭✭RedemptionZ


    zzfh wrote: »
    Lesnar was in and out with diverticulitis (sp?),pulling out of events and such,his time as the money maker was pretty much up.

    So basically when a guy is in his peak and wins, it's fixed. When he's out of his peak and loses it's fixed. That's what you're saying? So when Weidman beat Silva it was because Silva was getting too old I assume? When Silva broke his leg live on TV that was fixed too?

    Just because there are stoppages you disagree with doesn't mean it's fixed. Referee's are different. Interpretations can differ marginally.


  • #90
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 53,068 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    See here for explanation on thread closure :)

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=96215855&postcount=255


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