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Same Sex Marriage Referendum Mega Thread - MOD WARNING IN FIRST POST

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Comments

  • #1112
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    dodderangler wrote: »
    I was called a scumbag by a bloke who was handing out leaflets for voting yes when I didn't take it off him. When he asked why, I told him because I'm voting no.
    I was called a scumbag and he basically followed me saying this. I have my reasons and he didn't exactly help change my mind about it.

    What are you reasons. Countless, countless times in my life I've been told I am paedophile because I am gay so we all have our whinge stories.


  • #1113
    anvilfour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 720 ✭✭✭anvilfour


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    Because I feel that the family unit of mother.father and child is the strongest possible unit above all else. That includes hetrosexual/homosexual or whatever else.

    Therefore further re-defining of the family I think will be bad for society as a whole. Have I am evidence for it? No. Is it a gut feeling primal instinct? yes

    Can you understand that no one is asking you to marry a person of the same sex and raise a family? Voting yes will only give people who are already in a homosexual relationship (and in some cases raising children) the right to marry.


  • #1114
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    If the minority breaks down one of pillars of society for the majority if the rights are changed (as they will be) then I believe that it is not the right thing to do.
    How can the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the the majority. it will completely re-write what a family unit means.

    Another way should be found around it in my view to keep everyone happy.
    I don't think this ref is as simple as yes for equality, no for inequality (although it is painted that way).

    But enough about divorce...

    Give couple A the same access to Constitutional protection as enjoyed by Couple B.

    That is what is is about and it you don't see that being about addressing an inequality then I'm not sure what you think equality is...


  • #1115
    floggg
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,821 ✭✭✭floggg


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    Side note - I have noticed when I say it does not involve children people say gay couples have children and when I said it does beforehand I am told it has nothing to do with children.
    Therefore I find the what is a family question much easier in my mind.

    The referendum won't grant lgbt couples any additional rights to adopt kids or start families - they already have those. So in that sense it's not about kids.

    But as gay people can and do have kids already, any argument that gay couples can't marry because they don't have kids are ridiculous. Hence the relevance of the kids - there are already children being raised by gay couples and a no vote won't change that.

    It will just send the kids an unhelpful message regarding how the country fired their parents relationship and their family.


  • #1116
    Shanotheslayer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,191 ✭✭✭✭Shanotheslayer


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    What are you reasons. Countless, countless times in my life I've been told I am paedophile because I am gay so we all have our whinge stories.

    Jesus christ, what is wrong with this world. That's disgusting.


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  • #1117
    traprunner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,887 ✭✭✭traprunner


    gormdubhgorm...no joke. You need to contact the independent Referendum Commission if you have such grave misgivings. They will answer all your questions since you don't believe us here.



    The Referendum Commission
    18 Lower Leeson Street, Dublin 2, Ireland.
    Telephone: 01 639 5695

    Locall: 1890 270970

    Email: refcom@refcom.gov.ie


  • #1118
    Dimithy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 351 ✭✭Dimithy


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    What are you reasons. Countless, countless times in my life I've been told I am paedophile because I am gay so we all have our whinge stories.

    This is worse though. Now its happening to normal people!


  • #1119
    anvilfour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 720 ✭✭✭anvilfour


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    What are you reasons. Countless, countless times in my life I've been told I am paedophile because I am gay so we all have our whinge stories.

    Amen brother.

    My Father is in a Civil Partnership with a wonderful man. This man faced huge opposition from parents in the 70's when he worked with the local Boys' Brigade as apparently being gay meant he would molest children...!

    And as we know, no heterosexual male who works with children has ever abused young girls... sigh.


  • #1120
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    Shanotheslayer wrote: »
    Jesus christ, what is wrong with this world. That's disgusting.

    According to many people, this is perfectly acceptable but calling people out on it is a severe form of bullying.


  • #1121
    GCU Flexible Demeanour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,257 ✭✭✭GCU Flexible Demeanour


    smash wrote: »
    With good sometimes comes bad. But it's still not what we're voting on.
    It still is what we're voting on, and it's down specified as one of the 160 differences. Are there any other "bad" differences?
    smash wrote: »
    I wish you'd just come out and say it that you disapprove of same sex marriage instead of picking apart laws like that. Laws that will not change anyway if the vote doesn't pass. You're looking for any excuse.
    No, I'm expecting proposals for change to have a depth behind them that's missing on this occasion.

    Like, it's OK to pick apart laws and just count the differences. But it's a problem if someone asks "what do all these differences actually mean".

    And then fall back on the ritual questioning of motives. Because it would be nice and simple if I was a member of the Iona Institute, and a daily communicant.


