Same Sex Marriage Referendum Mega Thread - MOD WARNING IN FIRST POST

SafeSurfer · 22-05-2015 11:59PM

Zen65 wrote: »

I was a bit surprised to one one in my polling station too, though I shouldn't have been. (I remember once having to decline a bible in court when swearing in as a witness ).

Yes, they are works of fiction, but they are also reminders of the oppression that has been brought to bear on our country through the undue power exerted by the RCC here. For balance there should have been a portrait of Oscar Wilde so we could remember the ordeal he had to endure for loving somebody with the love that dare not speak its name.

In fairness your "for balance" analogy is way off the mark. Do you really think any work of Oscar Wilde's, great though they are, have had, or could have the same influence on western society as the bible and Christianity?
All works of fiction are not equal in gravitas.

PopePalpatine · 22-05-2015 11:59PM

StewartGriffin wrote: »

Kermit, so he said.

After crapping on the chessboard, of course. :pac:

Ave Sodalis · 22-05-2015 11:59PM

yellowlabrador wrote: »

Maybe it would have been helpfull for the laws on adoption and surrogacy should have been tackled at the same time.

The adoption law was sorted

Anita Blow · 23-05-2015 12:00AM

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I don't see it as homophobic, but I see it as selfish. Those people are perfectly entitled to believe that, but that belief should only go so far as guiding their own actions rather than enforcing it on others. IE- If a guy believes that, then he should marry a woman so he's living according to his beliefs.

Look at another scenario. Jewish people do not eat Pork because their religion forbids it (Analagous to catholics & SSM). Would it be fair, in a free society, for Jewish people to enforce that belief on others who don't necessarily believe that themselves? Or is it fairer to say that we'll have pork and let people choose for themselves whether or not they'll eat it

BoJack Horseman · 23-05-2015 12:00AM

yellowlabrador wrote: »

I feel that this whole issue has divided the generations. The fact that bibles in the voting stations caused controversy says it all

The bible thing was something new.

A voter does not require ID, once they can swear to the man upstairs.

Quite incredible, yet typical at the same time.

YFlyer · 23-05-2015 12:00AM

RoadhouseBlues wrote: »

Hope no one minds me dipping my paw in here. I'm straight, but most people think I'm gay. So I don't know where I fit in here:-):-):-). I hope the Yes vote wins though. But I just wanted to say if ye don't mind. I've met bigots all through the years and I was just thinking. Even if the Yes vote wins, won't there still be bigots. Or what I'm trying to say is, the same bigots will still be bigots. Although as I'm typing this I'm thinking that it doesn't matter. Before ye get fed up of me, all the young people I was talking to seem to be really mature about this and are real positive about it. Maybe that's the difference between this generation and years ago. I hope that made some sense.

Maybe because they find you good looking.

Knasher · 23-05-2015 12:03AM

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

The bible thing was something new.

A voter does not require ID, once they can swear to the man upstairs.

Quite incredible, yet typical at the same time.

The rest of us can affirm, and be taken at our word. It's only the christians who need to use the bible before they are trusted.

LordSutch · 23-05-2015 12:03AM

herd behaviour in action.

CaveCanem · 23-05-2015 12:03AM

RoadhouseBlues wrote: »

Hope no one minds me dipping my paw in here. I'm straight, but most people think I'm gay. So I don't know where I fit in here:-):-):-). I hope the Yes vote wins though. But I just wanted to say if ye don't mind. I've met bigots all through the years and I was just thinking. Even if the Yes vote wins, won't there still be bigots. Or what I'm trying to say is, the same bigots will still be bigots. Although as I'm typing this I'm thinking that it doesn't matter. Before ye get fed up of me, all the young people I was talking to seem to be really mature about this and are real positive about it. Maybe that's the difference between this generation and years ago. I hope that made some sense.

Yeah, it's a hell of a turnaround. When I was younger I was the victim of mericless homophobic bullying for about three or four years despite the fact that I am straight, just because I didn't fit in I was branded gay and abused. Now some of the very same people are apoplectic that anyone could even consider voting no on Facebook.

I think it will make a big change, I don't know what changed these people's opinion since then but it is no longer acceptable for a teacher to laugh at you and tell you to toughen up. We may even be close to a situation where true homophobes are the ones who have something to fear when their intolerance actually gives them something to worry about.

