Cork GAA Discussion Thread

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/football/paul-geaney-says-tommy-walsh-finding-his-feet-and-will-again-be-a-force-for-kerry-311695.html

See the point geaney makes regard fitness and speed game

He's had three month start on Connor
By the time if we're lucky o Connor get up speed cork be out that stage and moral all time low so bring back guy play tale off hardly good boost it is it

Flanagan terrific fitness coach but he is not miracle worker and cork fans are imo unfair pressure demands expect o Connor save cork season when not just midfield but too many issues like can't counter attack can't defend, management can't select correct team can't read game flow or game management

Maguire is struggling serious back injury and may play barrs but doubts will he last season so we go to championship doubts regards players injury and old player fitness


This is elite football not Russian roulette
Cork have to call up kiely and leary and dinnen and yes yes may fail absolutely there's that risk however they can't be any worse then gould or cadogan in fairness

sean mac wrote: »

I wouldn't have loughrey near the team, odonoghue at 6 for sure, but tom Clancy is a natural centre back and nows when to hold or go forward.
I don't expect alan o connor to last the pace of the game, its over 2 months to Killarney so plenty of time for him to get up to pace.
Buckley and maher succeed through physical domination and doing the basics of midfield work right - win ball, tackle, get physical - they certainly wont run through oconnor. After 50 minutes hopefully deane to come in.
Niall moran is areally poor example imo, 34 yrs of age, oconnor isn't even 30 yet, and I put it to you possibly hareder to get back to touch of intercounty hurling.
Btw this is my team, Ii have no doubt Cuthbert will revert to a much poorer team, and in addition I don't think cork have a single chance of winnign in killareny, what I am talking about is the difference between a hammering as per 2014 or a 5-6 point loss that wont demoralise the younger players. This season is a right off, its all about regaining respect. I am sick of fellas in cork and outside referring to these players and their lack of bottle etc they have a chance to prove otherwise, time for senior players including the captain to start talking.
Walsh was referring specifically to the football aspect not the fitness btw.
Look cork are ****ed for 2015 again, but going with ohallorhan and not giving oconnor a chance will simply compound out misery.

Agree lot you said Sean and huge respect your posting
Your like myself blunt but realistic
All ill say you questioned bottle cork players also imo all yere doing is taking heat off management and it's like you said sickening read brehony Allen brolly etc say players are all blame

You see I oppose thar attuide as imo we blame players management get immunity
Did you read eugene-mcgee, brehony Allen

Appalling Sean they blamed players and said players need answer to management why failed more or less

What do make that Sean???
Come on Sean you know this management are poor surely you agree it's wrong way players being held total responsible

http://www.eveningecho.ie/sport/cork-sport/corkvkerry/
Congratulations to the ladies
Some achievement again
What a centre of sustained excellence they are always wanting more

James Loughrey was one of Corks best players on sunday did a very good job on Brogan....I don't think Stephen O Donoughue will do just does not have the pace ....

"We were too open, simple as," he admitted. "You're not going to win an All-Ireland if you're conceding scores like that. There's a saying in American sports that 'good forwards or offence wins you games, but good defence wins you championships'. We knew we were going to have to start at the back and be much more solid, but at the same time stay loyal to Kerry football."


Fitzmauirce after kerry won the all Ireland
He's right defence wins games and no teams wins all Ireland conceding huge scores.
Defence is paramount in any sport to win games
Classic example would be Liverpool again tonight who can't defend
Imo blanket defences can't concede more than 15 points or close to it to be effective

I'll say one thing while I remain to be convinced regards Waterford hurling credit has be given regards their talk about defensive system their defence record backs it up so far so they have a system and base for foundation be fair

Didn't want to post on Sun after the game...let the frustration subside and think about it clearly...something Cubby should probably start doing too btw.

The problems are glaringly obvious so I dunno why this "root and branch review" needs to take place.