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  • #1122
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    dodderangler wrote: »
    I was called a scumbag by a bloke who was handing out leaflets for voting yes when I didn't take it off him. When he asked why, I told him because I'm voting no.
    I was called a scumbag and he basically followed me saying this. I have my reasons and he didn't exactly help change my mind about it.

    I was called a child molester by someone who came to my front door with No leaflets because I said I am a lesbian.

    I win.


  • #1123
    Anita Blow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,935 ✭✭✭Anita Blow


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    Because I feel that the family unit of mother.father and child is the strongest possible unit above all else. That includes hetrosexual/homosexual or whatever else.

    Therefore further re-defining of the family I think will be bad for society as a whole. Have I am evidence for it? No. Is it a gut feeling primal instinct? yes

    But then why are you acting as if you may vote yes? Between this "gut feeling primal instinct" and your previous posts suggesting that homosexual relationships cannot be the same as heterosexual ones because of biological differences, it is abundantly clear that your mind is not for changing.
    If you're not willing to make an informed vote, and rather rely on a gut feeling (with no basis in reality, the constitution or evidence) then no amount of arguments and studies/legal texts quoted are going to change your mind.


  • #1124
    gormdubhgorm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,503 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Dimithy wrote: »
    What do you think will happen to those mother+father+child families if we vote yes?

    I think that a same sex couple with a child would be regarded as a family unit under the constitution also. I then think that this will lead to A LOT of further complications and legal minefields in future. Things are complicated enough as they are...

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • #1125
    sunshine and showers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,027 ✭✭✭sunshine and showers


    GSU, since I've pointed out to you that your "reason" for voting no is rather moot, will you now be voting yes?


  • #1126
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    I think that a same sex couple with a child would be regarded as a family unit under the constitution also. I then think that this will lead to A LOT of further complications and legal minefields in future. Things are complicated enough as they are...

    A lot? Can you name one?


  • #1127
    SireOfSeth
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 340 ✭✭SireOfSeth


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    In that case I would vote yes.

    Everything you have said (before or after your statement above) contradicts this. You say you are happy for them to be treated equally but different - which is the definition of not equal. So, you are simply happy to keep oppressing the gays.


  • #1128
    eviltwin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    I was called a child molester by someone who came to my front door with No leaflets because I said I am a lesbian.

    I win.

    Was in town with my kids and wearing a Yes badge when someone on a pro life stand at the GPO called me selfish and a bad mother. She then screamed baby killer at us because I wouldn't buy a foetus necklace. It's unsettling and quite scary, this girl was only a young one herself, how do they get so militant.


  • #1129
    1hnr79jr65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 907 ✭✭✭1hnr79jr65


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    If the minority breaks down one of pillars of society for the majority if the rights are changed (as they will be) then I believe that it is not the right thing to do.

    Eh i don't know if you studied history or are just ignorant of how the pillars of society came to be but modern democracy was largely founded by the Greeks way way way back.

    They had copious amounts of "bum sex" as you call it and people were quiet open about who they slept/had relationship with weather gay, straight or bi.

    So before you go spouting rubbish about the pillars of society will be broken down, remember that modern society was largely influenced by ancient society who had copious amounts of "bum sex" as you call it and people were open about who they slept/had relationship with weather gay, straight or bi. Their efforts benefit us all today.


  • #1130
    traprunner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,887 ✭✭✭traprunner


    Originally Posted by gormdubhgorm
    Because I feel that the family unit of mother.father and child is the strongest possible unit above all else. That includes hetrosexual/homosexual or whatever else.

    traprunner wrote: »
    But they only make up a percentage of the population. What about kids where the mother and father are separated due to domestic abuse? Should the child and whichever parent they stay with be forced to have a new mother/father to adhere to what you "feel"?

    I'd love an answer to this because your reasoning would either 1) force all separated parents to be married, or, 2) force them to marry someone else.

    What about where one parent is dead? Should the single parent be forced to marry another single parent of the opposite sex?


  • #1131
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    I think that a same sex couple with a child would be regarded as a family unit under the constitution also. I then think that this will lead to A LOT of further complications and legal minefields in future. Things are complicated enough as they are...

    They aren't. Honestly please try and inform yourself before you consign thousands of your fellow countrymen and women, not to mention children into second class citizen status.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ruling-stresses-no-such-thing-as-de-facto-family-in-law-1.658471


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  • #1132
    dodderangler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,204 ✭✭✭dodderangler


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    What are you reasons. Countless, countless times in my life I've been told I am paedophile because I am gay so we all have our whinge stories.

    Well I've never considered any person gay or straight a paedophile unless I've actually had proof( thank god I've never met one either)
    But my reasons are my own and it's not in you to tell me to change my mind.
    Whatever way the voting goes we have to live with it.
    I won't lose sleep either way.