SafeSurfer · 23-05-2015 12:03AM

RoadhouseBlues wrote: »

Hope no one minds me dipping my paw in here. I'm straight, but most people think I'm gay. So I don't know where I fit in here:-):-):-). I hope the Yes vote wins though. But I just wanted to say if ye don't mind. I've met bigots all through the years and I was just thinking. Even if the Yes vote wins, won't there still be bigots. Or what I'm trying to say is, the same bigots will still be bigots. Although as I'm typing this I'm thinking that it doesn't matter. Before ye get fed up of me, all the young people I was talking to seem to be really mature about this and are real positive about it. Maybe that's the difference between this generation and years ago. I hope that made some sense.

Hi roadhouseblues. I agree with you. And everybody labelling others "bigots" should be clear on the definition.

bigot
ˈbɪɡət/
noun
a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.
"don't let a few small-minded bigots destroy the good image of the city"
synonyms: dogmatist, partisan, sectarian, prejudiced person; More

mackerski · 23-05-2015 12:04AM

endacl wrote: »

It's an alternative firm if ID.

No it isn't. Whether the unknown person recites the magic words that use a bible or the magic words that don't, if they didn't show you ID, you still have no clue whether or not they are committing electoral fraud.

What it is is an alternative to ID. Just as alternative medicine is an alternative to medicine, not an alternative kind of medicine.

PopePalpatine · 23-05-2015 12:04AM

LordSutch wrote: »

herd behaviour in action.

Butthurt behaviour in action. :pac:

miralize · 23-05-2015 12:04AM

LordSutch wrote: »

herd behaviour in action.

Like all religions so...

darced · 23-05-2015 12:05AM

This post has been deleted.

molloyjh · 23-05-2015 12:06AM

darced wrote: »

What about people who believe marriage is between a man and a woman,what exactly is homophobic about that?

It depends on why they believe it should be that way and only that way. There must be a reason. Just because isn't a reason. I've found that when asked most don't know why they believe that, they just do. If they don't have a reason for it then I can't see why they shouldn't be open to changing their view. It seems only logical to me that if you don't know why you believe something you might reconsider your position on it.

humberklog · 23-05-2015 12:06AM

Why are there no exit polls?

anyone? anyone?

Cold War Kid · 23-05-2015 12:06AM

LordSutch wrote: »

herd behaviour in action.

You've no grounds for believing this, other than it being a topic you disagree with.

mylefttesticle · 23-05-2015 12:06AM

JamboMac wrote: »

But do you think either the staunchly yes or no voters read any of what was going to be changed. To me their seemed like a massive band wagon for the yes and everybody seemed to on it and if anybody who voted no from the voice of this thread they'll be crucified.

For its of homophobic nature why they voted no.

If you are staunchly yes or no voter the bigger picture is always not seen and maybe those of us who didn't vote ultimately didn't believe either side was right and if this had have been done a little different then more would have voted yes.

The reality is the majority over 60 more then likely voted no and they are the usual voters.
Let's say the majority of 18-30 year olds voted yes. Your swing vote will be the people in the middle.

As I said if it's a yes fair play, if it's a no, in 3 or 4 years it will be voted on again.

Point being what is the bigger picture you speak off? if you can answer that then maybe we can have a discussion on it.

I have read lots on it and it comes down to a simple thing. You either want to legitimize same sex marriage or you don't. It really is that simple. If you are talking about how we see parents and how we see children as a consequence of that then yes things will change in time and why is that so bad? you cant sweep these things under the carpet and wish them away.

One of the many flawed arguments is the supposed bullying of same sex children because of having two mammies and two daddies and that may well be true but that doesn't go away by denying equality it goes away by having a progressive society that is ready to tackle these issues in a whole and holistic way that includes all members of society and ironically if you ostracize one part of society from having the same rights as everyone else then you can hardly be the moral authority on how bullies should behave.

The world evolves and the world changes and you may not agree with it but you cant really stop it either because that is what leads to a disenfranchised population and eventually an unhappy existence.

Instead of looking at the negatives take a look at the positives of today, the unity of people has never been as strong as it was today, that is a beautiful thing.

molloyjh · 23-05-2015 12:07AM

Cold War Kid wrote: »

You've no grounds for believing this, other than it being a topic you disagree with.

Getting excuses in early.