First off we are not playing a blanket...in theory we are but in practice nowhere near it. For a start playing lads at cornerback who are natural in the half back line doesn't help one bit, secondly we engage teams too high up the pitch...which renders the blanket completely ineffective..we funnel back ok but we come out to press lads 55/60m from goal and try to turn ball over there which just leaves our fullback line exposed 1v1 as if no blanket was put in place. Combine this mortal flaw with poor execution of the tackle and it leads to big scores being conceded.

Secondly our kickouts outs...Lord God they are appalling. No offence to our keeper but he doesn't have the required length or accuracy or indeed the bravery to execute.

It's very easy to push up on a team who's keeper can't kick past 50m. He's very tentative to hit lads on the run which makes it even more noticeable that he doesn't have distance either.

The space for shorter options is too crowded as the threat of him launching one long is non existent so Dublin inflicted an aggressive high press on us Sunday.

Fortunately a proper coaching set up could correct our defensive structure and tackling within a 5/6 weeks imo but you'd have to wonder if they haven't spotted this before Sun or need a review to do so then it could be too late for this management team sadly.

Attacking wise we're probably playing too many work horses in the half forward line...they are certainly giving it absolutely everything but just lacking quality on the ball both in a creative and scoring sense. The gap between our blanket and full forward line needs a player or two to pick a pass.

If it was Kerry you'd say they would learn from it or weren't showing their full hand etc and be confident by championship that things would be corrected and perfected but sadly we can only live in hope based on this time last year.

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Brilliant brilliant post short and sweet

I love to master that art of short posts to the point but still haven't got there yet
I agree all you said

Imo it's just usual pr spin doctoring which is what management do all term
We had it last year after tipp
Kerry midfield was going be solved
Then dualism be reviewed
Then league defence being worked on
Its all talk and promises but same old story in big games

Haha not as short as it appeared. Hit the post button by accident. Full post a wee bit longer

ancapallliath wrote: »

Cork and Dublin are playing again, this time it is in Cill Na Martra on May 10th 3pm for the Sean O Shiochain commemoration.

2 fairly strong teams are expected.

I wonder if they will use it as a good challenge game and experiment a little?

Dublin have their job done and had after ten minutes Sunday to a feeble non existent one dimension cotk so like league opener won't pick strong team and as it's ceremonial game will play lot new lads with no intensity thus I say it now cork will probably win as these games cuthbert wins but before and yes it will happen A FALSE FALSE DAWN POST MATCH RUBBISH be posted we beat league champions we learned we improved we knew were never that bad when NOTHING WOULD HAVE CHANGED BUT CORK WIN MICKEY MOUSE GAMES like mcgrath cups and early leagues but like kerry donegal Dublin league earlier a false dawn


Nothing will be learned from cork side imo as Dublin will but our management has this inability to actually differential value between games that actually good and games made looking good and horan said it the online one to say it in article I posted yesterday when he said early league games no relevance as standard off and fitter teams win

Dublin have no game til august really so we should appreciate won't give a monies about this let's be crystal clear
Gould cold kevin driscoll and Hayes will probably score one five Barry driscoll stormer and this management fails see what's is glaringly obvious too see


Naming a strong team and intensity are totally different
Gavin as proved early rounds leagues no doubt no intensity

Dublin will get tougher training a v b matches so expect flat Dublin performance this make cork look better we are


Surely Sunday was three times bitten four times shy and you would hope this stage naive pundits that belive false dawns will finally finally learn the ability to know a false dawn from a real valued win as until it's done cork evolution this team has zero I mean zero chance of improving and another huge defeat will happen cause false dawn you fool no one absolutely no one bar yourself


Finally though credit should be given both for playing in this worthy commeration and it deserves huge huge crowd


However imo the results needs be devalued and not read in to as this will be open game football with no blanket from Dublin and no high press in sunlight see this as ideal game open football to keep attacking instincts and basic skills in tune as always when you play blanket every now again you need orthodox game to not loose other football sharpness
Cork will thrive in games like this where allowed space so expect a high scoring game from both teams

