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Luas inspector authority after you have gotten off the luas

  • 20-05-2015 06:40PM
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,905 ✭✭✭


    I've noticed the luas inspectors are waiting outside the team lately and checking tickets after the people have disembarked.

    Do you have to show your ticket to them once you are off the tram?

    I have a yearly pass so I have nothing to hide, but when I'm running to work in the morning it's annoying, once I'm off the luas to have to produce my travel pass.


Comments

  • Hosted Moderators Posts: 7,486 ✭✭✭Red Alert


    You're technically within the fare zone on a platform if I understand things correctly, so they can. The Luas inspectors are very efficient at what they do so the check is very fast, and you can also see their jackets on the platform as the tram pulls in, so plenty of time to have your ticket ready.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,371 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    How do you think it should work? They duck down and hide on the tram coming up to a stop to ensure fare dodgers get on...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,905 ✭✭✭fret_wimp2


    How do you think it should work? They duck down and hide on the tram coming up to a stop to ensure fare dodgers get on...

    How about the do what they used to do, get on the tram and once the doors close do a ticket Check.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,905 ✭✭✭fret_wimp2


    Red Alert wrote: »
    You're technically within the fare zone on a platform if I understand things correctly, so they can. The Luas inspectors are very efficient at what they do so the check is very fast, and you can also see their jackets on the platform as the tram pulls in, so plenty of time to have your ticket ready.

    Fare zone? So im I'm standing on the platform but havnt gotten into a luas, they can ask for my ticket? What if I'm waiting for someone and have no intention of getting on, can I be fined?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,925 ✭✭✭✭anncoates


    fret_wimp2 wrote: »
    How about the do what they used to do, get on the tram and once the doors close do a ticket Check.

    People just watch to see if they're on the platform and jump off the train when it pulls in.

    Presumably that's who they're after, not people boarding. You'd hardly get on the tram without a ticket with an inspector standing beside you.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,652 ✭✭✭goingnowhere


    The bye laws were changed several years ago to allow for checking of tickets after alighting the tram. If you are on the platform they can check your tickets


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 334 ✭✭triple nipple


    They've been doing that since they started


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 818 ✭✭✭Triangla


    Person with no ticket gets off Luas. Luas inspector waiting on platform.

    Luas inspector " Can I see your ticket"

    Person walks away.

    That's basically it, they can't physically stop you so what's going to happen?

    The usual beauties will just tell the inspector to F off.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,519 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Triangla wrote: »
    Person with no ticket gets off Luas. Luas inspector waiting on platform.

    Luas inspector " Can I see your ticket"

    Person walks away.

    That's basically it, they can't physically stop you so what's going to happen?

    The usual beauties will just tell the inspector to F off.


    I haven't looked up the bye laws but I am sure if they wanted to they could detain one if they believe they are fare evading.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭Celly Smunt


    I haven't looked up the bye laws but I am sure if they wanted to they could detain one if they believe they are fare evading.

    I highly doubt luas inspectors have any right to lay hands on anybody when it comes to detaining people, even security guards can't touch theives so i'd say its in the realm of possibilty that you could just walk off and not say a word to them.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,519 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    I highly doubt luas inspectors have any right to lay hands on anybody when it comes to detaining people, even security guards can't touch theives so i'd say its in the realm of possibilty that you could just walk off and not say a word to them.


    Citizens arest?

    You have the right to defend yourself and detain one if commiting a crime.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,144 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    ... even security guards can't touch theives ....

    That claim requires a reputable source.... Do you have a link?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,261 ✭✭✭Baron Kurtz


    Seriously though, as someone already mentioned, can this not be checked whilst on the damn transport, like, I dunno, a normal system. Unlike a very Irish cotton-headed system of leaving them liable to a myriad of trouble investigating/accosting the alighting public/general populous on a public street essentially. I always found it moronic.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,498 ✭✭✭Wheety


    I highly doubt luas inspectors have any right to lay hands on anybody when it comes to detaining people, even security guards can't touch theives so i'd say its in the realm of possibilty that you could just walk off and not say a word to them.

    When I worked in Dunnes Stores years ago, the security guards often had to grapple with thieves and drag them into the security room and detain them until the Guards arrive.

    Do you think just asking them nicely will work?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,002 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    fret_wimp2 wrote: »
    Fare zone? So im I'm standing on the platform but havnt gotten into a luas, they can ask for my ticket? What if I'm waiting for someone and have no intention of getting on, can I be fined?