  • #1133
    anvilfour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 720 ✭✭✭anvilfour


    Sour Lemonz wrote: »
    Eh i don't know if you studied history or are just ignorant of how the pillars of society came to be but modern democracy was largely founded by the Greeks way way way back.

    They had copious amounts of "bum sex" as you call it and people were quiet open about who they slept/had relationship with weather gay, straight or bi.

    So before you go spouting rubbish about the pillars of society will be broken down, remember that modern society was largely influenced by ancient society who had copious amounts of "bum sex" as you call it and people were open about who they slept/had relationship with weather gay, straight or bi. Their efforts benefit us all today.

    The old "floodgates" argument. People said the same thing about interracial marriage and yet here we all still are. I think we can weather the supposed legal storm of allowing same sex couples to marry! :)


  • #1134
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    dodderangler wrote: »
    Well I've never considered any person gay or straight a paedophile unless I've actually had proof( thank god I've never met one either)
    But my reasons are my own and it's not in you to tell me to change my mind.
    Whatever way the voting goes we have to live with it.
    I won't lose sleep either way.

    No one asked you to change your mind.

    People simply pointed out that the No side aren't covering themselves in glory in the name calling department.


  • #1135
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    dodderangler wrote: »
    Well I've never considered any person gay or straight a paedophile unless I've actually had proof( thank god I've never met one either)
    But my reasons are my own and it's not in you to tell me to change my mind.
    Whatever way the voting goes we have to live with it.
    I won't lose sleep either way.

    I can assure you it is in me to tell you to change your mind, you just won't. I am interested in general though to see and hear your reasons so I can better understand those who want to keep me a second class citizen and consider me their inferior.


  • #1136
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,808 ✭✭✭✭smash


    GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »
    No, I'm expecting proposals for change to have a depth behind them that's missing on this occasion.

    No, you have issues with the laws as they currently stand. Voting yes or no will not change these laws. In fact there'll never be a vote to change these laws because a vote is not required to change them.

    So given that a no vote will not change what you want it to change, which is a completely separate issue, but it will make life better and more equal for a portion of our population without affecting anyone else in the slightest then a yes vote should really be the default option.

    So let's be clear: You vote no and nothing changes and your issues still stand. Voting yes means something changes for the better and you're not affected and your issues still stand. Either way your issues still stand, so why not make someone happy?


  • #1137
    traprunner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,887 ✭✭✭traprunner


    sunshine and showers wrote: »
    GSU, since I've pointed out to you that your "reason" for voting no is rather moot, will you now be voting yes?

    No he won't.

    The answer should be a simple yes or no but he will digress again. He is a bigot plain and simple.


  • #1138
    Hyzepher
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 4,687 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hyzepher


    dodderangler wrote: »
    But my reasons are my own and it's not in you to tell me to change my mind.
    Whatever way the voting goes we have to live with it.
    I won't lose sleep either way.

    For me this is what the Yes side are really fighting against. The No voters who have their own - probably valid for them - reasons for not wanting SSM, but who actually don't care whichever way the vote turns out.

    Why? Cause they know it actually doesn't affect them. Selfish is a word some might use.


  • #1139
    Anita Blow
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,935 ✭✭✭Anita Blow


    dodderangler wrote: »
    Well I've never considered any person gay or straight a paedophile unless I've actually had proof( thank god I've never met one either)
    But my reasons are my own and it's not in you to tell me to change my mind.
    Whatever way the voting goes we have to live with it.
    I won't lose sleep either way.

    It's only really gay people that will have to live with it though, isn't it? I'm sure many of them will lose a lot of sleep over a no vote. Bear that in mind when you're voting to bar a section of society from basic constitutional protection at no loss to yourself


  • #1140
    sunshine and showers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,027 ✭✭✭sunshine and showers


    eviltwin wrote: »
    Was in town with my kids and wearing a Yes badge when someone on a pro life stand at the GPO called me selfish and a bad mother. She then screamed baby killer at us because I wouldn't buy a foetus necklace. It's unsettling and quite scary, this girl was only a young one herself, how do they get so militant.

    There are few things more bewilderingly frightening than a Youth Defence member.


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  • #1141
    Dimithy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 351 ✭✭Dimithy


    gormdubhgorm wrote: »
    I think that a same sex couple with a child would be regarded as a family unit under the constitution also. I then think that this will lead to A LOT of further complications and legal minefields in future. Things are complicated enough as they are...

    Why not answer the question I actually asked?

    What do you think will happen to those mother+father+child families if we vote yes?


This discussion has been closed.
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