Ave Sodalis · 23-05-2015 12:07AM

LordSutch wrote: »

herd behaviour in action.

Do you actually believe that those voting Yes are doing so because they can't think for themselves, or are you just trying to tell yourself that because nobody was entertaining your previous posts? Is it a case of "they don't agree with me therefore, they must not be capable of thinking"?

Anita Blow · 23-05-2015 12:08AM

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I agree, I don't see most votes as homophobic

P_1 · 23-05-2015 12:08AM

humberklog wrote: »

Why are there no exit polls?

anyone? anyone?

They cost money, they're generally commissioned by media bodies who by all accounts are rather lacking in the pot to píss in department at present.

YFlyer · 23-05-2015 12:08AM

CaveCanem wrote: »

Yeah, it's a hell of a turnaround. When I was younger I was the victim of mericless homophobic bullying for about three or four years despite the fact that I am straight, just because I didn't fit in I was branded gay and abused. Now some of the very same people are apoplectic that anyone could even consider voting no on Facebook.

I think it will make a big change, I don't know what changed these people's opinion since then but it is no longer acceptable for a teacher to laugh at you and tell you to toughen up. We may even be close to a situation where true homophobes are the ones who have something to fear when their intolerance actually gives them something to worry about.

Agree. As I said above.

molloyjh · 23-05-2015 12:09AM

mylefttesticle wrote: »

One of the many flawed arguments is the supposed bullying of same sex children because of having two mammies and two daddies and that may well be true but that doesn't go away by denying equality it goes away by having a progressive society that is ready to tackle these issues in a whole and holistic way that includes all members of society and ironically if you ostracize one part of society from having the same rights as everyone else then you can hardly be the moral authority on how bullies should behave.

This. A thousand times this.

marco_polo · 23-05-2015 12:09AM

humberklog wrote: »

Why are there no exit polls?

anyone? anyone?

I don't ever recall exit polls for previous referenda either, no idea why but RTE only seem to do it for elections.

Mr.Nice Guy · 23-05-2015 12:09AM

RoadhouseBlues wrote: »

Hope no one minds me dipping my paw in here. I'm straight, but most people think I'm gay. So I don't know where I fit in here:-):-):-). I hope the Yes vote wins though. But I just wanted to say if ye don't mind. I've met bigots all through the years and I was just thinking. Even if the Yes vote wins, won't there still be bigots. Or what I'm trying to say is, the same bigots will still be bigots. Although as I'm typing this I'm thinking that it doesn't matter. Before ye get fed up of me, all the young people I was talking to seem to be really mature about this and are real positive about it. Maybe that's the difference between this generation and years ago. I hope that made some sense.

There will be always be bigots but bigotry feeds off ignorance. What I'm noticing about this referendum debate is that many Irish people, who before might not have thought much about their gay fellow citizens, are now starting to think about the challenges that they face in this society. I think that has to be welcomed because education and understanding beats ignorance, which ultimately beats bigotry.

I think it's encouraging the direction this country is heading in social terms and if it's a Yes win I will feel especially proud to call myself an Irish citizen.

sunshine and showers · 23-05-2015 12:10AM

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Where that idea of marriage comes from is homophobic reasoning, usually from a religious basis of "being gay is a sin". Are you reading my posts? I am not calling people homophobic.

Yes, yes I was. Because I didn't want my opinion being twisted by the no side into more "poor us, look at the yes side bullying and silencing us by saying things that disagree with the things we're saying! boohoo! People should vote no because the yes side are trying to follow everyone into the polling booth with a hurley and the threat of violence if they don't vote yes. Omg, we're so persecuted and silenced." :rolleyes:

humberklog · 23-05-2015 12:11AM

marco_polo wrote: »

I don't ever recall exit polls for previous referenda either, no idea why but RTE only seem to do it for elections.

Yeah, same as. Just curious.

mikom · 23-05-2015 12:11AM

LordSutch wrote: »

herd behaviour in action.

Isaiah 40:11
He will feed his flock like a shepherd.
He will carry the lambs in his arms, holding them close to his heart.
He will gently lead the mother sheep with their young.

Ave Sodalis · 23-05-2015 12:11AM

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

bigotry feeds off ignorance

This really. I believe that many of the No voters are doing so out of simple ignorance

Same Sex Marriage Referendum Mega Thread - MOD WARNING IN FIRST POST

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