    A quick read through the Bye-Laws accepted by each customer everytime they purchase a ticket or pass will address most issues....

    http://www.luas.ie/luas-byelaws.html
    Stop platform” means a platform for the collection or setting down of passengers by trams. The stop platform shall be 6 metres in width from the white line at the edge of the platform or, if less than 6 metres, to the nearest bounded property, wall or fence. The stop platform shall be limited in length to the area between the pedestrian crossings on the tracks or limited by a physical barrier such as a guard rail, wall or fence.
    (2) Where an authorised person observes an individual alighting from a light rail vehicle they may request that the individual produces a valid ticket for inspection on the stop platform.

    (3) A passenger alighting from a light rail vehicle, who is not in possession of a valid ticket, is liable to pay the standard fare.

    (4) An individual at a stop platform is not taken to be travelling on a tram service unless they came there by alighting from a tram.

    Mind you,Dublin Bus has a somewhat more robust set of Bye-Laws,particularly when it comes to verifying identity....

    http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/About-Us/Dublin-Bus-Bye-Laws/Enforcement-Procedures/
    58 (a) Any person who is reasonably suspected by an authorised person of contravening or attempting to contravene these Bye-Laws shall upon being requested so to do give his name and address to an authorized person who is an inspector, driver or conductor in uniform or who produces evidence of identity.

    58 (b) The person aforesaid shall on the request of the authorised person remain in the company of the authorised person pending verification of the name and address.

    58 (c) Where any such person refuses or fails to comply with a request under paragraph (a) or (b) of this Bye-Law or following such request such person gives a name and address which the authorised person has reasonable grounds for believing is false or misleading, such person may be detained by the authorised person until the arrival of a member of the Garda Síochána.
    60 (a) Any person who is reasonably suspected by an authorised person of contravening or of attempting to contravene these Bye-Laws may be removed from the vehicle by an authorised person or a member of the Garda Síochána acting on the request of such authorised person.
    60 (b) In the exercise of the power conferred on him under paragraph (a) of this Bye-Law an authorised person or member of the Garda Síochána may use such reasonable force as is necessary.

    The greatest difference,perhaps,is that Dublin Bus had the great benefit of experience when it came to drafting it's Bye-Laws,whereas the RPA felt it might have a better sort of clientele ?? ;)


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Posts: 9,954 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    They've been doing that since they started

    They have, but they go into trouble for it, so they changed the bye-laws to give the inspectors the ability to check on the platform.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,632 ✭✭✭draiochtanois


    This post has been deleted.


  • Posts: 9,954 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    This post has been deleted.

    You can see it in action on the Red Line...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,862 ✭✭✭Cushie Butterfield


    This post has been deleted.
    I haven't read through all the bye laws but I assume that by boarding a tram the bye laws automatically apply to anyone on it, therefore by getting off without a valid ticket they have broken the bye laws by not having a valid ticket in the first place?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 177 ✭✭The YOPPA


    I think it's interesting that according to the byelaws stated above, the authorised person can ask to check your ticket if he/she "OBSERVES" you alighting from the tram/light rail. Kind of difficult to prove when there's a crowd alighting.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,519 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    The YOPPA wrote: »
    I think it's interesting that according to the byelaws stated above, the authorised person can ask to check your ticket if he/she "OBSERVES" you alighting from the tram/light rail. Kind of difficult to prove when there's a crowd alighting.

    cctv proves


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    fret_wimp2 wrote: »
    I've noticed the luas inspectors are waiting outside the team lately and checking tickets after the people have disembarked.

    Do you have to show your ticket to them once you are off the tram?

    I have a yearly pass so I have nothing to hide, but when I'm running to work in the morning it's annoying, once I'm off the luas to have to produce my travel pass.

    They do have the authority to ask to see your ticket but they have no authority to physically detain you so ........


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,162 ✭✭✭MadDog76


    I haven't looked up the bye laws but I am sure if they wanted to they could detain one if they believe they are fare evading.

    They definitely cannot physically detain anybody.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 343 ✭✭easygoing1982


    Citizens arest?

    You have the right to defend yourself and detain one if committing a crime.

    A citizens arrest is only applicable if the offence is an arrest-able offence.The fare evading offence is not an arrest-able offence therefore the inspectors cannot make a citizens arrest.
    monument wrote: »
    That claim requires a reputable source.... Do you have a link?

    Security guards have the right as any other citizen to make a citizens arrest but again only under the guidelines above.The have a very specific protocol to follow before they'll make an arrest due to legal action being made against the security company for wrongful arrest and defamation in regards to shoplifting etc


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