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Dublin have their job done and had after ten minutes Sunday to a feeble non existent one dimension cotk so like league opener won't pick strong team and as it's ceremonial game will play lot new lads with no intensity thus I say it now cork will probably win as these games cuthbert wins but before and yes it will happen A FALSE FALSE DAWN POST MATCH RUBBISH be posted we beat league champions we learned we improved we knew were never that bad when NOTHING WOULD HAVE CHANGED BUT CORK WIN THESE MICKEY MOUSE GAMES like mcgrath cups and early leagues but like kerry donegal Dublin league earlier a false dawn


Nothing will be learned from cork side imo as Dublin will but our management has this inability to actually differential value between games that actually good and games made looking good and horan said it the online one to say it in article I posted yesterday when he said early league games no relevance as standard off and fitter teams win

Dublin have no game til august really so we should appreciate won't give a monies about this let's be crystal clear
Gould cold kevin driscoll and Hayes will probably score one five Barry driscoll stormer and this management fails see what's is glaringly obvious too see


Naming a strong team and intensity are totally different
Gavin as proved early rounds leagues no doubt no intensity

Dublin will get tougher training a v b matches so expect flat Dublin performance this make cork look better we are


Surely Sunday was three times bitten four times shy and you would hope this stage naive pundits that belive false dawns will finally finally learn the ability to know a false dawn from a real valued win as until it's done cork evolution this team has zero I mean zero chance of improving and another huge defeat will happen cause false dawn you fool no one absolutely no one bar yourself

its glaringly obvious there will be no intensity alright.
my point was will Cuthbert try to experiment a little with a strong team against another strong team. regardless of intensity, the dublin players have good footballing skills and that cant be ignored.

i really hope he does try something as continuing along the same lines is just doomed

HighKing33 wrote: »

It was like pros vs. amatuers there on Sunday. Whatever about tactics the lethargy of the Cork players was worrying. Dublin always come racing out of the blocks at Croke Park in front of a big crowd and you have to be capable of absorbing that pressure early on or you'll sink but Cork were just wastefull and nervous - that's a mental thing.

The lack of creativity is a big problem, lot of grafters at midfield and then O'Rourke at 11? Also a lack of aggressive man-markers. For me No. 6 would be the biggest concern. Cork have not looked like an All-Ireland winning team since John Miskella retired.

A lot of what you say is one hundred per cent tight high king and I agree and fair play from few months ago telling and being quick point out few cork fans over reacting in cork defeat mcgrath cups and you felt cotk real contenders it's good two see your now see what a few of saw months ago as few us know cork football upside down and inside out tonight know when real real and not fabricated false progress is made




Nervousness comes from management in would you be nervous in passengers with poorer driver your know has poorer record

Course you would were all only human
O rourke has to start and when you question he's creativity I presume they what you mean well o rourke best half forward up injury cork and all league and also surely creativity others two half forward be questioned

And your one hundred per cent right it's was pro gavin v cuthbert and management who amateur management as record shows this level


Your great great great meath team under great really great sean boylan died boots on as they had managers instill confidence and belief and remember where meath was when he took over initially shows why you need competent great management

You will not even compete with out it
Mick o dowd said it many times here good manager and didn't like defence style but all credit to meath who are defensive now and good record in league and shows like Dublin etc not long to change and compare cork were miles off defence

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

That's the difficulty he has


He tried attacking game failed
He tried defence game failed
He recalled past players they didn't perform
Played numerous lads out position and it failed
What other system can he try
There's nothing he can try but where the problem will lie is whatever he and he's selectors do is huge questions remain have they the coaching ability to effectively do it whether it's defence or attack

The last two years would prove they haven't so far so in almost seventy two weeks of no progress imo even with this root and branch review I expect little if any progress in seven weeks as I asked question here geuinely can anyone see one improvement in team in this term
I can't even see one to be honest as not were being defeated but we're actually in all big games being completely out played and this is a trend

there will be no improvement this season. maybe more flatter to deceive games but in reality Q/F is the very best we can hope for.

I dont believe in this blanket defence. stifling your own footballers playing football.

play attacking half backs if you want. but play guys that can play football - sold, pass, kick etc
I always thought this blanket defence can be beaten by running at the defence but you need quick fast thinking players with footballing skills. players that can look up and see a pass and delivery it.

what we have are players who seem to put their head down. stop. turn around and try handpassing backwards and sideways

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

There's nothing at all wrong with blanket as kerry proved balance can be found

Donegal players played wonderful attacking football

What you say Is true regards some players and that in any spirt is a reflection poor management by constantly picking them


Running in to a blanket is meat and drink as blanket defence loves contact where's the real hate blanket teams hsve is face fast team with varied precision kick passing both short and long, players with great decision making and both speed mind and legs and then and then only when space is created when you break the ist line of attack can hand pass at pace like rugby offload in the twelve breaks a gap for he's elusive thirteen to exploit
Cork hand passing is exactly the same as counihan era

the hand passing only works if you are going somewhere with it. if you break the first line of blanket defence you have a great opportunity for goals. but you need to be quick to break it

HighKing33 wrote: »

I'm afraid Meath's current management team is just not up to it and never has been although the quality is there on the pitch.

As for Cuthbert, a lot of the stuff being said about him was spitefull and I respect Cork GAA for coming out to defend him but really how did ye get caught out so badly again on Sunday?

Good piece from Eugene McGee in the Indo on Cork's players: "They showed little or no interest in taking on the Dubs full blast and at least making a game out of it. These players have a lot of explaining to do, because the manager was not playing in this match."

Couldn't agree more but honestly this new 'defensive system' is not Cork. Too much pressure on Collins to set up attacks. Not enough creativity from the backs. I would love the luxury of Shields at 6 or another look at Kelly there. Kerrigan at 11 was awesome in his first year under Cuthbert. If Donch was fit I'd play him from the start but maybe I'm just a romantic when it comes to football?

i think we are all romantic when it comes to football.
problem is romance doesnt win you much.

Jose's comments re Chelsea this past weekend springs to mind

ancapallliath wrote: »

i think we are all romantic when it comes to football.
problem is romance doesnt win you much.

Jose's comments re Chelsea this past weekend springs to mind

Look cork are the Liverpool of football and listen to Rodgers and cuthbert similarities interviews are obvious both have huge passion yes both talk the good games yes both are good in the media and both in teams against poor teams win but in the big big games their both tactical wise and team selection as time proved off the great managers I mean great like gavin Fitzmauirce van gal mouronio the wenger this world

HighKing33 wrote: »

I'm afraid Meath's current management team is just not up to it and never has been although the quality is there on the pitch.

As for Cuthbert, a lot of the stuff being said about him was spitefull and I respect Cork GAA for coming out to defend him but really how did ye get caught out so badly again on Sunday?

Good piece from Eugene McGee in the Indo on Cork's players: "They showed little or no interest in taking on the Dubs full blast and at least making a game out of it. These players have a lot of explaining to do, because the manager was not playing in this match."

Couldn't agree more but honestly this new 'defensive system' is not Cork. Too much pressure on Collins to set up attacks. Not enough creativity from the backs. I would love the luxury of Shields at 6 or another look at Kelly there. Kerrigan at 11 was awesome in his first year under Cuthbert. If Donch was fit I'd play him from the start but maybe I'm just a romantic when it comes to football?

Not on this forum by myself in all I did questions and justified critsom on performance which is what other counties do be fair

Like you correctly have questioned dowd your opinion
However dowd be fair limited resources and lot injuries past year doing well imo


On mayo thread you question roscommon but roscommon have done all that was asked and you must remember Owen proven managers in kerry

From day one problem I had cork management was none was proven and I'd love them to do well don't forget I'm cork but point was always thar record and three selectors never even managed at club level

Surely you see where I'm coming from

Okay defensive system fair enough is not cork you say but attack was not either
You can't judge a system when management are poor to implement them


Look at cork minor football four years ago conceded huge scores in around six games five goals to Galway, armagh and nineteenth points and point is any team cuthbert has in that and last two years cork now defence is conceding too much


So that's three teams
What's the common dominator?
Management clearly

Now this is nit being hard on management all cork most do judge field play
It's nothing more nothing less
Read the book hurling years page 244 to page 250 mick o flynn saying soft minded approach won't work and as harsh judge players their performance must still be judged purely field play
That's all most fans ask for